# CPL while bow hunting.



## brdhntr (Oct 1, 2003)

Boehr,
Can you confirm this?

Subject: SCI- SE Michigan Bowhunters Chapter MEMBER MEMO (10/4/04A)


ATTENTION BOWHUNTERS! 
With a new archery deer season on top of us, the dispute over whether or not an archery deer hunter can carry a pistol if the hunter has a CPL has resurfaced. The DNR had earlier issued a memo to all conservation officers that it is a violation of law for an archery deer hunter to carry a concealed handgun. This has lead to a dispute both within the DNR and with legislators.

Senator Alan Cropsey has said, "This is not an enforcement issue. If the deer has an arrow sticking out and a kill tag-congratulate them. If the deer has a bullet hole, arrest them."

Thus, the DNR has now sought the advice of the Attorney General's office. From what we have been told, based on guidance received from the AG, the DNR is issuing new instructions to CO's. The new instructions state that it is NOT a violation for a person with a concealed pistol license (CPL) to carry concealed while bow hunting.

If confronted by a CO while carrying a concealed pistol in conformity with a CPL, a bow hunter should request that the CO check with Lt. Purol of the DNR's law enforcement division before issuing a citation.

Hope you don't need to use this bit of info, but just in case, it may help you avoid some problems this season. Have a safe & successful season!

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 
The SE Michigan Bowhunters Chapter of Safari Club International has established this e-mail network to mobilize large numbers of sportsmen whenever a quick response is needed to protect our rights. It is our hopes that those in our network will forward the alerts on to other sportsmen in their e-mail loop or network. We also use the network to periodically keep sportsmen informed of items of interest. For your privacy, we list the addresses of those we send to under Blind Carbon Copy (Bcc) so as not to include their addresses to others as the messages are forwarded along.

If you would like to be removed from our list, simply reply back stating your wishes with REMOVE in the Subject Line. 
For chapter membership information, simply reply back requesting "Membership Information" in the Subject Line


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

Yep.

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=77259

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=77176&highlight=bow


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## answerguy8 (Oct 15, 2001)

Boehr,

Thank you for sharing this bit of good news!

Gary


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## umas911 (Sep 19, 2003)

So using this same logic does this mean that this could also apply to shineing?


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

Yep, providing you are talking both handgun and a CPL. A longarm, bow or no CPL and you get charged.


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## umas911 (Sep 19, 2003)

ok i thought so Thank You!


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## UpYour4x4 (Mar 19, 2004)

Well I find this hard to beleive. I work for a local police department and known many officers that have been warned for having a pistol with them while hunting. In fact DNR sends a message to all local departments stating its against the law for a police officer to carry a pistol while hunting. As of yet I do not know anyone that has been charged with it, but I also don't see anyone testing the waters.


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## NEMichsportsman (Jul 3, 2001)

UpYour4x4 said:


> Well I find this hard to beleive.


Not hard to believe at all...the following is an excerpt from a thread that Boehr referenced above.

*DNR has now sought the advice of the Attorney General's office. Based on guidance received from the AG, the DNR is issuing new instructions to CO's. The new instructions state that it is NOT a violation for a person with a concealed pistol license (CPL) to carry concealed while bow hunting.*


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## UpYour4x4 (Mar 19, 2004)

don't believe everything the AG says. its just there opinon and something. They can still write a ticket to you and the judge can still find u guilty. Just because the AG has an opinion


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## NEMichsportsman (Jul 3, 2001)

UpYour4x4 said:


> don't believe everything the AG says. its just there opinon and something. They can still write a ticket to you and the judge can still find u guilty. Just because the AG has an opinion


As the DNR requested the advice of the AG, and issued instructions based on that decision, I think one could feel safe carrying (assuming they are a CPL holder). Just as it is a matter of choice to carry or not under any circumstance, it is a matter of choice while bow hunting.

Boehr- sorry to turn this thread into a debate...it seems that this topic will not go away no matter what the DNR policy is/was.


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## UpYour4x4 (Mar 19, 2004)

Oh I am not debating it with you. Its just I don't trust the DNR for anything. I been told 10 differnt answers to the same question by them, Even got differnt answers for the same CO. Saw one CO write some tickets that were totally not right. I mean yes they were 100% legal tickets, but the use of discreation went out the window. I think they forgot to teach a few CO's about the letter of the law verse the spirte of the law. Not to mention the LEIN messages sent out by them was through there headquarters. I mean some police officers are mandated to carry their weapons off duty and for them to come out and say that a police officer will get a ticket for bowhunting with a pistol. Not to mention Michgian law states that a police officer can carry a gun off duty for the most part anywhere in the state. I mean that shows the sense they have right there!
I am sorry, after I read that message to all local police departments warning them not to have their pistols with them while bowhunting, I lost a ton of respect for them.


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## mike h (Jan 11, 2003)

I agree with you NEMICHSPORTSMAN it is what it is


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

UpYour4x4...I will be happy to debate with what you stated above since you are wrong. If you want to provide a specific instance based on fact then let me know. As to the LEIN message that has went out, that was prior to the change in the firearm laws and if you would have read all of the LEIN message you would have known the exceptions that you obviously ignored. There has not even been any LEIN message in more than two years since the change in the laws. Of course I suspect you just heard about it and never really did read it, right? If you want to bash CO's then you best have your facts together. Please don't hide behind an internet name either. I'll be more than happy to say if a CO did something wrong if it's true but will not have some anonymous person alleging to be a LEO bashing other people or other LEOs and providing wrong info. I have never, and I mean never, in more than 24 years of law enforcement seen an AG opinion, formal or informal, be ignored by any law enforcement agency. That leads me to believe you do not have anything to do with law enforcement. And I don't care if you don't have respect for me or not because you obvious don't have any for the law. Be advised any more bashing without the support of facts with be deleted too!

Lt. Ray Boehringer
DNR District 12 Law Supervisor
Plainwell


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## trout (Jan 17, 2000)

Hmmm interesting.
Thanks for clearing things up Ray.
Many of us here are thankful for your time spent here helping us all.


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## Ferg (Dec 17, 2002)

Ray - I too appricate your time and efforts here - I think you have indeed called this one on the money.

ferg....
20+ LEO Ret.


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## SPH (Jan 20, 2004)

And to think, I just finished arguing with my buddies that it was illegal to carry while bow hunting with a ccw after the last go around on this board. :rant: 

Well at least you will have a few guys that won't carry for quite a while as I have convinced them it is illegal. They don't read or write so well so it will be a while before they figure out the rule has changed!!!


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

That is why it is important for hunters to read the hunting guide (or fishing guide) every year regardless how much they think they know the laws because laws are constantly changing. The handgun laws are just a small example that has a lot of interest. There are some law changes that go without notice to many. Law changes are a progessive and sometimes a reactive process but it does evolve just the same.


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## answerguy8 (Oct 15, 2001)

I just find it amazing that someone thinks that a LEO, in any department, would go on arresting people for 'crimes' that the chief law einforcement officer of the state said to not pursue.
I'd sure like to be a fly on the wall when that guy gets to have a conference with his boss.


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## UpYour4x4 (Mar 19, 2004)

I sent you a PM to discuss the issues. I will not give out specific instances in a general fourm.


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## deputy (Feb 2, 2002)

oooooohhhhh super secret stuff! :lol:


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## malainse (Sep 2, 2002)

deputy said:


> oooooohhhhh super secret stuff! :lol:


I Agree Deputy....Slam the DNR on public site. Look at all the work that they do with limited number of Officers, then not want to discuss it in public.......
Malainse from CJ101


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## SPH (Jan 20, 2004)

Boehr,

I was just kidding obviously, but this is one of the laws that has always been gray and regardless of what is on paper it just makes life a little easier when a DNR rep. sets you straight.

Most of the other hunting and fishing laws are fairly easy to interpret and yes my friends can read and write but it is easier when they have pictures.


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## maximus (Mar 1, 2004)

boehr,

I noticed that you did not deny that a lein message was sent out in the past in reference to leo's carrying a firearm while bow hunting. I to can confirm that, that happen. I saw and read it with my own two eyes. 

I have not seen one this year though. I dont know if it was because of all the recent changes in the ccw laws or not. I did see the message every year for a couple years straight.

I didnt agree with the message, and was acutally advised by my cheif to carry if i wished. I choose not too.

You will proably agree that every department has one or a couple sub par officers, my department included. I dont think upyour4x4 was trying to bash your agency but just show that there are some leo's who will do things based on what they think the law is not on what the law is.

I support your agency and have backed them up several times in the past and will continue to. 

Road Patrol Sgt.


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

maximus,

Your right, I didn't deny the LEIN message, it was a mistake, something that was sent out by the communications room that shouldn't have been. It was corrected shortly afterward with a follow up LEIN message as soon as the CO's and Chief found out the first was sent. You said you didn't see one last year, fact is you haven't seen one in a number of years. It isn't just because of the ccw changes it is because that one message was a mistake as I said above.

As you stated "every department has one or a couple sub par officers, my department included". You are correct, you have never seen me state anything different although that has nothing to do with this particular topic.

upyour4x4 and I PM'ed each other and I still have no idea who he is and don't care. I won't post the PM's but I still feel his thoughts are not correct.

I'm glad you have backed up CO's several times in the past and will continue and I'm sure that the CO's will back you up when needed.

Let's just leave it. Further discussion on this topic should be in person with those who choose.

Road Patrol Sgt.[/QUOTE]


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