# Regulations at Shiawassee Flats



## Lurker (Jan 25, 2009)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> Here's how to hunt it. Take a zone in the 50's on the youth hunt. Wait until every one else is set up, then back in your Equinox and get it stuck, so leave it at the launch. It's now 2:30 and birds are coming out and looking at the field, so drive your big azz mud motor boat wide open all around the field until you get in, then get it stuck right in the middle of the field 100 yards from my decoys. After spending 1/2 a hour rocking it with the motor wide open, just leave it and hike to your zone while your dog comes over to visit me 5 times. Then proceed to shoot off all 100 shells you're allowed at anything coming out of the refuge, killing one bird and sailing two. The two that sail, walk all around the field looking for them as other birds try to work (they will work when you're not shooting at them the moment they leave the refuge) as the dog you brought is now two zones over playing. Pack up and meet me at the launch as we gave up and headed in early. When I pull in next to you to load my canoe, accuse me of cutting in line, even though I don't have a trailer and don't need to be in line. Then look at my Jeep and ask if I can tow you out, as there's only a line as your Equinox that could not make it out of the launch on its own with an empty trailer now has no chance with your boat behind it.
> 
> The next time we hunted there we drew 75th and ended up on the river, all by ourselves. So much nicer.


so did you tow them out?


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## Far Beyond Driven (Jan 23, 2006)

I'm in a canoe. After they unloaded all their gear, they were able to get the boat back to the canal and reload it after their hunt. And after the way they bitched at me when I backed the Jeep in, there was no way I was towing out their "truck".

Funny thing is while I was ratcheting down the canoe, one of their youths came over and asked my daughter how we did, and those two had a nice conversation. Hopefully he turns out to be a better man than the adults he was hunting with.


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## BangBangBang (Mar 30, 2011)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> if anyone else has specific questions answered about flats or things i do on hunts. post them here and i'll answer to best i can. Only dumb question is the one you don't ask.


Hi Shi Kid,

Here's one for you:

Say I get first pick in the draw. Should I take the upwind side of the honey hole? Is this where I stick my mojo too?

What would you do?


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

BangBangBang said:


> Hi Shi Kid,
> 
> Here's one for you:
> 
> ...


1st pick strong wind. i take field downwind of hot hole. in that field i will setup upwind end of that field if it applies. depends on how the wind correlates with field layout. spinner always goes in the kill hole unless you got tall poles to run in the corn. (of course we can't use spinners anymore at shi). but i realize you can at other areas so keeping it general.

1st pick soft wind, i take the kill hole.


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## Far Beyond Driven (Jan 23, 2006)

1. Kill hole, usually center most field in an area? (I.e. 30's, 40's, 1-5)

2. Wind parallel to corn strips. What side to set up on? We had this once, set up on one side, then tried to move to the other side later only to find the guys in the next zone would have been facing right at us and it would not have been safe. Does the first guy to set up dictate this and everyone else follows?

3. Walk in opportunities. I have a cart and a kayak that I use at Pt. Mouillee. Works great. Can you walk into every zone? For example, we were going to walk the dike around 1-5 to hunt 15 on the river, but cold not find how to cross and get to that dike, so we ended up paddling. Which was fine.

4. Do unique spreads work later in the year? I mean most people run 2-3 dozen mallards at the managed areas. What if I ran 18 geese and a pair of mallards? A flock of coots and a single hen late in the year? I mean if you're on the X thats 90% of the game, but I'm wondering about upping the odds if I'm on U or Q and not near X.


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> 1. Kill hole, usually center most field in an area? (I.e. 30's, 40's, 1-5)
> 
> 2. Wind parallel to corn strips. What side to set up on? We had this once, set up on one side, then tried to move to the other side later only to find the guys in the next zone would have been facing right at us and it would not have been safe. Does the first guy to set up dictate this and everyone else follows?
> 
> ...


I could give my two cents on some of this, but I'll let Shi Kid respond since he asked for more questions, and he's got WAAAAAAY more experience at Shi than I could ever dream of having.

But I will say about your question #3...most people don't realize that there actually are quite a few walk in opportunities at Shi. I've walked into a whole bunch there, and it sometimes means a LONG walk...I mean sometimes a mile or more, but it is doable. Of course I love to walk. Out in Nodak I walk a whole lot. And here in Michigan when it's wet or there's a skiff of snow, a jet sled does wonders. HOWEVER, at Shi you have to know EXACTLY where to walk into a field. This is why going out there in the summer, helping the SFCHA with summer projects, can give you a whole lot of knowledge because when the fields are dry you can SEE the field entry points where the farmers drive tractors in, which are GENERALLY wadeable...some aren't. But you take one false step, and you're floating a hat  One of my first years volunteering in the summer with the association, I marked up a map with all the field entry points, that way come fall I knew where I could and couldn't walk in.


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## Far Beyond Driven (Jan 23, 2006)

Why aren't 19, 20, 49-52 better than they are? There even looks like there's a bit of zone "A" that could be hunted in that area. They're between the refuge and some of the best zones, can't you pull traffic in that area? Or was it like when we hunted 15 and the geese poured out of the National Refuge and came over us headed into 1-5, only to get chased out of 1-5, and not want to work us. 

Also, when we hunted 15, we faced the NWR and watched 100's of duck pile in over the other side of the river. Were they landing in 21, 22, or the NWR? Please note we could not find our stake and we ended up hunting about even with zone 5 - the water was very high and we only found our stake on the way out - about 4" of it was above the water level.


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## Duckman Racing (Oct 11, 2004)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> 1. Kill hole, usually center most field in an area? (I.e. 30's, 40's, 1-5)
> 
> 2. Wind parallel to corn strips. What side to set up on? We had this once, set up on one side, then tried to move to the other side later only to find the guys in the next zone would have been facing right at us and it would not have been safe. Does the first guy to set up dictate this and everyone else follows?
> 
> ...


Far from an expert, but I'll give my experiences...
1. Generally yes, as corn gets eaten the birds move around, but going in with limited knowledge/scouting always take the middle, or on windy days the field downwind from the middle. (This applies to most MWA's not just shi)

2. Have had this happen to me multiple times. Still not sure of the answer I think I was told to face the woods when wind is parallel to the zone.

4. We generally run 4-5 dozen decoys, mix of blacks and mallards with a few geese. Texas-rigged, I can put them out and pick them up in under 10 minutes. Later in the year, like when half the zones are frozen I have tried running as few as 5-6 decoys, but results were inconclusive.


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## lefty421 (Dec 7, 2012)

For you guys new to hunting flooded corn strip and asking about which side to setup on, etc.... 
Shi Kid has a link to his wind guide in his sig. I would suggest that you all click on the link and download/print a copy and throw it into your blind bag.

Most guys out there will setup correctly, but you will often find guys who setup on the opposite side of the corn and you will have to adjust accordingly. 

if everyone followed Shi Kid's wind guide, then this wouldn't be an issue.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> 1. Kill hole, usually center most field in an area? (I.e. 30's, 40's, 1-5)
> 
> 2. Wind parallel to corn strips. What side to set up on? We had this once, set up on one side, then tried to move to the other side later only to find the guys in the next zone would have been facing right at us and it would not have been safe. Does the first guy to set up dictate this and everyone else follows?
> 
> ...


1. not necessarily but as a rule of thumb you could say that yes. it does change during season and it usually goes with the water height in each field. almost every field block has a natural elevation change in it (1 end deeper than the other). This plays huge factor in "hot" field as water is raised.

2. standard would be set on east side. but at shiawassee there is no rules against setting up on either side. sometimes in a north or south wind, its benificial to set backside....this is where experience wins over in that decision.

3. 50's and 60's are easily walkable. 1-5 and 9-14 will be soon (building new hay bridge next summer hopefully).

4. I run 18-24 oversized plasti-duk decoys. all year. Ajusting your set (pattern) to current wind is more important than the quantity of decoys. I have 3 super floater goose shells...they are b52 field decoys with pipe insulation around the base to float.

*tip* don't mix yer duck and goose deeks. keep them separate. keep them way way separate. I put my 3 geese way out and way up wind of my ducks.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> Why aren't 19, 20, 49-52 better than they are? There even looks like there's a bit of zone "A" that could be hunted in that area. They're between the refuge and some of the best zones, can't you pull traffic in that area? Or was it like when we hunted 15 and the geese poured out of the National Refuge and came over us headed into 1-5, only to get chased out of 1-5, and not want to work us.
> 
> Also, when we hunted 15, we faced the NWR and watched 100's of duck pile in over the other side of the river. Were they landing in 21, 22, or the NWR? Please note we could not find our stake and we ended up hunting about even with zone 5 - the water was very high and we only found our stake on the way out - about 4" of it was above the water level.


whos says they aren't good? 


yeah water levels play big part of rivers. its tough to mark and predict water a month later....so may have been posted in lower water situation and we got more water when you hunted.

more than likely those birds were going into the federal refuge that you were watching. possibly dumping into 21-28 but i doubt it. usually hunters in there preventing that.


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## craigrh13 (Oct 24, 2011)

How's things looking up there right now? I just read the newest managers report and it sounds like crop conditions are good but bird numbers are wayyy down. It did sound like they were going to start flooding 50's/60's and the 30's next week. Did I read that wrong on N Prior? It seems that always get flooded later due to sharecropping?


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

craigrh13 said:


> How's things looking up there right now? I just read the newest managers report and it sounds like crop conditions are good but bird numbers are wayyy down. It did sound like they were going to start flooding 50's/60's and the 30's next week. Did I read that wrong on N Prior? It seems that always get flooded later due to sharecropping?


50's is no longer sharecropped. Its planted completely for duck food now. Should be flooded on opener. Will be handled like 60's from here on out. 

crops are damn good. probably best i've seen in while around here. teal were way down. i think that was the general consensus across the board in mid-michigan as a whole.


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## craigrh13 (Oct 24, 2011)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> 50's is no longer sharecropped. Its planted completely for duck food now. Should be flooded on opener. Will be handled like 60's from here on out.
> 
> crops are damn good. probably best i've seen in while around here. teal were way down. i think that was the general consensus across the board in mid-michigan as a whole.


Ohhhh. That sounds good. I was just basing it off of the managers report. Sounds like it might have something to do with the refuge still be down? Harsens was reporting excellent duck numbers and FP had decent numbers. It seemed to me Shi numbers were skewed because the refuge wasn't flooded yet.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

craigrh13 said:


> Ohhhh. That sounds good. I was just basing it off of the managers report. Sounds like it might have something to do with the refuge still be down? Harsens was reporting excellent duck numbers and FP had decent numbers. It seemed to me Shi numbers were skewed because the refuge wasn't flooded yet.


i've never read a managers report or duck counts....its impossible for them to count ducks and its all dependent on a managers take on how many ducks hes seeing in his view of an area.

Many years ago i was sitting on dike int he 30's after hours...coming in from a hunt. Just shot a 4 man limit in 34, It was peak migration, all the fields were hot. I sat on the dike for over an hour watching the show of over 10-15k birds come out of prior refuge and over the river and swarm 30's and 40's. it was well over an hour into the dark of waves and waves of thousands of ducks. When i say 15k....i'm undershooting the number. Refuge was stacked for a week at least. Later that week refuge counts came out and they counted 3600 mallards, 1500 wigeon, 900 pintails, 1500 teal.....and so on.

moral of the story? counts are general guesses at best. i'm not saying our counter sucks...hes just more conservative with all his numbers across the board compared to others. So comparing ours to harsens or fish points is all relative to the counter. And i suggest to never depend on a count to make yer decision on whether to hunt or not.....its almost as bad as kill charts


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## craigrh13 (Oct 24, 2011)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> i've never read a managers report or duck counts....its impossible for them to count ducks and its all dependent on a managers take on how many ducks hes seeing in his view of an area.
> 
> Many years ago i was sitting on dike int he 30's after hours...coming in from a hunt. Just shot a 4 man limit in 34, It was peak migration, all the fields were hot. I sat on the dike for over an hour watching the show of over 10-15k birds come out of prior refuge and over the river and swarm 30's and 40's. it was well over an hour into the dark of waves and waves of thousands of ducks. When i say 15k....i'm undershooting the number. Refuge was stacked for a week at least. Later that week refuge counts came out and they counted 3600 mallards, 1500 wigeon, 900 pintails, 1500 teal.....and so on.
> 
> moral of the story? counts are general guesses at best. i'm not saying our counter sucks...hes just more conservative with all his numbers across the board compared to others. So comparing ours to harsens or fish points is all relative to the counter. And i suggest to never depend on a count to make yer decision on whether to hunt or not.....its almost as bad as kill charts


Oh I'm not deciding my hunt on that. I just found his report kind of interesting. You are right though, his numbers always seem a little conservative.


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## jwinks (Mar 20, 2014)

craigrh13 said:


> Oh I'm not deciding my hunt on that. I just found his report kind of interesting. You are right though, his numbers always seem a little conservative.


Don't they count the refuge midday? Like when a lot of those birds could be out and about?


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> i'm bored so here we go.
> 
> every person needs a PFD. not a boat cushion....a cert PFD. boat must be registered with sticker (if under power). boat must have running lights bow/stern (if under power)....good idea to run whether motor or not. good idea to have the other stuff u mentioned if you got it.
> 
> ...


PFD is a biggie. Differ from print, http://www.michigandnr.com/publications/pdfs/huntingwildlifehabitat/sga/Shiawassee_River_SGA_map.pdf


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

15.) if i pull up next to you in the boat and yell something and you can't make out what i'm saying.....its "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS". If you are reading this message after being swamped by a-hole shiawassee duck hunter.....I said "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS".


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> 15.) if i pull up next to you in the boat and yell something and you can't make out what i'm saying.....its "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS". If you are reading this message after being swamped by a-hole shiawassee duck hunter.....I said "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS".


Ha Ha! You almost got me a couple times years ago  Yeah, I learned to get the hell outta the way


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## Lurker (Jan 25, 2009)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> 15.) if i pull up next to you in the boat and yell something and you can't make out what i'm saying.....its "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS". If you are reading this message after being swamped by a-hole shiawassee duck hunter.....I said "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS".


more then likely the same people driving below the speed limit in the passing lane on the expressway.


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## fsamie1 (Mar 8, 2008)

Lurker said:


> more then likely the same people driving below the speed limit in the passing lane on the expressway.


quit picking on my wife.


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## fsamie1 (Mar 8, 2008)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> 15.) if i pull up next to you in the boat and yell something and you can't make out what i'm saying.....its "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS". If you are reading this message after being swamped by a-hole shiawassee duck hunter.....I said "SLOW THE **** DOWN SO I CAN PASS".


you are just so right. I can pass people at full throttle with my GoDevil with less wake than going 5-10 mph.


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## buckin&duckin (Oct 26, 2014)

I used a hunt app to build a map that will give me my realtime location while navigating the refuge. Are there any other good resources besides actually driving the flats to get the lay of the land?


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## Tom_Miller (Apr 23, 2010)

When a boat comes up behind me I always pull off to the side and either slow way down or stop. My boat was on the bottom once out there and that water was mighty cold in late October.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

buckin&duckin said:


> I used a hunt app to build a map that will give me my realtime location while navigating the refuge. Are there any other good resources besides actually driving the flats to get the lay of the land?


thats pretty good. only thing i would add to it is pull over for federal marsh and maybe actual zone spots for 15-16-17


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

Lurker said:


> more then likely the same people driving below the speed limit in the passing lane on the expressway.


not me. It's just a lot slower in a square back canoe with 2hp kicker motor. But I love that rig for the flats. Gets me anywhere I wanna go, is light enough to pull a dike, and can hide in practically nothing without destroying cover


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

just ducky said:


> not me. It's just a lot slower in a square back canoe with 2hp kicker motor. But I love that rig for the flats. Gets me anywhere I wanna go, is light enough to pull a dike, and can hide in practically nothing without destroying cover


i think what he's getting at is slower not moving over....thats exactly like driving 50mph in fast lane on 75


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## Lurker (Jan 25, 2009)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> i think what he's getting at is slower not moving over....thats exactly like driving 50mph in fast lane on 75


yea..... that.


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## buckin&duckin (Oct 26, 2014)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> thats pretty good. only thing i would add to it is pull over for federal marsh and maybe actual zone spots for 15-16-17


Thank You, Like I said I am just looking for a head start. I don't want to be the lost guy driving around because if I was I would just turn around and head back but I'd rather not lose what little days I have to hunt. 

The map didn't show a pull over near 15-16-17, is there a way to reference where it would be using the DNR State area map so I can mark it, incase I ever get a draw out that way because I plan on putting some distance between me and everyone else in the beginning. Is there a pull over needed to access 23-28? I plan on keeping it simple the first year I have not had the time to scout like I planned. 

Thanks,
Josh


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

buckin&duckin said:


> Thank You, Like I said I am just looking for a head start. I don't want to be the lost guy driving around because if I was I would just turn around and head back but I'd rather not lose what little days I have to hunt.
> 
> The map didn't show a pull over near 15-16-17, is there a way to reference where it would be using the DNR State area map so I can mark it, incase I ever get a draw out that way because I plan on putting some distance between me and everyone else in the beginning. Is there a pull over needed to access 23-28? I plan on keeping it simple the first year I have not had the time to scout like I planned.
> 
> ...


no pull over for river but the zones are kinda borderless. rule of thumb is hunt anywhere within 100yrds of stake type of deal. keep in mind the map is quick photoshop, not exact.

attached is a little map i made to give you jist of it.
View attachment 227279


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## buckin&duckin (Oct 26, 2014)

W


Shiawassee_Kid said:


> no pull over for river but the zones are kinda borderless. rule of thumb is hunt anywhere within 100yrds of stake type of deal. keep in mind the map is quick photoshop, not exact.
> 
> attached is a little map i made to give you jist of it.
> View attachment 227279


Wow thats awesome, thank you.


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## Hammertime989 (Oct 17, 2009)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> no pull over for river but the zones are kinda borderless. rule of thumb is hunt anywhere within 100yrds of stake type of deal. keep in mind the map is quick photoshop, not exact.
> 
> attached is a little map i made to give you jist of it.
> View attachment 227279



Great map. Thank you. I will use it this season.


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## buckin&duckin (Oct 26, 2014)

buckin&duckin said:


> W
> 
> Wow thats awesome, thank you.


You talked about a federal pull over, where is that and what sections does it lead to. I didn't see it on the DNR map. Thanks.


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## lefty421 (Dec 7, 2012)

What's up with that 'private' area to the north end of 15? I didn't know there was any private property in there.... Has it always been private? None of the SRSGA maps indicate that is private property?


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

lefty421 said:


> What's up with that 'private' area to the north end of 15? I didn't know there was any private property in there.... Has it always been private? None of the SRSGA maps indicate that is private property?


yes. been private forever. actually know the owner and have permission. rarely hunt it.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

buckin&duckin said:


> You talked about a federal pull over, where is that and what sections does it lead to. I didn't see it on the DNR map. Thanks.


follow the light green line from miller rd. parking lot. pullover where the red mark is. that leads into 23-28 (old F thru K federal marsh).
View attachment 227317


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## buckin&duckin (Oct 26, 2014)

Again thank you for all the information it has been very helpful. Also I really like whatever program your using to draw on the map, if you don't mind what program are you using?


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

buckin&duckin said:


> Again thank you for all the information it has been very helpful. Also I really like whatever program your using to draw on the map, if you don't mind what program are you using?


photoshop.


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> follow the light green line from miller rd. parking lot. pullover where the red mark is. that leads into 23-28 (old F thru K federal marsh).
> View attachment 227317


And since Shi Kid didn't say it, I will. Be very careful about this trip to the "federal marsh" (23-28) because on the wrong wind, blowing the water out to the bay, this can get very shallow, making running with an outboard nearly impossible. So don't get yourself stuck out there with no way back (learned that the hard way).


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