# 2018 Steelhead Egg Take, Little Manistee Weir



## levi moore (Feb 28, 2017)

Thanks


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Big Phish- We look at scale samples from the steelhead at the weir, and yes we can tell that many of them are returning fish. There is definitely some mortality associated with spawning regardless of whether it's at a weir or not, but some of them do come back for a second or even third time.

Treedizzle- Basically the same answer. As long as the water stays cold, those dropbacks will hang just above the weir and then go downstream once we pull it.

Levi- The males continue upstream to find another female. We don't take all of their milt at the weir. The females we've spawned don't go very far upstream. They become dropbacks and wait for us to pull the weir.


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## mondrella (Dec 27, 2001)

big_phish said:


> Just wondering if the fish survive the egg take to return ans spawn the following year?


 If I remember right i thought i read somewhere in research that it is about 17 percent are return fish to the river. I could be wrong i cannot seem to find that info again. I think that is a impressive number of return fish. It would be interesting to know returns on rivers with heavier fishing pressure like the big river or the Muskegon.


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## Benzie Rover (Mar 17, 2008)

mondrella said:


> If I remember right i thought i read somewhere in research that it is about 17 percent are return fish to the river. I could be wrong i cannot seem to find that info again. I think that is a impressive number of return fish. It would be interesting to know returns on rivers with heavier fishing pressure like the big river or the Muskegon.


I've read similar info. There is significant variability in the return rate of repeat steelhead spawners for various stocks. Streams with a short run from ocean/lake to spawning riffles have highest % typically. Several studies have been done on the Brule River in MN (Lake Superior) and they have found had some fish return 7 years, but those are very rare/cool fish. That system is short with no dams to navigate. On average only 10-30% of the dropbacks (kelts) make it back to the ocean/big lake, again, depending on how rigorous their migration was up and downstream. Steelhead that have to navigate several dams, like on the Columbia, have a very low return rate due to all the dams. Coastal streams along OR and WA have much higher rates. In the Great Lakes we also typically have higher rates - likely 10-15%, but again, that varies from river to river and from year to year.


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## MrFysch (Feb 9, 2008)

I would say the number is higher. Just a guess but it seems like alot of steelies we catch on the great lakes are post spawn in June.


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## Riverdude (Dec 21, 2017)

Some salmon and steelhead migrate as much as 2500 miles to spawn,
and climb 6000 ft. in elevation.
Comparatively, anything in the great lakes region is a walk in the park.
Steelhead have been recorded migrating 50 miles in a single day.
I have seen them in the weir on the Salmon R. and it really makes you appreciate how amazing these fish are.


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Day one of steelhead egg take was today. We spawned 212 females, passing a total of 304 fish. Biggest fish was a 17.2 lb male. Had another 4 or 5 that were over 15 lbs. We plan on taking eggs again tomorrow. After that will depend on how many fish remain on hand and how ripe they are.


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## stickbow shooter (Dec 19, 2010)

That doesn't sound like very many fish. How many pens are full. I remember the good old days when all the pens were full.


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## Wet Fly (Apr 14, 2016)

Once the fish are passed, how long does it take them to move up the river to the area around Spencer's bridge? Wondering if we might see a few fish on the gravel over trout opener this year.


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## MrFysch (Feb 9, 2008)

Couple days if water is up


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Second day of egg take was today. I wasn't there, but they spawned 191 pairs, passing 356 steelhead. Sounds like we'll try to finish up next week Tuesday and Wednesday. Might be the latest egg take ever! Big fish today was 17.1.

Wet Fly- MrFysch is about right. If they want to move, they can move pretty quick. One issue is that we're not passing any green hens right now, because we need them for next week's egg take. We do send the males on up once we use them, so you may see some of them up that way.


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## Wet Fly (Apr 14, 2016)

Thanks,
Somehow I was thinking some green hens were passed to allow spawning which maintains the wild steelhead population in the river. But because the weather delayed everything does that mean that the spawning that sustains the population, above the weir, will be happening in a few weeks? I dont ever remember seeing spawning pairs in the river that late and I've been up here since 1975.


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## skipper34 (Oct 13, 2005)

Wet Fly said:


> Thanks,
> Somehow I was thinking some green hens were passed to allow spawning which maintains the wild steelhead population in the river. But because the weather delayed everything does that mean that the spawning that sustains the population, above the weir, will be happening in a few weeks? I dont ever remember seeing spawning pairs in the river that late and I've been up here since 1975.


I have seen spawning pairs as late as mid May. All depends on weather and stream flow. Spring rains and high water will bring fresh fish.


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## MrFysch (Feb 9, 2008)

All those lonely bucks are going to be covering alot of water looking for hens.


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## skipper34 (Oct 13, 2005)

MrFysch said:


> All those lonely bucks are going to be covering alot of water looking for hens.


There are a lot of hens upstream already. They run before the weir is in place and many will winter over in the river from the fall run.


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## MrFysch (Feb 9, 2008)

True....I have to believe all of the Fall/winter hens have spawned. Just a guess though. I have caught several hens over the years that had been "spawned" at the weir. They don't remove all of the eggs. Alot of the hens will actually still go UPRIVER and do their thing. Even with the majority of eggs removed.


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## skipper34 (Oct 13, 2005)

Yes indeed. I have caught many hens that have had caved-in bellies. There are always fish upstream on the gravel in April.


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## Fishndude (Feb 22, 2003)

There have been strong numbers of Steelhead spawning in the Little River in May, for years. The late runs have been increasing in recent times, as well.


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## JAA (Oct 6, 2004)

Do they ever bring fresh eggs in from out of state? To keep the gene pool fresh? Or is that a No No?


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## mondrella (Dec 27, 2001)

JAA said:


> Do they ever bring fresh eggs in from out of state? To keep the gene pool fresh? Or is that a No No?


Our steelhead are from wild fish. We supply other states also. Mark will correct me if I am wrong but when eggs are taken they try to pair fish up trying to avoid using one single Male let's say for 10 females. This helps keep a diverse strain of fish. We have a very healthy steelhead population. I have seen years when weir numbers were very low yet high numbers of fish well upstream. Then years late may a huge push of fish better than what was there during what we consider normal steelhead times. Those late fish maybe there just a few days.


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Third day of egg take was today. We spawned 265 females today, passing a total of 551 steelhead and one lonely brown trout. One of the steelhead was an 18.6 lb brute male. Final day of egg take is tomorrow. If all goes well we'll remove the weir tomorrow so the remainder of the run can go up unimpeded. There were plenty of chrome fish on the camera below the weir today, so it isn't over by a long shot. Total number passed so far this spring is 1,211.


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

JAA- Mondrella is right. Our Little Manistee strain is an outstanding strain to work with. They have good genetics and do well in the hatchery. They've been here now for about 140 years. There's really no need to bring in anything else from out west. The only other strain we stock in Michigan is the Skamania strain in the Manistee River, although we do stock Eagle Lake strain rainbow trout in some locations. That is a domestic strain that doesn't have the migratory habits of the Little Manistee strain.


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## MrFysch (Feb 9, 2008)

Once again thanks for your updates!


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Today was the final day of egg take. Went very well. We spawned 114 total pairs today. We pulled the grates (meaning there is now free fish passage, both up and downstream) and emptied the ponds. We passed a total of 1,216 steelhead today and four brown trout. The total number passed this year was 2,427.

Amazingly, most of those came within the last week and a half or so, with more coming even now. We've only ever taken eggs in May one other time (in 2016). See the pics for what some of these fish look like. Not what you'd expect in early May!


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## Treven (Feb 21, 2006)

M. Tonello said:


> JAA- Mondrella is right. Our Little Manistee strain is an outstanding strain to work with. They have good genetics and do well in the hatchery. They've been here now for about 140 years. There's really no need to bring in anything else from out west. The only other strain we stock in Michigan is the Skamania strain in the Manistee River, although we do stock Eagle Lake strain rainbow trout in some locations. That is a domestic strain that doesn't have the migratory habits of the Little Manistee strain.


 I wish we'd plant more Skamania in the Big River. Not for the June, July, and August fishery, but the September, October, November, December, and January fishery. I really enjoy having those acrobats mixed in.


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## Carpmaster (Apr 1, 2004)

Treven said:


> I wish we'd plant more Skamania in the Big River. Not for the June, July, and August fishery, but the September, October, November, December, and January fishery. I really enjoy having those acrobats mixed in.


I second that....Id like to see them in a few others such as the Pentwater as well!


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## jrv (Nov 11, 2008)

Treven said:


> I wish we'd plant more Skamania in the Big River. Not for the June, July, and August fishery, but the September, October, November, December, and January fishery. I really enjoy having those acrobats mixed in.


My favorite fish to catch! 


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## Mike (Nov 26, 2000)

M. Tonello said:


> JAA- Mondrella is right. Our Little Manistee strain is an outstanding strain to work with. They have good genetics and do well in the hatchery. They've been here now for about 140 years. There's really no need to bring in anything else from out west. The only other strain we stock in Michigan is the Skamania strain in the Manistee River, although we do stock Eagle Lake strain rainbow trout in some locations. That is a domestic strain that doesn't have the migratory habits of the Little Manistee strain.


Any chance more of the Manistee strain could be planted in the put and take inland lakes instead of the the Eagle Lake? The Manistee overwinter better, and are a riot to catch... 

Mike


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Mike said:


> Any chance more of the Manistee strain could be planted in the put and take inland lakes instead of the the Eagle Lake? The Manistee overwinter better, and are a riot to catch...
> 
> Mike


Mike- We would love to, but we're currently maxed out on steelhead production, and we need them all for the rivers. You're right- they do better than the Eagle Lakes do in lake environments, but the ELs still do pretty well. Perhaps after the renovations at Thompson we might be able to rear more Little Manistees and put some in inland lakes.


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## Carpmaster (Apr 1, 2004)

Mark - First thing I would like to say is thank you for the information that you provide on here. As far as steelhead production goes has there been any serious talks on adding more capacity?


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

Carpmaster said:


> Mark - First thing I would like to say is thank you for the information that you provide on here. As far as steelhead production goes has there been any serious talks on adding more capacity?


Yes. Lots of discussion for many years, and now finally some action! We received a major appropriation from the legislature in 2018 for capitol upgrades at the Little Manistee Weir and Thompson Hatchery. The work at Thompson Hatchery should provide us with more rearing capacity for steelhead, which will be most welcome. It will be a few years before the work is complete and those extra fish available, but we're really looking forward to it.


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## BMARKS (Nov 6, 2017)

M. Tonello said:


> Mike- We would love to, but we're currently maxed out on steelhead production, and we need them all for the rivers. You're right- they do better than the Eagle Lakes do in lake environments, but the ELs still do pretty well. Perhaps after the renovations at Thompson we might be able to rear more Little Manistees and put some in inland lakes.


Just out of curiosity, do the fish we sell to other states go as fertilized eggs or are they smolts?


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## M. Tonello (Sep 20, 2002)

BMARKS said:


> Just out of curiosity, do the fish we sell to other states go as fertilized eggs or are they smolts?


Fertilized eggs.


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## BMARKS (Nov 6, 2017)

M. Tonello said:


> Fertilized eggs.


thanks for the response.


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## The Ghettoblaster (Jan 22, 2014)

M. Tonello said:


> Today was the final day of egg take. Went very well. We spawned 114 total pairs today. We pulled the grates (meaning there is now free fish passage, both up and downstream) and emptied the ponds. We passed a total of 1,216 steelhead today and four brown trout. The total number passed this year was 2,427.
> 
> Amazingly, most of those came within the last week and a half or so, with more coming even now. We've only ever taken eggs in May one other time (in 2016). See the pics for what some of these fish look like. Not what you'd expect in early May!
> View attachment 310671
> View attachment 310672


Thanks for your updates and for all of the info you provide Mark. Much appreciated as always!


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## Carpmaster (Apr 1, 2004)

M. Tonello said:


> Yes. Lots of discussion for many years, and now finally some action! We received a major appropriation from the legislature in 2018 for capitol upgrades at the Little Manistee Weir and Thompson Hatchery. The work at Thompson Hatchery should provide us with more rearing capacity for steelhead, which will be most welcome. It will be a few years before the work is complete and those extra fish available, but we're really looking forward to it.


Awesome! Thank you for the heads up!


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## Splitshot (Nov 30, 2000)

Saw a bunch in front of my house today. A few are spawning. My neighbor hooked 2 today, his first in 6 years, so fishing is great.


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