# Release schedule for Pheasants ?



## Tomfive5 (Dec 15, 2015)

Howitzer said:


> Nope, not the Pheasident. I am the Secretary of Phedense ..
> 
> 
> I cant understand why you think someone saying they have first hand knowledge of Hens being shot is total BS. It sounds to me like you are pushing a narrative like the program is perfect and nothing is wrong and it is great. I see lots of photos and posts of people who are enjoying the MPHI, but to push the narrative that it is perfect and there are not any issues is absurd. You sound like someone who is scared of losing funding if word gets out about the possibility of non legal game being taken. Instead of using it as a opportunity to push for improvements next season, and better information for new/returning upland hunters.
> ...


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> The officers name please.


The officer of officers, watch the damn testimony.


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## Tomfive5 (Dec 15, 2015)

DirtySteve said:


> I have spent a fair amount of time with my dog on the lapeer field. Havent seen a hen or remains of a hen there. I live in lapeer county about a mile from a hunt club that releases thousands per year. I see dozens of birds a year in my yard. Occasional my dog catches one. They are all leftovers from the hunt club. I have been here 19 yrs and only recall ever seeing 2 hens and not once a young bird of any age. In the winter there are feather piles everywhere where the fox get them.
> 
> But say someone really did make a mistake and shoot a hen there. How do we know it was a wild hen and not a mistake by the club that released birds? Also isnt it still good that there were actually pheasant hunters out there hunting whether they are shooting wild birds or pen raised birds? Mistakes are unfortunately part of hunting. You have to have hunters to begin with to have hunting violations.


How do we know there weren't any wild pheasants on the release sites before birds were placed there? That's what I want to know. I understand a hen could be shot by mistake, or placed in the field by mistake. I am in no way saying this program should be cancelled because of this. I am however concerned about put n take hunts in areas with wild pheasants.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

Good questions,
MPHI is a committee and does not have a say-so where and when birds are released, that is at the sole discretion of the DNR. To honor an agreement with MPRI releasing birds where wild populations are established is to be avoided.

Keep in mind MPHI has no money, therefore, managing a website and what-not is an afterthought and really not necessary at this time, the best information should come from the DNR or MUCC.

Yes I am sort of a politician with an activist drive, I believe in the initiative so I volunteer time. I am dodging questions that I cannot conclusively answer on the internet because it's impossible to make a point without being flamed by people with no interest in hearing our side of the story. For the most part, I am more than willing to personally discuss the different initiatives with anyone that wishes to contact me.

The saddest part of this is that Pheasants Forever has had a chance to cooperate and help steer money to MPRI. Personally I am pretty much center between habitat and release, I chose to work on the MPHI committee because I think revenue is the key to habitat and we need a jump start of hunters to make that happen. The status at this point is the Hunting Initiative has been so successful that PF is not really needed, their 8000 members in Michigan are dwarfed by the satisfied hunters this year that participated in the MPHI hunts.

I hope that helps.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

Tomfive5 said:


> How do we know there weren't any wild pheasants on the release sites before birds were placed there? That's what I want to know. I understand a hen could be shot by mistake, or placed in the field by mistake. I am in no way saying this program should be cancelled because of this. I am however concerned about put n take hunts in areas with wild pheasants.


I wouldn’t be too anxious about that Tom.
There is almost no natural reproduction on any of the heavily pressured state game lands.

If you were going to have the hunter volumes necessary to support small game endeavors, They have to be planted.

Do the math, in order to pay one state employee, you have to collect more than $100,000 in revenue. It has to come from someplace. 
Contracting for pheasants at 10 bucks apiece, requires the sale of a huge number of pheasant stamps, just to pay the labor cost of the one or two people who will watch over it.

I shoot fair quantities of pheasants in foreign countries that rear them for profit.

I also shoot them across the pheasant belt here in the United States , having recently returned from shooting the upland slam in Nebraska.

Most countries that rear pheasants don’t want any carryover through the winter.

It seems counterintuitive, but they do everything they can to not have to feed remnant flocks.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

Tomfive5 said:


> How do we know there weren't any wild pheasants on the release sites before birds were placed there? That's what I want to know. I understand a hen could be shot by mistake, or placed in the field by mistake. I am in no way saying this program should be cancelled because of this. I am however concerned about put n take hunts in areas with wild pheasants.


They picked fields void of pheasants where and pheasant habitat improvement projects werent going on.....according to Al Stewart. I have hunted quite a bit in lapeer state game area and have never heard or seen a pheasant while deer or duck hunting. 

I did run into an old timer my first time out who was pretty excited about the program. He said he shot his last wild michigan pheasant in that same exact field about 15 years prior. He said over the years he would run his dogs there periodically and had never seen another.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

DirtySteve said:


> They picked fields void of pheasants where and pheasant habitat improvement projects werent going on.....according to Al Stewart. I have hunted quite a bit in lapeer state game area and have never heard or seen a pheasant while deer or duck hunting.
> 
> I did run into an old timer my first time out who was pretty excited about the program. He said he shot his last wild michigan pheasant in that same exact field about 15 years prior. He said over the years he would run his dogs there periodically and had never seen another.


 Perspective is all relative Steve.

Because I’ve been marching around State game areas since the early 1960s, I’ve encountered pheasants in all kinds of places.

But, because state ground is typically marginal farmland, habitat efforts always wain with the end of sharecropper contracts.

I shot many birds grouse and pheasant on the Lapeer State game area, and have watched the habitat grow unfettered to create deer and turkey habitat.
Same with other SGA’s.

Can’t afford to hold back mother nature, and the farmland typically doesn’t drain well enough for sharecropping to continue.

The SGA near my home has had all kinds of upland habitat initiatives.

With the attendance signage.

So, it’s not entirely accurate to say that the release programs only occur at places where no habitat work was being done. 

More accurately, it’s places where the habitat managers have been frustrated.

Since I’ve been walking the upland units near my home for five decades, I believe it’s pressure that extirpated the birds.


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## anticipation (Jun 5, 2008)

Howitzer said:


> That's what I thought, fake news. I am armed with the real information that is why I called you out on the CO BS, probably a CO feeling important over a beer.
> 
> Read the facts about the release sites and how they were/are chosen. The initiative is about getting butt's in the field. In fact, we are more focused on the reactivation folks because they are ready to hunt and have money to spend.


I know there are wild populations at some of the release sites and wish they would have thought them out better .if the folks you are targeting have so much money to spend why not send them to a Pheasant farm instead ?


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

birdhntr said:


> The officers name please.


The Rose lake officers name that you referenced.To be fair.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

anticipation said:


> I know there are wild populations at some of the release sites and wish they would have thought them out better .if the folks you are targeting have so much money to spend why not send them to a Pheasant farm instead ?


That is a question you should ask MPRI and PF since the Ok'd the release sites. That is a nonsensical question because it generates no revenue for the state to create habitat and public opportunities.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> The Rose lake officers name that you referenced.To be fair.


listen to the damn testimony.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

anticipation said:


> I know there are wild populations at some of the release sites and wish they would have thought them out better .if the folks you are targeting have so much money to spend why not send them to a Pheasant farm instead ?


Better yet why didn't they get involved years ago like the folks in Minnesota and put money to work


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## poz (Nov 12, 2004)

Tomfive5 said:


> A
> 
> Also, does that mean you are saying the release has zero impact on wild populations?


We hunt a farm that is about 1.5 miles from a game farm. Since the game farm opened, pheasant numbers are way up. And climb every year. So some birds are surviving and some are breeding with the native and surviving


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Howitzer said:


> listen to the damn testimony.


I only ask that you name an officer you referenced because you asked for an officer to be named that was referenced.
I did find this.


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## anticipation (Jun 5, 2008)

Howitzer said:


> That is a question you should ask MPRI and PF since the Ok'd the release sites. That is a nonsensical question because it generates no revenue for the state to create habitat and public opportunities.


i don’t need to ask mphi because I think they are doing a great job and there is plenty of opportunities to hunt pheasants on state ground if your not a lazy hunter .i know the dnr had to come up with places to put your birds because they were told they are getting these birds and to figure out where to put them.i didn’t know your program was about generating funds for habitat , because you guys were preaching it was all hunter recruitment once you figured out you could get funds from that angle ,pushing it threw a lame duck .so my question does make Sense


Howitzer said:


> That is a question you should ask MPRI and PF since the Ok'd the release sites. That is a nonsensical question because it generates no revenue for the state to create habitat and public opportunities.


going recruitment once you figured out you could get funds if you worded it right


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Howitzer said:


> listen to the damn testimony.


Post the testimony for us.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> I only ask that you name an officer you referenced because you asked for an officer to be named that was referenced.
> I did find this.


This isn't a ask me I'll tell you if you tell me dating game.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> Post the testimony for us.


I already linked it, you ask for more than a colicky baby. It's in the archives, but you have to know the committee process and what to search for, this make the point that you think about the ideas and ask for information to be shoveled in your mouth while you do not take the time to understand all of the elements of the MPRI and MPHI programs.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Howitzer said:


> This isn't a ask me I'll tell you if you tell me dating game.


Deflection as usual.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Howitzer said:


> I already linked it, you ask for more than a colicky baby. It's in the archives, but you have to know the committee process and what to search for, this make the point that you think about the ideas and ask for information to be shoveled in your mouth while you do not take the time to understand all of the elements of the MPRI and MPHI programs.


It won't come up so I was hoping instead of directing us to the general information site you could provide a direct link.But I see you choose to play the go find it yourself routine.I do try but you are very selective on information and deflect many questions that don't fit your narrative it seems but I am still trying.I do believe many here see how you tend to negate,block,deflect,or ignore instead of debating or provide information Mr.Secretary.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

poz said:


> We hunt a farm that is about 1.5 miles from a game farm. Since the game farm opened, pheasant numbers are way up. And climb every year. So some birds are surviving and some are breeding with the native and surviving


I live by a hunt club. I dont belive for one minute that those birds survive. My dog gets a few. I see atleast 40 a yr hit by cars as they peck gravel on the side of the road. I see them hang on til we get 5" or so of snow and then the feather piles show up everywhere at my place. I typically see 1 or 2 roosters that make it til spring. Only once saw two roosters chase a hen in 19 yrs. 

Fox numbers are very high in my area.


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## Josh R (Dec 4, 2010)

You'd think a Secretary for a upstart organization who could potentially be begging for money, begging might not be the best word I'll admit, would act a little more then foolish. 
A few here are looking for the right answers or better answers and can't find them and you seem to ridicule them, geesh. Maybe some thoughts should be thoughts and not said. 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

Josh R said:


> You'd think a Secretary for a upstart organization who could potentially be begging for money, begging might not be the best word I'll admit, would act a little more then foolish.
> A few here are looking for the right answers or better answers and can't find them and you seem to ridicule them, geesh. Maybe some thoughts should be thoughts and not said.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


They don't need you.
They have someone in the legislature carrying their mail for them.

For the life of me, since this program was anounced, I have wondered why they ever bothered to post back here.

It doesn't advance their agenda.

It will be interesting to see how many youths signed up for the zero cost pheasant stamp, subtracted from last year's youth license sales.

The math will say all anyone needs to know.
It either brings additional youth in, or It doesn't.

Won't be able to hide from that.


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## RCA DOGS (Sep 24, 2011)

I really haven’t payed much attention to this thread, mainly because it’s the same arguments for the last year. But skimming through it I did notice a few things. 
To my knowledge Pheasant Forever has had nothing to do with this program. MPHI and MUCC asked for support on the pheasant stamp and they said only if it was mainly directed at habitat. PF is the habitat organization not the stock and shoot type. Pretty simple where they stand. Not sure how they are getting tied to this. 
MPHI and MPRI are two totally different groups as well. Very little crossover in there goal. 
From the few people within the DNR I have talked to prior to the releases starting they have basically stated. They have been told they have to support the MPHI wether they believe it’s good or not. 
Honestly I’m not sure how I feel about the program. If it can be self funded and only in certain areas to not take away from actual habitat. I can see the possible good it can do. I do believe that the MPHI people are fairly well organized and together on things.


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## fordman1 (Dec 12, 2015)

DirtySteve said:


> Better than having no stamp or no money going towards anything. Bring it on.


Maybe for guys that can't and don't want to put in the work for Wild birds but not me.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> Deflection as usual.


THE CO's name working Rose Lake is Todd Thorn, I only deflect your questions because it's a road to nowhere and more questions that are unneeded. I speak from a position of power because I am not an internet hunter and spend my time in the field and working directly with causes.

Could you please send the link to the poll you did last spring? For some reason, it's not coming up easily in the searches.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

Josh R said:


> You'd think a Secretary for a upstart organization who could potentially be begging for money, begging might not be the best word I'll admit, would act a little more then foolish.
> A few here are looking for the right answers or better answers and can't find them and you seem to ridicule them, geesh. Maybe some thoughts should be thoughts and not said.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Actually, I came back to this thread because I helping a lurker understand that the majority posting group on Michigan Sportsman is about 5 strong and does not have any affiliation with MPRI/PF hierarchy. 

I proved that point in less than 24 hours.

MPHI is unlike MPRI and PF on the standpoint that MPHI is inclusive to all hunters whether birds are released or not, in fact, I was invited to serve with MPRI and I still might but I want to see if they are going to be as relevant after the great success of MPHI. I cannot cite anything until an official report is done but preliminary polls, questionnaires, field reports are far beyond the benchmarks of what we would view as a success. 

What I really want to see is an end to the stalemate of PF and MPHI, Howard Vicent has conveyed support for MPHI on the basis of R3. What I want to see is the Michigan leadership get to the table and make some concessions because at this point the interest of you and your cohorts here at MS is not going to be addressed. If you talk to Bill Vanerzowden my name is Jeff and he will attest that I want to bring an understanding of both camps to the table.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Howitzer said:


> Actually, I came back to this thread because I helping a lurker understand that the majority posting group on Michigan Sportsman is about 5 strong and does not have any affiliation with MPRI/PF hierarchy.
> 
> I proved that point in less than 24 hours.
> 
> ...


https://www.michigan-sportsman.com/...-or-not-to-release.634939/page-3#post-7188179
See that's how it works!


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

As of last week, 163,000 got the pheasant endorsement those numbers were given to me verbally I will ask if there is anything I can get in writing. Expectations were 22K to 40K, with that that said MPRI/PF is being quick to go on the attack because 163K is a number that they cannot ignore or hide from.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> https://www.michigan-sportsman.com/...-or-not-to-release.634939/page-3#post-7188179
> See that's how it works!


Not really, but OK.


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## RCA DOGS (Sep 24, 2011)

Just because 163000 got the stamp doesn’t mean 163000 are in favor of the MPHI. 
Roger, as someone interested in the MPRI and PF I would be interested in who you are. You keep saying you are involved with these groups and speak as you have influence. I mean no disrespect at all I’m just curious who im listening to. My names Dan Goodrich and I’m involved with Clinton county PF and the Clinton Lakes Pheasant CoOp. Like I’ve stated. I’m unsure of the MPRI being viable so far but I do come with a open mind.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

RCA DOGS said:


> Just because 163000 got the stamp doesn’t mean 163000 are in favor of the MPHI.
> Roger, as someone interested in the MPRI and PF I would be interested in who you are. You keep saying you are involved with these groups and speak as you have influence. I mean no disrespect at all I’m just curious who im listening to. My names Dan Goodrich and I’m involved with Clinton county PF and the Clinton Lakes Pheasant CoOp. Like I’ve stated. I’m unsure of the MPRI being viable so far but I do come with a open mind.



All true, the number is a measure of interest in Pheasant Hunting. PM sent.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Just for one example a friend with diabetes at age 58 on disability (fixed Income)living with his mother has the stamp in which i asked why.His reply was that when getting his base and deer license the asked if he wanted one and that it didn't cost anything.So he did.He definitely won't buy one in the future due to his health and income.I have the stamp because I hunt for wild pheasants and need to have it.I am pro habitat but not in the release club.
I will buy one however without hesitation.We must take into consideration that the people issuing licenses can create a skew.They work the register and hardly any of them honestly know what they are doing.
We have lost tens of thousands of hunters.What is the realistic number of stamps to be purchased when the time comes?

And yes Howitzer that is how it works.
I still can't seem to find and listen to the testimony that you would like me to listen to and I asked for help with a direct link possibly.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

birdhntr said:


> Just for one example a friend with diabetes at age 58 on disability (fixed Income)living with his mother has the stamp in which i asked why.His reply was that when getting his base and deer license the asked if he wanted one and that it didn't cost anything.So he did.He definitely won't buy one in the future due to his health and income.I have the stamp because I hunt for wild pheasants and need to have it.I am pro habitat but not in the release club.
> I will buy one however without hesitation.We must take into consideration that the people issuing licenses can create a skew.They work the register and hardly any of them honestly know what they are doing.
> We have lost tens of thousands of hunters.What is the realistic number of stamps to be purchased when the time comes?
> 
> ...


The survey statisticians will figure out the margins one of the purposes of the free endorsement is to get a sample to survey. I personally think and it's only a guess based on what I have learned this year is stamps at $25 will get 60-80K purchasers, I can't argue about what it will be because it's just a guess so take it at that. I think that the MPRI and MPHI working together on hunters to fund habitat is the only real way to win and have an effective statewide pheasant hunt in Michigan. 

https://www.house.mi.gov/SharedVideo/PlayVideoArchive.html?video=NATU-110519.mp4


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## fordman1 (Dec 12, 2015)

birdhntr said:


> Just for one example a friend with diabetes at age 58 on disability (fixed Income)living with his mother has the stamp in which i asked why.His reply was that when getting his base and deer license the asked if he wanted one and that it didn't cost anything.So he did.He definitely won't buy one in the future due to his health and income.I have the stamp because I hunt for wild pheasants and need to have it.I am pro habitat but not in the release club.
> I will buy one however without hesitation.We must take into consideration that the people issuing licenses can create a skew.They work the register and hardly any of them honestly know what they are doing.
> We have lost tens of thousands of hunters.What is the realistic number of stamps to be purchased when the time comes?
> 
> ...


Yep, your friend and about 159,999 others that were told the same thing or asked for the Sharptail stamp.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

I dont understand all the bickering. I am for both the habitat and the bird release program.

I would like to see them just ask if you would like to donate a dollar or any amount to pheasant habitat when you buy your license. The last couple of years they did the same thing with sportsman against hunger. I gave money every time I purchased a tag for me or my boys. I easily gave them $20 over the year.


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## Howitzer (Nov 1, 2004)

DirtySteve said:


> I dont understand all the bickering. I am for both the habitat and the bird release program.
> 
> I would like to see them just ask if you would like to donate a dollar or any amount to pheasant habitat when you buy your license. The last couple of years they did the same thing with sportsman against hunger. I gave money every time I purchased a tag for me or my boys. I easily gave them $20 over the year.


That's a great idea Steve and I will see what the logistics are for that. My grand vision is to get the program running to the point where stakeholders like Cabela's Meijer would contribute the money or at least a big chunk.


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## Zeboy (Oct 4, 2002)

DirtySteve said:


> I dont understand all the bickering. I am for both the habitat and the bird release program.
> 
> I would like to see them just ask if you would like to donate a dollar or any amount to pheasant habitat when you buy your license. The last couple of years they did the same thing with sportsman against hunger. I gave money every time I purchased a tag for me or my boys. I easily gave them $20 over the year.


AMEN!

I am an avid bird (and duck) hunter. I 've hunted all over the west and midwest. I totally get "the habitat thing". I haven't bothered with the pheasant release program this year. I have no problem with it. I see plenty of good things about it. I just don't get the people on their UNENDING CRUSADE to bash it.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

DirtySteve said:


> I dont understand all the bickering. I am for both the habitat and the bird release program.
> 
> I would like to see them just ask if you would like to donate a dollar or any amount to pheasant habitat when you buy your license. The last couple of years they did the same thing with sportsman against hunger. I gave money every time I purchased a tag for me or my boys. I easily gave them $20 over the year.


In the beginning the argument was Pennsylvania is so why not us.The state of Pennsylvania is running close to a 4 million dollar program funded by a stamp by approximately 25 percent.Roughly 200,000 birds released with roughly half recovered at best.The current argument is why if it's not gathering folks at game preserves in growing interest compared to a public game area and many believe that is because it is free so the interest is up.The same question that comes up is why not just go to a game farm and pay to play.
Although Michigan pheasant hunting took a dive they were still harvesting a lot more wild birds in the 70's-80's then today during the put n take program which brought them in masses.
Under the current plan and the program continues to expand how will we satisfy the masses and where will we have ground to do so.Currently this program has very little room for growth and has very limited funding.
One must ask themselves where will these 60,000 to a 160,000 pheasant hunters have the space.
Simple math tells me that if 10,000 hunt on a Sunday and if there was a 160,000 acres of available pheasant habitat that's 16 acres per hunter.
Minnesota has the best practice currently.
Space is the biggest issue and I feel that a stamp that is for land acquisition,restoration,erosion and waterways protection is more proactive and benefits all wildlife and outdoorsman of all kinds.It will never be what it was (quantity)
A Heritage or Futurity stamp with a long term plan focused on critical areas pertaining to the environmental concerns would be better.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

birdhntr said:


> In the beginning the argument was Pennsylvania is so why not us.The state of Pennsylvania is running close to a 4 million dollar program funded by a stamp by approximately 25 percent.Roughly 200,000 birds released with roughly half recovered at best.The current argument is why if it's not gathering folks at game preserves in growing interest compared to a public game area and many believe that is because it is free so the interest is up.The same question that comes up is why not just go to a game farm and pay to play.
> Although Michigan pheasant hunting took a dive they were still harvesting a lot more wild birds in the 70's-80's then today during the put n take program which brought them in masses.
> Under the current plan and the program continues to expand how will we satisfy the masses and where will we have ground to do so.Currently this program has very little room for growth and has very limited funding.
> One must ask themselves where will these 60,000 to a 160,000 pheasant hunters have the space.
> ...


I have never in my life hunted at a game farm. I dont like the idea of the cost and a minimum amount of birds you have to buy. Then on top of that you have a time slot that you get the field. There are alot of negaitves with going to a farm. Then there is the entire idea that younk know there are x amount of birds in that field to go after. It is guaranteed success.

I have hunted the lapeer field 4 times. Had a total of 6 points with the dog resulting in 6 flushes and 3 birds taken. I have completely struck out twice. I have gone on a moments notice when i have had 1.5-2 hrs free on a saturday or sunday. No appointment necasary. No time slot I have to be there. And no gurantee of how many birds will be out there just placed waiting for me to shoot. Everytime I have looked into the cost of a game farm it seems like i am in for atleast a $90 expense or more. That is if I can find a buddy to go and buy his share of birds. Or I take my two sons and foot the bill for all of us at the minimum price for 3 guns. 

To me the state program is alot more like actual hunting than a game farm could ever be. If i bought a $25 or $50 stamp and could go once or 20 times at my leasure with no gurantees of anything I like that idea alot more than saying just go to a game farm. It isnt the same at all to me.

Another positive I see to this put n take program is i would think it would take hunting pressure off areas that have wild birds. I went to Verona 3-4 times last year and had a blast. It was over an hr drive for me and there was alot of hunting pressure in my opinion. Seems like this would just make areas like that better.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

RCA DOGS said:


> When you get to CRP sign ups I’m not sure they can make this process harder or more confusing. I was just talking to neighbor about CRP and trying to help them. Sign ups for our area typically don’t happen. The erodibility of the west keeps acres away and in Michigan it seems with few acres available they never are able to fill for it’s a short window. CREP and SAFE and the whole alphabet of programs complexity turn people away.


Nahh.
It's free money measured against cropping.
As soon as the balance swings, people get out.
Simple economics.
Been there, done that.


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## RCA DOGS (Sep 24, 2011)

Gamekeeper said:


> Nahh.
> It's free money measured against cropping.
> As soon as the balance swings, people get out.
> Simple economics.
> Been there, done that.


 It’s not free money. There are standards and maintenance. Also for the land owner who doesn’t farm themselves it’s still rental for there investment property.
I never commented on the concept of CRP but the way of finding information on different programs and what qualifies is not as clear as it could be.


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## FNC (Jun 5, 2007)

Howitzer said:


> The Sharptail stamp has been static at about 5K per year, so statistically you deduct 5K and you have your number. There is no fudging or anything like that, the DNR, MPRI, PF and MPHI, R3, MUCC were in the same room when it was decided to do it this way. The reason they are combined is/was timing, we had to get the survey out before the new licenses were to go online and another line item/stamp was not possible. The licenses with endorsements will be surveyed for hard numbers.
> 
> Let me repeat that in fewer words, everyone was in the same room at a horseshoe table agreed on the free stamp/endorsement as done/worded there were no "no votes" we are well aware that the integrity of the data is the most important aspect of gauging success.


Thanks - makes sense.

Frank


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## fordman1 (Dec 12, 2015)

Howitzer said:


> Birthunte, Josh and Fordman. If have not been active with MPRI, Adopt a game area or PF why don't you? They do have the money for habitat MPRI has spent millions and has many millions more. They could give you Minnesota with change to spare.
> 
> "The MPRI coalition applied for and received approval for 40,000 Conservation Reserve Program SAFE (State Acres for Wildlife Enhancement) acres and $61 million for incentive payments to landowners to benefit pheasants, mallards, monarchs and other grassland wildlife."


I am one of the few original members of a PF chapter started 20 + years ago and have been a PF member for 29 years. Our chapter was putting money and seed into Verona before any one ever thought about it and we we're the Only one's doing it, back then we worked with Mike Parker.


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## Mark4486 (Oct 14, 2015)

I have read this entire thread from start till now. I get the reason for this program but don’t agree with it. Placing farm birds to me seems like a bandaide on a bigger problem. Why wouldn’t you want to fix habitat and bring down predators then the birds will be there... “build it and they will come”. I am not as versed in the studies as most but if we continue to release birds for let’s just say 10yrs then the funding is lost or something changes in the laws. Poof there goes pheasant hunting. Plus if money was to go to buying habitat it’s always worth something. I don’t know enough about these programs to bash them but in any situation when money and suits get involved it never ends well.


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## Chessieman (Dec 8, 2009)

I keep hearing buy and build habit for the Pheasant. How long do you think it will take to build this habit? There are* THOUSANDS* of us here in Michigan that have been doing that through our local PF. I myself have been this for 30 years on my property, the majority with PF's help. Help comes in form of seed and fertilizer, some of which may have cost besides the membership. $100 annual fuel bill and the thousands into the equipment just a little more money.
After 30 years sure it should be done, but *EVERY YEAR* you have to plant your Sorghum for winter feed. You must have a nesting fields with pollinators for the chicks. You must have tall standing fields for the spring nesting. You must have late fall fields plowed or brush hogged that are to be worked in the coming spring. You *CAN NOT *leave these fields for the spring unless you want to steer around those if found nests. Now let us talk about cover, planting the White Pines with low slopping branches which must be trimmed that way every year until old enough. The Spruce trees which throw the best extreme winter cover. Now just hope in the extreme spring sleet storm the mature birds are near enough to utilize these or they are dead. Now comes the Redbush, Dogwood and dozens of that must be planted and developed for avian cover.
Now the little sticking point of this whole thing. Is there existing Pheasant stock to reproduce natural? Are you ready for the extreme spring weather that will wipe out 90% of your existing birds?
My point is there is a lot more that believing in those "Field of Dream". I guess I am a believer, but my Pheasant stock is steady but "why the hell is it not expanding three times the numbers every year"? Life in the Field of Dreams are different than in this keyboard world. As I was sitting up gun blind last night over previous 10' high Sorghum, two hens flew from a pine row into the 2' high snow packed Sorghum in front of me. Both were the same light brown color of the Sorghum. Color changing *Chameleon *hens, *HELL YES*, after all it's my "Field of Dreams".


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

P


Chessieman said:


> I keep hearing buy and build habit for the Pheasant. How long do you think it will take to build this habit? There are* THOUSANDS* of us here in Michigan that have been doing that through our local PF. I myself have been this for 30 years on my property, the majority with PF's help. Help comes in form of seed and fertilizer, some of which may have cost besides the membership. $100 annual fuel bill and the thousands into the equipment just a little more money.
> After 30 years sure it should be done, but *EVERY YEAR* you have to plant your Sorghum for winter feed. You must have a nesting fields with pollinators for the chicks. You must have tall standing fields for the spring nesting. You must have late fall fields plowed or brush hogged that are to be worked in the coming spring. You *CAN NOT *leave these fields for the spring unless you want to steer around those if found nests. Now let us talk about cover, planting the White Pines with low slopping branches which must be trimmed that way every year until old enough. The Spruce trees which throw the best extreme winter cover. Now just hope in the extreme spring sleet storm the mature birds are near enough to utilize these or they are dead. Now comes the Redbush, Dogwood and dozens of that must be planted and developed for avian cover.
> Now the little sticking point of this whole thing. Is there existing Pheasant stock to reproduce natural? Are you ready for the extreme spring weather that will wipe out 90% of your existing birds?
> My point is there is a lot more that believing in those "Field of Dream". I guess I am a believer, but my Pheasant stock is steady but "why the hell is it not expanding three times the numbers every year"? Life in the Field of Dreams are different than in this keyboard world. As I was sitting up gun blind last night over previous 10' high Sorghum, two hens flew from a pine row into the 2' high snow packed Sorghum in front of me. Both were the same light brown color of the Sorghum. Color changing *Chameleon *hens, *HELL YES*, after all it's my "Field of Dreams".


People want that but aren’t willing to pay for it.

The other reality is that michigan doesn’t have the money to continue any sort of planting program without a dedicated funding source.

So your tax dollars are going to pay for somebody downstate to shoot at pen raised pheasants.

That’s just the way it’s going to be.

Sportsmen should be concerned that with ever tightening budget restraints and ever higher costs, that every targeted species is going to end up with a targeted funding source.


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## ab5228 (Nov 13, 2009)

Chessieman said:


> I keep hearing buy and build habit for the Pheasant. How long do you think it will take to build this habit? There are* THOUSANDS* of us here in Michigan that have been doing that through our local PF. I myself have been this for 30 years on my property, the majority with PF's help. Help comes in form of seed and fertilizer, some of which may have cost besides the membership. $100 annual fuel bill and the thousands into the equipment just a little more money.
> After 30 years sure it should be done, but *EVERY YEAR* you have to plant your Sorghum for winter feed. You must have a nesting fields with pollinators for the chicks. You must have tall standing fields for the spring nesting. You must have late fall fields plowed or brush hogged that are to be worked in the coming spring. You *CAN NOT *leave these fields for the spring unless you want to steer around those if found nests. Now let us talk about cover, planting the White Pines with low slopping branches which must be trimmed that way every year until old enough. The Spruce trees which throw the best extreme winter cover. Now just hope in the extreme spring sleet storm the mature birds are near enough to utilize these or they are dead. Now comes the Redbush, Dogwood and dozens of that must be planted and developed for avian cover.
> Now the little sticking point of this whole thing. Is there existing Pheasant stock to reproduce natural? Are you ready for the extreme spring weather that will wipe out 90% of your existing birds?
> My point is there is a lot more that believing in those "Field of Dream". I guess I am a believer, but my Pheasant stock is steady but "why the hell is it not expanding three times the numbers every year"? Life in the Field of Dreams are different than in this keyboard world. As I was sitting up gun blind last night over previous 10' high Sorghum, two hens flew from a pine row into the 2' high snow packed Sorghum in front of me. Both were the same light brown color of the Sorghum. Color changing *Chameleon *hens, *HELL YES*, after all it's my "Field of Dreams".


I’ll call your spruce and raise you a cattail marsh when it comes to winter cover...I started working on habitat on my parents property in 2010. We saw one rooster this spring there. So I know it must be nice to watch birds using what you worked on. 

You already know this but it’s landscape level habitat that would make a real difference. The only things that are going to cause a landscape level change are population and economic reasons. Like something that would cause a change in agriculture practices. Something that would cause acreage to go out of production. Like the farm booms and busts of the past. 

I would like to see a buffer of grass between dirt roads and farm fields personally. There are a lot of dirt roads where the corn field starts on the edge of the road. I’m all for any conservation practice that provides for wildlife. I’m also for farmers being able to make a profit from their investment. I don’t think we need to make laws that limit that. 

I think conservation acreage is important but what is happening on the “non-conservation” acres matters significantly. Economic, population, and other factors that lead to land use practices is the number one factor. 

I think we’ve got it pretty good though. There are pheasants, grouse, and woodcock on public lands within driving distance for all of us. The average guy can afford to go hunt them. But oh yea this thread is about release schedule for pen birds my bad.


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## Chessieman (Dec 8, 2009)

All yea, the Cattails are a must, the ultimate winter cover. In the large Rye field I just planted this fall I made 2 berms that will hold 3 feet of water I am assuming they will plant them self off of my 1 1/2 acre wetland surrounded pond.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

fordman1 said:


> If it passes Every pheasant hunter has to buy the stamp, except preserve hunters or those under 16. The bill draft only puts 25% of the stamp revenue towards habitat. A mandatory stamp for stocking birds is Dumb.


As an old bird hunter I can assure you if it passes, i'll just drop out of pheasant hunting altogether. Wonder how that works for their hunter recruitment. If someone wants to shoot pheasants just spend a little of your "own" money. If the DNR doesn't sell tags like the last time it's just an excuse to have someone else pay for their shoot.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

DirtySteve said:


> I live by a hunt club. I dont belive for one minute that those birds survive. My dog gets a few. I see atleast 40 a yr hit by cars as they peck gravel on the side of the road. I see them hang on til we get 5" or so of snow and then the feather piles show up everywhere at my place. I typically see 1 or 2 roosters that make it til spring. Only once saw two roosters chase a hen in 19 yrs.
> 
> Fox numbers are very high in my area.


I agree. I spoke with the owner of a very nice shooting preserve and he told me that despite all the work on habitat and food plots, the preserve birds do NOT make it. In fact, the abundance of wild birds in his area has dwindled. Sure wish the money spent on this short term program was chosen by biologists and not politicians. That won't happen though.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

Josh R said:


> I have and will continue to do what I can to help.
> 
> I've hunted plenty of state games areas(roughly 98% of my time afield) with both my dogs the past 8 years for pheasants and have done really well, better then anyone could ever imagine.
> 
> ...


As I've mentioned before, our PF Chapter invited 300 to learn and hopefully sign up to CRP and had no takers. It's ALL about the money. Match what a farmer can make and maybe, just maybe they will sign up. Some want no part of a government program for various reasons.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

Chessieman said:


> I keep hearing buy and build habit for the Pheasant. How long do you think it will take to build this habit? There are* THOUSANDS* of us here in Michigan that have been doing that through our local PF. I myself have been this for 30 years on my property, the majority with PF's help. Help comes in form of seed and fertilizer, some of which may have cost besides the membership. $100 annual fuel bill and the thousands into the equipment just a little more money.
> After 30 years sure it should be done, but *EVERY YEAR* you have to plant your Sorghum for winter feed. You must have a nesting fields with pollinators for the chicks. You must have tall standing fields for the spring nesting. You must have late fall fields plowed or brush hogged that are to be worked in the coming spring. You *CAN NOT *leave these fields for the spring unless you want to steer around those if found nests. Now let us talk about cover, planting the White Pines with low slopping branches which must be trimmed that way every year until old enough. The Spruce trees which throw the best extreme winter cover. Now just hope in the extreme spring sleet storm the mature birds are near enough to utilize these or they are dead. Now comes the Redbush, Dogwood and dozens of that must be planted and developed for avian cover.
> Now the little sticking point of this whole thing. Is there existing Pheasant stock to reproduce natural? Are you ready for the extreme spring weather that will wipe out 90% of your existing birds?
> My point is there is a lot more that believing in those "Field of Dream". I guess I am a believer, but my Pheasant stock is steady but "why the hell is it not expanding three times the numbers every year"? Life in the Field of Dreams are different than in this keyboard world. As I was sitting up gun blind last night over previous 10' high Sorghum, two hens flew from a pine row into the 2' high snow packed Sorghum in front of me. Both were the same light brown color of the Sorghum. Color changing *Chameleon *hens, *HELL YES*, after all it's my "Field of Dreams".


Great job! I've been doing the same thing. No luck yet, but I'm still hoping the DNR follows thru with some "wild" relocated birds like they promised at the start of the MPRI. In the mean time all do what I can myself.


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## fordman1 (Dec 12, 2015)

Mi. Chuck said:


> As an old bird hunter I can assure you if it passes, i'll just drop out of pheasant hunting altogether. Wonder how that works for their hunter recruitment. If someone wants to shoot pheasants just spend a little of your "own" money. If the DNR doesn't sell tags like the last time it's just an excuse to have someone else pay for their shoot.


I agree. A poor business model to milk more money from a small group.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

Mark4486 said:


> I have read this entire thread from start till now. I get the reason for this program but don’t agree with it. Placing farm birds to me seems like a bandaide on a bigger problem. Why wouldn’t you want to fix habitat and bring down predators then the birds will be there... “build it and they will come”. I am not as versed in the studies as most but if we continue to release birds for let’s just say 10yrs then the funding is lost or something changes in the laws. Poof there goes pheasant hunting. Plus if money was to go to buying habitat it’s always worth something. I don’t know enough about these programs to bash them but in any situation when money and suits get involved it never ends well.


Looks like no one is really digging into what's scientifically going on with the demise of the pheasant throughout the entire midwest, so with that being the case, why not partner with large private companies who will control access and plant the best birds they can get under those controlled conditions. Outdoor groups like PF can help with many obstacles and let's see what happens in a few years. Hopefully the birds may flourish and spread without modern farming techniques, pesticides, predators, and other negative factors. I've done it inside a very secure and large compound and hopefully any native birds may be multiplying. It's sure better than the same old things. Works in DETROIT, right.


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## Guy63 (Jan 7, 2018)

Been gone deer hunting looks like the same crying going on here nothing to see. I did see some roosters while sitting in the blind and a female in a little tree eating some berries or whatnot from it.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Guy63 said:


> Been gone deer hunting looks like the same crying going on here nothing to see. I did see some roosters while sitting in the blind and a female in a little tree eating some berries or whatnot from it.


A female? Was this a release area?


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## Guy63 (Jan 7, 2018)

No my property in the thumb


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## Possum209 (Aug 5, 2017)

hunterdau2 said:


> If it is 6000 birds a year , 12000 total that figures out to 545 birds per sga or 68 birds per week released . As i stated i hunt here several times a week and during the weekdays there is very little pressure and i am not seeing these numbers ! There are certain open fields that are good habitat the rest is swamp and wooded areas . It isn't hard to check the whole area and get a good idea if anything was planted. Who is making sure we are getting what was payed for and promised.





hunterdau2 said:


> If it is 6000 birds a year , 12000 total that figures out to 545 birds per sga or 68 birds per week released . As i stated i hunt here several times a week and during the weekdays there is very little pressure and i am not seeing these numbers ! There are certain open fields that are good habitat the rest is swamp and wooded areas . It isn't hard to check the whole area and get a good idea if anything was planted. Who is making sure we are getting what was payed for and promised.


I agree. The first week after gun season I know that planted them at Minden City but there's no way they planted them this past Friday. Not sure if they did Saturday as I was not able to make it out. However there was fresh snow Friday evening and I was driving around three area at about midnight. Not one vehicle track had been through since the snow which covered roads at dusk. Unless they air dropped them or threw them in the swamp somewhere.


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## Possum209 (Aug 5, 2017)

Tomfive5 said:


> I have heard of people finding Hens that have been shot on some of the release sites. This obviously means that pen raised birds are being released where there is a wild population. This should not happen and goes against all things conservation. I will be honest with you I was 100% against the program when I first heard about. I still do not like it, but have come around a bit for the sole reason that I do know a few who used it as a opportunity to get kids into upland hunting. I have not been to any of the sites, my dog is currently on long term IR. However if he is better in a month the release sites will be a great place for me to get him some work, especially because I currently cannot afford to go to a hunt club because his vet bills have drained by Fun Fund (and then some).
> So my point is, its not the end of the world if the MPHI continues to exist, and may even end up being positive. however the people in charge need to recognize that there is a huntable population of wild pheasants in this state, and we should do everything we can to maintain and improve our wild pheasant population.


I've put up a lot of hens on a couple of the areas of release sight


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

Possum209 said:


> I agree. The first week after gun season I know that planted them at Minden City but there's no way they planted them this past Friday. Not sure if they did Saturday as I was not able to make it out. However there was fresh snow Friday evening and I was driving around three area at about midnight. Not one vehicle track had been through since the snow which covered roads at dusk. Unless they air dropped them or threw them in the swamp somewhere.


It is 5800 birds this year and 5800 next year. They are releasing 1 bird per 2 acres of field at each location. I hunt the lapeer area and they put out 40 per week. They put them out sometime after sundown and before sunrise on random days each week. 

The season started back up on a sunday. If they released birds in the early AM sunday they would not have to release birds again before the following weekend. They could wait until after the fillwong weekend and do it monday thru friday. If they put them put sunday morning technically they shouldnt put them out again before the next sunday morning.....no reason they coukdnt wait longer.


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## Hackman (Aug 13, 2008)

At a couple of the release sites I,ve put up birds in the middle of the week in the corners of the areas in thick cover. So just because you can't go during the weekend doesn't mean there are no birds. The extra walking and brush busting makes it more realistic , the birds definitely get spread out. My dog caught a cripple rooster with no tail and I noticed pics a rooster birds with no tails. Are some of the pen raised pheasants to young too develope tail feathers?


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

Hackman said:


> At a couple of the release sites I,ve put up birds in the middle of the week in the corners of the areas in thick cover. So just because you can't go during the weekend doesn't mean there are no birds. The extra walking and brush busting makes it more realistic , the birds definitely get spread out. My dog caught a cripple rooster with no tail and I noticed pics a rooster birds with no tails. Are some of the pen raised pheasants to young too develope tail feathers?


The pheasants I've raised all had tails, even young ones. Young are not fully matured with all their colors but should have tails. Sounds like "deal" birds that may have been overcrowded. There is a pecking order, and looks like some got their butts pecked.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

Possum209 said:


> I've put up a lot of hens on a couple of the areas of release sight


In previous threads we were told birds would not be released in areas with wild populations.A couple reasons were not to impact the states Pheasant restoration project,genetic dilution,and concentrating hunters on wild populations.I attempted to find out where this land void of pheasants was to run my dogs and see what I found.I truly still question who came to the conclusion and how.Hope no one pops at hens under the premise of it being a release area void of wilds.Hey it's a released bird "shoot it"..


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## chemjunkie (Sep 16, 2015)

I went out yesterday and my dog and I flushed two and got one. One thing I noticed compared to the early season is that the ground cover has been trampled down significantly. Areas that used to be good cover have been reduced to foot trails. We had to work harder than the first two times out and ended up flushing one from heavy brush and another from the standing corn. With all the hunters and dogs it appears to me that the birds are being pushed into thicker areas. I liked it, as it teaches both me and the dog that things shouldn't come so easy.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

They seek cover.The cover is laid down from previous snow/wet snow,freezing rain.It is not from traffic 


chemjunkie said:


> I went out yesterday and my dog and I flushed two and got one. One thing I noticed compared to the early season is that the ground cover has been trampled down significantly. Areas that used to be good cover have been reduced to foot trails. We had to work harder than the first two times out and ended up flushing one from heavy brush and another from the standing corn. With all the hunters and dogs it appears to me that the birds are being pushed into thicker areas. I liked it, as it teaches both me and the dog that things shouldn't come so easy.


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## chemjunkie (Sep 16, 2015)

It is both. I agree with you on the switch grass and the field weeds, that has predominately been knocked down by snow and weather, but the trails through stuff like raspberry bushes I couldn't walk through last year is definitely foot traffic. Much more pressure with the pheasant release program. Last year in the second season I saw one person in three visits and he was running rabbits. Yesterday there were 6-7 groups of up to three people each. Part of me liked the solitude of last year, the other part likes the increased action of this year. Either way I am happy to get out and the dog is geeked to be able to run.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

birdhntr said:


> In previous threads we were told birds would not be released in areas with wild populations.A couple reasons were not to impact the states Pheasant restoration project,genetic dilution,and concentrating hunters on wild populations.I attempted to find out where this land void of pheasants was to run my dogs and see what I found.I truly still question who came to the conclusion and how.Hope no one pops at hens under the premise of it being a release area void of wilds.Hey it's a released bird "shoot it"..


You're right, but it's also possible that the bird breeder gets a little more for roosters and a "young" rooster just happened to get into a crate. Accidents happen.


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

I live by the Minden game area so hunt it a couple times a week and am not seeing any difference from last year when they didn't plant . Opening weekend was the only time i actually saw an above average number of birds. Was wondering who is doing the oversite on bird planting, is there a DNR officer with them? I am attending a outdoor function thurs in Bad Axe and will try to talk to a biologist and see what i can find out.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

chemjunkie said:


> It is both. I agree with you on the switch grass and the field weeds, that has predominately been knocked down by snow and weather, but the trails through stuff like raspberry bushes I couldn't walk through last year is definitely foot traffic. Much more pressure with the pheasant release program. Last year in the second season I saw one person in three visits and he was running rabbits. Yesterday there were 6-7 groups of up to three people each. Part of me liked the solitude of last year, the other part likes the increased action of this year. Either way I am happy to get out and the dog is geeked to be able to run.


You were,hunting pheasants there last year before the release program?I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

hunterdau2 said:


> I live by the Minden game area so hunt it a couple times a week and am not seeing any difference from last year when they didn't plant . Opening weekend was the only time i actually saw an above average number of birds. Was wondering who is doing the oversite on bird planting, is there a DNR officer with them? I am attending a outdoor function thurs in Bad Axe and will try to talk to a biologist and see what i can find out.


I would doubt that a CO would be involved in planting birds. The do alot of tasks within their job title but i would think someone below their pay grade would be running the pheasant operation. The DNR has contracted hunt clubs from around the state. I would guess their employees that plant the birds at the huntclubs are thenines planting birds in the field.


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## birdhntr (Jan 25, 2014)

hunterdau2 said:


> I live by the Minden game area so hunt it a couple times a week and am not seeing any difference from last year when they didn't plant . Opening weekend was the only time i actually saw an above average number of birds. Was wondering who is doing the oversite on bird planting, is there a DNR officer with them? I am attending a outdoor function thurs in Bad Axe and will try to talk to a biologist and see what i can find out.


So it's safe to say that wild birds are at the areas pre determined to not have wild birds.I ******* knew it was bs.Prove me wrong now.


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## chemjunkie (Sep 16, 2015)

birdhntr said:


> You were,hunting pheasants there last year before the release program?I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly


Yes. Last year I went to a SGA that has habitat managed for pheasants, I went out four times and flushed four birds, all wild roosters. 2018 was my first year pheasant hunting and I thought that level of action was enough to keep me coming back. Even if others think that was slow I was happy cause you gotta be in the woods and on the water for good things to happen. Nothing happens on the couch while typing on message boards (LOL).


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

I'm at the one down the road from My house a couple times a week. Year round.
There were a few remaining hens down there this year, though I saw no broods this spring.
Last winter I saw very few birds down there.

It's actually quite suitable for a game preserve. Surrounded by edge to edge farming. Ditches cleared. Hedgerow brush removed to get in another row. New dikes, drains, and rebuilt pumps.

I wouldn't anguish over remnant stock. The properties can't produce the concentrated killing these initiatives promote. It's not a well that refills with ground water after a rain.

Any of them with good access to the public get sieved.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

birdhntr said:


> So it's safe to say that wild birds are at the areas pre determined to not have wild birds.I ******* knew it was bs.Prove me wrong now.


 I think he believes birds are being planted everywhere in Minden.....which they arent.


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## Mi. Chuck (Jun 12, 2018)

Gamekeeper said:


> I'm at the one down the road from My house a couple times a week. Year round.
> There were a few remaining hens down there this year, though I saw no broods this spring.
> Last winter I saw very few birds down there.
> 
> ...


Same thing in areas that I used to hunt. Land that came off of CRP went into mass production. Even cattail marshes were drained, tiled, and nothing lives there anymore. Spotting a wild pheasant is rare these days.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

Mi. Chuck said:


> Same thing in areas that I used to hunt. Land that came off of CRP went into mass production. Even cattail marshes were drained, tiled, and nothing lives there anymore. Spotting a wild pheasant is rare these days.


 It’s an expensive fantasy promoted by aging baby boomers.


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

If there were birds planted last weekend the sea of orange on Mills road would have had shooting , as it was barely any shooting Sat . Also talked to other hunters Sat and was told same thing no birds and a butt load of bird hunters. As to my statement about wild birds , last year hunted every weekend and some during the week and saw WILD birds both roosters and hens in that area. This year i drove down Palms rd to the end before the season opened and saw hens and a couple roosters along the rd and they scooted off to the north (private property) . As for them planting in a different area there is not a lot of suitable pheasant hunting areas in minden sga except the east side , mostly swamp and woods excluding the blueberry patch beyond the end of palms rd.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

hunterdau2 said:


> If there were birds planted last weekend the sea of orange on Mills road would have had shooting , as it was barely any shooting Sat . Also talked to other hunters Sat and was told same thing no birds and a butt load of bird hunters. As to my statement about wild birds , last year hunted every weekend and some during the week and saw WILD birds both roosters and hens in that area. This year i drove down Palms rd to the end before the season opened and saw hens and a couple roosters along the rd and they scooted off to the north (private property) . As for them planting in a different area there is not a lot of suitable pheasant hunting areas in minden sga except the east side , mostly swamp and woods excluding the blueberry patch beyond the end of palms rd.


There was no requirement for them to release birds for last weekend. They would need to release sometime from last sunday to this sat according to the info put out by the DNR.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

DirtySteve said:


> There was no requirement for them to release birds for last weekend. They would need to release sometime from last sunday to this sat according to the info put out by the DNR.


I'd guess some of that is to decrease the number of truck followers.


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

I understand planting them at different times to stop truck chasers but isn't this program to increase chances of seeing and shooting these birds. The majority of hunters can only hunt on the weekend they are not within short driving distance or have to work. Planting the birds closer too the weekend would give more bang for the money being spent.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

hunterdau2 said:


> I understand planting them at different times to stop truck chasers but isn't this program to increase chances of seeing and shooting these birds. The majority of hunters can only hunt on the weekend they are not within short driving distance or have to work. Planting the birds closer too the weekend would give more bang for the money being spent.


Do you mean "Bang!" as in conflicts and shootings?


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

As in having more chances to harvest the planted birds . I rarely see people out there on the weekdays in the afternoon can't say in the mornings so figure the harvest rate would be better if planted say about thurs.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

hunterdau2 said:


> As in having more chances to harvest the planted birds . I rarely see people out there on the weekdays in the afternoon can't say in the mornings so figure the harvest rate would be better if planted say about thurs.


you either make it a crazy shootout or you plant birds when no one is there, and let them dig in a bit.

This isn't rocket science.
People are nuts.
They'll chase the trucks.

All the eastern states have been running these shoots for years. When we couldn't afford to.
It's the same crazy greedy dangerous **** every year.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

hunterdau2 said:


> I understand planting them at different times to stop truck chasers but isn't this program to increase chances of seeing and shooting these birds. The majority of hunters can only hunt on the weekend they are not within short driving distance or have to work. Planting the birds closer too the weekend would give more bang for the money being spent.


I went last weekend in lapeer. Saw nothing. I had guy pull in when i was leaving he had is young son. They had just driven over from the sanillac field and they saw nothing there. When he asked if I had any luck he just shrugged it off and said oh well thats hunting.....still a nice day to let the dog run. Thay was my feeling exactly.

I have been to that field 5 times now. Struck out 3 times. Found 1 bird 1 time and the field had plenty the other. I kinda like it that way becuase it doesnt seem like a paid guaranteed thing. Havent heard one complaint from anyone who was there.


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

Was the guy in a blue pick up ,sounds like one of the guys i talked to saturday , he said he was from lapeer area.


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## Gamekeeper (Oct 9, 2015)

I see the same trucks every day at the one by me.

Since it’s in the middle of the day, I doubt there are any kids tagging along.


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## DirtySteve (Apr 9, 2006)

hunterdau2 said:


> Was the guy in a blue pick up ,sounds like one of the guys i talked to saturday , he said he was from lapeer area.


No black chevy. He was from marlette. I saw a blue pickup there. No hunter in that truck though. Looked like the same truck I saw earlier in the year. The guy was a deer hunter using a crossbow.


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

Guys are putting in a lot of road time to hunt birds ! I've talked to hunters from Lapeer , Detroit , Saginaw , Flint and Port Huron this year in just Minden area


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## Possum209 (Aug 5, 2017)

I really don't like the way that Minden is set up. Hard to cover a field with the way the ponds and ditches run. My dog always tries to fool me and act like there's a bird on the other side of the water lol. I've yet to hunt Minden this year and not put up any birds. Problem was last Saturday they were all hens. I did hear one shot from a group of hunters that were out really early. Even sounded like a kids voice yelling I got him!. With all the hunters out there I ended up heading up to Verona and there was quite a few guys up there as well.


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## hunterdau2 (Feb 7, 2006)

When Mullett donated the land he dug those ponds for ducks. Don't see many ducks but it does make it a pain to work the area.


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