# Drama



## CoryMerryman (Apr 30, 2012)

So I baited for 6 weeks only to have some slobs run their dogs off my bait, tree a bear and shoot it right behind my bait. I walked in on them dragging it while their dogs were tied off by my bait. Words were exchanged. Unfortunately, it's not illegal to be an unethical and immoral slob but bringing their tractor over the edge of a beaver pond and cutting limbs and trees down right to where I sit to hunt on public land......BIG NO NO. This is the 1% that give hunting a bad rap.


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## LakeCityMi (Sep 15, 2009)

Sorry to hear that. What I learned I had to do is put my baits next to busy roads, such as highways or interstates. Even a half mile away from the road works, and most nights you can't hear the traffic.

The hunters with dogs usually will not run their dogs that close to a busy road with the fear of the dogs being hit by cars.

With that being said I'm a firm believer of a dog hunt and a non dog hunt.

Some people are jerks!


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## thaken (Sep 18, 2007)

Did you actually witness these guys bringing their dogs in on leashes and cutting them loose at your bait?


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## srconnell22 (Aug 27, 2007)

CoryMerryman said:


> So I baited for 6 weeks only to have some slobs run their dogs off my bait, tree a bear and shoot it right behind my bait. I walked in on them dragging it while their dogs were tied off by my bait. Words were exchanged. Unfortunately, it's not illegal to be an unethical and immoral slob but bringing their tractor over the edge of a beaver pond and cutting limbs and trees down right to where I sit to hunt on public land......BIG NO NO. This is the 1% that give hunting a bad rap.


They started it at your bait and treed it right by your bait? So you must have pictures of them walking in and checking your bait, then bringing the dogs in and turning them loose? 

I've never been on a bear chase that started and ended in the same spot. Treeing a bear on state land within a few hundred yards of your bait in a swamp is easy to see and 100% ethical. But starting and ending a bear chase a couple hundred yards away doesn't make sense. Bear races are measured in miles, not yards. 

I'd be willing to bet you they treed it right by your bait, but they started it a long ways from there. 

As far as the tractor on state land and cutting live trees down, that's illegal and can be pursued via your local CO.


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## ART (Jul 7, 2004)

I have had dog hunters start their dogs off my bait before........should allow dogs only the last week of season....


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## Magnet (Mar 2, 2001)

ART said:


> I have had dog hunters start their dogs off my bait before........should allow dogs only the last week of season....


I agree with that. It sucks having to wait 5 years to get enough pref points for the first hunt, just so you don't have to deal with the dogs.


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## brokenarrow (Oct 6, 2003)

I have a group in my area that has no issues with setting their pups off right on HY 27 in Wis. I stopped to have a discussion with them last week with out anything good coming from it. I have pics of his dogs on all three of my baits. I agree, it only takes a few to give a bad rap to most. If they/you don't have permission for a decent chunk of land they should re-think the sport. Trespassing is trespassing. Why are some folks ok with it if its a dog but not ok if its a hunter?


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## srconnell22 (Aug 27, 2007)

brokenarrow said:


> I have pics of his dogs on all three of my baits.


Do you have pictures of the hunters walking the dogs in and checking your baits, then walking dogs in and turning them loose? Or do you just have pictures of the dogs sniffing around your bait with no hunters around? 

I don't understand why it's so difficult for people to understand that bear are hitting your bait along with a bunch of others overnight. A hound hunter may pick up the bear track on their own bait or on a road and cold trail that bear for miles through a bunch of baits (which is why you are getting pictures of just the dog). 

If they are walking the dog in on your bait and starting it, that's BS and I'm 100% with you. If the dog is just cold trailing the bear from where they started it through your bait then it is what it is.


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## dickey3476 (Dec 19, 2005)

CoryMerryman said:


> So I baited for 6 weeks only to have some slobs run their dogs off my bait, tree a bear and shoot it right behind my bait. I walked in on them dragging it while their dogs were tied off by my bait. Words were exchanged. Unfortunately, it's not illegal to be an unethical and immoral slob but bringing their tractor over the edge of a beaver pond and cutting limbs and trees down right to where I sit to hunt on public land......BIG NO NO. This is the 1% that give hunting a bad rap.


It's people like you who give hunters a bad name by getting on sites like this and spreading lies. There's know possible way that they turned loose on your bait and treed any where close to it. It doesn't happen that way and never will. . It makes me sick you people get on here and bash a group because that's not the way you hunt but you congratulate people shooting cubs and yearlings. You might want to thank A hound hunter next time you see them because if it wasn't for them the bear population would be farther in the toilet than it already is. All this thread is going to be is another bash the hound guy because that's not the way I hunt thread just like every year about this time when you realize time is running out and I'm not gonna be successful. 
If they were cutting trees down on public land turn them in because I'm sure any c.o. Would right a ticket for that but that's probably a lie just like everything else in your post


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## ART (Jul 7, 2004)

dickey3476 said:


> It makes me sick you people get on here and bash a group because that's not the way you hunt but you congratulate people shooting cubs and yearlings.


I don't congratulate anybody for doing anything illegal. I have had negative run ins with hound hunters. Their thought is bait hunters are somehow cheating. They have the attitude of "tough $#!t."


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## packmaster (Mar 1, 2010)

Corry,is there any way you can get me in contact with these guys? sounds like they have some really good dogs? I may be interested in one. Dogs so fast there treeing em on the bait! lol!


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

I seldom if ever treed a bear near a bait I released my dogs on. I agree must have some kind of real dogs. What may have happened is the dogs struck off the truck because the bait was close to the road. Bears run several miles generally. Also bears just go from bait to bait. Hounds tend to stumble at each bait if coldtrailing that can last for miles. Not sure what happened but sometimes accusations result in heated exchanges. I don't really understand how shooting a bear can ruin another persons season. Hounds do not scare bears away and I hope they didn't kill the last bear in Michigan. I bait for weeks, feed and train my dogs every day for years. Most of the time the season passes without harvesting a bear by myself or anyone with me. The vast majority of bears are killed by bait hunters in Michigan. Baiting close to busy roads, smaller tracks, or any other reason that would deter hounds is a real easy thing to do. Sorry you had a conflict. 


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


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## B&B guide service (Jun 29, 2011)

I have been baiting for 20+ years and have yet to have dog hunters mess up one of my baits. I have nothing against dog hunters but if you ask me the hounds help bait sites a lot they get the bears running around and tired which if they don't get shot they always end up hungry and at a bait when they loose the dogs. if I set a new bait site up I find a spot which is a good distance from a trail but not to far out of dog range and I always have good luck at them sites. but nobody should have to walk into there bait and see a dead bear being dragged away and dogs tied up next to your bait. that bear that they shot was most likely headed to your bait because it thaught it was a safe place to hide. but made a mistake. if you had a good bait setup you should have multiple bears at that site and a couple days to cool off and it should be back to normal. good luck hope you get a bear!


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## SMITTY1233 (Dec 8, 2003)

B&B guide service said:


> I have been baiting for 20+ years and have yet to have dog hunters mess up one of my baits. I have nothing against dog hunters but if you ask me the hounds help bait sites a lot they get the bears running around and tired which if they don't get shot they always end up hungry and at a bait when they loose the dogs. if I set a new bait site up I find a spot which is a good distance from a trail but not to far out of dog range and I always have good luck at them sites. but nobody should have to walk into there bait and see a dead bear being dragged away and dogs tied up next to your bait. that bear that they shot was most likely headed to your bait because it thaught it was a safe place to hide. but made a mistake. if you had a good bait setup you should have multiple bears at that site and a couple days to cool off and it should be back to normal. good luck hope you get a bear!


Perspective....


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## marty59 (Jul 17, 2007)

infighting is only good for the anti-hunter crowd. They just love to cheery pick this kind of dialog. There is room for all of us.


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## I'm with Brandy (Aug 5, 2007)

Not that I don't see enough drama in the upland bird hunting forum I will toss my 2 cent in here. I have bear hunted by bait a few times and have never had a problem with bear dogs or their handlers if they treed a bear in that short of distance it must have been an ity bity cub. 

I had another bait hunter move in on my bait spot and setup one 80 yards from mine. He then proceeded to put human crap on my bait pile and dump his ash tray all over it. When that didn't work (amazing what a shovel and a gallon container of strawberry gelatin can cover up), he poached his bear the night before from my hide. Opening morning I got in their noticed as it started to get light there were orange flags marking a blood trail. So I called the CO and let them handle it. They found him driving around town in Cadillac showing it off. Wish I knew how it turned out but never found out all information when dead silent on the event. Found out the guy was some leader in a hunting organization. They probably let him off but I did what I could. I never took a bear that year.


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## Sasquatch Lives (May 23, 2011)

That sucks. Did you call the RAP line to report the habitat destruction?


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## GIDEON (Mar 28, 2008)

One of the states that I hunt in you can hunt bear from mid Sept thru Dec. They basically break down their season like this, 1st. week bow, second and third weeks bow and gun, Then dogs are allowed for a couple weeks, then back to gun and bow for a couple weeks, then dog for a week, then back to gun and bow. Seems to work out well for them as a bow or gun hunter only have to be afield with hounds if they want to. Their state is over the counter licenses with no baiting. Some counties allow multiple (2) kill tags. maybe a variation of this would work in Mich.


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## srconnell22 (Aug 27, 2007)

Rooster, the post you just posted (and subsequently deleted) would be my nomination for post of the year!


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Sure appreciate the kind words SR. I was trying to edit a typo and the system locked up. Got disgusted and just deleted my post. Will try again

Years ago Michigan's bear season always opened on September 10....then hound hunters went along with giving up the first 5 days of the season to appease folks who bear hunt over bait. Then two years ago hound hunters agreed to ending the training season 5 days earlier creating a 5 day quiet time prior to the September 10 opening for bait hunters only. This quiet time affects all dog training not just for bear. So, once again folks who hunt over bait got special consideration.

Back in January 2010 a DNR press release claimed the state's black bear population was 18,000 to 19,000. And, in August of this year....just 3 years and 8 months later.... a DNR press release stated the bear population is currently 8,000 to 10,000 bears. Seems to me any real bear hunter should be outraged.

As bear numbers decline competition for the resource greatly increases.
Instead of pointing fingers at other users its time for folks who take their bear hunting serious to demand Michigan bear numbers be increased at lease to the equal of Wisconsin bear population. 

The NRC is now required by law to manage the state's black bear based on sound science....and the excuse, they have to manage based on nusiance complaints and public acceptance is not going to fly anymore.


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## brokenarrow (Oct 6, 2003)

brokenarrow said:


> I have a group in my area that has no issues with setting their pups off right on HY 27 in Wis. I stopped to have a discussion with them last week with out anything good coming from it. I have pics of his dogs on all three of my baits. I agree, it only takes a few to give a bad rap to most. If they/you don't have permission for a decent chunk of land they should re-think the sport. Trespassing is trespassing. Why are some folks ok with it if its a dog but not ok if its a hunter?


SRConnel22
My issue is not with the dogs but rather the owners. I also wait 6-7 years for my tag. While I'm on my bear stand on my land it would be nice if the bear hunter that is running his dogs off of his 40 acre parcel would consider the black eye he is putting on all ethical bear dog runners. A 40 or 80 or even 200 for that matter is no where near enough land to release dogs on. You said it yourself, {"I've never been on a bear chase that started and ended in the same spot. Treeing a bear on state land within a few hundred yards of your bait in a swamp is easy to see and 100% ethical. But starting and ending a bear chase a couple hundred yards away doesn't make sense. Bear races are measured in miles, not yards."} Miles!! You said it not me. Miles. A bear runner that isn't on a vast tract of land or public land does not have total control of their dogs (as we all know) This means your dogs will eventually trespass on my land. 
A bear dog is an extension of his hunting party, no different than if his son or brother came walking through my land and stopped and left his scent on and all around my bait. There is absolutely no denying that! How would you feel if I came walking though your land and peed on your bait then tramped all around the near vicinity all while you were in your stand trying to hunt a bear you waited 6-9 years for a tag for? There is no difference if I did that or if MY dogs did that to you. We hunt together, we are responsible for each others actions. 
I'm ok with a bear dog that comes through my land after a long chase from the public land across the highway, he would of had 6 miles of paper land to run till he trespassed except for the fact that where my land is, the land across the highway is not a bear dog unit. this means he let his dogs ("hunting party") loose on a parcel on my side of the highway. On my side it is legal to run dogs. I own the one of the largest parcels of land for a few miles (200 acres). That means his dogs ran across many peoples land. Technically, his "hunting party" was essentially trespassing on many peoples property.
That being said (I was venting) I am not against dog owners or running bear with dogs. What I am against is the owners that (no way in heck) could ever tree a bear on their land (your words, remember "it likely would be miles not yards") but yet continue to think we bait hunters should be "OK" with a member of their hunting party "just passing through" or "just sniffing" my bait. 
Can anyone see my point? What's wrong with this picture? We are responsible to control our animals while in public. That is where the "Responsible" hunting starts and ends"
I tried to get my feelings out with out sounding like a piece of crap, I really did not mean to offend anyone and my rant is not directed at you, just the fella's group that thinks its "ok" to scent check my baits anytime they want.


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## brokenarrow (Oct 6, 2003)

Mary, there is no infighting, where I come from we keep score in baseball games, the world can have a civil discussion with out worry


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