# Qdm



## plugger (Aug 8, 2001)

Erik,


Stay on this site and on this forum. If you allow youself to be runoff by the lunatic fringe all that is left is the fringe. As alivestock producer I have viewed the QDM posts with amusement. If I used QDM methods to run my farm I would be broke. 


Button buck grades choice= 78 cents per lb.


Lactating doe or old buck grades utility =
11 cents per lb.


Quality deer management or trophy management?


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

Erik,
Don't go away mad. Simply turn your feelings into something positive. If you disagree with mandatory QDM, contact K.L. Cool, the Natural Resources Commission, your legislators, and anyone else who will listen to your opinion. We have! And guess what...they're listening! Even if the DNR doesn't, your elected officials care what you think....believe me.


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## johnhunter (Jun 17, 2000)

Jamie, you are astute! I had wondered what had ever happened to our old friend hassenpfeffer. A real stand-up guy.


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## Neal (Mar 20, 2001)

It shows what a sad situation Michigan is in when people who strive to do what's best for the future of the resourse, and for the future of hunting are referred to as the Lunatic fringe. 

Plugger~ We QDM'rs agree with you.....farms are much different than a wild herd. QDM has nothing to do with farming strategies or the cost of meat  

Neal


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## jamie7117 (Aug 15, 2001)

poor Erik! he did absolutley nothing to bring down his own house of cards.


please, give me a break. here's a dime and a quarter.


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## Swamp Monster (Jan 11, 2002)

Are anti Qdmer's worried they will never bea ble to shoot a buck again? I don't get it.

QDM is NOT mandatory and probably never will be, atleast in full. If some of us choose to practice it so what? Why are those so against QDM so worried? Go hassle PETA or something! This forum should be for those folks who want to learn about QDM and its practices, not for bashing it.
I had nothing against Erik and I didn't slam him in his earlier post but he instigated that thread and he knew full well what kind of reaction he was gonna get. If QDM bothers him so much, then maybe he just should have left that forum alone, simple as that. There are plenty of other great forums on this website.


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## plugger (Aug 8, 2001)

How can you say you want to improve the herd and then advocate removing the males you deem ideal. Nowhere do you mention taking the inferior and leaving the superior.


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## Swamp Monster (Jan 11, 2002)

Plugger, whats your definition of Inferior? And how do you know if a deer is inferior? Is a spike or a forkie inferior? I don't necesarily think it is.....its just young most likely. Does inferior mean sick or weak? I never remember anyone saying a small buck is inferior, ever, so what are you asking?


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## mechanical head (Jan 18, 2000)

Farmlegend, what the hell does jamie have to do with anything in this post.

A couple friends are trying to keep a guy on the site and forum and you gotta give a thumbs up to jamie....

If Eric is half the hunter he is a fisherman than he's most likely better at hunting than most people on this forum.

I'm sure Steve doesn't want Eric to go, if Eric wants to vent his disbeliefs of qdm let him do it here, thats what this forums for, not just all positive comments. 

Eric is a hell of a guy, if he doesn't play along with your guys idea of saving the deer herd thats shouldn't offend you, nor anyone else.


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## Neal (Mar 20, 2001)

Plugger~ I won't waste my time trying to convince you, there are those who come to this forum to ask questions and learn, I am happy to answer their questions. Then there are other, like you and Erik, who just want to argue ..... There are volumes of information contained in this forum about QDM, It is obvious to me by your previous comments,you are ignorant to what QDM Stands for. Search around and you will learn as much as you want. Start with www.QDMA.org

I don't know why people come here to bash QDM, then get their feelings hurt when we fight back. Why don't they go to the Whitetailed deer forum and post how deer hunting is wrong, go to the varmit hunting forum and tell them killing an animal for its fur is wrong.......what do you expect.

MH~ Being a good fisherman or hunter has no correlation with QDM, It is a scientific strategy, for achieving a better, healthier, balanced deer herd. I don't know Erik or his contributions to this site.....I just know when you go looking for a fight, you'll usually find one.


Neal


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## plugger (Aug 8, 2001)

What I am saying is the size of the antlers does not make an animal superior. The current QDM proposals will only add age to the male portion of the herd. If anyone wants to realy know what makes a superior animal go to a 4H show and listen to the judge explain why he placed certain animals. Goats and sheep are the closest to deer.


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## bwiltse (Jan 18, 2000)

Plugger, I find it difficult to understand how removing a gentically superior animal at age 1 1/2 is better than removing him at age 3 1/2 or 6 1/2. 


My property doe count is 5 and the buck count is one.


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## plugger (Aug 8, 2001)

Neal, Just because I dont agree doesnt mean I dont understand. Do you want this forum just for people that agree wih you. I feel that Erik had some valid points and did not deserve the personal attack. Point out flaws in logic without being childish.


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

Mechanical head, exactly regarding Eric! I don't know him personally, but I like some of his thinking. And Swamp Monster, with all due respect, QDM is becoming mandatory in certain portions of the state. As many of you know, I have been very vocal about the proposal for Montcalm Co. for next year of 4 pts or more on one side, because this happens to be where I have a large tract of land, and what is being proposed is not voluntary by any means. I won't go down that path again, because we beat the crap out of the Montcalm proposal on another thread. And Plugger, I agree with you that this is a "forum", which typically means discussion covers all sides of the issue, not just those in agreement. So if you QDM'ers don't want the other side, just say so and we'll go away. I for one think it typically is healthy to hear both sides of an issue.


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## bwiltse (Jan 18, 2000)

I think the MDNR deer management is much closer to QDM than traditional deer management. Also, I think sometimes we tend to make an issue more complicated than it is. The deer issue for this forum is how to effectively manage the deer herd with the key word being "manage". It's important to define what you want to accomplish. All too often when it comes to deer we want more, that is more deer (bucks and does), more habitat, better habitat, etc.

Many items that get discussed here are emotional deer topics and not deer management. It'd be nice to see more discussion on deer management.


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## jamie7117 (Aug 15, 2001)

New Antler Restrictions: Questions & Answers 

Here's Why


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## bwiltse (Jan 18, 2000)

PA certainly seems to be proactive in deer management, including publication of the whys and wheres of what they're doing.


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## beer and nuts (Jan 2, 2001)

Totally agree with Splitshot. SFK. its not typical of the QDM gang, its typical of a chosen few(not hard to figure out).

If QDM was such for a healthy herd, it would put more effort into habitat improvements than antler restrictions.

Eric, stick around but take a break from this forum. 

Hey Jaime, saw that you took out your breeding buck with the 11 point big boy. Wouldn't have been wiser to let him go and harvest one of the many 2.5 year old bucks that you passed on, giving your area a more balanced age structure, hence a healthier herd that you preach??? And the thought of having that 11 point breeeder passing on better/healthier genes.


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## Guest (Nov 19, 2002)

"If QDM was such for a healthy herd, it would put more effort into habitat improvements than antler restrictions."


" Hey Jaime, saw that you took out your breeding buck with the 11 point big boy. Wouldn't have been wiser to let him go and harvest one of the many 2.5 year old bucks that you passed on, giving your area a more balanced age structure, hence a healthier herd that you preach??? And the thought of having that 11 point breeeder passing on better/healthier genes."


Beautiful points Beer and nuts.


I kind of thought it was a bit two faced also Jamie. You should be whacking does like hell, and leave those big fellas since their so rare that rules and laws have to be changed to get more to that size.


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## bwiltse (Jan 18, 2000)

Why not let the young bucks grow-up to be breeders and let the cream come to the top. Jamies buck has already done his job and spread his genes throughout the herd. If he'd been taken out as a 1 1/2 year old, this wouldn't have happened.


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