# Fair Chase



## rcleofly (Feb 18, 2012)

This is not a knock on anyone. Just looking for knowledge and tips. As long as you are hunting and eating meat your cool in my book. 

Does anyone in Michigan hunt bear with out bait or dogs? 

What units are best for public land spot and stalks? I was think Qwinn.

What techniques do you guys who do practice fair chase on bear seem to work best? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## SteelSearchin (Apr 8, 2004)

Your questions seem to be leading the witness. FWIW, most trolling questions are posted in the fishing forums…but I'll take the bait.

In my opinion, using hounds and/or bait is 100% "fair chase." Having extended viewing opportunities allows the hunter to establish sex and age of the bear prior to releasing an arrow or firing a boo-let. 

The best places to hunt bears, regardless of which state/province/bait/hounds/etc are areas where bears naturally hang out with natural food sources, and hunter access is limited by geography (water/swamps/mtns/etc) or large chunks of private ground. 

If you're dead set against using hounds/bait- head to SE AK or VC and hunt beaches and clear cuts.


----------



## Tilden Hunter (Jun 14, 2018)

I live and hunt in the Gwinn (I'm guessing that's what you meant by Qwinn) BMU. The only kind of spot and stalk kind of hunting you might be able to pull off is to stake out a corn field, but there aren't many of them, and none on public land. Michigan bears have no need nor desire to walk around in the open.


----------



## rcleofly (Feb 18, 2012)

Not totally sure what you mean by trolling? If I’m doing something wrong let me know. 
The reason I’m asking the question is we plan to hunt in the UP without bait or dogs. The concern this brings up is we don’t want to blow people’s hunts who are bait hunting or running dogs. The style of hunting we do requires us to move around a lot. Therefore we are looking for a place to hunt that has a vast amount of public land where we stand the least amount of chance infringing on others hunts but have the ability to hunt the style we prefer to hunt. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Lumberman (Sep 27, 2010)

Boy did you word that wrong knuckle head.... HAHA 

In his defense guys he has a holier then thou fly fisherman too. Believe it or not he's actually not trolling. 

If I was you I would go up there this summer and back country camp a few days. To be able to spot stalk a bear you have to be able to accomplish the SPOT part. It isn't the mountains. You can only see about 10 feet in front of you so no real need for the Bino's. If anyone can do it you're probably the guy but man oh man is that going to be a tough task.


----------



## Wild Thing (Mar 19, 2010)

The vast majority of Michigan bear hunters are hunting either with bait or dogs. I would guess there are very few using spot & stalk or other techniques. That being said, a friend of mine used to kill quite a few bears by hunting corn fields as mentioned by Tilden Hunter. He was quite good and the local farmers would often call him when they found that they had bears ravishing their corn. This was many years ago when you didn't have to wait years to draw a permit so he killed a bear usually every year.

Bears can cause a lot of damage when they stake out a corn field, often just staying there and eating at their pleasure. Most farmers would likely be very happy if you asked to hunt their corn fields for bear.

Not sure how much ag there is in the Gwinn unit but southern Dickinson County and Menominee and Delta counties also have quite a bit of corn. If you have time, I would do some scouting in those areas and maybe get some farms lined up where they would like bears harvested and maybe they would even call you if a bear shows up in their corn.

Good luck.


----------



## SMITTY1233 (Dec 8, 2003)

rcleofly said:


> This is not a knock on anyone. Just looking for knowledge and tips. As long as you are hunting and eating meat your cool in my book.
> 
> Does anyone in Michigan hunt bear with out bait or dogs?
> 
> ...


If you kill a bear spot and stalk in Michigan please post the story here for us to read it will be one worthy of sharing with other hunters. I can't think of many things tougher to do in Michigan then spot and stalk a black bear as the terrain just doesn't lend itself to that type of hunting. Not saying it can't be accomplished but if it is I want to read about it!! Good Luck!


----------



## SteelSearchin (Apr 8, 2004)

To ask a question like, "What techniques do you guys who do practice fair chase on bear seem to work best?" implies that folks who hunt with hounds and/or bait are not ethically implementing fair chase practices. Bear hunting with hounds/bait has been attacked by anti-hunting groups for decades, and debates on many hunting forums escalate quickly into fights and locked posts. 

While I've never bear hunted (currently sitting on 10 pts), I don't have any issue with those who do. When I finally decide to pull a tag, I will hunt with hounds or bait. It can be done without it, but your odds of success drop drastically. A great friend of mine arrowed a monster bear years ago without the use of hounds or bait, but that bear was shot on water hole in the SW during an elk hunt. I guess some could consider water "bait" in the southwest, so maybe he didn't practice "fair chase" either.









Look at your planning like an OTC western elk hunt. Bear hunting with dogs/bait requires work/logistics. Bears can move a lot that time of year. Bait attracts bears for miles. Hounds run bears for miles. Do more work than others are willing to do. My advice would be to boat/canoe into a remote area that the hound/bait guys can't easily access. Do the "Randy Newberg method" of analyzing a map and eliminating areas within a mile of two-tracks and roads. If you can put water between you and the roads, so much the better.

Some people have had success with predator calls, but given the typical abundance of fruit/grains in the fall I think you'd be hard pressed to call one in w/ a fawn bleat.


----------



## rcleofly (Feb 18, 2012)

Please don’t take me wrong on what I’m trying to do here.

Here’s the back story. I’ve never bear hunted. I have one of those cool jobs where I get to travel around Michigan and I spend about 50% of my time talking hunting with people.

I always tell people “man bear are cool, I’m going to do a bear hunt”. 98% of the hunters I talk to are like “you are nuts” “it’s just about impossible” “good luck with that”.
And I’m like WTF, bears are neat. Like why would anyone not want to experience that? I honestly feel we are blessed to have the opportunity we have here in MI to hunt bears. They truly are a beautiful animal. And a challenge regardless of how you do it. 

So I ask people, why are they not interested? Why do they have a negative attitude about it? In reality a very small percentage of Michigan hunters/conservationist show interest in bear hunting. The best thing that could happen for bear hunting and management in the state of MI is interest. The more hunters/conservationist who take interest and support bear management the better. Yes, it could potentially make getting a tag harder to get but that is the only down side. As long as we all are working together as a team to manage our habitat and population, the more the better.

So I spent time asking people the “why not” questions. Very popular responses are:

1) Don’t have or know any one with dogs to hunt them. This is a huge investment of time and patience. It’s very difficult and requires day to day effort. Very understandable this prevents people from bear hunting.

2) Getting a tag is nearly impossible. This is kind of true but not really. With the way our lottery is setup and the availability of the later season hunts in the UP you can get a tag. Probably not ever year but it’s not that hard. I have 4 points at this time. 

3) I don’t have the availability to spend the time in the UP tending to bait sites and scouting to locate a bear. I simply live to far away. 

I have way more to go along with this but these are what I would call the “big dogs”.

So I got together with a couple other crazy ass mofos like myself and we are like “we’re going to prove them wrong” we are going to show them you can have a very enjoyable hunt successful or not without being the hardcore dedicated bear hunter that most Michigan bear guys and gals are. This doesn’t mean we aren’t going to have to put a bunch of work and effort into bear hunting.

We are documenting the entire experience on film. Start to finish. We’ve already started. Then when we are done we will share the experience on YouTube. 

So we started out by checking out OnX Hunt and picking what we figured would gives us the most amount of public land while figuring license quotas into play. This is how we set our eyes on the Gwinn unit. Looking to hunt the latest season. We’ve spent a weekend so far getting familiar with the public land and access sites. Just a quick over night, while sleeping in the car. 

I do have 10 business days of vacation set aside for bear hunting this year. Possibly more if I’m unsuccessful in my Wyoming draw. 

So yeah, I’m not hunting the more traditional methods. We are doing this in a very budget minded fashion. Going to put in tons of hard work and effort but we will be doing it in a way your average Michigan hunter/conservationist can imagine themselves doing without the standard day to day investment. If that makes sense. 
I’m not he greatest with words, as I’m sure my opening statement has showed lol. Thanks Lumberman for jumping in with the save. 

All that being said all I’m doing is looking for a little advice and maybe some pointers to help aid and support our cause to draw more interest in to bear population and habitat management in MI. By getting people more interested in bear hunting by showing them it’s not as impossible as they may think. 

Sorry if I upset anyone. 










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Forest Meister (Mar 7, 2010)

Rcleofly, good on you for trying to prove the naysayers wrong and wanting to march to your own accordion. That said, may I suggest a possible way to not only increase your odds but also to give you a taste of what the North Woods has in store for you?

My $.02 would be to put the actual hunt on hold until 2020, only applying for a PP this year. Continue all the prep you feel is necessary and when bear season opens this fall and you feel well prepared, head to the hills for a trial run and see how well you are doing. See if you or any of your group actually sees a legal bear using your methods of choice. If not, you would have a chance to modify tactics/areas without having burned through your PPs. Maybe bring along a shotgun or .22 for birds or squirrels if you so desire.

Now a bit of info to maybe help with your efforts: I have never attempted to bag a bear without watching a bait pit or a cornfield but when I was growing up, decades before bear tags became a draw item, there was a group of neighbors that would make bear drives. There favorite area was a large expanse of oak with swamps well situated adjacent to that area. You could see a long way because of the rolling terrain and lack of underbrush. They were less successful than bait or dog hunters but they did get a bear ever so often. FM


----------



## Nostromo (Feb 14, 2012)

Honestly, if you want to spot and stalk a bear you might want to look down in the garden peninsula. The AG operations there might give you permission to take a bear off of their fields. I think going into the corn after a bear would be a good time.

Good time to have an autoloader that is.


----------



## timbrhuntr (Feb 4, 2009)

When I hunted the fall in northern Ontario which may or may not be different than Michigan we would talk to some of the locals that were picking blueberries and they would often tell you what field the bears were in feeding of course hunting over a bluberry field may be like bait and not fair chase lol


----------



## rcleofly (Feb 18, 2012)

Gents,

I appreciate all the feed back. I don’t think “fair chase” was the proper phrase to use lol. I plan to make multiple short trips over the next few months. I’ll keep everyone updated as to how things unfold. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## timbrhuntr (Feb 4, 2009)

I figured what you meant but couldn't help myself, had to take a poke at the bear so to speak !

Don't over look the blue berries I had met a guy in northern ontario near Wawa that killed a bear almost ever year with his long bow in blueberry fields he had a few videos on the old pic hosting sites before youtube pretty cool to see .


----------



## rcleofly (Feb 18, 2012)

timbrhuntr said:


> I figured what you meant but couldn't help myself, had to take a poke at the bear so to speak !
> 
> Don't over look the blue berries I had met a guy in northern ontario near Wawa that killed a bear almost ever year with his long bow in blueberry fields he had a few videos on the old pic hosting sites before youtube pretty cool to see .


Lol, I already have the low down on some wild berries on public land. I have a good friend who has family that lives up that way. He has an aunt who goes out every year to pick them. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## timbrhuntr (Feb 4, 2009)

Nice a few years ago when I was up there hunting nothing was coming to the baits that had been set up. We found out from the locals that all the bears were in nearby field gorging on berries.


----------



## Tron322 (Oct 29, 2011)

Nice thread.

Week before my bear hunt started two years ago I snuck around scouting. Found lots of tracks and tough finding a good sitting spot.

Relaxed a bit on a Sandy two track moving slow, moved toward a small oak,.

Up popped a younger bear, we were eye to eye but the bear was skinny, would have been dead if I had my rifle when the season opener.

Cool looking eye to eye at about 20 yards, and off it went. Cool watching the tree tops on young Aspen and oak.

One of the cooler things I can remember in the woods because it was safe.

Had something similar happen in 2013 which wasn't nice, still not sure if it was a bear then but had three woofs and something false charge me.

Was cool looking eye to eye with a bear that close


----------



## mstgman (Oct 3, 2007)

Good luck!

We enjoy all parts of bear hunting. Driving 500 miles one way to set baits (2 times before our hunt), then driving back for the hunt spending about 10 days. Running baits every morning during those 10 days and stand hunting over baits for the evening hunts. To be successful will take a lot of effort. Bear hunting isn't for the faint of heart (hounds or bait). It's this effort as you've stated is why others stay away from this sport (some stay away merely from fear). Where we hunt, we're able to draw a 2nd hunt tag nearly every year. Our success rate is proportional to our efforts! Those years we chose not to run baits twice before the hunt, we had the least activity and success, however, the ones we do run double bait runs have had great success with 2 years ago going 3 for 3!


----------



## Biggbear (Aug 14, 2001)

To expand on the advice already given regarding stalking in ag fields, you may want to contact the local DNR officer, and the field office in the area you're looking at hunting. They may know of farms experiencing problem bears, or areas of high complaints. That would be the first places I asked permission, from people who have reported or complained of issues with bears. 

I've spoken to our local CO, and she turned me on to several spots where bear complaints were high that had state land close by. That way if I didn't get permission from the landowners, the bears were likely traveling the state ground too. I didn't need to hunt the state land, every land owner almost shouted YES!! when I asked for permission.


----------

