# Is an hour before fly down to early to...



## Muskegon Jim (Oct 8, 2006)

So is an hour before fly down to early to get a gobbler to gobble with an owl call? I would assume the answer is no. But this weekend I was out at 6:15 hooting with my call, then I would move 300 yards or so and repeat, hoot then move, hoot then move, until I covered 2 miles. Now I am 95% sure that some turkeys heard me, they are all over this area, I just dont know where there roost's are yet. I have seen them midday, and a couple hours before sunset so they cant be far. It was a damp morning like it rained during the night, would this matter?  Anyway just curious what your opinion is, guess I will try again this weekend.


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## Ack (Oct 3, 2004)

Sounds a little early to me, but you may try a coyote call instead...something just a little different that would still seem natural at that time of the morning.


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## Linda G. (Mar 28, 2002)

A lot of turkeys won't answer an owl call. After all, owls and turkeys aren't exactly friends. 

And it may not be natural for turkeys in that area to answer an owl call...are there any owls around there?

But to answer your question, it probably is too early...I don't use any calls at all if I know the birds are there until just before fly down. If they're there, they'll gobble on their own if it's warm enough. So, if you know the birds are there, don't get their ears up with unnatural calls, just wait for them to gobble, and start with some light tree yelps just before they fly down. You can tell when they're getting ready to fly, they move around on the branch a lot and the gobble will change it's tone with every move. 

If you don't know if they're there, you need to be there in the evening, about an hour before fly down, sitting quietly somewhere. You may hear them fly up...and very often, you'll get one single gobble after they're up. 

If you can't roost them, wait till about half an hour or so before they should be flying down, then try a very loud crow call.


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## Gobblerman (Dec 19, 2004)

I've had some respond to owl hoots and some that have not. I usually try my owl hooter about 1/2 before shooting time. Make sure your not educating the birds in your area. 

Before the season what I like to do is just sit and listen, if their gobbling you'll hear them. I was in Missouri this past weekend and I listen to them gobble right outside of dad's house about 15 right at day break. It was awesome! 

Good Luck


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## oldrank (Dec 5, 2006)

the best locator call that i have found is the hen yelp.........they still answer that the best.......only use it once to locate and get set up quick......then call....and give the birds what they want to hear........and also I agree with Linda G.......on a good morning you should be able to hear em.......a good place to look for birds is any place youve seen em.......they have very repeatable patterns......if you find a gobbler....he will usually be in the same spot everyday......until someone kills him....you can spend the whole year messing around with a smart old tom.......that is what makes it fun for me.......


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## EdB (Feb 28, 2002)

Sometimes turkeys just won't answer an owl call or any other locator call for that matter. You need to hit them when there in the right mood for gobbling. You really don't need to use locator calls much pre-season. Just get out early on any mild, warm and not windy mornings and listen. If there are gobblers in the area roosting, they will sound off from the tree's on any decent morning from here on out. If it is a windy, cold or nasty weather, stay in bed. Every nice weather morning till hunting season, I get up before sunrise, hit the woods and start listening in likely spots for turkey's. You can cover a lot of ground between 6:30 and 7:30 AM and still get to work. 6:00 to 6:30AM later this month. That is the prime time to scout roost locations and really learn how many gobblers are in an area. If I hear some gobblers, I move on and listen at another spot. Turkey's are always in the mood to tree gobble at dawn this time of year. Save using locator calls until it is much closer to your hunt period. I find all the local gobblers around here over the next few weeks but I don't let the long beards hear my calls till I'm hunting.


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## Muskegon Jim (Oct 8, 2006)

Thank you all for the replies. To answer a few of the questions...I dont believe we have any yotes. This plot I hunt is a 40 acre public plot, fairly rural, across the dirt road is a golf course, and my side of the road is surrounded by private property with houses on approximately 20-30 acre plots. Last season I hunted the same area and they were responsive to owl calls while on the roost, but I never tried a crow call except during mid day, so I will give that a shot this weekend at first light if I have not heard them gobbling on there own. As for using a yelp I was under the impression you should not do that while scouting birds only do that when your actually hunting...I assume thats true? As for the roosting them in the evening, thanks I will give that a shot after dinner a few times as long as better half will let me :lol:. Lastly, I currently only have an owl and a crow call, but for something different I was debating on a woodpecker call or crane call. They are both in my area. Do you have any experience with these calls? Is one any easier than the other to get the proper sound out of? I assume both of these are after day break type calls, unlike the owl. Thanks again for the suggestions, I will get out there some and just listen and figure out where these boys are.


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## Sib (Jan 8, 2003)

All locator calls can be hit and miss, which is why it helps to have a few in your vest. Shock gobbles are not a thought out response, it's an emotinal reaction, so whether it's a preditor like an owl, or yote it won't hurt your hunting. Are you a waterfowler? A goose call can work at times and so will a duck call. These are 1st light flyers, so it's also natural to have them calling before shooting time. A crane (sandhill) sound is pretty easy to make without a call, imo, I just listened and before long I was working our little flock of cranes in no time. I find they call most when in the air. I've never used a woodpecker call, but I've read some articles that have had success with them.

Imo, there is no real science to this, I've heard train whistles, doors slamming, neighbors dogs, etc. all elicit shock gobbles. I do try and appear natural and use calls that are natural to the time I use them, but that is probably more my idiosyncrasy, rather than something that will effect a hunt. If something doesn't work, I just reach into my vest and throw something else out there. 

There are tight-lipped days in the field, just seems the birds don't vocalize much on the roost, but once on the ground they may end up vocalizing like normal. Occasionally, they can be tight lipped on the gound. My ZZ hunt last year was a very quiet hunt and the bird I took, in my avatar, only gobbled twice, but I was fortunate to have him commit even being tight lipped.

On those tight lipped days, the hens can still be fairly vocal, even on the roost. When this happens I always make the assumption that a tom is up there with them and I attempt to out hen the hens even if the toms are tight lipped.

As for putting them to bed, I couldn't agree more. I love to put them to bed the night before, it gives you a place to set-up in the morning and shock gobbling is not all that important to the hunter when he has a tom roosted. Personally, I like to get out there early, too. I just like watching the dawn break and the world come to life. I just sit quietly until I start to hear the 1st gobbles, or the hens start to chat. Once it close to flydown I attempt to develop a dialog with a tom.

Sandhill Crane vocalization:
http://home.nikocity.de/craneworld/images/wav/flight.wav

Various animal vocalizations for listening reference:
http://www.allpredatorcalls.com/sound_links.htm


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## oldrank (Dec 5, 2006)

Muskegon Jim.......there are alot of myths about not using the yelp while you are hunting but its all a myth.....if you like to spend alot of money on hunting trinkets then use all the calls ya want.....but if you wanna spend 4 bucks on a mouth call and not have to haul around a bunch of gear you can seriously locate with a yelp.....just dont over do it......there gonna shock gobble that early so they are gobbling at any noise....and ive really found they respond better to a yelp then any of the other calls....if ya aint using the yelp before you move up the road then your gonna be missing birds.....


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## Muskegon Jim (Oct 8, 2006)

I found his tree tonight! Just went out and sat in the vicinity of there roost last year and an hour later, there was no noises at all due to more rain and I saw him fly up. About 40 yards away from me. That puts me at ease some. But he was the only bird I saw. So I wonder where the rest of the flock went? Now I have to find the rest of them just to satisy the hunger :lol:. Thanks again all!


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## Thunderhead (Feb 2, 2002)

oldrank said:


> Muskegon Jim.......there are alot of myths about not using the yelp while you are hunting but its all a myth.....if you like to spend alot of money on hunting trinkets then use all the calls ya want.....but if you wanna spend 4 bucks on a mouth call and not have to haul around a bunch of gear you can seriously locate with a yelp.....just dont over do it......there gonna shock gobble that early so they are gobbling at any noise....and ive really found they respond better to a yelp then any of the other calls....if ya aint using the yelp before you move up the road then your gonna be missing birds.....



Not exactly true................especially when the Toms are henned up. Sure, the Toms will respond, then you can bet your last shell that the hens will gather up the Gobblers and head the other direction.
Yelping as a locator is good midday when the hens are on the nest and will bring in a bird, but you really need to watch it when using one.
They can work just as fast against you as for you.

Morning, before flydown, stick to the crow or owl. Don't get the hens riled with competition or you'll be in for a long sit.
If anything, a few tree yelps, followed by a cut or two after flydown is all I recommend when your on the birds.


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## HUNT4FUN (Jan 10, 2006)

I Don't Know If It Is Or Isn't


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## yippy (Dec 22, 2004)

For what its worth, there are plenty of yotes in Muskegon County. They dont seem to howl much but they are there along with fox.


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## Gramps (Jan 19, 2007)

1 hour is to early for a locator call, 1/2 hr is just fine, throw away your owl call, if you want to lite up a long beard use a gobble call, you will have every gobbler in the area sound off. try it you"ll like it, believe me its my number one call.


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## Gobblerman (Dec 19, 2004)

Gramps said:


> 1 hour is to early for a locator call, 1/2 hr is just fine, throw away your owl call, if you want to lite up a long beard use a gobble call, you will have every gobbler in the area sound off. try it you"ll like it, believe me its my number one call.


Never thought of that, makes sense. Thanks for posting Gramps.


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## Linda G. (Mar 28, 2002)

using a gobble call before full daylight, especially on public lands, when there's still a good chance of having someone move in on you that's just getting set up and doesn't realize that gobbler is human, could be very, very risky...I would never use a gobble call at that time of day on anything less than extremely private land.


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## Gobblerman (Dec 19, 2004)

Linda G. said:


> using a gobble call before full daylight, especially on public lands, when there's still a good chance of having someone move in on you that's just getting set up and doesn't realize that gobbler is human, could be very, very risky...I would never use a gobble call at that time of day on anything less than extremely private land.


I agree, however I hunt private land. Plus once a Gobbler gobbles from the roost or on the ground if other hunters are around the same thing may happen. So I'm not sure I understand why if your whole intent is to get a gobble in the morning from the roost why a gobble call would be an issue. Unless all you do is constantly shake the gobble call non stop. I would only use it once or twice. I would think you hit the call once and if there is a gobbler in the area he is going to gobble as well. 

Most of the time we roost the night before and we just sit and wait patiently for the first gobble or I use a few soft tree yelps to get em to let me know where exactly he is.


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## oldrank (Dec 5, 2006)

you can pretty much make a tom shock gobble to whatever ya got in your bag.......or banging a couple rocks together or crowing with your voice or pretty much any load noise........but i pretty much head to the woods every spring with 3 mouth calls in my pocket..........and I take a bird every year.......off public land........turkeys around here are pretty dumb..........they just recently upped the permits on the public land....10 years ago the were only giving out 75 permit per hunt......it was phenominal hunting and the birds ran to anything that even remotely sounded like a hen......nobody applied back then and i would draw 1st hunt every year......also i have hunted them in the ULP and it was a totally different game.......a heck of alot more wary birds up there........


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## Gramps (Jan 19, 2007)

Linda G. said:


> using a gobble call before full daylight, especially on public lands, when there's still a good chance of having someone move in on you that's just getting set up and doesn't realize that gobbler is human, could be very, very risky...I would never use a gobble call at that time of day on anything less than extremely private land.


Have had a problem in over 30 years of turkey hunting and using a gobble call first thing in the morning, and i have hunted birds all over the country. i hunt private and public lands. i have had road hunters try to move in on me during the morning hunt when i have got a bird going, (and there out driving around at 8:30 a.m) but never have had a problem at first light. you have a better chance of someone moving in on you after you start working a bird.


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## Linda G. (Mar 28, 2002)

but there's always a 1st time, particularly if you're on public land. It only takes one newbie turkey hunter to really ruin your day...and maybe your life...look at some of the injury stats on people who used a gobble call at any time of the day.


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## Gramps (Jan 19, 2007)

Linda G. said:


> but there's always a 1st time, particularly if you're on public land. It only takes one newbie turkey hunter to really ruin your day...and maybe your life...look at some of the injury stats on people who used a gobble call at any time of the day.


But i do not see how anybody in their right mine could shoot another hunter and mistake him our her for a turkey, the only way i could even think of it is if you have a decoy set up right in front of you, and even then you would see the person or here them, i do not know all the stats and don't want to argue with you, but i do think most of the turkey hunters who are shot are from the southern states were they can use rifles and shoot long shots across open fields, i maybe wrong, but i have read stories about this happening down there.


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## Gobblerman (Dec 19, 2004)

Gramps said:


> But i do not see how anybody in their right mine could shoot another hunter and mistake him our her for a turkey, the only way i could even think of it is if you have a decoy set up right in front of you, and even then you would see the person or here them, i do not know all the stats and don't want to argue with you, but i do think most of the turkey hunters who are shot are from the southern states were they can use rifles and shoot long shots across open fields, i maybe wrong, but i have read stories about this happening down there.


Hey Gramps,

It can happen. Last year I was hunting with my brother in Missouri and we set up in the rain on fence row. We placed a jake and hen decoy out, the mistake I made was placing the decoys right in front of my brother (line of sight 15 yards out). Well after about an hour of sitting in the rain I think we were both dozing off a little when all of a sudden an Amish man came walking up over the hill and as soon as he crested the hill he saw the dekes and raised his gun, I stood up and yelled "HEY Hunters Here!" He was tresspassing and he very easily could have shot at the decoys which he would of shot in the direction of my little brother.

We talked to him he apologized and he left. Bottom line there are some careless hunters out there and that was a huge life lesson for me. So everyone be careful this spring. You never know what idiot is out there stalking your dekes or your calling. 

Let's hunt safe and hard this spring!


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## Muskegon Jim (Oct 8, 2006)

Thanks again to everyone for there advice. Also if you want to read a post on a kids misfortune running to another hunter this season in GA here is a link. I just dont understand how this happens, with turkey or deer. I know it does every year but geez we all need to know what the heck we are shooting! With regs such as it has to be bearded or it must have so many points on one side I just dont understand how people can be making this type of mistake...Just ask "One-eye" from the deer forum. Anyway here is a link http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=109348


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## Big Ches (Mar 22, 2005)

Gramps said:


> But i do not see how anybody in their right mine could shoot another hunter and mistake him our her for a turkey, the only way i could even think of it is if you have a decoy set up right in front of you, and even then you would see the person or here them, i do not know all the stats and don't want to argue with you, but i do think most of the turkey hunters who are shot are from the southern states were they can use rifles and shoot long shots across open fields, i maybe wrong, but i have read stories about this happening down there.


The same idiots that deer hunt....turkey hunt. It can and does happen! An old boss of mine was shot in the face on public land while turkey hunting. He lost sight out of one eye. And no state allows rifles for turkey hunting Gramps...


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## Linda G. (Mar 28, 2002)

Some states do allow rifles for turkey hunting, but they're all out west where shots would be very long and the sight plane is even further, and in most of those states rifles are only legal for fall hunting. None of the southern states allow rifles, it's all shotguns, and people get shot every year in just about every state that allows turkey hunting. Again, with our large tracts of public land Michigan is very spoiled and very underinformed about dangers like this...I know of two people that have been shot by turkey hunters, one of them while out of state, a national NWTF rep, and another that was shot by his own kid...yes, it does happen. 

As someone has already pointed out, it can even be very dangerous just to use dekes. Please be careful, and don't take any stupid chances.


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## Gramps (Jan 19, 2007)

Big Ches said:


> The same idiots that deer hunt....turkey hunt. It can and does happen! An old boss of mine was shot in the face on public land while turkey hunting. He lost sight out of one eye. And no state allows rifles for turkey hunting Gramps...


But you are wrong, other states do allow you to use rifles for turkey hunting.Virginia is one West Virginia also. Wild turkey my be hunted with rifles, handguns, muzzeloaders, shotguns or bows, i'm done with this topic, i just told jim what call to use, and what call i use. if you don't want to use it, then don't.


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