# Bridge Count



## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

Well once again we came across the bridge from deer camp and didnt even get asked if we had any deer. I went across the bridge 2 twice becasue I had to go home and prime my pump when the wind storm came through and neither time did I get asked about deer. That's 4 years in a row they didnt ask. I also ask the rest of the guys that came back and they didnt get ask either. We all had pickups with either caps or tonneu covers where they couldnt see if we had anything. I think the count is a joke and I hope they dont use the information gathered for any real pruposes because I can tell you as a fact it aint even close to being accurate. By the way, we did have deer and so did some of our camp members.

I came back across on Sunday and the count showed a 100 deer increase over last year.


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## Thunderhead (Feb 2, 2002)

They don't ask you cause they know that you couldn't hit a house if you was standin in it.

They already know that bed is empty, again, so why take the time to ask.


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

Thunderhead said:


> They don't ask you cause they know that you couldn't hit a house if you was standin in it.
> 
> They already know that bed is empty, again, so why take the time to ask.


Ha, the bed of my truck as had horns in it 10+ years in a row now :lol: 

Here's good eatin proof:


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## Foreveryoung001 (Sep 24, 2005)

We went up Wednesday, came back Sunday and didn't asked either. And we too had a deer, and we were still wearing our orange since we came right out of the woods to head home...


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## Taxidermist (Jan 3, 2002)

Same here they didnt ask About 4 years ago the day after thanksgiving they asked us and we told them 15 he laugh at us and said ya right so we dropped the tailgate and let him count heads his jaw dropped and said you guys are real shooters!!!


Rob


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

Taxidermist said:


> Same here they didnt ask About 4 years ago the day after thanksgiving they asked us and we told them 15 he laugh at us and said ya right so we dropped the tailgate and let him count heads his jaw dropped and said you guys are real shooters!!!
> 
> 
> Rob


Thats funny!

I seen a stake truck a few years ago coming across the bridge that had deer stacked up like cord wood, there must of been 50 deer on that truck.

I still say the count is a joke and should be discontinued unless they have a way of getting more accurate numbers. A day by day count and comparing it to previous years also depends on what day the season opens (weekend or weekday) so how can they compare it to a previous year?


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## onebad800 (Apr 28, 2003)

as of weds. afternoon it was down 8% but they didnt ask me either so I told them I had one , went up last friday and couldnt believe the amount and size of all the bucks on cars at the bridge looked best Ive seen in years?


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

I'm starting to wonder if they ask anyone? What a joke!

Maybe its a visual count only and if thats the case I hope everyone doesnt start covering up thier deer or the count will be ZERO someday.


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## One Eye (Sep 10, 2000)

Wouldn't need to have a half-baked bridge count if we had deer registration. Ooops, can't do that. Wouldn't want to get "real" numbers.

dan


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## kingfisher 11 (Jan 26, 2000)

I thini it was four years ago we had three big Saskathewan bucks in the back of our trailer. I bet that was counted toward the kill. We were not asked if they were MI deer but you could clearly see them.

Good thing we don't cross the bridge coming back from Kansas next week. Cause we plan to have three more big deer in the back!


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## tdejong302 (Nov 28, 2004)

Crossed Sunday the 20th. The deer check station was already closed (5pm) don't know what time they closed. And no one at the bridge asked about deer #'s.


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## Trophy Specialist (Nov 30, 2001)

A while back they changed their policy and stopped asking people if they had deer and only counted ones that were visible. The bridge count is not designed to count the number of deer crossing the bridge; rather is is just used as a guage to judge the kill from one year to the next.


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

Trophy Specialist said:


> A while back they changed their policy and stopped asking people if they had deer and only counted ones that were visible. The bridge count is not designed to count the number of deer crossing the bridge; rather is is just used as a guage to judge the kill from one year to the next.



I read a few posts elsewhere that some were asked so this isnt making sense at all. The Free Press is even posting figures from the biridge and comparing them. I'm sure there are alot of Hunters that dont have internet access and the only info they see are the numbers posted at TTT's booth (*T*roll *T*oken *T*akers) :lol:


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## poz (Nov 12, 2004)

They just use an educated guess, Just like the check stations. If over the years when they asked people if they had deer, and for every 2 deer they saw on top of a car or in a truck, they got an answer yes for 1 deer that that couldn't see.Then they know that they are only seeing 2/3 of the deer killed and to add another 1/3 to the count. So basically if they saw 200 deer go by, they assume 300 were killed. IT's not the most accurate, but it gives them a ballpark figure that they can compare every year.


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## Whit1 (Apr 27, 2001)

poz said:


> They just use an educated guess, Just like the check stations. If over the years when they asked people if they had deer, and for every 2 deer they saw on top of a car or in a truck, they got an answer yes for 1 deer that that couldn't see.Then they know that they are only seeing 2/3 of the deer killed and to add another 1/3 to the count. So basically if they saw 200 deer go by, they assume 300 were killed. IT's not the most accurate, but it gives them a ballpark figure that they can compare every year.


 
If you really looked into how they do it you'd find it to be more complicated than what you're suggesting.


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## poz (Nov 12, 2004)

Whit1 said:


> If you really looked into how they do it you'd find it to be more complicated than what you're suggesting.


I'm sure it is but, they do have some sort of formula to count the deer they don't see. I was just giving a basic example to give people an idea. I should have worded it more clearly.


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## Garret (Aug 2, 2002)

Hay gang! I'm in Hartford,CT on business until Dec. 2nd but had to chime in on this one. We came across the bridge on the 19th at 1pm and the numbers on the posted paper at the toll was DOWN 38%. I was a little stuned. I know with the season starting on Tue that the numbers would be down, but 38%? I figured the weather had as much to do with it as the opening day being in the middle of the week. I do think there has to be a better way to get closer to the actual numbers and it wouldn't be all that time consuming. Put a darn check station at the bridge that is open from 8am-5pm and have the toll takers ask each car or truck passing thru during the closed (check station) hours if you have deer. I understand that many people would pass by the check station but it may be a better idea.

OR, the state could spend a few thousand bucks for a pin or nice patch to give to all the hunters that check deer in? I mean a NICE patch or pin, something hunters would take pride in having. I'm sure the increse in license fees could cover the cost!!!! I know it sounds like a joke but until we have a mandatory check-in (I HOPE) something needs to be done to get a better grasp on the REAL numbers of deer being harvested. Heck we passed two check stations that Saturday afternoon and both were closed. What's the deal with that? 

just my 2 cents. I look forward to seeing others coments on this subject when i return home. Good luck to all over the last few days of gun! 

Peace,

G-MAN


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## trailsend (Feb 12, 2005)

I am not sure what purpose the so called "bridge count" serves? The UP is a wide area accessed from the west end through wisconsin too.It also has many residents that never take there kill over the bridge. It seems to me that if all hunters were required to report there kills it would end all the speculations. We have been crosiing the bridge for 20+ years and have not been asked since the late 90's.


*[size=+1]Deer harvest down[/size]*​*By DIONNA HARRIS
Staff Writer*
IRON MOUNTAIN  The winter storm that moved through the area on Nov. 16 may be one factor in the reduction of deer registered locally during the 16-day firearm season.
Doug Wagner of the Michigan Department of Natural Resources District Office in Crystal Falls, noted that as of Wednesday afternoon, approximately 300 deer had been registered, reflecting a 10 percent decrease in the number registered in 2004.
The DNR Field Office in Norway, during the same period of time checked 181 deer as of Wednesday afternoon, compared to 185 checked at the end of the season in 2004, said Monica Joseph, a Wildlife Biology Technician with the DNR.
Elsewhere, reports from the south central Upper Peninsula show hunters had a reasonable season as well.
The DNR Field Office in Escanaba reported an eight percent increase in the number of deer checked compared to 2004.
Current numbers are within nine percent of Escanabas 10 year average, said DNR Wildlife Biologist Craig Albright.
*For the complete story see todays edition of The Daily News*


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

Anyone know what the final count was at the bridge?


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## answerguy8 (Oct 15, 2001)

Trophy Specialist said:


> A while back they changed their policy and stopped asking people if they had deer and only counted ones that were visible. The bridge count is not designed to count the number of deer crossing the bridge; rather is is just used as a guage to judge the kill from one year to the next.


They asked me when I crossed on 11/19th. But maybe she was just flirting with me.


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## 2tundras (Jan 11, 2005)

Nothing tells them they have to ask. Its almost a "if ya wanna." I know pretty much every booth worker and only two or three say they that ask every truck... at least. But they tell me some of the other workers don't even bother counting the trucks with big ole horns haning over the side smacking up aside the booth.

Its a crap count.

*Hey Anwserguy, leave my aunt outa this*


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## Swamper (Apr 12, 2004)

I would submit that a survey of the vehicles crossing the bridge is adequate if a survey method is appropriate to determine whether or not QDM is mandated for an area.

Swamper


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

I think I proved my point here and 2tundras just put the icing on it by proving its a crap shoot. First it was "they only count the deer seen" after everyone said they werent being ask. Then after hearing that some were being ask it was "they count every so many vehicles". And now its they take a survey of how many cars cross the bridge?

Give it up guys, its a joke and it proves the information their giving is inaccurate and misleading. What other information are they feeding us thats inaccurate? 

CB


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## marshrat (Oct 29, 2005)

The bridge count is a CENSUS method. Nobody 'counts' deer, dead or alive. Surveys to count live deer on large land areas would be too expensive, and counts of dead deer are unnecessary, as well as expensive. The bridge "count" is ONE of the many census methods used to get a "quick and dirty" idea of what's going on early in the season. The folks at the booth don't count deer or ask anyone; it is the Wildlife Division personnel at overlooks that observe and record deer that they see (there is a methodology to it) and compare it to years past utilizing traffic patterns, busy times, etc. 

Check stations, likewise, are not used to 'count' deer. They are used to collect biological data on the deer herd, primarily looking at average beam diameters of bucks within age classes, % lactating females and other data. If beam diameters within an age class are down or declining compared to long-term averages within certain areas, those bucks are stressed, most likely due to density-dependent factors (population factors)...food, sex ratios, late-born fawns (in the case of a higher-than-normal spike rate of yearling bucks, which suggests spread out breeding periods which result in late-born fawns and therefore first-year antlers that tend toward underdevelopment). So, really, from a manager's standpoint, it doesn't matter how MANY deer there are number-wise; what matters is the CONDITION of those animals as indicators of their health and the health of their range. That's why the DNR uses census methods to monitor the deer herd.


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## glock29 (Mar 16, 2005)

marshrat said:


> The folks at the booth don't count deer or ask anyone; it is the Wildlife Division personnel at overlooks that observe and record deer that they see


I wondered why I had that "feeling" I was being watched..... 

Mandatory Registration would be slightly more accurate....I forgot I can't say that....:banghead3 

Counting pellets to determine the number of deer in the State...theres another one....:lol: Hope we don't count any Wisconsin pellets...


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

marshrat said:


> The bridge count is a CENSUS method


 Now its a Census?




> *marshrat*
> "The folks at the booth don't count deer or ask anyone"?





> *2tundras*
> I know pretty much every booth worker and only two or three say they that ask every truck...


Should of read the above post before saying that :lol:


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## trailsend (Feb 12, 2005)

Marshrat, looking at your first post i see you are former UP bioligist. So please post whatever you want i would like to hear your input.


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## 2tundras (Jan 11, 2005)

Marshrat is right to a degree. There was a period of time when MDNR staff oversaw the process. But that was a while ago. I was asking one of bridge workers about this just last night (due to this post) and his comment was that even then they were either typcailly younger guys looking for some part time cash, or low level MDNR staff reassigned from other areas. Accordingly, the hotty in the Taurus got more attention than what was in the back of a truck. 

Once that died away they went to the booth workers, year unknown. Apparently at times MDNR staff still dhows up for a brief period to do a count they way they had in the past. Either way its a very informal process overseen by laypeople.

For what its worth local consider it a complete joke.


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## Grouse Hunter (Jan 23, 2000)

Trophy Specialist said:


> The bridge count is not designed to count the number of deer crossing the bridge; rather is is just used as a guage to judge the kill from one year to the next.



Thats exactly right! Its not used a pop. estiamte or harvest estimate. Its used as an index to show trends.


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## codybear (Jun 27, 2002)

Thats one of the reasons I started this post, to show how some of the individuals that drive this WDM thread will basically say anything to cover for certain orginizations at all costs. There is alot of speculation going on with no factual evidence and if you dig deep enough you can unravel their theory.


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## trailsend (Feb 12, 2005)

Welcome


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