# Logging



## Young1Gun (Feb 9, 2008)

Have looked on the internet quite a bit, but have yet to find anything close to what I am looking for. A buddy of mine has a substansial amount of property and instead of paying a company to come in and log a portion of it. He is thinking that he can log it himself and a few friends. Question is, does he need any sort of permit? Dropping the trees and moving them isn't a problem at all. Just curious? If anyone has any idea or where to look to inquire on this further it would be greatly appreciated


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## Forest Meister (Mar 7, 2010)

Young1Gun said:


> Have looked on the internet quite a bit, but have yet to find anything close to what I am looking for. A buddy of mine has a substansial amount of property and instead of paying a company to come in and log a portion of it. He is thinking that he can log it himself and a few friends. Question is, does he need any sort of permit? Dropping the trees and moving them isn't a problem at all. Just curious? If anyone has any idea or where to look to inquire on this further it would be greatly appreciated


If you have any questions contact the Township Supervisor. He or she would know of any local ordinances but I have never heard of any permit requirements for logging one's own land in Michigan. Some states out east have requirements but not Michigan as yet.

The rest of your post perplexes me. If your buddy has "a substantial amount of property" he should not have to pay a company to come in and log a portion of it if the trees are indeed ready for harvest. A logging company should be paying him. 

If you and your friends do decide to do a cutting be sure your buddy has liability and workers comp insurance in case any of you get injured. Nobody ever thinks they will get hurt but logging is very near the top to the list of dangerous occupations, and most of the guys getting hurt are professionals. Also, in this sue happy society many mills are reluctant to purchase logs from folks who are not fully covered by insurance and can prove it. FM


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## Petronius (Oct 13, 2010)

Some municipalities have ordnance that requires a permit to cut down a tree. You did not get any information on where this property might be or what he wants to do with the wood. Fire wood or lumber? Hey, just grab a few cases of the cheapest beer and tell the guys to show up and cut it up in 16" lengths. That will do it.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

Forest Meister said:


> .........The rest of your post perplexes me. If your buddy has "a substantial amount of property" he should not have to pay a company to come in and log a portion of it if the trees are indeed ready for harvest. *A logging company should be paying him*.
> 
> If you and your friends do decide to do a cutting be sure your buddy has liability and workers comp insurance in case any of you get injured. Nobody ever thinks they will get hurt but logging is very near the top to the list of dangerous occupations, and most of the guys getting hurt are professionals. Also, in this sue happy society many mills are reluctant to purchase logs from folks who are not fully covered by insurance and can prove it. FM


 My neighbor has 30 acres, had a select cut of oak and maple, and was paid $5,000 by the logger. The logger and crew was insured, a very important issue. If its a large parcel, then a forester should be brought in. A forester will give him valuable information about what should and should not be cut. He can also provide you with an estimate, associated with the amount of logs removed. Using a licensed and insured logger, you can help to plan out any lanes/skid trails.


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## Paperboy 1 (Aug 7, 2008)

Young1Gun said:


> Have looked on the internet quite a bit, but have yet to find anything close to what I am looking for. A buddy of mine has a substansial amount of property and instead of paying a company to come in and log a portion of it. He is thinking that he can log it himself and a few friends. Question is, does he need any sort of permit? Dropping the trees and moving them isn't a problem at all. Just curious? If anyone has any idea or where to look to inquire on this further it would be greatly appreciated


I see you're only 18yo. A buddy of yours has this land where? The reason for needing to know is because my wife is main lady at the Alcona Conservation District. Herself and a few others hire the foresters for our county. Very knowledgeable people to help residents for free. They will come out an access the property and give great input to what you might do and should not do.




If I knew what county you were in she might know the people to contact for "your" forester to come out and give you the "what ifs" and offer some really great help for FREE!:thumbup:

Pm me your # and I'll help ya out. OK?

PS: logging companies pay YOU! Period!

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Ohub Campfire mobile app


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## BUCK/PIKE (Oct 24, 2011)

Make sure u have a buyer set up before u cut,alot of log buyers are picky and want certain lengths and sizes of different species.friends of mine cut there own logs and had a hard time selling them


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## NATTY BUMPO (May 12, 2001)

Paperboy 1 said:


> If I knew what county you were in she might know the people to contact for "your" forester to come out and give you the "what ifs" and offer some really great help for FREE!:thumbup:
> 
> Pm me your # and I'll help ya out. OK?
> 
> ...


Take this advice! We did and it was worth a million!

NB


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## Young1Gun (Feb 9, 2008)

I wrote that wrong, yes I know the loggers pay him. The property is in Glennie, and I'm 22 now. I believe he was only quoted at around 300 an acre. He thought it was low. The have somewheres around 1200 acres. Not all 1200 is getting cut. somewhere around 100 Maybe


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

Young1Gun said:


> I wrote that wrong, yes I know the loggers pay him. The property is in Glennie, and I'm 22 now. I believe he was only quoted at around 300 an acre. He thought it was low. The have somewheres around 1200 acres. Not all 1200 is getting cut. somewhere around 100 Maybe


Call a Forester in............


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## multibeard (Mar 3, 2002)

Make sure that he gets paid before they move on the property. 

Also make sure that every tree they are to cutr is marked and that they are marked by the owner real low to the ground. I know there are a few loggers that know how to bury some extra stumps with the skidder.


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## feedinggrounds (Jul 21, 2009)

2 of the best loggers for habitat and profit are right close to that area. I have used them for a work project of 700 acres, and came highly recomended with many references that I called. These brothers are permanant timber managers for Boy Scouts in Skidway and Clare which camps exceeds 5000 acres PM me for contact info. They work well with the county foresters, USFWS, and MDNR and encourage the use of a forester.


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## NATTY BUMPO (May 12, 2001)

ENCORE said:


> Call a Forester in............


3+

1200 acres is too valuable for amateurs to dabble about with............

Hire a forester to make a management plan, do a timber inventory, mark the trees to be cut, solicit bids on the job, help pic the best bid, you get paid up front, supervise the logging operation, the whole ball of wax. Be sure you get a performance bond, up front, from the logger against any damages. I know of a few absolute butcher jobs by outlaw loggers.:rant:

IME you will be way ahead, on all fronts, by doing it the right way.


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## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

Hire a forester to cruise the timber for him.


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## Forest Meister (Mar 7, 2010)

Young1Gun said:


> I wrote that wrong, yes I know the loggers pay him. The property is in Glennie, and I'm 22 now. I believe he was only quoted at around 300 an acre. He thought it was low. The have somewheres around 1200 acres. Not all 1200 is getting cut. somewhere around 100 Maybe


Sometimes I tend to ramble when passionate about something so please bear with me..........

$300/acre may or may not be a fair price. There are many variables including when the area was last harvested, what the species composition is, how many cords and/or board feet/acre are going to be removed, what kind of access there is, how much road building, maintenance and or snow plowing is necessary, how far the timber is going to have to be skidded, what part of the year logging can take place, how much trucking is involved, if pulp is being removed the number of tons (cords) the quoting logger is being allowed to haul to the mill in any given time frame, etc. 

The only way your buddy will know for sure if he is getting a square deal would be to get a professional out there, as so many have already stressed, and put the timber up on bids. In almost four decades I have yet to see a landowner lose money by having his timber offered on the open market. Often times the bids come in at double, triple, or even more than what the original logger offers. Would your friend or his family be willing to sell their home without having it professionally appraised? How about selling a car, boat, camper, or coin collection? Everybody wants to get top dollar for those things, why should timber be any different?

If you guys still want to cut it yourself be sure to follow the advice of BUCK/PIKE and have your markets lined up ahead of time, but also be fully aware that buyers do not have a crystal ball that is any better than yours. If markets should change your buddy may be left with one pile of wood (pun intended) on his hands. Also, certain species develop stain quite rapidly in hot weather. Stain is a degrade in logs and reduces their value so unless a full truckload can be cut and moved quickly waiting for cooler weather might have its advantages.....but then hunting season is just around the corner.

FWIW. Recently I marked about 75 acres timber for a gentleman who later toyed with the idea of cutting it himself. After contacting local mills the best that could be done by cutting the logs and pulpwood himself and skidding them to a point where they could be picked up by a truck was $5,000 over the top bid, less than 10% of the total. Out of that extra five grand he would have to pay for his gas, oil, and diesel. He would also have to pay for repairs on his equipment along with travel expenses and most likely a new heavy duty chainsaw and probably a new tire or two on his Kubota. Weekends would surely be tied up for at least a year. 

Having made extra money in college by working for loggers on weekends and knowing that the unexpected is what to expect when logging he quickly decided that a 10% margin was not nearly enough to compensate for the risks and loss of free time and took the high bid. FM


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