# Kayak differences? - (ie: Ocean brand w/open seats)???



## sgc (Oct 21, 2007)

I'm new to kayaks. I was at Lake Michigan this past weekend & was surprised to see small kayaks (about 10 footers) with open seats, out on the lake. The name brand was Ocean. In this months Field & Stream there's an article about fishing big water & I noticed the brand kayak was Ocean and again they had open seats (they were much larger). I like the idea of open seats. I'm not fond of the confinement I feel in the "sit-in" cockpit type of kayak. So, my question is what's the deal with the open seats. Are they OK"? Are they better? I always thought big water kayaks would have the cockpit type seats.


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## Chinookhead (Mar 4, 2005)

In my opinion SOT (Sit On Top) kayaks are much safer, especially for a beginner, than a SIK (Sit Inside Kayak) in big water. There are many SIK kayaks that perform well in big water, but you need a "skirt" to keep water from filling the cockpit and you need to be skilled at rolling a kayak in case you flip, which is not so easy in rough weather.....then you may also have to bail it if you fell out.

With a SOT, re-entry into a flipped kayak is easy as long as you are in reasonable shape. Another big advantage of SOT kayaks is comfort and being able to switch positions throughout the day and even standing on them. Also, rigging them is much easier.

The Advantage of SIK kayaks are that they are often lighter and the "touring" models will often be a bit faster. However, a narrow super fast kayak is not an ideal fishing platform (not as stable as a standard wider SOT kayak). A skilled kayaker who can roll and bail a kayak in rough weather can do well in rough weather. Another thing is that you are more sheltered from the weather in a SIK. However, I kayak on my SOT even in the winter......u just need a dry-suit or a wader/dry-top combo for the real cold weather. 

I assume that the kayaks that you describe as "Ocean" Kayaks are the "Ocean Kayak" brand (OK). There are many good manufacturers of SOT kayaks like Ocean Kayak, Malibu, Wilderness System etc. It comes down to personal taste and your style of fishing. For the ultimate in speed look into Hobies, which are "pedal" kayaks and not just paddle kayaks. However, in extremely shallow situations and smaller rivers you won't be pedaling.

You will see many debates about SOT vs. SIK's in many forums. In the end, it comes down to personal taste, but in my opinion, SOT's are usually much better as fishing platforms.


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## malainse (Sep 2, 2002)

Chinook, Great post !!!!!

Go to a dealer and try out the different type. Most will have times when you can try them and/or rent for a few days. 


I agree: if looking for a fishing kayak, Sit-on-top is the way to go. I am saving my $$ for a Hobie pedal kayak....:evil:


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## centerpin (Jun 13, 2009)

good post.

Chinookhead if you dont mind could you please elaborate on a dry top / wader setup for winter kayak angling, I am thinking about running my kayak until January this year in the river.


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## coverdog (Dec 7, 2003)

centerpin said:


> good post.
> 
> Chinookhead if you dont mind could you please elaborate on a dry top / wader setup for winter kayak angling, I am thinking about running my kayak until January this year in the river.


Personally I wouldn't go out that late in the year with water that cold without a dry suit.


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## Chinookhead (Mar 4, 2005)

centerpin said:


> good post.
> 
> Chinookhead if you dont mind could you please elaborate on a dry top / wader setup for winter kayak angling, I am thinking about running my kayak until January this year in the river.


To qualify as a dry top it has to have seals at the neck, wrists, and waist that seal out all water entry. This is not a "splash top" which is just good for splashes....dry tops keep out water even after immersion. The purpose of the dry-top is to prevent you from getting too cold and so that your waders don't fill up if you fall in making it tough for you to swim or re-enter the kayak.

You can wear the dry-top over waders or waterproof kayak "dry-pants" specifically designed to be used with dry tops. The absolute safest route is a one piece dry-suit (very expensive), but you can find dry-tops which can performs close to equally well. Should you go the wader and dry-top combo route, make sure to test it in a pool and swim with it on your waders to see if the waist gasket actually seals to your waders before going out with it in cold weather.

I wear a NRS double tunnel dry-top (2 waist seals) on top of my waders that reliably seals to by gore-tex bootfoot waders. I still wear a belt over it all "just in case".

This video is very interesting about "waders of death", but even after seeing this video I either wear a dry-top on top of my waders or I don't wear waders and expect to get wet with nothing waterproof.


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## centerpin (Jun 13, 2009)

Outstanding information, more research and testing is in order. I will be sure to do that before November gets here. 

Thanks again.


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## Flyfisher (Oct 1, 2002)

Chinookhead said:


> To qualify as a dry top it has to have seals at the neck, wrists, and waist that seal out all water entry. This is not a "splash top" which is just good for splashes....dry tops keep out water even after immersion. The purpose of the dry-top is to prevent you from getting too cold and so that your waders don't fill up if you fall in making it tough for you to swim or re-enter the kayak.
> 
> You can wear the dry-top over waders or waterproof kayak "dry-pants" specifically designed to be used with dry tops. The absolute safest route is a one piece dry-suit (very expensive), but you can find dry-tops which can performs close to equally well. Should you go the wader and dry-top combo route, make sure to test it in a pool and swim with it on your waders to see if the waist gasket actually seals to your waders before going out with it in cold weather.
> 
> I wear a NRS double tunnel dry-top (2 waist seals) on top of my waders that reliably seals to by gore-tex bootfoot waders. I still wear a belt over it all "just in case".


I wear a similar setup for cold weather paddling for steelhead. Even more important is to have a dry bag stuffed with warm clothes and a towel so one can dry off and change quickly. Personally, I am not worried about my waders "filling up with water" with the combimation of a wading belt and the adjustable waist seal on the dry top (worn over the waders). I always wear a snug PFD as well so my biggest concern would be getting my hands, face, and head dry as quickly a possible.


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