# Farmlegend, or anyone interested.



## BSK (Apr 10, 2004)

Probably the "stats" I like best:

Over the last 5 years, 27% of observed antlered bucks are "shooters" (2 1/2 or older).

Last year, photo census data indicated 40% of our buck population was shooters.


----------



## BSK (Apr 10, 2004)

It's amazing the interesting analyses you can pull from observation data. Below is a graph of only older-age (2 1/2+ year-old) buck observation rates _per day_ during the month of November from my place. This is 10 years of data. Even without fetal data, the "peak of breeding" is quite obvious.










By the way, only true "estrus chases" are included in the "chase" category. Bucks can be seen pestering and flat-out chasing does throughout the the time-frame labeled "seeking phase." But true estrus chases have been limited to a 13 day window over 10 years, Nov. 17-29.


----------



## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

I just spent the last week at camp and looked at my journal and thought about bringing it home to tally up the numbers. It's still at camp but I try my next trip to camp. Deer numbers look pretty good with lots of fawns.

My camp is a good example of how individuals can make a difference.

Firearms deer season '97, I saw a deer every few days and sometimes more than one. 

I started improving the habitat in the spring of '98, food plots, tree/shrub planting and tree cutting. I'm sure I've put in over a 1000 manhours of labor by now.

Firearms deer season '03, the longest I went without seeing a deer in the first 7.5 days of hunting dark to dark was 2 hours. :yikes:

I fully expect deer numbers to triple in the next few months when my new and existing plantings are the only green lush growth around. Watch out mature does, I've been at the Co-Op buying tags since they became available last Monday. I'm planning a surprise going away party for you.


----------



## newk8 (Jul 28, 2004)

I have enjoyed reading all of the data and information shared in this thread. I would like to add one small piece of information. Regardless of how many deer I see, or the number of deer per hunted hour, I enjoy the opportunity to be in the woods. A good hunt to me is one shared with a friend or spouse, where the sun comes up in the east to warm you a little bit. The squirrels (sp?) a moving around, the birds are chirping, and of course there is always a warm cup of coffee waiting at the end of the morning. Seeing deer is a bonus for me, always has been always will be. I love to spend time outdoors, it is a time to relax and enjoy the beauty that has been provided to us. Thank you for sharing all of the information in this thread. I have enjoyed reading all of it.


----------



## omega58 (Sep 3, 2003)

The only numbers I have kept the past couple of years is the number of bucks I see opening day of firearm season at the property I rifle hunt, I don't think the doe count would be accurate with doubling back and seeing them later in the day, but the least amount of deer during the past few years would be 68. I do know that I have hunted on the property once without seeing a deer during muzzleloader season, I was sitting for a total of about 2 hours planning on shooting a doe, I guess that's the way it works. 


These are my opening day stats for the past few years and what I shot

1998 - 14 different bucks (8 point)
1999 - 12 (8 point)
2000 - 15 (didn't shoot)
2001 - 13 (didn't shoot)
2002 - 14 (dad sitting with me, he missed nice 8, he thought was 7 point and wouldn't listen to his son and was worried about stupid camp rule. . .I am guessing 3 1/2 old deer)
2003 - 12 (8 point)

This past year was the most fun I have had, even though I have seen more deer on a day, I was playing around with the PHANTOM WHITETAIL all day and had the bucks and does going nuts.(called in the buck I shot and had him scraping and rubbing trees and grunting coming in for a fight) My max without seeing a deer that day was 9 minutes, first year I had a food plot there. (and that wasn't at the time I was gutting my buck around noon. . .had three deer come on the food plot while I was gutting him off to the side) 

THE BEST PART OF THE DAY CAME ABOUT 5 MINUTES AFTER I SHOT MY BUCK AND MY WIFE CALLED TO SAY SHE WAS PREGNANT, we now have a great little son named HUNTER. :gaga: 

I am going to miss hunting that spot if the owners have a fallout this year. . . I am hoping on them settling differences or my friends and us doing the buying out.


----------



## BSK (Apr 10, 2004)

newk8,

Don't worry, even us "data heads" enjoy the simple pleasures of the hunt. We just also get a kick out of tracking progress with our management, and the only way to do that is with hard numbers.


----------



## johnhunter (Jun 17, 2000)

Wow, Omega. Twelve (12) different bucks seen on opening day of gun season? 

I haven't seen 12 different bucks in the last TWO calendar years on my place - that includes about 35 hunts/year, throughout the archery and gun seasons, walking to/from my stands during the hunting seasons, year-round visits for habitat work, everything.

You've got too many deer over there!


----------



## omega58 (Sep 3, 2003)

farmlegend said:


> Wow, Omega. Twelve (12) different bucks seen on opening day of gun season?
> 
> I haven't seen 12 different bucks in the last TWO calendar years on my place - that includes about 35 hunts/year, throughout the archery and gun seasons, walking to/from my stands during the hunting seasons, year-round visits for habitat work, everything.
> 
> You've got too many deer over there!



Yeah, it's a bad problem to have, but I'll deal with it somehow.


----------



## newk8 (Jul 28, 2004)

BSK

I agree that data is important, I just do not spend that much time on it. When I am done hunting I either grab a beer or have to work on the honey do list. Not much time to write stuff down. Maybe I should, and will probball start this year to track the decline of the buck heard post QDM. I was out scouting last night and saw three of the nicest bucks I have ever seen in the area I hunt. 1 - 6 point, nice a tall, 2.5 year old buck and two 8' s both 3.5 years old. Both with nice 15 - 17 inch spreads and tall. Taller than any thing I have seen. Also one nice 8 point running around that is pi bald. Completely white from about the middle of his body back. Beautiful buck, but he knows he is special. Does not stay out long. 

omega 58 - goin fishing soon. missed you on the water this summer? Baby stuff is important though. See you on Labor day weekend or sooner???


----------



## omega58 (Sep 3, 2003)

Newk8,

I am heading up tomorrow to get in some fishing finally. . . Labor Day looks like it will happen and it should be fun, hope we are sore from fighting all the salmon!

I know what you mean about 118, should be a big harvest all small bucks from some of the neighbors. . . are you seeing these bucks at the farm or Ali?


----------



## newk8 (Jul 28, 2004)

Omega 58 - buck reports coming from around farm. Have seen does at ali but no horns yet. Tough to see deer when tractors, and wheelers are running around planting plots.


Yes I too am hoping to be sore this labor day weekend. Should be a good catch, congrats on the baby and the good catch on Friday!!!


----------



## Leon2 (Mar 8, 2004)

Wow, Bob S, thanks for getting this post going. I too thoroughly enjoyed reading all of these posts. Unfortunately, I haven't kept quite the data records that the rest of you have, but here are my observations about whitetail counts and successful seasons.

Since becoming a QDM fanatic, I usually judge the "season" by how many mature bucks I get a chance to see. Like others, I don't have to see deer every hour or every day to enjoy the hunt. I do, however, like to see at least one mature, wall hanger once a season and have some reasonable chance to get him. For me, that's why I hunt and many of you have heard me say that I won't apologize because I love to hunt big bucks. For the record, I also take 2.5 year old bucks and I shoot 2-4 does every year, whether they needed thinnin' or not!

For example, two years ago, I saw a huge 12 point buck with a large spread in my neighbor's field six times before rifle season. Now, I never saw this deer on one of my stands, but just the thought that I might see this monster drove me to hunt hard and made each day in the woods a great day. Amazingly, no one ever claimed to have killed this monster and my neighbor claims to have seen him after muzzleloading season.

A year earlier, we had several big bucks on camera, but I hadn't seen one through Nov. 7. Then I saw a 14 pointer at 15 yards and I took the hair off his back with an arrow. I saw him three more times in the next week before rifle season, including another 15 yard opportunity where I just couldn't get the shot off before he took off chasing a doe. I never saw him in rifle season, but the second week of the season, I heard my neighbor got a huge buck. Sure enough, there was "my" 14 pointer in the neighbor's garage. It didn't matter to me that I didn't get this trophy. I treasured the time I had to pursue him and I was happy that my neighbor got the trophy of the lifetime. In 40+ years of hunting, it was by far the biggest buck he had ever shot.

I am 50 years old and I have been deer hunting 10-25 days a season in the Eastern UP since I was 12 years old. I am old enough to remember when the deer were so scarce, we used to get excited when we'd see tracks in the snow. We'd even stop the car and look at them, trying to imagine where those critters were headed. I can remember trailing a lone track in the snow all day long, hoping to catch up and get a glimpse of it for a fleeting shot. I also remember one rifle season when I hunted about eight days and I never saw a deer the entire time. I remember hoping and praying that I would just see one doe. It never happened.

I also remember the 1988 and 1989 seasons when there were deer everywhere and we could kill 4 bucks each. I was quilty of taking my quota - all 1.5 year "sparky the wonderbuck" specimens except for one magnificent 11 point 4.5 year old that adorns my rec room.

In 1991, my dad first challenged me to get off the spikehorn addiction and begin trying to take 2.5 year old deer and older. We didn't know there was a fancy name for this (QDM) and we didn't know there was a national organization promoting this simple concept. We just knew that it made sense to stop shooting every spikehorn that moved past us.

That year, I took two beautiful 3.5 year old bucks, one on Nov. 10 after spending 10 straight days in the same stand waiting for him to cross near me, and one five days later, the first day of rifle season. Had I been predisposed to kill young bucks, I wouldn't have taken either of these "trophy" bucks.

Following that experience, I was hooked on "Let him go, so he can grow." 

Today, I get a kick out of trying to identify specific deer and I give them names throughout the season as I see them over and over. I give the young bucks special names and I wish them good luck as they move on past me. I hope that I see them again in another year.

We also make extensive use of deer cams to photograph and to estimate the number of deer in the area. Each year, I am amazed that we photograph some nice bucks that we never see and, occasionally, we take a nice buck that we never photographed.

I must be feeling philosophical tonight, but this is the essence of why I hunt and why I love and admire the whitetail so much.


----------



## Bob S (Mar 8, 2000)

Good post Leon, thanks for sharing. 

It is amazing what a difference we can make to the age structure of the deer herd when we decide to stop culling those genetically inferior spikes.


----------

