# DNR Pulling Over Successful Deer Hunters???



## GrizzlyHunter

My son and I drove back from the UP yesterday (Sunday, 11/17/2019). Between the bridge and Gaylord we saw seven different DNR vehicles sitting in the I-75 freeway turnaround areas waiting for successful hunters to pull over. We saw three different vehicles headed South with deer obviously displayed and watched the DNR vehicles come speeding out of their spot to catch up to and pull over the successful hunters.

I've never seen or heard of this before. Is this new? Pulling over vehicles NOT because they were breaking the law. What's up with that? I don't like it.

And no, we did not shoot a deer and we were not pulled over.

Your thoughts?


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## PTPD2312

This happens every year. You display a deer openly and they have RS/PC to stop and make sure that the deer was legally taken.


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## U of M Fan

Apparently my buddy got pulled over on the way home from camp. CO said he pulled him over for tinted windows and then searched his enclosed trailer. I seen a CO sitting and the park and ride at the intersection in Sagola. My trailer isn’t enclosed and I don’t have a cap on my truck. Didn’t get a deer either.

I don’t like that they’re obviously pulling people over just to search their vehicles.


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## beer and nuts

I will assume they are "targeting" outstate potential hunters coming back via the UP!? maybe? ps. I've never heard of this before or seen a DNR on I-75 waiting in median. Mmmm.


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## michiganreaper

There were 2 CO's parked just outside Rose City on 33 yesterday doing the same thing.


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## Old lund

I don’t see a problem with that if you have a leagal deer you have nothing to worry about with all the dnr reports that you see of people buying tags after the fact of shooting I’m not complaining about a little check . Don’t do anything wrong and you have nothing to worry about except for a few minutes of lost travel time


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## bheary

Not new, happens every opening weekend.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk


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## stickbow shooter

Seen it on one of those warden shows too. But it was in southern Mich. Years ago they did a rode block on one of the popular seasonal roads around here. They stopped every vehicle coming out that night.


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## SteelShot

Old lund said:


> I don’t see a problem with that if you have a leagal deer you have nothing to worry about with all the dnr reports that you see of people buying tags after the fact of shooting I’m not complaining about a little check . Don’t do anything wrong and you have nothing to worry about except for a few minutes of lost travel time


Exactly the point, you’ve done nothing wrong but are being harassed for no reason other than you killed a deer. Unfortunately with all the crazy laws if they dig around enough they can find something to write you on. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## d_rek

My cousins and two friends got pulled over near Gaylord not once but twice this weekend. The first time they were coming home from the morning hunt and saw a deer about 10 yards off the road so they slowed to check it out. They saw right away it was a decoy and went on their way. They got about 1/2 mile up the road and DNR pulled them over, checked tags and licenses and told them he could have got them for 'shining' if he wanted to. 

They got pulled over by the same guy a day later on a different road. They had a doe in the bed of the truck but unfortunately the guy that shot it didn't tag it, even though he had his tags and licenses. He gave the guy a ticket for not tagging his animal. And shame on him for not tagging it, but seeing as he had his licenses he could have let them off with a warning if he had tagged it then and there.

Sounds like there's a CO up there who has a chip on his shoulder. I sure hope they don't start more aggressive searching to meet budget shortfalls. Just a really bad look for CO's and the agency if they go that direction.


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## tdduckman

Come on a non tagged deer in a truck is deserving of a ticket, " He forgot" holds zero weight on that with me. 


TD


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## d_rek

tdduckman said:


> Come on a non tagged deer in a truck is deserving of a ticket, " He forgot" holds zero weight on that with me.
> 
> 
> TD


Like I said, shame on him. I'm not apologizing or making any excuses for the guy. I agree he should have tagged it.


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## Eyecon

Sign up for the dnr email. They told us they’re going to be looking.


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## kisherfisher

tdduckman said:


> Come on a non tagged deer in a truck is deserving of a ticket, " He forgot" holds zero weight on that with me.
> 
> 
> TD


Add the fact he was road "observing" the day before. Good job CO !


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## d_rek

kisherfisher said:


> Add the fact he was road "observing" the day before. Good job CO !


Is it a crime to look at deer from the road?


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## DEDGOOSE

That's why you wear your church clothes in transit 

If we got searched in Sal's truck I give em a list of stuff we've been missing in the backseat piled high and if he came across them set them aside lol


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## kisherfisher

Never said it was illegal to observe . Always worth a check to see if the "sportsman" are on the up and up, like maybe a loaded gun in the vehicle doing a little road hunting. So the next day they "oops" forgot to tag a deer. What a coincident! Doing exactly what they are paid to do, making stops and inquiries.


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## NbyNW

Anyone hear they are using helicopters to find bait piles on opening weekend? Heard a few reports of heli's circling over hunting grounds.

DNR might want to spend more money on actual researches about CWD before throwing hells gates at the public. Just another reason to contribute to the decline in hunters.


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## Scout 2

NbyNW said:


> Anyone hear they are using helicopters to find bait piles on opening weekend? Heard a few reports of heli's circling over hunting grounds.
> 
> DNR might want to spend more money on actual researches about CWD before throwing hells gates at the public. Just another reason to contribute to the decline in hunters.


Well at least at this rate they may be able to go on vacation next year from the 15 to 30


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## Luv2hunteup

Watch the video.


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## birdhntr

stickbow shooter said:


> Seen it on one of those warden shows too. But it was in southern Mich. Years ago they did a rode block on one of the popular seasonal roads around here. They stopped every vehicle coming out that night.


Yup it was on Wardens.That was a few miles from the state border In southwest Michigan.If I remember correctly they did get a few bringing in unprocessed deer across the border.They have done this for years.A very common practice across the country.We ran into a mandatory stop in ND.They were checking for legal possession limits for pheasants.Many were directed to a parking area so I assume there was a problem.I asked what was there worst violation.He said they had one that day in which a lone guy in a Cadillac had 47 pheasants in his trunk.
If they weren't writing tickets they wouldn't waste the time but apparently they find a lot of violations doing checks.


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## jr28schalm

Check me all you want. I'll give them same rule as my wife. Stf out of my pockets


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## UPEsox

Honestly I think people are just plain sick of being under the boot. Seems LEO's spend way more time trying to "catch you" or made you life miserable than they are keeping anything safe.


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## sparky18181

Biggbear said:


> First, I have no problem with CO's and respect the job they do, Lord knows I couldn't do what they do.
> 
> But I'm sorry I have an issue with using going 2 mph over the speed limit over, or tinted windows, or some other traffic violation as an excuse to look for hunting violations. If I'm driving down the road and the tag has blown off my deer and a CO pulls me over so be it. But to use one as an excuse to get to the other is over reach from my perspective. It is legal I guess, while you're pulled over for violating one law they can look for more, it's the intent that bothers me. This isn't coincidence, it's a concerted effort to take advantage of a legal loophole.
> 
> Seems like lazy law enforcement work, and a chicken s--- thing to do. While technically not a violation of anyone's rights, it's about as close to the line as you can get.


That’s why they draw lines. You don’t have to like it when it’s you but it is legal. One thing leads to another


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## kisherfisher

Sewey said:


> You cannot be pulled over while driving simply because an officer wants to check your license, privilege or not they need probable cause or reasonable suspicion of a crime being committed. If transporting a deer carcass within visible sight is PC/RS enough to be stopped by a CO as Nocked states, I'd like to see article stating it. I have no problem with being checked for my license while afield, and I have been, while participating in whatever outdoor activity I choose to. That is active police work and how you go about catching violators, not sitting in a median and assuming or hoping someone did something wrong because you see someone with a deer or a truck and trailer with hunting stickers on it driving down the road.
> 
> But you're right, we can go round and round on this and neither will persuade the other. I just feel strongly over my personal liberties and the constitution in which this country was founded. It's a very slippery slope when more and more people are willing to sacrifice freedoms because they have nothing to hide and feel it's for the greater good of catching those that do, just my opinion.


You are correct , to a point. The Motor vehicle code is very thick . A traffic violation can be found on nearly anyone driving . Then the investigation starts . If all is in order, have a good day! If not , be patient until you can explain your evasiveness. Yes , this is how the rapist who skipped bond, or the pedophile that did not register , or the guy that just stole your rifles out of your truck when you stopped for a cold one, gets caught. No they didn't flag anyone down out of guilt to admit their crimes. Or do you have the better idea on how to spot a criminal or violator? Please enlighten Law enforcement , it would save a lot of grief for all of the above people that were inconvenienced on the way home.


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## buckguts1970

Where in the hell do you people live that you are having this much trouble with law enforcement?
All I can say is when you get pulled over is resist as much as possible, i love watching the videos on you tube. Lol

Sent from my SM-G965U using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## UPEsox

The actual criminals are such a small percentage of the population that these dragnets piss a ton of people off. Also if LEO's weren't such "hardasses" people would be more likely to call them to turn in poachers/etc. 
Not to mention the consequences of something like having a consumed beer in the back of your truck or a roach in the ash tray that you didn't toss because you don't litter. That can be "probable" cause to ruin someone's life, for what a little revenue.


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## Sewey

kisherfisher said:


> You are correct , to a point. The Motor vehicle code is very thick . A traffic violation can be found on nearly anyone driving . Then the investigation starts . If all is in order, have a good day! If not , be patient until you can explain your evasiveness. Yes , this is how the rapist who skipped bond, or the pedophile that did not register , or the guy that just stole your rifles out of your truck when you stopped for a cold one, gets caught. No they didn't flag anyone down out of guilt to admit their crimes. Or do you have the better idea on how to spot a criminal or violator? Please enlighten Law enforcement , it would save a lot of grief for all of the above people that were inconvenienced on the way home.


I never once stated I was against a lawful stop. If I’m speeding or have a tail light out or in violation of any other traffic laws or moving violations, then by all means pull me over and let’s talk. What I am against is unlawful detention and unreasonable searches without PC or RS. IMO, me having a deer visible while driving down the road does not leave any indication that I killed that animal illegally or committed any other violations, and I haven’t been shown otherwise that it is enough PC/RS for a stop. I’m a law abiding citizen who doesn’t require supervision or random audits to ensure I haven’t broken any laws simply because other people may have. It kind of goes hand in hand with gun bans, just because some people miss use them doesn’t mean we take them from everyone. So the only “enlightenment”, as you say, I have for LEO is to adhere to the constitution they swore to uphold and follow the guidelines in which they have to operate within. And of course, for them to be safe, I do have an officer in the family who I just enjoyed a weekend at deer camp with and would like to continue to do so.


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## poz

The problem is how many calls did they get for trespassing and don't respond because they are out doing things like this


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## jr28schalm

buckguts1970 said:


> Where in the hell do you people live that you are having this much trouble with law enforcement?
> All I can say is when you get pulled over is resist as much as possible, i love watching the videos on you tube. Lol
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


All the police got to do is whisper in your ear on a Friday night your not getting out till Monday morning. Resist comes naturally


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## stickbow shooter




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## kisherfisher

Sewey said:


> I never once stated I was against a lawful stop. If I’m speeding or have a tail light out or in violation of any other traffic laws or moving violations, then by all means pull me over and let’s talk. What I am against is unlawful detention and unreasonable searches without PC or RS. IMO, me having a deer visible while driving down the road does not leave any indication that I killed that animal illegally or committed any other violations, and I haven’t been shown otherwise that it is enough PC/RS for a stop. I’m a law abiding citizen who doesn’t require supervision or random audits to ensure I haven’t broken any laws simply because other people may have. It kind of goes hand in hand with gun bans, just because some people miss use them doesn’t mean we take them from everyone. So the only “enlightenment”, as you say, I have for LEO is to adhere to the constitution they swore to uphold and follow the guidelines in which they have to operate within. And of course, for them to be safe, I do have an officer in the family who I just enjoyed a weekend at deer camp with and would like to continue to do so.


Dnr has every right to make a stop if you are carrying a deer . 100 per cent a lawful stop , no question.


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## Plumbgranny

Interesting thread. I can see both sides to a certain degree. I don't like the inconvenience, but I do want the violators out there held accountable. I think much of this it depends on the individual CO. and if they're quickly checking for a game violation which I'd gladly adhere to, or are they're accusatory and digging for anything to pop you on. I've experienced both type stops. The polite, respectful quick check and the look for anything we can find type"cowboy" who seems to want to write a citation.
I'd liken this to the weigh stations on the highway that check commercial motor vehicles. No hint that they are not fully compliant, but a requirement that you pull thru for a quick check of your equipment and possibly credentials for the greater good. Occasionally they mark "out of service" the unsafe, 80,000 lb. projectile careening down the highway, but the other 97% of the trucks have to deal with the inconvenience of pulling in and the delay.
Maybe not a perfect apples to apples...just one way of looking at it.


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## bowhunter426

Simple solution. Don't travel with a deer in plain sight. If you do get stopped, point out that the deer is legally tagged and ask to be on your way if that is all they want


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## Sewey

kisherfisher said:


> Dnr has every right to make a stop if you are carrying a deer . 100 per cent a lawful stop , no question.


I’ll question, is it written in the MI Legislation? It’s not in the digest.


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## UPEsox

bowhunter426 said:


> Simple solution. Don't travel with a deer in plain sight. If you do get stopped, point out that the deer is legally tagged and ask to be on your way if that is all they want


and bite their finger if they try any of that saliva swab nonsense lol


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## HUBBHUNTER

The 2nd week of bow season I had a DNR officer follow me to where I park on our property. I got out and walked up to him like he was the neighbor stopping to chat about how the hunting has been going. That was pretty much the tone of the conversation. We BS'd for a minute and tractor was coming down the road so he needed to get out of the way. He wished me good luck without ever asking to see my licence and drove off. 


Whether you have a positive or negative interaction with a LEO is incredibly dependent on your actions not the LEO's.


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## DirtySteve

bowhunter42 said:


> From my experience this year, my local CO just likes to stop and shoot the **** for a few minutes. I don't support the dnr stopping sucessfull trucks coming back from the up just because they were successful. Those that are bringing home untagged deer have them cut and in a cooler already.


Not me i use my musky/sturgeon or otter tag on them. Keeps my hero pitcures on social media looking legit! 

Get yourself a stencil and a sharpie and you can make a free bobcat tag look just like a snowmobile trail permit when you are traveling 25mph. S N O W 19


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## Nocked

Sewey said:


> I’ll question, is it written in the MI Legislation? It’s not in the digest.


Unfortunately not every fish and game law is printed in the digests. Good thing too, unless you want to be issued a dictionary sized manual when you buy a license.

Look up Michigan Wildlife Conservation Order of the Michigan Complied Laws.


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## Honyuk96

Anyway you slice it, LEO’s can pretty much get away w whatever they wish. I’ve been on both sides of the coin. My BIL is a LEO and he’s a total POS. Meathead that thrives on F’in w people. Another aquaintence that used to come up to our deer camp was a LEO his entire life, until he retired. Biggest violator ever. Best way to protect yourself is don’t put yourself in a vulnerable position to be f’d w. It’s that simple. I personally know many LEO’s and they for the most part are as dirty as the poachers, meth heads, rapists etc just the way it is


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## kisherfisher

Turn them in ! Makes a bad name for the good ones . They are not above the law , and will be dealt with like anyone. No one is going to jeopardize their careers on a violator .


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## Biggbear

sparky18181 said:


> That’s why they draw lines. You don’t have to like it when it’s you but it is legal. One thing leads to another


You don't get it. I've never been pulled over, so it's never been me. I don't like the practice, and flirting with violating people's rights. I get that it's legal, I get that there is nothing to be done about it, I get that from law enforcement's perspective it's likely seen as a tool and nothing more.

I also stand by my perspective that pulling someone over who is speeding to give them a speeding ticket is law enforcement work. Pulling someone over for speeding with the intended purpose of questioning them about their legally tagged deer is chicken s---.


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## GrizzlyHunter

Honyuk96 said:


> Anyway you slice it, LEO’s can pretty much get away w whatever they wish. I’ve been on both sides of the coin. My BIL is a LEO and he’s a total POS. Meathead that thrives on F’in w people. Another aquaintence that used to come up to our deer camp was a LEO his entire life, until he retired. Biggest violator ever. Best way to protect yourself is don’t put yourself in a vulnerable position to be f’d w. It’s that simple. I personally know many LEO’s and they for the most part are as dirty as the poachers, meth heads, rapists etc just the way it is


WOW!!! That post doesn't give me the "Warm Fuzzies!"

I know when I saw the seven DNR vehicles laying in hide for the hunters I felt like I was running a gauntlet. Now I think I know how the deer feel when they're in their winter yards and the wolves are circling the perimeter. Somebody is going down, we just don't know who.


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## UPEsox

Honyuk96 said:


> Anyway you slice it, LEO’s can pretty much get away w whatever they wish.


This is exactly why I feel the way I do, because it happens over and over. They work for us yet are never held accountable, and generally make life hell. Also these bad LEO's exist within the ranks years before they are caught and that tells me all I need to know about the organization as a whole. It means their coworkers are aware of the behavior and allow it to happen, even if they themselves aren't crooked they are complicit.


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## Sharkbait11

jiggin is livin said:


> Yeah it's total BS. No it's not right. Probably not constitutional either. I'd fight it the whole way. Nothing pissess me off more than being accused of being a criminal. That's how I'd start that conversation too. "What am I being pulled over for?" Let them talk a minute then tell them "No you may not search anything, I'm not a criminal and you have no evidence to accuse me of being a criminal. I don't appreciate being treated as a criminal and you have a nice day, I'm out of here."
> 
> No different than the dicks at Walmart asking to check your receipt. I tell them the same thing and never slow down.
> 
> Sure they might get a warrant, but I got nothing to hide and they are gonna work for it. F them for wasting my time.
> 
> 
> As for the don't do anything wrong and you have nothing to worry about BS. NO NO NO NO, ABSOLUTELY NO!!! This is America and we are free, we have rights. It's not a police state and checkpoints and the like should be faught. Every. Single. Time.
> 
> Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


Yeah this is my thoughts too. one slip up, one time your forget 1 small thing it will cost you and for what? Does it mean your a poacher or criminal..no, its targeted and its harassment. What a lame way to enforce laws and spend taxpayer money. 

They should be more proactive and get out of their vehicle "boots on the ground" approach and go find criminals, instead there sitting on their azzes eating candy bars smelling each others farts and pretending to do their job. "Ahh I see a rack sticking out there, lets pull him over Johnson" 

For how many people call the rap lines and dont get investigated and yet they have time to spot hunters at the road who have not done anything wrong unless they search your vehicle....shameful!


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## Sewey

HUBBHUNTER said:


> The 2nd week of bow season I had a DNR officer follow me to where I park on our property. I got out and walked up to him like he was the neighbor stopping to chat about how the hunting has been going. That was pretty much the tone of the conversation. We BS'd for a minute and tractor was coming down the road so he needed to get out of the way. He wished me good luck without ever asking to see my licence and drove off.
> 
> 
> Whether you have a positive or negative interaction with a LEO is incredibly dependent on your actions not the LEO's.


I’ve always had a positive interaction with LEO. Treat them with respect and you usually get the same in return. I would never advocate being disrespectful to LEO’s. This, however, is more of a debate on if the interaction should take place to begin with.




Nocked said:


> Unfortunately not every fish and game law is printed in the digests. Good thing too, unless you want to be issued a dictionary sized manual when you buy a license.
> 
> Look up Michigan Wildlife Conservation Order of the Michigan Complied Laws.


That is unfortunate. I think most people go to the digest for the rules and regulations, having more laws someplace else doesn’t give us a very good chance to stay within them, or know when a CO is stepping outside of them. Thank you for the resource, I’ll have to do some looking when I get time.


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## HUBBHUNTER

Honyuk96 said:


> Anyway you slice it, LEO’s can pretty much get away w whatever they wish. I’ve been on both sides of the coin. My BIL is a LEO and he’s a total POS. Meathead that thrives on F’in w people. Another aquaintence that used to come up to our deer camp was a LEO his entire life, until he retired. Biggest violator ever. Best way to protect yourself is don’t put yourself in a vulnerable position to be f’d w. It’s that simple. I personally know many LEO’s and they for the most part are as dirty as the poachers, meth heads, rapists etc just the way it is


Wut? Ok, there will always be bad apples but I think you just run with a rough crowd that happens to have a couple cops.

I know a handful DNR, County, State and Local cops and they are all good solid people.


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## Floater

I'd like to start this by saying that I don't use marijuana either medically or recreationally. I have been reading the posts where some of you claim that the potheads are paranoid. However, if you read the bi-weekly reports on the the DNR crime website, it seems like there are a disproportionate number of marijuana offense arrests made by DNR conservation officers. I will not take a position on whether the arrests are appropriate. However I do have a real problem with Conservation Officers dealing with marijuana and other non-conservation offenses. Over and over on this site people excuse the DNR lack of timely response to RAP calls by saying they are spread thin, have a lot of territory to cover, understaffed, etc. Yet, they seem to spend an excessive amount of time with non-conservation offenses. I fully understand that they are law enforcement officers and have the right to make non-conservation arrests. But it seems that their priority should be the protection of the natural resources of the State. If they are worried about the odor of marijuana coming from a vehicle or the possibility that someone may have an outstanding warrant, they should call in local law enforcement to handle it. I'd rather the CO write tickets to the individuals snagging salmon at homestead or taking over-limits or undersized fish and game rather than spending their time searching a vehicle, making an arrest, transporting to jail and appearing in court on overtime for a non-conservation offense. This is both time and money being taken away from protecting our resources. It makes very little sense to me.


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## Honyuk96

I’m just going to share one example and the bow out of this conversation, quite frankly, cause it makes me sick. The aquaintenance i mentioned earlier. Worked as a county sheriiff for 20 some ought years before he retired. He and his son came up to deer camp every year. One of the last years i hunted there, said LEO and his son were involved in an auto accident on the way up to camp. Of course they wer pounding “road sodas” the whole way up. When they pulled over and responding officer arrived on scene it was just a matter of flashing a badge and a little good ole boy talk and they continued on their way to camp. Anyone else would’ve been in da slammer. It happens. Every single day. Never consent to searches and do yourself a favor and never put yourself in a vulnerable position to begin w. Drive a two track at 2am during deer season and your asking for trouble. Right, wrong, makes no difference, it’s just the way it is.


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## mbrewer

Tom (mich) said:


> Someone splain this to me please.
> 
> 1. I'm fishing the Detroit River in April for walleye and I'm traveling in my boat from Wyandotte up to the Ren Cen. When I hit the Ambassador Bridge, I get pulled over by the DNR to check to see if I have the appropriate licenses and I'm compliant with the allowable limit.
> 2. I'm hunting in Atlanta for deer and I'm now traveling southbound to my home in Troy on I-75 after a successful hunt. When I hit Birch Run, I get pulled over by the DNR to check to see if I have the appropriate licenses and I'm compliant with the allowable limit.
> 
> Scenario #1 happens consistently and virtually no one has any issue with it. In fact, if you fish the Detroit River often enough, it's nearly certain you've been checked.
> 
> Scenario #2 has MS in a collective panty bunch, with baseless accusations of unreasonable search, loss of basic human rights, etc.
> 
> What am I missing here?


Maybe someone has already but if not I'll have a go at it.

Would you consider the stop proper if you were trailering your boat down the highway and were pulled over for a license and bag limit check? Hunters in the woods, fisherman on the water is quite a different scenario than either rolling down the interstate. IMO.


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## sparky18181

Biggbear said:


> You don't get it. I've never been pulled over, so it's never been me. I don't like the practice, and flirting with violating people's rights. I get that it's legal, I get that there is nothing to be done about it, I get that from law enforcement's perspective it's likely seen as a tool and nothing more.
> 
> I also stand by my perspective that pulling someone over who is speeding to give them a speeding ticket is law enforcement work. Pulling someone over for speeding with the intended purpose of questioning them about their legally tagged deer is chicken s---.


Guess we disagree.


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## Sharkbait11

jr28schalm said:


> I got my mouth swabbed in caddy Saturday.. lmfao.. Wtf I am no test case


Can I have a smoke after you "swab" me officer or at least kiss me first...


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## mbrewer

jr28schalm said:


> I got my mouth swabbed in caddy Saturday.. lmfao.. Wtf I am no test case


Told ya! Back to the wall only has you half covered.:lol:


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## CHASINEYES

If they have a right to pull people over just to check tags on a visible animal, so be it. But,, there's obviously been a degraded moral and ethical code in the department to use that as an excuse for checkpoint stops on a fing Xway.


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## jr28schalm

mbrewer said:


> Told ya! Back to the wall only has you half covered.:lol:


Lmfao. Great one brew


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## Tom (mich)

mbrewer said:


> Maybe someone has already but if not I'll have a go at it.
> 
> Would you consider the stop proper if you were trailering your boat down the highway and were pulled over for a license and bag limit check? Hunters in the woods, fisherman on the water is quite a different scenario than either rolling down the interstate. IMO.


I've gotten checked more often at the ramp upon trailering the boat than I have on the water. Either way I'm in transit from point A to B. So to the foundation of your question it's 100% appropriate and quite frankly very smart. The example of being pulled over on the highway is just too extreme and inefficient so I'm not going to comment on that.


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## baycountyhunter

beer and nuts said:


> ********. The reasons are bS as well. I've been stopped a few times over the years, two reasons stick out.... 1. we've had complaints of poaching in the area. 2. Description of your vehicle...matches a complaint we had...
> 
> Both times I was doing nothing illegal, they just pulled me over.


Yea cops are liars I was with with my brother when he got pulled over for turning right on a red light. Cop says you can't turn on red light. I told him he was full of **** and lets go back to the traffic light and call his supervisor to meet us there. He was checking for other things while using a lie to illegally pull us over.


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## mbrewer

HUBBHUNTER said:


> The 2nd week of bow season I had a DNR officer follow me to where I park on our property. I got out and walked up to him like he was the neighbor stopping to chat about how the hunting has been going. That was pretty much the tone of the conversation. We BS'd for a minute and tractor was coming down the road so he needed to get out of the way. He wished me good luck without ever asking to see my licence and drove off.
> 
> 
> Whether you have a positive or negative interaction with a LEO is incredibly dependent on your actions not the LEO's.


Either that he he saw you weren't big enough to get in much trouble. :lol:

Sorry having too much fun and I'm not stopping til someone make me.


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## sparky18181

baycountyhunter said:


> Yea cops are liars I was with with my brother when he got pulled over for turning right on a red light. Cop says you can't turn on red light. I told him he was full of **** and lets go back to the traffic light and call his supervisor to meet us there. He was checking for other things while using a lie to illegally pull us over.


Did your BIL get a ticket?


----------



## Sharkbait11

Sewey said:


> I’ve always had a positive interaction with LEO. Treat them with respect and you usually get the same in return. I would never advocate being disrespectful to LEO’s. This, however, is more of a debate on if the interaction should take place to begin with.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is unfortunate. I think most people go to the digest for the rules and regulations, having more laws someplace else doesn’t give us a very good chance to stay within them, or know when a CO is stepping outside of them. Thank you for the resource, I’ll have to do some looking when I get time.


You can be a friendly little bone hugger if you want, I dont think it keeps ticket writers at bay. There are alot who see through the nice guy act and have it in their mind if they find something you WILL get a ticket. Being polite is just something all humans should practice all the time.

Like I said, one time you forget one simple item your grocery money is gone for the week and a strike against your good name, nobody is perfect.


----------



## Fishndude

SteelShot said:


> Exactly the point, you’ve done nothing wrong but are being harassed for no reason other than you killed a deer. Unfortunately with all the crazy laws if they dig around enough they can find something to write you on.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk





d_rek said:


> My cousins and two friends got pulled over near Gaylord not once but twice this weekend. The first time they were coming home from the morning hunt and saw a deer about 10 yards off the road so they slowed to check it out. They saw right away it was a decoy and went on their way. They got about 1/2 mile up the road and DNR pulled them over, checked tags and licenses and told them he could have got them for 'shining' if he wanted to.
> 
> They got pulled over by the same guy a day later on a different road. They had a doe in the bed of the truck but unfortunately the guy that shot it didn't tag it, even though he had his tags and licenses. He gave the guy a ticket for not tagging his animal. And shame on him for not tagging it, but seeing as he had his licenses he could have let them off with a warning if he had tagged it then and there.
> 
> Sounds like there's a CO up there who has a chip on his shoulder. I sure hope they don't start more aggressive searching to meet budget shortfalls. Just a really bad look for CO's and the agency if they go that direction.


Nope, SteelShot. You are being "harassed" because not everyone plays by the rules, and the DNR is tasked with enforcing the rules. Say, for instance, someone shoots a deer, and has their tags, but chooses not to tag that deer? Were they hoping to get another deer they could use the Tag on, and decided not to tag the first deer, which would mean it was taken illegally? What should the CO do in that situation? They have a 2-week window every year to police 550,000 gun deer hunters, with maybe 2 COs per County. It's a tough job that goes on 24/7 at a frenetic pace. And everyone is carrying a gun. 

And, sorry, d_rek. Dude should have used that tag. Do NOT put it on the CO that your buddy earned a ticket by consciously violating a game law. That is just a black-eye for all Hunters.


----------



## jiggin is livin

outdoorsaddict99 said:


> I called the RAP line on nov 16 to talk to a dnr officer about one of my favorite state land spots being posted on every tree and the one and only two track being blocked off by several chainsaw cut trees, and the dispatcher told me that the only responding officer was on a "bait flight" and took down my cell #. Got a call from the officer later and he said he was on a flight looking for baiters, but he also confirmed I could still hunt the property in question, and he would be by to take down the illegal signs.


There are a few chunks of state land in Arenac county that were posted just before season too. A couple different sections and all in the same ugly yellow plastic looking signs. I'm thinking some dipshit THINKS they own it. I should probably call the DNR and ask them. I doubt they sold off that much state land. 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## duck boy

H


Tom (mich) said:


> I am apoplectic at some of the responses I'm seeing on here. Time and time again, in fact - ad nauseum, on these forums we see complaints from people about the DNR not doing their job. To the contrary, we see countless postings about the need for additional CO's in the state. Now, we see concrete evidence of the DNR doing PRECISELY what they are tasked to do, and people are bitching about it. To be clear, this has got absolutely NOTHING to do about probable cause for a search, you're displaying a dead deer for god's sake! The additional paranoia about the "real" season for the traffic stop - searching for weed....are you freakin' kidding me??
> 
> For those with their panties in a bunch about these traffic stops, what exactly is it that you'd prefer the CO's be doing?[/QUOThow about go walk in the woods where they belong and look for violators.


----------



## duck boy

How about the DNR did away with back tags years ago for simple fact that it gives em a reason to confront you. If they see it no problem. Now they have a reason to make contact no matter what.


----------



## duck boy

It's all about revenue


----------



## PTPD2312

I find it quite amusing that the openly users of recreational or medical marijuana hate LEO in general, including the COs. 

COs primary focus are conservation violations but they do enforce State Laws as well. The courts have ruled that it doesn't matter what reason a LEO pulled you over for as long as it is a legal violation that may ultimately lead to additional violations and/or crimes. 

To me, there is no difference in a CO checking me in the woods, near my vehicle or if I'm transporting game on any road to make sure I'm legal. 

Esox, let me know where you hunt and I'll be sure to send more COs afield to check you everyday just after daylight and an hour before dark. LOL

Food for thought...how do we expect COs to do their jobs without making stops making sure the game was harvested legally?

*324.1602 Department or officer; prosecution; search without warrant; private property; definition; common carrier not liable; issuance of warrant; seizures; probable cause.*


Sec. 1602.

(1) The department, or an officer appointed by the department, may file a complaint and commence proceedings against any person for a violation of any of the laws or statutes described in section 1601, without the sanction of the prosecuting attorney of the county in which the proceedings are commenced. In such a case, the officer is not obliged to furnish security for costs. The department, or an officer appointed by the department, may appear for the people in any court of competent jurisdiction in any cases for violation of any of the statutes or laws described in section 1601, may prosecute the cases in the same manner and with the same authority as the prosecuting attorney of any county in which the proceedings are commenced, and may sign vouchers for the payment of jurors' or witnesses' fees in those cases in the same manner and with the same authority as prosecuting attorneys in criminal cases. Whenever an officer appointed by the department has probable cause to believe that any of the statutes or laws mentioned in section 1601 have been or are being violated by any particular person, *the officer has the power to search, without warrant, any boat, conveyance, vehicle, automobile, fish box, fish basket, game bag, game coat, or any other receptacle or place, except dwellings or dwelling houses, or within the curtilage of any dwelling house, in which nets, hunting or fishing apparatuses or appliances, wild birds, wild animals, or fish may be possessed, kept, or carried by the person, and an officer appointed by the department may enter into or upon any private or public property for that purpose or for the purpose of patrolling, investigating, or examining when he or she has probable cause for believing that any of the statutes or laws described in section 1601 have been or are being violated on that property. *The term “private property” as used in this part does not include dwellings or dwelling houses or that which is within the curtilage of any dwelling house. An officer appointed by the department shall at any and all times seize and take possession of any and all nets, hunting or fishing apparatuses or appliances, or other property, wild birds, wild animals, or fish, or any part or parts thereof, which have been caught, taken, killed, shipped, or had in possession or under control, at a time, in a manner, or for a purpose, contrary to any of the statutes or laws described in section 1601, and the seizure may be made without a warrant. A common carrier is not responsible for damages or otherwise to any owner, shipper, or consignee by reason of any such seizure. When a complaint is made on oath to any magistrate authorized to issue warrants in criminal cases that any wild birds, wild animals, or fish, any part or parts of wild birds, wild animals, or fish, or any nets, hunting or fishing apparatuses or appliances, or other property have been or are being killed, taken, caught, had in possession or under control, or shipped, contrary to the statutes or laws described in section 1601, and that the complainant believes the property to be stored, kept, or concealed in any particular house or place, the magistrate, if he or she is satisfied that there is probable cause for the belief, shall issue a warrant to search for the property. The warrant shall be directed to the department, or an officer appointed by the department, or to any other peace officer. All wild birds, wild animals, fish, nets, boats, fishing or hunting appliances or apparatuses, or automobiles or other property of any kind seized by an officer shall be turned over to the department to be held by the department subject to the order of the court as provided in this part.
(2) For the purposes of this part, “probable cause” or “probable cause to believe” is present on the part of a peace officer if there are facts that would induce any fair-minded person of average intelligence and judgment to believe that a law or statute had been violated or was being violated contrary to any of the statutes or laws described in section 1601.



*
324.40104 Definitions; T, V.*
Sec. 40104.

(1) “Take” means to hunt with any weapon, dog, raptor, or other wild or domestic animal trained for that purpose; kill; chase; follow; harass; harm; pursue; shoot; rob; trap; capture; or collect animals, or to attempt to engage in such an activity.
(2) “Transport” means to carry or ship animals within this state or to points outside this state.
(3) “Trap” means taking or attempting to take animals by means of a trap or other device designed to kill or capture animals.
(4) “Vehicle” means every device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported, except devices exclusively moved by human power.

*324.40109 Transportation of game; identification of sex and species; tagging; section inapplicable to skins, pelts, and hides.*

Sec. 40109.

If game is transported, the sex and species of the game shall be readily identifiable unless the game is game that has been cleaned at a hunting preserve and tagged as required by law. If game is transported, it shall be tagged as required by law or a department order authorized under section 40107. This section does not apply to skins, pelts, or hides of game that is lawfully taken and legally possessed.


3.100 Take of deer; prohibited firearms, legal weapons, “bait” and “baiting” defined, conditions for baiting established in certain area(s); unlawful acts. Sec. 3.100 (1) “Take” means the same as defined in section 40104, 1994 PA 451, MCL 324.40104. (2) An individual must possess while hunting deer the unused kill tag issued with the deer license, pursuant to section 3.103, and provide it to a conservation officer, a law enforcement officer, or a tribal conservation officer upon request. (3) Unless otherwise specified in this order, an individual shall not do any of the following: (*a) Take a deer without possessing a valid license with kill tag. (b) Take a deer other than during the open seasons established in this order. (c) Take a deer outside of lawful hunting hours. (d) Take a deer by any method other than by firearm, bow and arrow, or crossbow. (e) Take a deer with a rimfire firearm .22 caliber or smaller. (f) Take a deer during any firearm deer season in the “limited firearms deer zone,” with a firearm other than a shotgun with a smooth or rifled barrel, a .35 caliber or larger pistol capable of holding no more than nine shells at one time in the barrel and magazine combined and loaded with straight-walled cartridges, a .35 caliber or larger rifle loaded with straight-walled cartridges with a minimum case length of 1.16 inches and a maximum case length of 1.80 inches, a .35 caliber or larger air rifle or pistol charged only from an external high-compression power source, or a muzzleloading rifle or black-powder pistol loaded with black-powder or a commercially manufactured black- powder substitute. (g) Take a deer, or have in possession while hunting deer, a semiautomatic shotgun or rifle, capable of holding more than six shells in the magazine and barrel combined, or use a cartridge containing a tracer or explosive bullet, or a firearm capable of firing more than one shot with a single pull or activation of the trigger. (h) Take a deer using an arrow, bolt, or quarrel with a broadhead hunting type of point less than 7/8 of an inch wide and/or a length less than 14 inches. (i) Take a deer with a crossbow or a modified bow in zone 1 from December 1 to March 31 except for the core CWD surveillance area unless issued a disability crossbow permit by the department. (j) Take a deer while the deer is swimming in a pond, lake, stream, or other body of water. (k) Make use of a dog in hunting a deer, except as noted in section 2.1a of this order. (l) Use aircraft to aid in the taking of a deer. (m) Set afire or assist in setting afire any land for the purpose of driving out a deer, or take or attempt to take a deer so driven out of any land.  Purchase a deer license unless the individual holds a current base license. (o) Possess or use natural cervid urine-based lures or attractants not marked with the official archery trade association seal of participation stamp in an area frequented by deer.*


----------



## Liver and Onions

duck boy said:


> How about the DNR did away with back tags years ago for simple fact that it gives em a reason to confront you.
> 
> .............


That's not why they dropped the license on our back. If you want you can do a search and recover that reason from about 25 years ago.

L & O


----------



## jiggin is livin

beer and nuts said:


> ********. The reasons are bS as well. I've been stopped a few times over the years, two reasons stick out.... 1. we've had complaints of poaching in the area. 2. Description of your vehicle...matches a complaint we had...
> 
> Both times I was doing nothing illegal, they just pulled me over.


That's the issue. They can say whatever they want and then it's "probable cause". Doesn't have to be proven, but it's their word over yours and you might as well be a mute. 

I was pulled over once and had a fountain Sprite in my counsel. Officer asked what's in the cup, I said Sprite. He said he smelled alcohol and I assured him he didn't as I'm on my way home from work. He asked to smell it, I said sure go ahead. He popped the top and said, "Yup, that's alcohol." I laughed and said "wtf, really!? You obviously have no idea what alcohol smells like". He gave me a bunch of BS and then asked to search my car. Told him no and be threatened a warrant, blah blah blah. He finally told me to go home and enjoy my day. That type of thing is what pissess me off. There doesn't need to be a stitch of Truth. He could of called that in and probably got a warrant just on his word. But he knew he would have come up empty handed. 

I'm not typically rude to officers. It isn't gonna help you in the least. But when it's blatant BS I'm not gonna go along with it. I'll admit if I'm speeding. I do something dumb and get caught, you got me. I'm not gonna try to get around it. I know the risk. But I'm not ok with BS stops because their trying to catch someone drinking or poaching. I'm not breaking any laws, blow me. 

Working second shift really woke me up to that crap. 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## jiggin is livin

Tom (mich) said:


> I am apoplectic at some of the responses I'm seeing on here. Time and time again, in fact - ad nauseum, on these forums we see complaints from people about the DNR not doing their job. To the contrary, we see countless postings about the need for additional CO's in the state. Now, we see concrete evidence of the DNR doing PRECISELY what they are tasked to do, and people are bitching about it. To be clear, this has got absolutely NOTHING to do about probable cause for a search, you're displaying a dead deer for god's sake! The additional paranoia about the "real" season for the traffic stop - searching for weed....are you freakin' kidding me??
> 
> For those with their panties in a bunch about these traffic stops, what exactly is it that you'd prefer the CO's be doing?


IDK, maybe investigating actual complaints that are LEGIT probable cause. 

Every time you call. Their on patrol, their on bait looking, their doing deer checkpoints. 

No, do your goddamn job!

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## jiggin is livin

Sewey said:


> You cannot be pulled over while driving simply because an officer wants to check your license, privilege or not they need probable cause or reasonable suspicion of a crime being committed. If transporting a deer carcass within visible sight is PC/RS enough to be stopped by a CO as Nocked states, I'd like to see article stating it. I have no problem with being checked for my license while afield, and I have been, while participating in whatever outdoor activity I choose to. That is active police work and how you go about catching violators, not sitting in a median and assuming or hoping someone did something wrong because you see someone with a deer or a truck and trailer with hunting stickers on it driving down the road.
> 
> But you're right, we can go round and round on this and neither will persuade the other. I just feel strongly over my personal liberties and the constitution in which this country was founded. It's a very slippery slope when more and more people are willing to sacrifice freedoms because they have nothing to hide and feel it's for the greater good of catching those that do, just my opinion.


Word for word, YES!

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## duck boy

Liver and Onions said:


> That's not why they dropped the license on our back. If you want you can do a search and recover that reason from about 25 years ago.
> 
> L & O


Yeah sure! Whatever u wanna believe.


----------



## jiggin is livin

UPEsox said:


> Honestly I think people are just plain sick of being under the boot. Seems LEO's spend way more time trying to "catch you" or made you life miserable than they are keeping anything safe.


Exactly! 

Instead of "to serve and protect" it's becoming "to search and convict" 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## UPEsox

PTPD2312 said:


> Esox, let me know where you hunt and I'll be sure to send more COs afield to check you everyday just after daylight and an hour before dark. LOL


The CO's in my area already know where to find me during deer opener, on a river chasing musky or on a Type 4.


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## 12970

Maybe This Is Why They Cannot Tell If a Hunter has a valid Private Land Antlerless Permit because they No Longer Requiring a Hunter to Provide a Parcel Number when purchasing a License? Was that Not a Means for CO's to Investigate If a Hunter Truly Had Access to Private Lands? The Excuse I was Given Way Back was a Violator would Just go to the County Seat and Look One Up. Why would one go that Far to Get a Parcel Number? Today things have Changed a Lot and you can find a number much more easily but Giving a Phone Number is Useless as one can give any Number being most give a Cell Number and chasing that Down is not so Easy and adds Challenges to Investigate a Potential Violation and Most Private Land Owners do Not have any Phone Number Associated with Their Land so how does a CO Contact a Land Owner but via the mailing address associated with Your Property and that delays them knowing much and waiting on a reply. Yet They Gave that Up when you would think it was an Investigation Tool to Help them!
They want them caught so why take away a tool to do so? But They Did... If you have one what difference than a Phone Number to provide??? So many things just disappear that can Help them. But that is things of the Past most have Forgotten... So do they know if a Hunter has Access? They Really Do Not... Sad
Newaygo1


----------



## Tom (mich)

jiggin is livin said:


> IDK, maybe investigating actual complaints that are LEGIT probable cause.
> 
> Every time you call. Their on patrol, their on bait looking, their doing deer checkpoints.
> 
> No, do your goddamn job!
> 
> Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


I think I've been pretty clear documenting on this thread that the burden for probable cause is substantially different relative to the enforcement of game laws vs. searching private property. It's a mistake to conflate the two. 

To summarize, and basic to the premise of this thread, having a dead deer in your possession is most assuredly probable cause to warrant a traffic stop to ensure the hunter has the proper licenses. You might not like it, you may view it as an inconvenience, but your "rights" are most definitely not being violated. This is not my opinion, this is the law.


----------



## Vwidemann

d_rek said:


> My cousins and two friends got pulled over near Gaylord not once but twice this weekend. The first time they were coming home from the morning hunt and saw a deer about 10 yards off the road so they slowed to check it out. They saw right away it was a decoy and went on their way. They got about 1/2 mile up the road and DNR pulled them over, checked tags and licenses and told them he could have got them for 'shining' if he wanted to.
> 
> They got pulled over by the same guy a day later on a different road. They had a doe in the bed of the truck but unfortunately the guy that shot it didn't tag it, even though he had his tags and licenses. He gave the guy a ticket for not tagging his animal. And shame on him for not tagging it, but seeing as he had his licenses he could have let them off with a warning if he had tagged it then and there.
> 
> Sounds like there's a CO up there who has a chip on his shoulder. I sure hope they don't start more aggressive searching to meet budget shortfalls. Just a really bad look for CO's and the agency if they go that direction.


B.S. we all know he didn't tag it because he was giving to use the license for another deer. How Special Ed do you need to be to NOT realize your supposed to tag it. Warning, lol your just as guilty as him for that thought process.


----------



## d_rek

Yeah, I know. Bunch of keyboard saints on this forum. I already said (more than once) he should have tagged it. 

Still it’s amazing the number of guys here who never once forgot to tag their deer, never drove 1mph over the speed limit, never took an extra cookie from the jar, never had a single impure thought, and always kept your halos shiny and polished. 

Congrats fellas! Sounds like you’ll be in the speed lane through the pearly gates! 

The rest of us will just have to suffer in purgatory before joining the rest of y’all. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Liver and Onions

duck boy said:


> Yeah sure! Whatever u wanna believe.


Thanks, I think I will continue to be rely on accurate information instead bar talk and rumors.
Again, if you want to follow the reasoning and timeline regarding this change from many years ago, you should be able to locate that on the DNR site.
Or you can chose to hang on to stories if you prefer that to the truth.

L & O


----------



## Vwidemann

d_rek said:


> Yeah, I know. Bunch of keyboard saints on this forum. I already said (more than once) he should have tagged it.
> 
> Still it’s amazing the number of guys here who never once forgot to tag their deer, never drove 1mph over the speed limit, never took an extra cookie from the jar, never had a single impure thought, and always kept your halos shiny and polished.
> 
> Congrats fellas! Sounds like you’ll be in the speed lane through the pearly gates!
> 
> The rest of us will just have to suffer in purgatory before joining the rest of y’all.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I'll give you that Derek. But then you follow it up with your warning thought process. Felt like you were contradicting your statement.


----------



## jiggin is livin

Vwidemann said:


> B.S. we all know he didn't tag it because he was giving to use the license for another deer. How Special Ed do you need to be to NOT realize your supposed to tag it. Warning, lol your just as guilty as him for that thought process.


IDK about that. Years ago I shot a doe at my Dad's place last night of muzzle loading. I had a birthday party to go to that night for my, then girlfriends daughter. Only thing she said was you better not be late. I shot the doe, found blood, figured if I didn't get outta there I'd be in deep schitt so I'd come back in the morning and find her. Get back in the morning with my buddy, we find her half frozen and I started trying to gut. Got it done and loaded, called Dad and told him I found her and was taking her home and left. I got home and hung it up in the garage. Didn't even realize I never tagged it until she was hanging. It was the last day of the season, no reason not to tag it other than me being an idiot. I tagged it and told me buddy it's a good thing I didn't get stopped. I'm pretty good about doing it right away now. Last thing I want is a ticket for something as stupid as that. It's a COs wet dream and they'll never believe you forgot, even if you 100% had no ill intent. 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## Jimbos

jiggin is livin said:


> I don't think you're completely wrong. I don't blame COs or LEOs individually, some maybe, but definitely not as a whole.
> 
> I blame the system and the way it's designed. I blame the ones that encourage them to search for violations. I have zero issue with being stopped, asked for a license, checking you out and moving on. Just as I have zero issue with being pulled over for speeding or having a light out. I do have an issue with pulling you over just because of the time. I have an issue with checkpoints of any nature for any reason.
> 
> Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


All you can do is let them play their silly little "we're looking for a truck like yours" game, and since you know you're all in order, you'll be on your way shortly.
It's unfortunate, but if you buck them, they'll f-you up every which way.


----------



## Bow hunter on a Mission

Nocked said:


> Being a officer, (not CO) I can give my .02 cents.
> 
> Any vehicle stopped by a CO was done for a reason. It can be either for a game violation, or a violation of the Michigan Motor Vehicle Code. (The book is about a inch and a half thick).
> 
> If you have visible game, the reason for the stop is legal. However if I were stopped just because you saw my deer, I too would be upset.
> 
> A vehicle does not require a warrant to be searched. It does require probable cause by the officer to continue with a search, especially when permission is not given. The reason has to be something tangible, (odor, observations, etc.) and not just a "gut feeling."
> 
> Anyone can consent to a search and it is usually a question I ask on every traffic stop I make. You would not believe how many people agree to it, forgetting what is inside of their vehicles. Personally I've found loaded firearms, narcotics, stolen property, etc. That does not mean I search every vehicle I stop, I have no time for that where I work.


For some people’s benefit, that apparently fail to notice what I consider common sense I want to ask this question. When you pull someone over and they are a real jackwagon and give you a bunch of crap asking why you pulled them over and giving you a hard time for stopping them are you more likely to write them a citation than the guy who treats you reasonably and with respect? Assuming they both commit a minor offense such as speeding or some other offense that often can be handled by just a giving a warning


----------



## jjlrrw

kdogger said:


> This is great. Follow the rules.


Have you ever not followed the rules?


----------



## UPEsox

jjlrrw said:


> Have you ever not followed the rules?


He's not saying that I'm sure. It's just that the context of his rule breaking is/was meaningful, but for others context does not matter.


----------



## fishdip

I guess we know who the violators are.


----------



## UPEsox

fishdip said:


> I guess we know who the violators are.


Yes, you know how notorious Musky and trout guys are for breaking the rules. It's definitely all about the meat, and not the chase.


----------



## MichiFishy

If we get them more money in the way of license sales then they wont need to get money through tickets. Unfortunately thats kinda looking like their perogative right now, its not my favorite but its where we are at. Take a kid fishing/hunting and do everything you can to make it awesome! Donate all extra gear. It wont happen overnight but i think its our best shot.


----------



## PTPD2312

Bow hunter on a Mission said:


> For some people’s benefit, that apparently fail to notice what I consider common sense I want to ask this question. When you pull someone over and they are a real jackwagon and give you a bunch of crap asking why you pulled them over and giving you a hard time for stopping them are you more likely to write them a citation than the guy who treats you reasonably and with respect? Assuming they both commit a minor offense such as speeding or some other offense that often can be handled by just a giving a warning


Depends on how fast the person was going. Speeding could be 1 over the limit to 20+ over the limit. I don't know any LEOs that pull anyone over for 1 mph over the limit but MI has the absolute speed law. Demeanor of the person doesn't change my mind, everyone has a bad day now and then. What is great is when that person is being a turd and you give them a verbal warning, tell them to slow down and have a nice day. The look of astonishment and complete regret for being a turd is priceless.


----------



## fishdip

They’ve been pulling people over displaying deer for 45 yrs I’ve been hunting,its nothing new.


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## PTPD2312

d_rek said:


> I could easily understand how he might forget to tag it caught up in a whirlwind of emotion and excitement after the shot, which I can empathize with and why I said the CO could have shown some leniency.
> "


Did they let him keep the deer? If so, that seems pretty lenient.


----------



## kisherfisher

Maybe some peoples paranoia makes it new ! Just a thought 


fishdip said:


> They’ve been pulling people over displaying deer for 45 yrs I’ve been hunting,its nothing new.


----------



## jiggin is livin

kdogger said:


> I hate poachers. I hope they all get caught.


Me too, but not at the expense of my freedom and privacy. 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## jiggin is livin

buckguts1970 said:


> But you can afford weed or I mean medicine?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


You know that grows basically free, right?

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## jiggin is livin

fishdip said:


> They’ve been pulling people over displaying deer for 45 yrs I’ve been hunting,its nothing new.





kisherfisher said:


> Maybe some peoples paranoia makes it new ! Just a thought


No, it was wrong then too. And it still is. 

Difference is the respect for law enforcement was different back then. And probably had a lot more lenient officers as well in return. 

This anti law enforcement, everyone having a video camera, minorities can do no wrong mantra the last decade or so has made things exponentially worse, regardless of what side of the check you are on. 

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## Nocked

Bow hunter on a Mission said:


> For some people’s benefit, that apparently fail to notice what I consider common sense I want to ask this question. When you pull someone over and they are a real jackwagon and give you a bunch of crap asking why you pulled them over and giving you a hard time for stopping them are you more likely to write them a citation than the guy who treats you reasonably and with respect? Assuming they both commit a minor offense such as speeding or some other offense that often can be handled by just a giving a warning


Usually people talk themselves into a citation. 



Sent from my SM-G950U using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## bmoffit

Guys.... I can tell you. They don’t care about the $$. The only $$ they care about is the money deposited in their account every two weeks. 
If you honestly believe that their whole reasoning to write tickets IS to generate revenue for the DNR.. you’re being naive 

That’s like the guy who sweeps the floor at a production plant saying. “Hell yeah. I sweep day in and day out it’s gonna bring in all kinds of sales of our product”. It’s just not common sense. 
Believe what you want. There are bad apples out there... and LEO should hold themselves to a higher standard. Hell. There’s bad apples in every occupation... priests doctors plumbers .. you name it


----------



## kdogger

jjlrrw said:


> Have you ever not followed the rules?[/QUOTE


someone driving around with a tag bought after dark the same day the deer was harvested, or not tagged, grandmas tag, or whatever BS poaching they did deserve to get pinched. I’m happy our CO’s are out there nabbing these dirt bags.


----------



## UPEsox

bmoffit said:


> Guys.... I can tell you. They don’t care about the $$. The only $$ they care about is the money deposited in their account every two weeks.
> If you honestly believe that their whole reasoning to write tickets IS to generate revenue for the DNR.. you’re being naive
> 
> That’s like the guy who sweeps the floor at a production plant saying. “Hell yeah. I sweep day in and day out it’s gonna bring in all kinds of sales of our product”. It’s just not common sense.
> Believe what you want. There are bad apples out there... and LEO should hold themselves to a higher standard. Hell. There’s bad apples in every occupation... priests doctors plumbers .. you name it


3% of the total budget aint nothing


----------



## FREEPOP




----------



## PTPD2312

UPEsox said:


> 3% of the total budget aint nothing


Nope it ain't nothing, it's something but not a lot after considering the fines and costs associated with violations that add up. Remember the commercial fishing guy that was fined a lot? Yup, all those fines from fishing/hunting are added in to the total. So it is something but not much in the grand scheme of things.

https://courts.michigan.gov/Administration/SCAO/Resources/Documents/other/DNRPenalties.pdf


----------



## Spartan88

Chris Rock did a spoof PSA on how not to get your *** beat by the police. Google it if you've never watched.


----------



## Honyuk96

So when i chimed in here i gave a few examples of what i’ve personally witnessed myself involving LEO’s. I no longer hunt. I did for many, many years but choose to no longer. My posts were aimed at cops, not CO’s. I’m glad i don’t hunt longer though, as it’s nothing like it was as a kid. No baiting, but everyone’s got a food plot. How differen’t is it ? APR’s ? I thought this was hunting ? Ya know, putting meat on the table. Hunting now is as hipster as ever. Want to ban something ? How bout trail cameras. This is hardly hunting now. It’s more like private surveilance of a wild animal and then killing it. Not for me. I have nothing against hunting, i hope my kid takes it up someday, as it generated some of my most cherished memories. 
And to all you anti cannabis guys, i hope you never blow 3 discs in your back at 35 yrs old. I hope you’re never forced to find a new profession that pays a fraction of what you used to make. I hope your 8 yr old son never suffers from epileptic seizures. I hope your 82 yr old mother can sleep at night w her arthritic old bones. It’s like the old saying, don’t throw stones in glass houses. Think about your cruel words. Cannabis is here to stay. Be kind to one another and do the right thing. Good luck to all you hunters still chasing a deer, i wish you all the best of luck !


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## Honyuk96

I’d also like to add. I work seven days a week driving Zamboni. I’ve had to change my entire life due to my degenerative disc disease. I’m a divorced father of a bright young man. I voluntarily coach my kiddos hockey team. I’m a good dude doing what i can. To be called a doper, pothead, stoner etc hurts. Please don’t do that, you never know what your fellow man is up against. 


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## UPEsox

Honyuk96 thats a bummer but I'm glad you've found some relief. 

A lot of you are under the impression that those of us who don't appreciate the stops also mouth off to CO's and LEO's. Couldn't be further from the truth, I give them all deference because they have all the power in the situation and can apply it capriciously.


----------



## stickbow shooter

Spartan88 said:


> Chris Rock did a spoof PSA on how not to get your *** beat by the police. Google it if you've never watched.


Post # 111


----------



## GrizzlyHunter

stickbow shooter said:


> Post # 111


Good job Stickbow - You beat me to it. LOL.


----------



## sparky18181

PTPD2312 said:


> Nope it ain't nothing, it's something but not a lot after considering the fines and costs associated with violations that add up. Remember the commercial fishing guy that was fined a lot? Yup, all those fines from fishing/hunting are added in to the total. So it is something but not much in the grand scheme of things.
> 
> https://courts.michigan.gov/Administration/SCAO/Resources/Documents/other/DNRPenalties.pdf


You do understand that those are just suggested guidelines and judges vary on this from court to court.


----------



## Spartan88

GrizzlyHunter said:


> Good job Stickbow - You beat me to it. LOL.


I didnt read all the posts. But I do use the search function before I ask questions.


----------



## Honyuk96

Esox, thanks for the suppport, next time i make it up to da yoop, i’ll look you up. I’d love to get out and chase esox, i’ve only caught one, to this day. We’ll get along great. Cheers man


UPEsox said:


> Honyuk96 thats a bummer but I'm glad you've found some relief.
> 
> A lot of you are under the impression that those of us who don't appreciate the stops also mouth off to CO's and LEO's. Couldn't be further from the truth, I give them all deference because they have all the power in the situation and can apply it capriciously.


----------



## TriggerDiscipline

Honyuk96 said:


> So when i chimed in here i gave a few examples of what i’ve personally witnessed myself involving LEO’s. I no longer hunt. I did for many, many years but choose to no longer. My posts were aimed at cops, not CO’s. I’m glad i don’t hunt longer though, as it’s nothing like it was as a kid. No baiting, but everyone’s got a food plot. How differen’t is it ? APR’s ? I thought this was hunting ? Ya know, putting meat on the table. Hunting now is as hipster as ever. Want to ban something ? How bout trail cameras. This is hardly hunting now. It’s more like private surveilance of a wild animal and then killing it. Not for me. I have nothing against hunting, i hope my kid takes it up someday, as it generated some of my most cherished memories.
> And to all you anti cannabis guys, i hope you never blow 3 discs in your back at 35 yrs old. I hope you’re never forced to find a new profession that pays a fraction of what you used to make. I hope your 8 yr old son never suffers from epileptic seizures. I hope your 82 yr old mother can sleep at night w her arthritic old bones. It’s like the old saying, don’t throw stones in glass houses. Think about your cruel words. Cannabis is here to stay. Be kind to one another and do the right thing. Good luck to all you hunters still chasing a deer, i wish you all the best of luck !
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


I hear you Honyuk. I have had a few terrible interactions with police when I was the _victim _of crimes. 

This song goes out to you:


----------



## UPEsox

Honyuk96 said:


> Esox, thanks for the suppport, next time i make it up to da yoop, i’ll look you up. I’d love to get out and chase esox, i’ve only caught one, to this day. We’ll get along great. Cheers man


You're welcome in the Western UP anytime, that's where the camp is. I make my home in Duluth, MN same rules apply if you're in that neck of the woods as well.


----------



## sparky18181

For all of you conspiracy therorist about how much money the dnr receives for each ticket. It is a mere 10 dollars unless there is some restitution granted by the judge for game or fish taken illegally it’s not a money making machine.


----------



## Honyuk96

UPEsox said:


> You're welcome in the Western UP anytime, that's where the camp is. I make my home in Duluth, MN same rules apply if you're in that neck of the woods as well.


gotcha. I have family up in MN too. Who knows, perhaps we’ll still cross paths. Thx fer da song, if i knew how, i’d post one back atcha. You keep up the good fight brotha, eventually this country will go legal and this pointless battle will be over. We’re gaining ground every day. Cheers man !


----------



## 6Speed

Why would the DNR pull over "unsuccessful" hunters? 

Just wondering, I'd be pissed if they just pulled over the unlucky boys that stank of skunk, big waste of our tax money...just wondering.


----------



## UPEsox

sparky18181 said:


> For all of you conspiracy therorist about how much money the dnr receives for each ticket. It is a mere 10 dollars unless there is some restitution granted by the judge for game or fish taken illegally it’s not a money making machine.


Okay, I'll take what you are saying at face value. Then it makes it all the more ridiculous that they engage in these random dragnets. This just highlights the perception that these stops are an excuse to "find something on you" because we know full well they can stop you whenever and for whatever they want. Again, why are you wondering why this level of resentment exists?


----------



## Jimbos

They can deny all they want but there's quotas, and I'll bet my bottom dollar that job reviews are based upon it.


----------



## kisherfisher

6Speed said:


> Why would the DNR pull over "unsuccessful" hunters?
> 
> Just wondering, I'd be pissed if they just pulled over the unlucky boys that stank of skunk, big waste of our tax money...just wondering.


I believe if they didn't , that it would be considered "Profiling" would it not ? You can't Profile, it is politically unacceptable.


----------



## UPEsox

kisherfisher said:


> I believe if they didn't , that it would be considered "Profiling" would it not ? You can't Profile, it is politically unacceptable.


You really are that dense aren't you.


----------



## YAKFish#1

kisherfisher said:


> You are correct about LEO and traffic stops.They WILL have a reason to make the stop. As far as a deer on a vehicle , absolutely a legit stop for CO. You must have documentation with the animal. Valid kill tag, car deer accident document, period.



Kisherfisher, I’m not here to argue the issue but a CO has no more authority to violate an individual’s rights just because it involves a fish, animal, plant, rock or any other natural resource. That CO has to operate on the same RS/PC that a crime or violation is being committed before they infringe on your constitutional rights no different than a police officer. A police officer can’t stop someone at 230 in the morning to MAKE SURE they're not drunk or have open alcohol in their car. They have to have RS/PC that you do. Unless you have something else that differs from MCL 324.1602. Seeing a car with a deer on the roof wouldn’t leave a fair minded person of reasonable intelligence and judgement, reason to believe the deer isn’t properly tagged (Probable Cause defined). Just because someone leaves a party store at 0158 am with a case of beer doesn’t give a police officer RS/PC that they are drinking and driving. Other than administrative inspections by the DEA on controlled substance locations, administrative border searches by BP/CBP and possibly Liquor Control Commission inspections, there aren’t many laws I’ve seen where someone can stop you to make sure you’re not violating the law. If I’m missing something please direct me to where I can find where a CO can stop you to make sure you’re not violating the law?
Over the years I've heard many hunters say the DNR can do this and that and even enter your house and check your freezer and there's nothing you can do. Trust me, if you haven't figured it out, I totally support Law Enforcement...But I more so support the Constitution of the United States. Believe me pal, I'm not trying to pick a fight...just trying to get educated..


----------



## sparky18181

I ve read thru over 300’post on this topic and it has run the gam mitt of get off the highway and out of the donut shops and hit the woods for real violators to I don’t want them walking up to my blind and ruining my hunt to a vast majority who like what the DNR CO s are doing out here. This isn’t a perfect world and god knows that being a law enforcement officer is an extremely micro managed job now a days. With the amount of scrutiny that there is do some of you really believe that officers are trying to violate people’s rights on a consistent basis? I for one don’t Granted there are bad apples but those are in the minority and I can tell you that the good ones don’t want those bad ones working with them either. The days of using more discretion are gone. Administrators don’t want things coming back in their laps and now you also have body cameras watching your every movement. So yes. No one likes to be stopped and inconvenienced but it is part of their job


----------



## Nocked

PTPD2312 said:


> The only one that committed a crime worked on the night shift. I knew nothing of it until my next shift the following morning when my boss told me. So in less than 12 hours the officer was no longer employed. He was tried and convicted.
> 
> Here’s another point you are missing.. every profession has bad apples from teachers, doctors, legislators...the list goes on and on. How many doctors have committed malpractice? How many lives have been lost due to abortion? How many teachers have been arrested for molesting students?
> 
> You can continue to say what you like. It’s obvious you have something against LEOs and like I said, that’s ok.
> 
> Good luck on the musky fishing. That’s a nice one in your profile photo.
> 
> See, it’s getting off topic. Back to the thread.


I can say the same at my place. We had guy get into a issue at around 2am. He was no longer a employee by the start of my shift at 6am.





Sent from my SM-G950U using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## Jiw275

fels340 said:


> Disclaimer: I have not read every post in this thread yet.
> 
> So jiggin, how do you feel about potential illegal immigrants randomly being asked to show proof of citizenship?Should we wait until they commit a crime before we require proof that they're in the country legally? And how do you and beer feel about going through security at an airport? You've committed no crime so why do you subject yourself to those security searches? Tell them you're not a criminal and to have a nice day as you walk away and try to board a plane. And beer, if they only catch 1 terrorist out of 20 passengers who got checked would that make it wrong to continue checking. I get checked every time I walk into Michigan stadium. It's the same principle used in other areas to protect our way of life. If there weren't so many terrorists out there we wouldn't have to do passenger searches. And if there weren't so many poachers out there we wouldn't have to do deer checks. You're mad at "the man" when all he's trying to do is protect your rights and privileges as a law abiding citizen.


Wow. Just wow.

I mind.


----------



## PTPD2312

swampbuck said:


> Weed, and it's a civil infraction if you refuse to take it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-S367VL using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


Is this something new? I haven’t heard of a refusal mouth swab for drugs being a civil infraction. I know the State was rolling out the road side detection device more but never heard there was a fine.


----------



## CHASINEYES

fishdip said:


> They’ve been pulling people over displaying deer for 45 yrs I’ve been hunting,its nothing new.


I don't recall ever hearing about mass deer check stings. That sounds more like that. Federally funded retarded seatbelt crap.


----------



## Tron322

CHASINEYES said:


> I don't recall ever hearing about mass deer check stings. That sounds more like that. Federally funded retarded seatbelt crap.


It's all about who you know.

Most impressive I heard was short but in southern Mich, only pulled over a few vehicles. One guy shot the deer in WI and heading home south thru our whole state.

Was a couple years ago...but it does happen.

Figured it was gonna be big this year, can't wait to hear the details in a month or two.


----------



## Grizzly Adams

swampbuck said:


> Weed, and it's a civil infraction if you refuse to take it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-S367VL using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


I thought those tests were ruled inaccurate?


----------



## bmoffit

Sharkbait11 said:


> Your comparing apples to oranges.
> 
> Writing tickets is a direct value added task, ie generating revenue. Sweeping floors is not directly value added.
> 
> Being in production management Ill tell you it looks alot better on an employee who choses to do value added work instead of non value added work, and makes their boss look good.
> 
> Tickets=money, maybe not directly for an LEO but pretty certain the extra revenue makes their department look good, especially in a public sector where everyone is looking for higher budgets.


you’re wrong. Flat out wrong. Writing tickets does not make an officer or the department look good. Now stopping someone for an infraction and it leads to other criminal charges... now that’s what makes an officer and department look good. 

you Guys have to truly realize that these guys don’t want to write tickets!!! They hate it. But they have a boss they have to answer too. And if they are tasked with stopping possible violator on the the highway. Then they’re doing what they’re told... following orders. The only enjoyment they get out of it is if it leads to a more serious charge

Look at it like this “ the broken windows theory”. If they let the little things go... they turn into bigger things. That’s just how it is. Hopefully they use some discretion but if they don’t they don’t.


----------



## Sharkbait11

bmoffit said:


> you’re wrong. Flat out wrong. Writing tickets does not make an officer or the department look good. Now stopping someone for an infraction and it leads to other criminal charges... now that’s what makes an officer and department look good.
> 
> you Guys have to truly realize that these guys don’t want to write tickets!!! They hate it. But they have a boss they have to answer too. And if they are tasked with stopping possible violator on the the highway. Then they’re doing what they’re told... following orders. The only enjoyment they get out of it is if it leads to a more serious charge
> 
> Look at it like this “ the broken windows theory”. If they let the little things go... they turn into bigger things. That’s just how it is. Hopefully they use some discretion but if they don’t they don’t.


ok whatever you say im done with this thread, lock er up!


----------



## plugger

I think the DNR should pull over and ticket unsuccessful hunters. If you haven't killed a deer by the end of the opening weekend of gun season have you really tried? We need hunters out there not wannabes.


----------



## CHASINEYES

fishdip said:


> I guess we know who the violators are.


That's BS. Some people just have no dignity I guess. They don't mind being treated like a criminal and a little biotch. Show me your papers Dipfish, NOW!!! Lol.. There's plenty of opportunity to check deer tags without setting up nazi style xway stings. Besides, what kind of numbnut would flaunt their untagged or illegally tagged deer while driving down the road?


----------



## CHASINEYES

Tron322 said:


> It's all about who you know.
> 
> Most impressive I heard was short but in southern Mich, only pulled over a few vehicles. One guy shot the deer in WI and heading home south thru our whole state.
> 
> Was a couple years ago...but it does happen.
> 
> Figured it was gonna be big this year, can't wait to hear the details in a month or two.


Checks at the border would be good. Or atleast would have been before cwd.


----------



## kisherfisher

CHASINEYES said:


> That's BS. Some people just have no dignity I guess. They don't mind being treated like a criminal and a little biotch. Show me your papers Dipfish, NOW!!! Lol.. There's plenty of opportunity to check deer tags without setting up nazi style xway stings. Besides, what kind of numbnut would flaunt their untagged or illegally tagged deer while driving down the road?


Really ! watch for the DNR report when it comes out. Not punched tags, wives name , grandmas tag, endless excuses . The same ones that shoot a deer , then go buy a license . Many !


----------



## Grizzly Adams

One time when younger - was hunting with a few buds on state land. We were going to meet back at truck at 11 or so. Well I get to truck & nobody there yet, so I lay down on ground in the sun & am soon sawing logs. I wake up to a CO standing over me & my buddy beside him. The CO says "I got your buddy with an illegal Doe & he says your the one that shot it". I was "ugh ugh ugh wtf" ...then my buddy & CO starts laughing. 
He give my bud a ride back to truck while walking down road - they see me there, & my bud gets him to say that to F with me. 
Told my bud ..."you SOB" ...lol


----------



## Grizzly Adams

He checked licenses & all was good. A positive story to add...


----------



## CHASINEYES

kisherfisher said:


> Really ! watch for the DNR report when it comes out. Not punched tags, wives name , grandmas tag, endless excuses . The same ones that shoot a deer , then go buy a license . Many !


That will be interesting to read.


----------



## 6Speed

I can't wait until deer season is over. You guys are a bunch of retards. Worse than the fly dunkers!


----------



## bmoffit

Sharkbait11 said:


> ok whatever you say im done with this thread, lock er up!


why lock it up?? Because some one has a different opinion than you? Because some of us on here are PRO POLICE??


----------



## NbyNW

PTPD2312 said:


> Ya know if I had to do it all over again I don’t think I’d be a LEO. The respect has gone out the window over the last 16 years. I don’t like missing holidays, family events, working weekends, seeing dead bodies, making death notifications, being spit on, being cursed at every day, being a babysitter for lacking parents, dealing with mentals, going to court on my days off, dealing with the court system in general, and missing hunting and fishing opportunities. It doesn’t pay all that good either. I’m glad I’m not a CO as I wouldn’t have any time to hunt or fish.


I’m gonna go ahead and call your bluff. I know this won’t be popular on here, but the truth isn’t always popular. LEOs get paid very well, have excellent benefits and retirement packages as well as an amazing amount of time off compared to most careers. 
The other on the job details can be difficult, but they are not unique only to LEOs. 
I am very pro LEO and respect the law, you might need to see what others deal with in other careers, might give you some perspective. I would bet many in your career-all I have spoken with-feel the same, which creates a sounding board, but when I compare the true numbers and benefits it isn’t comparable.


----------



## skyblaster

NbyNW said:


> I’m gonna go ahead and call your bluff. I know this won’t be popular on here, but the truth isn’t always popular. LEOs get paid very well, have excellent benefits and retirement packages as well as an amazing amount of time off compared to most careers.
> The other on the job details can be difficult, but they are not unique only to LEOs.
> I am very pro LEO and respect the law, you might need to see what others deal with in other careers, might give you some perspective. I would bet many in your career-all I have spoken with-feel the same, which creates a sounding board, but when I compare the true numbers and benefits it isn’t comparable.


As far as pay, benefits and retirement goes it all depends on what agency you work for. As far as everything else you are right. Every job has its cons. And some are the same as cops. But until your job requires you to run TOWARD the gunfire don't compare it to being a cop.


----------



## Grandriverrat

Mods why is this thread still going on? Really not good on either side. Good night all!


----------



## jamie2003rkc

anagranite said:


> I saw a helicopter on day 2. I'm in genesee county, not sure if it was looking for bait because it was going fast[/QUOTE
> It was most likely flight care heli transporting a patient


----------



## NbyNW

fels340 said:


> You guys need to quit being so sensitive. That's the problem with a lot of people today. Just relax a little. There are bigger battles to fight in this life.


I agree with these portions of your statement, but I believe you are directing them at one side of this discussion. I personally don’t understand why some think this thread needs to be locked, talking about LEO isn’t taboo, and I would rather hear both sides than pretend they don’t both exist. 
I appreciate these conversations and it has actually helped me get a better idea of my informed opinion on this matter.
I hear this on Meateater a lot: pro nuance anti bs. I think it fits well for this thread. You gotta wade through some bs to find the good info.


----------



## Jimbos

Ranger Ray said:


> Officer: Where did that 5lbs of dope come from that just fell out your pants?
> Punk: Not mine officer.
> O: Who's is it?
> P: I just borrowed these pants, from my cousin Billy Bob. They ain't even mines.
> O: So it's not yours?
> P: No.
> O: So who's pants are they again?
> P: My neighbor Elvis. Borrowed em.
> O: Have your license?
> P: I losts it.
> O: You lost it?
> P: Yeah.
> O: Insurance?
> P: Dis isn't my car occifer.
> O: Who's is it?
> P: My cousin Milly Mays?
> O: Registration?
> P: Was dat?
> O: So who's car is it?
> P: My freind Joe Bob's
> O: Can I search the car?
> P: I gots to recline?
> O: Recline?
> P: You knows, refuse.
> O: You mean decline?
> P: Huh?
> O: Who's crack pipe on the seat?
> P: What pipe?
> O: The one on the seat.
> P: Is dat whats that is? Thought it was a figurine. Founds it down the road.
> O: Turn around, put your hands on the car.
> P: Man, I can't go to jail. I just gots out.
> O: What were you in jail for?
> P: Got pulled over and 5lbs of dope fell out my pants. But that wasn't mine either.
> O: Sit right there, going to run the car.
> O: Appears this car was stolen.
> P: No ways.
> O: Yep, put your hands behind your back. Don't, dont run!
> Intermission.
> P: Man, why you tackle me? You hurts me. I'm suing!
> O: You have the right...................
> P: I'm suing! You, you harassing me and false arrest.



Holy cow Ray, you watch Live PD too?


----------



## MoreHuntingPls

beer and nuts said:


> Not 100% confirmation, but buddy said plane was circling and checking the 2nd day. I did have a helicopter come by 2nd day where we were at, but it was kinda high and going fast to be a observation DNR helicopter. But pretty rare to see a heli this time of year around that area, I suppose.


DNR in Roscommon gave my buddy a ticket for no name on blind and said they saw it in the plane on second day. Said that because he crossed train tracks on foot they felt implored to search. I thought it was more of ticketing a down state license plate/hunter. The other truck 200 yards up the road didn’t seem to have a problem. 


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


----------



## Sharkbait11

While I've had issues with LEOs in the past, I never did anything to deserve what was done to me. Property stolen, handcuffed for no reason at 17 yrs old my g/f balling her eyes out at the side of the road for a roadside stop, cop claimed I was swerving...uhh nope try again, he asked if any weapons or alcohol, being young I told him I had a folding pocket knife in the console, just happened to be a $150 smith and wesson that matched his gun, he even said wow nice knife, very sharp same brand as my gun. Made me get out of car, searched car while I was handcuffed, patted me and g/f down for what? A pocket knife? So yeah, I'm against unprovoked roadside checks for good reason - they can lead to unlawful seizure of personal property and being humiliated for absolutely no reason. Pocket knife was never returned...hmm....

Im just a regular law abiding citizen like most others out there who doesn't want to be bothered by Johnny Law when I haven't done anything wrong. I've met a lot of really cool LEO's. I used to hang out with a staff sergeant, get drunk at his place, roll joints on his poker table while he held gambling tournaments, really cool down to earth guy. Still see him from time to time and wish him well. I think most LEO's are like that, and alot are active outdoorsmen/women, most are decent people. One bad apple for sure.

Show of force? why not stand next to the gas stations selling bait and ask questions about what they are using the 6 bags of carrots for and promote awareness of CWD and the baiting ban. Go find the criminals, don't wait for them to come to you on the road that's just lazy waste of taxpayers hard earned $$$.

I have all the respect in the world for all law enforcement that does their job well and does not abuse their powers. Not a cop hater by a far shot, appreciate those that put their lives on the line to save others and fight for real justice and do not appreciate those that abuse the public trust.


----------



## UPEsox

Sharkbait11 said:


> While I've had issues with LEOs in the past, I never did anything to deserve what was done to me. Property stolen, handcuffed for no reason at 17 yrs old my g/f balling her eyes out at the side of the road for a roadside stop, cop claimed I was swerving...uhh nope try again, he asked if any weapons or alcohol, being young I told him I had a folding pocket knife in the console, just happened to be a $150 smith and wesson that matched his gun, he even said wow nice knife, very sharp same brand as my gun. Made me get out of car, searched car while I was handcuffed, patted me and g/f down for what? A pocket knife? So yeah, I'm against unprovoked roadside checks for good reason - they can lead to unlawful seizure of personal property and being humiliated for absolutely no reason. Pocket knife was never returned...hmm....
> 
> Im just a regular law abiding citizen like most others out there who doesn't want to be bothered by Johnny Law when I haven't done anything wrong. I've met a lot of really cool LEO's. I used to hang out with a staff sergeant, get drunk at his place, roll joints on his poker table while he held gambling tournaments, really cool down to earth guy. Still see him from time to time and wish him well. I think most LEO's are like that, and alot are active outdoorsmen/women, most are decent people. One bad apple for sure.
> 
> Show of force? why not stand next to the gas stations selling bait and ask questions about what they are using the 6 bags of carrots for and promote awareness of CWD and the baiting ban. Go find the criminals, don't wait for them to come to you on the road that's just lazy waste of taxpayers hard earned $$$.
> 
> I have all the respect in the world for all law enforcement that does their job well and does not abuse their powers. Not a cop hater by a far shot, appreciate those that put their lives on the line to save others and fight for real justice and do not appreciate those that abuse the public trust.


Yea, asset forfeiture is an absolute blight on our collective model of policing. It can be done without a conviction or charge as Shark noted. See the attachment, not a good look. Reversing this trend would go a long way to rebuilding public trust. Luckily this is being taken to the courts.


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## Tom (mich)

Jimbos said:


> Holy cow Ray, you watch Live PD too?


No, that's the actual transcript taken from the dash cam last time he was pulled over. True story.


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## Sharkbait11

UPEsox said:


> Yea, asset forfeiture is an absolute blight on our collective model of policing. It can be done without a conviction or charge as Shark noted. See the attachment, not a good look. Reversing this trend would go a long way to rebuilding public trust. Luckily this is being taken to the courts.


It takes a long time to build trust, and only 1 time to break it.


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## Jimbos




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## Rainman68

Jimbo, i got a doe that needs tenderizing you available.


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## Botiz

What will cops do when autonomous cars become a thing?


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## Tilden Hunter

TriggerDiscipline said:


> The sport is in major decline. That is an established fact. Arcane and arbitrary hunting laws probably contribute a little bit to that decline.
> 
> https://www.freep.com/story/news/lo...-hunting-big-decline-deer-fishing/1924497002/
> 
> I would lay most of the blame at larger macroeconomic forces, which UPEsox has already hinted at. Unfortunately, the average American worker works more hours, for less vacation time, and with far less job security than in the past. This makes it very hard to ask the bossman for a week off during the rut. The average successful hunter needs something like 7 days in the woods to punch a tag on a buck. Can't blame most young people for throwing in the towel.
> 
> The solution to the decline in hunting is more leisure time, and more power for the workers. Vote DA BERN! Make hunting great again!


I was with you until the very end. If the dems could manage to nominate someone who wasn't insane or senile, then they could win.

This is coming from a conservative Republican Never Trumper.


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## Tilden Hunter

Honyuk96 said:


> gotcha. I have family up in MN too. Who knows, perhaps we’ll still cross paths. Thx fer da song, if i knew how, i’d post one back atcha. You keep up the good fight brotha, eventually this country will go legal and this pointless battle will be over. We’re gaining ground every day. Cheers man !


This thread has become some kind of stoner love fest. Time to close it down.


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## Tilden Hunter

UPEsox said:


> Willing to bet my bottom dollar that the percentage of crooked LEO's out of total LEO population is way higher than the percentage of hunters that are bad apples in the hunting population. Yet LEO's are supposed to be held to a higher standard, the reality is the exact opposite. They get the benefit of the doubt, the burden of proof has been turned on us.


BS.


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## HookedUp

Prime examples of law enforcement violating are civil rights. I can't stress enough learn your rights. Stand up for them/yourself. Or enjoy the taste of licking boots.


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## Tilden Hunter

NbyNW said:


> I’m gonna go ahead and call your bluff. I know this won’t be popular on here, but the truth isn’t always popular. LEOs get paid very well, have excellent benefits and retirement packages as well as an amazing amount of time off compared to most careers.
> *The other on the job details can be difficult,* but they are not unique only to LEOs.
> I am very pro LEO and respect the law, you might need to see what others deal with in other careers, might give you some perspective. I would bet many in your career-all I have spoken with-feel the same, which creates a sounding board, but when I compare the true numbers and benefits it isn’t comparable.


Like being shot dead by stoners.


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## UPEsox

Unfortunately trying to assert your rights won't end well. Thats kind of what we are so mad about, it's a purely one sided relationship.


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## ReeseHunter

A Detroit police officer isn’t going home to his family tonight. Shot dead responding to a burglary in progress call. Yeah let’s complain about a CO pulling someone over to check and make sure a deer is properly tagged. SMH


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## Macs13

Tilden Hunter said:


> I was with you until the very end. If the dems could manage to nominate someone who wasn't insane or senile, then they could win.
> 
> This is coming from a conservative Republican Never Trumper.


Mayor Pete is the best choice by far. I've been on the bandwagon since day one. Midwest. Reasoned. Intelligent. Military vet. Young. Etc. That's a dude that nobody fears coming for your guns or hunting rights because he understands middle America. I'm all for intelligence in the White House. I never can understand why people don't insist on both intelligence and common courtesy/decency - you know, like a guy you'd want to work for. 

Sent from my LG-LS998 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## xl2000

Macs13 said:


> Mayor Pete is the best choice by far. I've been on the bandwagon since day one. Midwest. Reasoned. Intelligent. Military vet. Young. Etc. That's a dude that nobody fears coming for your guns or hunting rights because he understands middle America. I'm all for intelligence in the White House. I never can understand why people don't insist on both intelligence and common courtesy/decency - you know, like a guy you'd want to work for.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS998 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


Mayor Pete? Really #make America terrible again


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## bmoffit

UPEsox said:


> Tilden aint a big fan of dissent, or nuance. He's just a guy willing to take marching orders; a bootlicker


better a bootlicker than an adolescent enabled mommas boy who thinks he knows it all


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## UPEsox

bmoffit said:


> better a bootlicker than an adolescent enabled mommas boy who thinks he knows it all


At least you admit to being a bootlicker. As far as "adolescent enabled momma's boy", I'm impressed you could find a thesaurus, not surprised you don't understand the difference between present and past tense. Guess I'll give you some credit for trying, dolt.


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## sureshot006

UPEsox said:


> Taking the lazy way out.
> 
> Let me translate: "Its way warmer in our cars and we can pull over people that we thing look like offenders, if we find drugs and alcohol even better. Plus Tim Hortons is just the next exit down"


More effective this way. With limited officers what do you expect? Its smart.

It was in an email focused on regulations aimed at slowing the spread of CWD. It's a great way to help catch people hunting out of state or transporting out of disease zones improperly. Not sure how else they'd enforce those rules.

Keep on bitchin...


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## Honyuk96

That’s what i thought. You guys that go spouting off before you even know who your talking to is incredible. I’ve been nothing but polite throughout this thread. Show some respect. If you wouldn’t talk to me that way face to face, you shouldn’t behind a keyboard. It takes a marine bout ten seconds to put the average joe in a choke hold and to sleep. Your words are hurtful and just poor taste period. You don’t like cannabis? Fine. Don’t condemn other who do. Have a good evening


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## Honyuk96

Honyuk96 said:


> That’s what i thought. You guys that go spouting off before you even know who your talking to is incredible. I’ve been nothing but polite throughout this thread. Show some respect. If you wouldn’t talk to me that way face to face, you shouldn’t behind a keyboard. It takes a marine bout ten seconds to put the average joe in a choke hold and to sleep. Your words are hurtful and just poor taste period. You don’t like cannabis? Fine. Don’t condemn other who do. Have a good evening
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


So it looks like kisherfisher has gone and redacted his last post. For those of you who read it. Keep in mind this is a LEO or ex LEO who was just mocking me for being a Zamboni driver. Typical statement i’d expect from a LEO who doesn’t like cannabis. Too bad he didn’t leave his statement up for all to read. Ragging a guy down who works 7 days a week trying to make ends meet. SMH. 


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## sureshot006

There are a lot of folks who could beat the snot out of a marine, too...

Though I'm not sure why these fights are even a consideration. Adults in a physical fight over a few words is juvenile.


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## UPEsox

Honyuk96 said:


> So it looks like kisherfisher has gone and redacted his last post. For those of you who read it. Keep in mind this is a LEO or ex LEO who was just mocking me for being a Zamboni driver. Typical statement i’d expect from a LEO who doesn’t like cannabis. Too bad he didn’t leave his statement up for all to read. Ragging a guy down who works 7 days a week trying to make ends meet. SMH.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


 Exactly. Typical


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## bmoffit

Honyuk96 said:


> So it looks like kisherfisher has gone and redacted his last post. For those of you who read it. Keep in mind this is a LEO or ex LEO who was just mocking me for being a Zamboni driver. Typical statement i’d expect from a LEO who doesn’t like cannabis. Too bad he didn’t leave his statement up for all to read. Ragging a guy down who works 7 days a week trying to make ends meet. SMH.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


I’d love to drive a zamboni !!! That’d be awesome!!!’


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## Honyuk96

sureshot006 said:


> There are a lot of folks who could beat the snot out of a marine, too...
> 
> Though I'm not sure why these fights are even a consideration. Adults in a physical fight over a few words is juvenile.


Thanks for your response sureshot. I think you missed my point. My point was. Would these anti cannabis guys look a marine in the eyes and still spew their garbage ? Of course they wouldn’t. Even uncle sams children use the herb.


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## U of M Fan

Lock this up already!!!


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## sureshot006

Honyuk96 said:


> Thanks for your response sureshot. I think you missed my point. My point was. Would these anti cannabis guys look a marine in the eyes and still spew their garbage ? Of course they wouldn’t. Even uncle sams children use the herb.


I didn't miss the point. I just think its dumb to go to violence over something so small. Especially when you dont know who is doing the spewing. Might just have your ass handed right back to you. I do think any military personnel deserve a little more respect than to be ridiculed though.


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## HookedUp

I personally would rather be a mommas boy then a bootlicker.


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## Carpenter Bill

Seen that at Jordan river road in Antrim county years ago. 


stickbow shooter said:


> Seen it on one of those warden shows too. But it was in southern Mich. Years ago they did a rode block on one of the popular seasonal roads around here. They stopped every vehicle coming out that night.


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## june bugger

maybe if the bad half of the Leo lost their cocky a$$ attitudes and remember they work for us (public servants) we would no longer having people disrespecting them.


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## kisherfisher

Still here Hony ! Your the one who chirped in bud . Zero post directed towards you , until you made it personal. Reread 


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman


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## GrizzlyHunter

U of M Fan said:


> Lock this up already!!!


Agreed!

I'm the OP'er. I guess I'm to blame for all of this. This has been the worst down-ward spiraling thread that I can ever remember on this forum. And for that...I'm embarrassed that I started it. I had no idea it would have deteriorated to this level.

I apologize for starting it, and even more so for participating in it.

I'm done.


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## kisherfisher

Still here Hony ! Never directed a post toward you until You made it personal . Reread 


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman


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## Plumbgranny

UPEsox said:


> *You didn't ask a question you dolt*.


Not taking sides here, just had to jump in. 
Let's break the back and forth with a little humor. The term "dolt" just cracks me up. We had a true "dolt" in the campground I frequent and we referred to him so often as "dolt" that my wife actually thought that was his name! SMH. If she would have met him I'd love to have to seen the puzzled look on his "dolt" face when she said "Hi, Dolt I'm..." 
Okay...back to the knife-fight! 

P.S. Name calling is wrong (well, for you guys).


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## kisherfisher

GrizzlyHunter said:


> Agreed!
> 
> I'm the OP'er. I guess I'm to blame for all of this. This has been the worst down-ward spiraling thread that I can ever remember on this forum. And for that...I'm embarrassed that I started it. I had no idea it would have deteriorated to this level.
> 
> I apologize for starting it, and even more for participating in it.
> 
> I'm done.


You just got a feel for the public opinion on the Law enforcement community !


Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman


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## Honyuk96

sureshot006 said:


> I didn't miss the point. I just think its dumb to go to violence over something so small. Especially when you dont know who is doing the spewing. Might just have your ass handed right back to you. I do think any military personnel deserve a little more respect than to be ridiculed though.


I’d never advocate violence. I’m not that way. I was just using another scenario to make a point. Thank you


kisherfisher said:


> Sounds Like you may be a little irritated today ? I am not targeting anyone, but if the shoe fits where it. Flat tire on the Zamboni today, bud !





kisherfisher said:


> Sounds Like you may be a little irritated today ? I am not targeting anyone, but if the shoe fits where it. Flat tire on the Zamboni today, bud !


So i guess kisherfisher didn’t take this down. Here’s law enforcement ragging down a lowly Zamboni driver. Unreal


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## Honyuk96

Not targeting anyone. He called out the Zamboni driver. Incredible


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## kisherfisher

Honyuk96 said:


> Hey Kisherfisher My earlier post goes for you too. Would you go mouthing off to a marine returning home from duty and uses cannabis ? Please entertain me w more of your crap. No way in hell you’d be preaching your nonsense to a marine. Guarantee it. Zip it pal, you’ve said enough.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


Just a response to your above post Hony ! Like I said YOU made it personal. Not a single post mentioned you until you showed up today.


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## Liver and Onions

GrizzlyHunter said:


> ....
> 
> I'm the OP'er. ...........


I'm glad you did because I did not know about officers pulling over vehicles with deer visible. Just good to know info.
Does not bother bother me that this is a method for checking on hunters. Thanks for posting.

L & O


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## Gone Coastal

Su


sureshot006 said:


> There are a lot of folks who could beat the snot out of a marine, too...
> 
> Though I'm not sure why these fights are even a consideration. Adults in a physical fight over a few words is juvenile.


Sure, cause high marines would rather make love than war.


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## bucko12pt

d_rek said:


> My cousins and two friends got pulled over near Gaylord not once but twice this weekend. The first time they were coming home from the morning hunt and saw a deer about 10 yards off the road so they slowed to check it out. They saw right away it was a decoy and went on their way. They got about 1/2 mile up the road and DNR pulled them over, checked tags and licenses and told them he could have got them for 'shining' if he wanted to.
> 
> They got pulled over by the same guy a day later on a different road. They had a doe in the bed of the truck but unfortunately the guy that shot it didn't tag it, even though he had his tags and licenses. He gave the guy a ticket for not tagging his animal. And shame on him for not tagging it, but seeing as he had his licenses he could have let them off with a warning if he had tagged it then and there.
> 
> Sounds like there's a CO up there who has a chip on his shoulder. I sure hope they don't start more aggressive searching to meet budget shortfalls. Just a really bad look for CO's and the agency if they go that direction.


Or you could say he’s a poacher that got caught.


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## bucko12pt

NbyNW said:


> Anyone hear they are using helicopters to find bait piles on opening weekend? Heard a few reports of heli's circling over hunting grounds.
> 
> DNR might want to spend more money on actual researches about CWD before throwing hells gates at the public. Just another reason to contribute to the decline in hunters.


They’re hiring drones with infrared and searching for bait piles/congregated deer at bait sites.


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## RKPTA

I hunted both Ingham and Ionia Counties since firearms season opened and I had both planes and helicopters overhead every day. Didn't have nearly the air traffic during the opening week of bow season...


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## Liver and Onions

bucko12pt said:


> They’re hiring drones with infrared and searching for bait piles/congregated deer at bait sites.


My turnip and radish plots would sure light up a screen at this time of the year. 1 apple and several crabapples are dropping fruit. If timed correctly, they would light up a screen for a brief time. The rye/wheat/clover plots are all larger and would show animals spread out more I think.

L & O


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## John Dumbra

michiganreaper said:


> There were 2 CO's parked just outside Rose City on 33 yesterday doing the same thing.


i've seen the same thing before on m33 a little south of Rose City myself, i don't like the idea either, even when your tags in plan sight, and especially if you left the check sation in Mio, then i might be a little pissed


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## Whitetail_hunter

sureshot006 said:


> There are a lot of folks who could beat the snot out of a marine, too...
> 
> Though I'm not sure why these fights are even a consideration. Adults in a physical fight over a few words is juvenile.


Glad you said it, no disrespect to anyone in the armed forces but hand to hand combat isn't their most honed skill. They are awesome people but nowhere near invisible.

Should have been a locked thread before it came to this, hopefully it will soon.


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## Whitetail_hunter

bucko12pt said:


> They’re hiring drones with infrared and searching for bait piles/congregated deer at bait sites.


:lol: whatever swampbuck

I'll burn one to that.


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## FREEPOP

Whitetail_hunter said:


> . They are awesome people but nowhere near invisible.


Hard to fight em if you can't see em


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## Whitetail_hunter

FREEPOP said:


> Hard to fight em if you can't see em


True story, but you know what I meant.


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## PalookaJim

kisherfisher said:


> Did you get the COs account of the stop ? 2 guys on a 2 track at 2:00am has all kinds of reasonable suspicious for a stop. "Reasonable" defined ! A 2 track is not traffic road, it is a remote trail , used by a person who made need n ORV sticker, A reasonable person uses a road to travel to a destination . Could they be going to a remote cabin, or camp? Sure , a reasonable answer , after a reasonable stop to question where they are headed. You are confusing an arrest with "probable cause" . Sorry Jim , reasonable suspicion is valid for a further investigation. Check your notes from your Bar exam.


I practiced estate law so I actually had to Bone up on the subject. You are completely missing the point. While I agree that reasonable suspicion is a lower threshold than probable cause, it still requires that the LEO articulate what law has been broken. In other words," I am stopping you because you violated a law or vehicle code." The dash cam recorded the officer saying he pulled them over" to see what they were up to". As it turns out, they were up to no good. The guys were both scumbags. Their lawyer has scheduled a suppression hearing for next week. These guys are going to walk because you can't pull somebody over just to see what they are up to.


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## Whitetail_hunter

PalookaJim said:


> I practiced estate law so I actually had to Bone up on the subject. You are completely missing the point. While I agree that reasonable suspicion is a lower threshold than probable cause, it still requires that the LEO articulate what law has been broken. In other words," I am stopping you because you violated a law or vehicle code." The dash cam recorded the officer saying he pulled them over" to see what they were up to". As it turns out, they were up to no good. The guys were both scumbags. Their lawyer has scheduled a suppression hearing for next week. These guys are going to walk because you can't pull somebody over just to see what they are up to.


Awesome, not that two dipshits will walk but to the fact they where illegally pulled over and the system fixed it. A lesson for everyone.


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## Grandriverrat

U of M Fan said:


> Lock this up already!!!


Mods are you serious? I like this site but, to hear us going back and forth calling each other names is really pissing me off. I see both sides , but when you start calling out and belittling people because you “ think” you are smarter or more informed than the other side is not right. Can’t really believe you have let it go on this far. Wow just simply wow!


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## blackduckkilla

d_rek said:


> My cousins and two friends got pulled over near Gaylord not once but twice this weekend. The first time they were coming home from the morning hunt and saw a deer about 10 yards off the road so they slowed to check it out. They saw right away it was a decoy and went on their way. They got about 1/2 mile up the road and DNR pulled them over, checked tags and licenses and told them he could have got them for 'shining' if he wanted to.
> 
> They got pulled over by the same guy a day later on a different road. They had a doe in the bed of the truck but unfortunately the guy that shot it didn't tag it, even though he had his tags and licenses. He gave the guy a ticket for not tagging his animal. And shame on him for not tagging it, but seeing as he had his licenses he could have let them off with a warning if he had tagged it then and there.
> 
> Sounds like there's a CO up there who has a chip on his shoulder. I sure hope they don't start more aggressive searching to meet budget shortfalls. Just a really bad look for CO's and the agency if they go that direction.


Stop. Every single hunter knows to tag a deer especially before transporting it. He did not forget to tag the deer. This is crap when you blame the CO. He is doing his job and should be commended for it not labeled chip on his shoulder not budget shortfalls


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## Randy Schmid

Took my son to state land because he wanted to hunt ducks. Walked into a flooding and set up a few decoys and started hunting about 3pm. No ducks, nothing until about 15 min before shooting hours ended. With ten min. left here they come. Ducks flying around and two dnr are checking my licence and gun for a plug. Made me unload my gun to check for plug and by this time shooting hours were over. No big deal until a mallard came in and landed right in the decoys and my 5 yr old pulled up his bb gun and fired! I thought these two co's were going to have a heart attack! They actually started to lecture my son about shooting after hours! This little act lasted about 2 seconds and dad was up there ass like a duck on a junebug! They followed us up to our truck and my son sat his bb gun on the front seat and one of the co's said he could write him for not having the bb gun cased! They left a lasting negative memory in a five yr old's brain. We play by the rules and get our little hunt wrecked and then get threatened! "They have a job to do "i understand" but when they begin to change the course of our hunting heritage and make the hunting experience a negative thing they lose my support!"


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## Petronius

Randy Schmid said:


> Took my son to state land because he wanted to hunt ducks. Walked into a flooding and set up a few decoys and started hunting about 3pm. No ducks, nothing until about 15 min before shooting hours ended. With ten min. left here they come. Ducks flying around and two dnr are checking my licence and gun for a plug. Made me unload my gun to check for plug and by this time shooting hours were over. No big deal until a mallard came in and landed right in the decoys and my 5 yr old pulled up his bb gun and fired! I thought these two co's were going to have a heart attack! They actually started to lecture my son about shooting after hours! This little act lasted about 2 seconds and dad was up there ass like a duck on a junebug! They followed us up to our truck and my son sat his bb gun on the front seat and one of the co's said he could write him for not having the bb gun cased! They left a lasting negative memory in a five yr old's brain. We play by the rules and get our little hunt wrecked and then get threatened! "They have a job to do "i understand" but when they begin to change the course of our hunting heritage and make the hunting experience a negative thing they lose my support!"


The COs were blowing smoke, or they don't know the rules and need to go back to school. A traditional BB gun is spring loaded and not in the same class as an airgun, therefore, it is not treated as a firearm for hunting purposes.


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## Scout 2

Petronius said:


> The COs were blowing smoke, or they don't know the rules and need to go back to school. A traditional BB gun is spring loaded and not in the same class as an airgun, therefore, it is not treated as a firearm for hunting purposes.


I am not so sure about that. I have a spring loaded one that shoots at 1100 to 1200 FPS and I was told that these need to be cased. But I do agree I never heard of a reg BB gun having to be in a case


----------

