# Baiting ban in the lower?



## DecoySlayer

johnIV said:


> Sounds like a good hunt. Challenging but good.


It is a TON of fun! I grew up, split between PA and Michigan, hunting the cedar swamps first, then 2 weeks later the laurel in PA. I would think those hunts, so many years ago, have something to do with my bad knees today, but I would do all over again if I could.


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## 98885

DecoySlayer said:


> It is a TON of fun! I grew up, split between PA and Michigan, hunting the cedar swamps first, then 2 weeks later the laurel in PA. I would think those hunts, so many years ago, have something to do with my bad knees today, but I would do all over again if I could.


I've only hunted with a buddy that lives out there. His style is the extreme long range shooting from the mountain tops to another across canyon mountain top. Winds can be challenging and as you know being the bear season is late November early December, it's miserable sometimes. Success isn't great but decent. Some big bears live out there and it's just different than hunting bears in Michigan. No baiting or dogs. Seems bear drives are very common tho. I'm an ELR guy so that LR shooting is perfect for me. Many shot opportunities are lost from winds and less than perfect conditions to pull the trigger. Still many are available as well. I'm hopping for a calm evening on my next hunt and a bear inside the half mile marker. Maybe I'll get my first PA bear. Building a gun for the task that should be done by spring. Thanks for sharing that PA hunt experience. Sounds like a good time deer hunting there also. John


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## DecoySlayer

What county do you hunt there?

I am the opposite. I don't like to shoot long range. I like to see how close I can get before I shoot. I have touched two deer and one time, while in the laurel, managed to walk into a small group, 6 or 7, of sleeping deer. The only problem is I was in their primary escape route. LOL! Looking up at deer bellies as they jump over you is a hoot, just hoping they don't slip!


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## 98885

I have 80 acres in Gladwin county where i do my archery hunting mostly. I hunt Alger, Marquette and Delta counties in the UP for late archery and firearm deer. Mostly it's been a tradition for us as not many guys would go up there to hunt deer and expect to be real successful. Between the winters and wolves, the deer are thinned out pretty well. Our camp is in Alger county but need to spread out the bear baits and wind up in Delta and Marquette counties as well. The camp is in the 3 county corner basically off US 41.


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## DecoySlayer

We used to hunt in Roscommon County, near the Denton Creek floodings. 

In PA we hunted Somerset county. Our cabin was just a 1/2, through the woods, from the high point of the state.


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## 98885

DecoySlayer said:


> We used to hunt in Roscommon County, near the Denton Creek floodings.
> 
> In PA we hunted Somerset county. Our cabin was just a 1/2, through the woods, from the high point of the state.


Great area for bears also. Thick and hard to get into. Many guys stay out due to that fact. It's still a good spot to hunt. I have property in northern Gladwin county on the sugar river. Lots of bears I need that area also, just takes too long to get tags for the Gladwin, Red Oak unit. In my mid 50s and getting a tag every other year is my preference. Hell, I'd be in my mid 60s if I had to wait for a tag in those units. I love bear hunting but every two years is just right for me. Every year is a bit much running up to the UP every weekend baiting, setting cameras and packing bait. The excitement level is higher every other year


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## 98885

DecoySlayer said:


> We used to hunt in Roscommon County, near the Denton Creek floodings.
> 
> In PA we hunted Somerset county. Our cabin was just a 1/2, through the woods, from the high point of the state.


I used to hunt ducks down near Rockwood. From Dearborn originally so it was close to head south for it. Pt Mouille was a regular weekend visit in fall back in the 80s. Also loved shooting carp in there in the springtime. Miss all that alot being so far from it today. It's just a part of the past.


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## DecoySlayer

I still hunt ducks, around Pointe Mouillee, and once in a while, in the marsh, but it's hard with these legs. 

Back when I hunted Roscommon you got a bear tag with your deer tag. I did see a lot of bear, but never took one. I didn't want to drag one out of that swamp, deer were hard enough.


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## 98885

Yes I remember those days. I sold hunting licenses back in the early 80s when you could get a bear tag over the counter with deer tags. Killed a couple bears actually during deer season back then also. They are the only bears I killed with a firearm. Archery gear is how I prefer it today here in Michigan. I think the point system is best today but seems to take a while to get tags in many units.


DecoySlayer said:


> I still hunt ducks, around Pointe Mouillee, and once in a while, in the marsh, but it's hard with these legs.
> 
> Back when I hunted Roscommon you got a bear tag with your deer tag. I did see a lot of bear, but never took one. I didn't want to drag one out of that swamp, deer were hard enough.


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## DecoySlayer

johnIV said:


> Yes I remember those days. I sold hunting licenses back in the early 80s when you could get a bear tag over the counter with deer tags. Killed a couple bears actually during deer season back then also. They are the only bears I killed with a firearm. Archery gear is how I prefer it today here in Michigan. I think the point system is best today but seems to take a while to get tags in many units.


LOL! early 80's? I am talking 1965.

I have never hunted bear. I have a standing invitation to hunt in PA on my cousin's property. He has several large bear on his place. He hunting them, once, for about an hour, took a boar around 400#. Said it was too easy so he never hunted them again. LOL! I know there is one there bigger than that. Maybe someday. I would be more likely to go if it were not duck season.


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## rork

This lesson from my in-laws:
When you are spending hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars driving your ORV around working on your core skills of building boxes, baiting, and setting trail cams, there's no time to scout. And it really recreates the old ways of our ancestors in the green world - that feeling of connection.
/s
I'm going outdoors in beautiful places. Hope you can too.


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## 98885

DecoySlayer said:


> LOL! early 80's? I am talking 1965.
> 
> I have never hunted bear. I have a standing invitation to hunt in PA on my cousin's property. He has several large bear on his place. He hunting them, once, for about an hour, took a boar around 400#. Said it was too easy so he never hunted them again. LOL! I know there is one there bigger than that. Maybe someday. I would be more likely to go if it were not duck season.


Ya I never had any interest in bear hunting prior to selling licenses in 1983-1985. I realized buying a bear tag then was easy and could take a bear if I saw one while deer hunting. Hell, I was only around for a few years by 1965. Things I'm sure we're different back in those years where license availability was concerned. Everything was different then. I remember the deer ranges sure we're back then. Never saw deer down south where I pheasant hunted but today they are everywhere in that area and big bucks down there are second to none.


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## Chessieman

johnIV said:


> You got to love the baiter haters ! Show me a better way to get kids interested in hunting deer other than over some sort of bait? It's fine for all you "Awesome Hunter's" that have been doing it your whole life that don't necessarily require bait and can adequately hunt deer runways. For our brand new youth Hunters it's not quite the same. For some reason all you antler Point restriction guys and QMD guys easily forget about the up-and-coming new Hunters to our sport. Have you all forgot when you were 14 years old just starting this sport any deer with antlers was a good deer. Sure was for me back in the mid-70s any deer with antlers was a good deer for a first kill. Now it's being replaced with shoot Doe's not small bucks. That's just selfish thinking.


And you and I did not utilize bait, it was illegal!


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## Tilden Hunter

DecoySlayer said:


> No need to bait for bear either, or run dogs for that matter. PA does not allow baiting, or dogs, for bear, and they kill as many each year as Michigan does, with only a 4 day main season in some parts of the state for rifle, and the bear there are generally bigger than here. Go figure.
> 
> I am not against hunting with dogs, etc, I am just pointing out it is not needed.


PA bear hunting is a four day CF. Too many tags and too short a time. They seem to be happy with it, but I don't look to PA for how to manage our bears.


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## DecoySlayer

johnIV said:


> Ya I never had any interest in bear hunting prior to selling licenses in 1983-1985. I realized buying a bear tag then was easy and could take a bear if I saw one while deer hunting. Hell, I was only around for a few years by 1965. Things I'm sure we're different back in those years where license availability was concerned. Everything was different then. I remember the deer ranges sure we're back then. Never saw deer down south where I pheasant hunted but today they are everywhere in that area and big bucks down there are second to none.


I never saw a deer down here until I got out of the army in 1973.


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## 98885

Blaine man said:


> And you and I did not utilize bait, it was illegal!


I do not rememeber when I first hunted deer if it was or wasn't. Sure wasn't popular if it was legal. My first hunt was in Hawks Michigan. I killed my first buck on a broadcasted corn pile on a two track on private land. The landowner and my step father were buddy's and he put me in a ground blind where I killed that buck. Without a doubt, I was hooked on deer hunting but I think I was before that anyway.


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## DecoySlayer

I don't know if it was legal, or not, in Michigan when I started hunting, but if it was legal, it was rare. We would have looked at is as "lazy" hunting. 

I could not imagine, wanting to sit and wait for deer when I was young and very mobile. It was far too cool to wander off and see new things. 

I would sit opening morning till around noon, then I would head out. I have FAR more deer while looking for them rather than waiting on them to show.


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## Liver and Onions

Blaine man said:


> And you and I did not utilize bait, it was illegal!


Using bait in Michigan was never illegal, just wasn't done much. Unless you are making a reference to placing out salt blocks. Maybe the early 70's was when baiting became more popular ???
I know that some farmers were planting rye/wheat in small areas for gun season right after WW11. Basically a foodplot. Also leaving some standing corn until after the gun opener. I'm not sure if this was a very common practice, but it was done in the NLP to some extent.

L & O


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## DecoySlayer

I missed the 70, 71, and 72 seasons due to a prior commitment with my Uncle Sam, but from 73 thru 75, it was still rare, at least where I hunted. 

Shoot the first time I ever hunted with bait was sometime in the early 90's, in SC. Never killed a deer over bait until the mid 2000's


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## 98885

When a kid starts hunting with his parents, the style of Hunting that is executed typically is decided by the parent. When I hunted on a little bit if spread corn, it wasn't to wait for a deer to come and eat it. It was so the deer would stop while traveling the runway just off that two track and offer a good clean shot. I saw several dozen deer that morning and all stopped briefly to nibble on those kernels. None stayed more than a few minutes. They were on a runway and most of them were does. The buck I did kill was a small 3 pointer and was sure proud of it at 14. Thats all a parent wants his kid to do is kill cleanly and being happy and proud of the kill.


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## feedinggrounds

skipper34 said:


> Spoken like a typical lazy bait dumper.


Replied to like a Democrat, my way is the only way mindset.


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## feedinggrounds

Spartan88 said:


> I have drawn more bucks in bow range with a doe can call than I ever did with a rotting carrot pile.


Who uses rotting carrots? And why would a rotting carrot pile concern you? All the bucks are running to your doe call anyway.


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## GIDEON

skipper34 said:


> Spoken like a typical lazy bait dumper.]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> YEAP I agree, the things some people do, and then call it hunting.....baffles me


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## ridgewalker

skipper34 said:


> Spoken like a typical lazy bait dumper.


No, he spoke like the rest of us that are tired of the folks that want to mandate, "my way or the highway." I get along with my neighbors because I let them mind their own business. As for being lazy that could not be further from the truth.


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## Dish7

I'm too lazy _to bait. _


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## Waif

feedinggrounds said:


> Who uses rotting carrots? And why would a rotting carrot pile concern you? All the bucks are running to your doe call anyway.


Hmmm. Bucks stampede to his doe call...
What responds to his buck call?
Maybe ,some one mislabeled them...:16suspect

Maybe those aren't carrots...


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## Liver and Onions

skipper34 said:


> Spoken like a typical lazy bait dumper.


Are you attacking the baiters who baited illegally or all ? What you sound like is a guy who is very jealous of their success and the fact that they found a method of hunting that, for them, was fun and got results.

L & O


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## skipper34

Liver and Onions said:


> Are you attacking the baiters who baited illegally or all ? What you sound like is a guy who is very jealous of their success and the fact that they found a method of hunting that, for them, was fun and got results.
> 
> L & O


Baiting has been illegal for a number of years in the area of NELP where I hunt. But they bait there anyway. In my mind that is poaching. And it screws up the hunting for the rest of us legal hunters. The deer turn nocturnal in very short order. Yes, you can say that I despise baiting legal or not.


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## sureshot006

skipper34 said:


> Baiting has been illegal for a number of years in the area of NELP where I hunt. But they bait there anyway. In my mind that is poaching. And it screws up the hunting for the rest of us legal hunters. The deer turn nocturnal in very short order. Yes, you can say that I despise baiting legal or not.


I bet there is plenty of bait out before hunting season. They don't go nocturnal until guys are in the woods.


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## Hunters Edge

skipper34 said:


> Yes, you can say that I despise baiting legal or not.


Legal baiting increases daylight activity. I doubt anyone's post would infuence you to rationalize your views, especially with your posts.

Perspective is very hard to change to begin with. I would ask yourself how much do you enjoy deer hunting? For the loss of hunters do to banning bait and it's heated topic falls right into the anti hunters agenda. Not only divide and conquer, but reducing hunters both of which slowly whittles away our sport. May not affect you but will most likely affect your grandchildren, or there's.


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## skipper34

Hunters Edge said:


> Legal baiting increases daylight activity. I doubt anyone's post would infuence you to rationalize your views, especially with your posts.
> 
> Perspective is very hard to change to begin with. I would ask yourself how much do you enjoy deer hunting? For the loss of hunters do to banning bait and it's heated topic falls right into the anti hunters agenda. Not only divide and conquer, but reducing hunters both of which slowly whittles away our sport. May not affect you but will most likely affect your grandchildren, or there's.


How can you say that daylight activity increases due to baiting in the area that I hunt? You can't, plain and simple. My experience is that it decreases daytime activity. And how can you or anyone else tolerate the blatant illegal baiting which goes on in this state? Yeah, teach your children and grandchildren how to sneak bait into the woods without being caught. Very educational for up and coming hunters. If they could possibly enforce the non-baiting laws, I may take a different view of the practice. But as long as there are violators who are too lazy to learn to hunt the right way, my sentiments will remain the same. The baiting violators screw up my hunt. That's reason enough to despise it.


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## Hunters Edge

skipper34 said:


> How can you say that daylight activity increases due to baiting in the area that I hunt? You can't, plain and simple. My experience is that it decreases daytime activity. And how can you or anyone else tolerate the blatant illegal baiting which goes on in this state? Yeah, teach your children and grandchildren how to sneak bait into the woods without being caught. Very educational for up and coming hunters. If they could possibly enforce the non-baiting laws, I may take a different view of the practice. But as long as there are violators who are too lazy to learn to hunt the right way, my sentiments will remain the same. The baiting violators screw up my hunt. That's reason enough to despise it.


Again a person's perspective. 2 gallons of bait distributed in a minimum of 10' x 10' area promotes and encourages deer daytime activity. In my personal experience in many parts of the LP the small amount of bait, requires first come first gets to eat, or the early bird/birds gets the worm.

Illegal baiting is just that illegal baiting. Whether going over the 2 gallon limit in areas that baiting is legal, or baiting in areas that baiting has been banned. Your negativity should be directed to the CO, if you would report violations, they would have an opportunity to stop it. Especially in your area.

I think it is easier to blame someone else than seriously look at what you may be doing to increase nocturnal behavior, or possibility the lack of being successful at harvesting deer.

BELOW is your perspective
To stop the practice of legal baiting statewide because of violators not being caught. Is like saying we should stop banking, do away with all banks because we can not catch or stop all the bank robbers.

Just because you are disgusted with baiting, (legal baiting) many more approve and use this method and build lasting memories for them and their family. It also is an economy booster. A few weeks ago was at the local mill purchasing seed. Witnessed many workers standing around discussing CWD and the possibility of baiting being banned. I wonder how many of them will be cut and not needed in the coming months if baiting is indeed banned. Then it got me thinking not just the farmer, but the truck driver being paid to distribute bait. The stores or better yet the employees they would normally higher. It's not just the farmer that's going to feel the pinch if baiting is banned.

I also see the hunting license structure or prices changing if hunters walk away because they do not want to become violators. Have you even considered if the law abiding quit hunting, what's left?


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## feedinggrounds

Hunters Edge said:


> Legal baiting increases daylight activity. I doubt anyone's post would infuence you to rationalize your views, especially with your posts.
> 
> Perspective is very hard to change to begin with. I would ask yourself how much do you enjoy deer hunting? For the loss of hunters do to banning bait and it's heated topic falls right into the anti hunters agenda. Not only divide and conquer, but reducing hunters both of which slowly whittles away our sport. May not affect you but will most likely affect your grandchildren, or there's.


Its all about how he wants you to hunt. If baiting is legal and you choose not to, fine. If its legal and another wants to bait , well I guess mind your own business.


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## feedinggrounds

Ma


skipper34 said:


> How can you say that daylight activity increases due to baiting in the area that I hunt? You can't, plain and simple. My experience is that it decreases daytime activity. And how can you or anyone else tolerate the blatant illegal baiting which goes on in this state? Yeah, teach your children and grandchildren how to sneak bait into the woods without being caught. Very educational for up and coming hunters. If they could possibly enforce the non-baiting laws, I may take a different view of the practice. But as long as there are violators who are too lazy to learn to hunt the right way, my sentiments will remain the same. The baiting violators screw up my hunt. That's reason enough to despise it.


Maybe you need more baiting experience. You said in 50 years you never baited...How do you even know how deer react to bait, having never done it? Oh great hunter, I think your blowing smoke.


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## DirtySteve

Spartan88 said:


> I have drawn more bucks in bow range with a doe can call than I ever did with a rotting carrot pile.


I would try using fresh carrots. Not many animals would eat rotting vegetables.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## Masondrew

skipper34 said:


> How can you say that daylight activity increases due to baiting in the area that I hunt? You can't, plain and simple. My experience is that it decreases daytime activity. And how can you or anyone else tolerate the blatant illegal baiting which goes on in this state? Yeah, teach your children and grandchildren how to sneak bait into the woods without being caught. Very educational for up and coming hunters. If they could possibly enforce the non-baiting laws, I may take a different view of the practice. But as long as there are violators who are too lazy to learn to hunt the right way, my sentiments will remain the same. The baiting violators screw up my hunt. That's reason enough to despise it.


I like to see such selfishness, (screw up my hunt).


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## ESOX

feedinggrounds said:


> Its all about how he wants you to hunt. If baiting is legal and you choose not to, fine. If its legal and another wants to bait , well I guess mind your own business.


How he wants one to "hunt"? Baiting isn't hunting.


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## Petronius

ESOX said:


> How he wants one to "hunt"? Baiting isn't hunting.


Is fishing with bait really fishing?


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## DecoySlayer

petronius said:


> Is fishing with bait really fishing?


Only if you don't catch anything. If you catch a fish it's now called catching.

You can kill deer without the use of bait, or lures. Anyone who believes otherwise is incorrect. In many cases I believe you could take more deer without the use of bait. 

If baiting is legal, and you bait legal, it's OKEE DOKEE by me. I would never try to stop you. Just don't try to convince people baiting is necessary to take deer, it's not.


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## Hunters Edge

DecoySlayer said:


> Only if you don't catch anything. If you catch a fish it's now called catching.
> 
> You can kill deer without the use of bait, or lures. Anyone who believes otherwise is incorrect. In many cases I believe you could take more deer without the use of bait.
> 
> If baiting is legal, and you bait legal, it's OKEE DOKEE by me. I would never try to stop you. Just don't try to convince people baiting is necessary to take deer, it's not.


No one said it was a necessity, except your post. Most data says it increases harvest. More importantly it not only has more approval by hunters, but they believe it increases their chances (perception).

Ask yourself if it does not increase the opportunity to harvest deer for hunters, why is it legal to bait in the UP? If it does not increase or keep stability in hunter retention, why is it legal to bait in the UP? If it does not increase carring capacity why is it legal to feed deer in the UP?

Now a quick answer would be disease free. That does not hold water because the majority of the LP is disease free.

If it encourages spread of CWD why do the DNR use it with sharp shooters to eliminate deer in areas near civilization? If it does not increase harvest, again why does the DNR use it with sharp shooters?

If 74% of hunters approve or use bait, why is the NRC banning it totally in the LP?


DecoySlayer said:


> If baiting is legal, and you bait legal, it's OKEE DOKEE by me. I would never try to stop you.


You may not try to stop anybody, but the same can not be said for others, who push there ideology on others.
Otherwise baiting and feeding would be legal in all areas of the state that is disease free. Especially with a 74% approval rate and the impact on our economy it represents.

The big question is how many of those 74% of hunters will walk away from the sport in 2019, or 2020? Only time will reveal the answer.

I agree with you that baiting is not necessary to kill a deer. The bigger question is how many of the 74% will agree with that statement.


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## DecoySlayer

miruss said:


> Not a bad morning. #3 shot, skeet choke, inside 30 yards. My buddy's calling was magic! The last goose came in, just about landing on a spinning wing decoys. Had to wait for it to clear the decoy. 20 yards out.
> 
> Maybe you should learn how to hunt geese without DECOYS !! Do it every year get plenty of geese just need to be where they want to be !LOL!!


I know how to hunt geese without decoys. I have jump shot them and pass shot them. So there.


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## Hunters Edge

DecoySlayer said:


> I know how to hunt geese without decoys. I have jump shot them and pass shot them. So there.


How many waterfowlers use decoys, how many areas that offer pass shooting and jump shooting? I think the question you should be considering.

How many would still hunt waterfowl if decoys and calls were illegal to use? 

In Michigan electronic calls are illegal what if individuals push for banning all calls and decoys. This is similar and a closer comparison as to what will most likely happen to many deer hunters in Michigan, because of banning the use of bait.

Obviously I am not suggesting this or advocating such bans. Just trying to give others to think of the ramifications that are to come, or may happen.

In my day when they went to the point system they lost waterfowl hunters.


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## jiggin is livin

Justin said:


> You are correct. You don't really need bait to kill deer. Where there are deer. The problem is when you are surrounded by landowners that are doing everything they can do to draw and hold deer on their land. It's what I call defensive baiting. It's also the reason most landowners hate baiting although they would never admit it.


Which is exactly why if baiting becomes illegal, food plots should follow. It is the same damn thing, only on a larger scale. Instead of 2 gal of bait you have a semi truck load.


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## mattawanhunter

Same old S--t different Day!

Blah blah, blah blah blah blah blaaa blaaaaa blaaaaaa....

Next


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## MossyHorns

jiggin is livin said:


> Which is exactly why if baiting becomes illegal, food plots should follow. It is the same damn thing, only on a larger scale. Instead of 2 gal of bait you have a semi truck load.


The DNR will never ban food plots, because they plant them too. I saw several freshly planted rye fields in Lake County 2 weeks ago on state land.


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## jiggin is livin

MossyHorns said:


> The DNR will never ban food plots, because they plant them too. I saw several freshly planted rye fields in Lake County 2 weeks ago on state land.


I didn't say they would. I'm sure they never would. 

There will always be ways around it anyway. They can't outlaw gardens. They can't prove someone spread a bunch of acorns. 

If people wanna hunt with feed, they will. 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## Hunters Edge

jiggin is livin said:


> I didn't say they would. I'm sure they never would.
> 
> There will always be ways around it anyway. They can't outlaw gardens. They can't prove someone spread a bunch of acorns.
> 
> If people wanna hunt with feed, they will.
> 
> Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


Many hunters will walk away from hunting because of the ban. It may make some hunters into poachers, by continuing to bait similar to Europe centuries ago. Back then many times the crime of treaspassing was punished by hanging. Yet if the peasants did not become poachers many continental breeds would not be here today.


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## feedinggrounds

ESOX said:


> How he wants one to "hunt"? Baiting isn't hunting.


Your opinion, and that is all it is. Skipper has a opinion and that is all it is, a opinion.


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## feedinggrounds

Hunters Edge said:


> Many hunters will walk away from hunting because of the ban. It may make some hunters into poachers, by continuing to bait similar to Europe centuries ago. Back then many times the crime of treaspassing was punished by hanging. Yet if the peasants did not become poachers many continental breeds would not be here today.


Wonder if, those hunters that give up, would still support hunting at the ballot box down the road? Sort of like bait fishermen not caring too much what happens to flies only water, now that they are not welcome or allowed to use it with a method they choose. Bad trend, but real.


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## feedinggrounds

DecoySlayer said:


> I am not arguing why, how, when, etc. I don't want to ban anything or stop anyone from doing anything that is legal.
> 
> Why is that so hard to figure out?
> 
> ALL I am saying is that there are multiple ways to take game.


And soon, as far as deer go there will be one less method.


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## Hunters Edge

feedinggrounds said:


> And soon, as far as deer go there will be one less method.


Yep, but the million dollar question is, will it last?


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## DecoySlayer

Calling, and decoys, are not baiting. How do I know that? I have hunted ducks over baited ponds, at night, in England.

They are not the same thing.

I just wish I was able to hunt deer the way I used to do when I was younger. 

Go into an area where I had never been. No internet, no photos, no maps, no bait, no stands, no nothing. Just go in, find a deer, shoot it. Just move, SLOWLY, and QUIETLY, even catch them in their beds from time to time. 

You guys can bait, I don't really care, but, no matter how much you cry, it is more than possible to take a deer without the use of bait. That is a fact.


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## Hunters Edge

DecoySlayer said:


> Calling, and decoys, are not baiting. How do I know that? I have hunted ducks over baited ponds, at night, in England.
> 
> They are not the same thing.
> 
> I just wish I was able to hunt deer the way I used to do when I was younger.
> 
> Go into an area where I had never been. No internet, no photos, no maps, no bait, no stands, no nothing. Just go in, find a deer, shoot it. Just move, SLOWLY, and QUIETLY, even catch them in their beds from time to time.
> 
> You guys can bait, I don't really care, but, no matter how much you cry, it is more than possible to take a deer without the use of bait. That is a fact.





DecoySlayer said:


> I just wish I was able to hunt deer the way I used to do when I was younger.


I would wager many using bait today, wish the same.


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## DecoySlayer

Hunters Edge said:


> I would wager many using bait today, wish the same.


It's those who could go out and find them, that are still able to do so, and never learned how, that I am speaking of.


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## Hunters Edge

DecoySlayer said:


> It's those who could go out and find them, that are still able to do so, and never learned how, that I am speaking of.


The ban affects all. Including youth hunting and disabled outside of special hunts where those weekends it is allowed. Unfortunately many will testify to bait to be successful is allowing a week at the very least to allow deer in the area to find it, or utilize it. 

Actually have witnessed new bait site spooking deer. Others even spooked eventually curiosity brings them in then the forage or feeding eventually calms them down.

Similar to many runways. If you see a deer on a runway, within a week that deer will be on it. Some you can set the day and watch to it, others not so, especially if they become nocturnal.



DecoySlayer said:


> You guys can bait, I don't really care,


For someone that doesn't care, you seem to be posting a lot for the ban?


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## Dish7

Hunters Edge said:


> For someone that doesn't care, you seem to be posting a lot for the ban?


Maybe he just realizes that the ban is not the end of the world or deer hunting in MI like so many have been proclaiming. JMO.


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## Hunters Edge

Dish7 said:


> Maybe he just realizes that the ban is not the end of the world or deer hunting in MI like so many have been proclaiming. JMO.


Your the only one saying the end of the world. Many myself included have stated many will just walk away from deer hunting, similar to the last time it was banned.

History repeating itself. Ever hear of that before?


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## Dish7

Hunters Edge said:


> Your the only one saying the end of the world. Many myself included have stated many will just walk away from deer hunting, similar to the last time it was banned.
> 
> History repeating itself. Ever hear of that before?


Yep, I remember the last ban. Deer hunting in MI came to a screeching halt and never recovered. I decided that if I couldn't put some mineral out I was quitting deer hunting altogether...Sounds silly doesn't it?

Look, they could ban treestands tomorrow and I would just adjust and hunt from the ground.


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## DecoySlayer

Dish7 said:


> Look, they could ban treestands tomorrow and I would just adjust and hunt from the ground.


When I started hunting tree stands were illegal in Michigan and baiting was not common at all.


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## Hunters Edge

DecoySlayer said:


> When I started hunting tree stands were illegal in Michigan and baiting was not common at all.


Yep let's go backwards not forward in harvesting. Even with bait not being as popular or accepted as it is today, many hunters quit hunting when bait was banned last time in Michigan. 

True Story!


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## Hunters Edge

Dish7 said:


> Sounds silly doesn't it?


Tell that to those that suffer from disabilities, the handicapped, or aging hunters that even putting on clothes in the morning is a challenge.


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## MossyHorns

Hunters Edge said:


> Your the only one saying the end of the world. Many myself included have stated many will just walk away from deer hunting, similar to the last time it was banned.
> 
> History repeating itself. Ever hear of that before?


Great! More deer for the rest of us to hunt. I will buy extra tags to cover the ones you won't be buying. Someone willing to give up deer hunting, because they cant bait sure doesn't sound like someone who enjoys deer hunting anyway. If the bait ban prevents 1 deer from getting CWD or TB, then it will be a success.


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## Dish7

Hunters Edge said:


> Tell that to those that suffer from disabilities, the handicapped, or aging hunters that even putting on clothes in the morning is a challenge.


Personally, I have nothing against bait. I don't use it but I could care less if someone does. I don't even think it will help with slowing CWD but I'm not a biologist. But if we are banning it in the name fighting disease, then it _all_ needs to stop IMO. You can't have it both ways. That's right, sorry kids, sorry grandpa and very sorry to someone physically disabled. This is partly why, IMO, we have such a hard time with these reg changes. It not okay to bait here but go ahead over here. Not at all allowed for you but for the youngster its alright. Kinda like saying a little disease is okay. Either stop it or don't. JMO.

Please don't start yelling about food plots. That's a different debate for a different thread.


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## hawgeye

Spartan88 said:


> I have drawn more bucks in bow range with a doe can call than I ever did with a rotting carrot pile.


Try corn! LOL

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## skipper34

Hunters Edge said:


> No one said it was a necessity, except your post. Most data says it increases harvest. More importantly it not only has more approval by hunters, but they believe it increases their chances (perception).
> 
> Ask yourself if it does not increase the opportunity to harvest deer for hunters, why is it legal to bait in the UP? If it does not increase or keep stability in hunter retention, why is it legal to bait in the UP? If it does not increase carring capacity why is it legal to feed deer in the UP?
> 
> Now a quick answer would be disease free. That does not hold water because the majority of the LP is disease free.
> 
> If it encourages spread of CWD why do the DNR use it with sharp shooters to eliminate deer in areas near civilization? If it does not increase harvest, again why does the DNR use it with sharp shooters?
> 
> If 74% of hunters approve or use bait, why is the NRC banning it totally in the LP?
> 
> You may not try to stop anybody, but the same can not be said for others, who push there ideology on others.
> Otherwise baiting and feeding would be legal in all areas of the state that is disease free. Especially with a 74% approval rate and the impact on our economy it represents.
> 
> The big question is how many of those 74% of hunters will walk away from the sport in 2019, or 2020? Only time will reveal the answer.
> 
> I agree with you that baiting is not necessary to kill a deer. The bigger question is how many of the 74% will agree with that statement.


Even though I detest the use of bait, even more of that detest comes from the fact that the vast majority of those who use bait legally will also use bait illegally.


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## jiggin is livin

Anyone else setting up a mineral lick sight? If done right it should last a while.

No different than a food plot and those are sacred.


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## retired dundo

I remember in the 70s me and my brother was hunting on his brother in laws farm.We foundation small pile of carrots.We were shocked we wondered why they were there.We were shocked when we told the farmer and he said hi s friend put them out for the deer.At the time we thought it was the dumbest thing .After a coulple we started using some and could not believe how it helped.But after about five years. It did not help much when everyone. Started baiting so we quit baiting


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## DecoySlayer

Hunters Edge said:


> Tell that to those that suffer from disabilities, the handicapped, or aging hunters that even putting on clothes in the morning is a challenge.



Let's see, my "disabilities" don't stop me from hunting, yet. My "handicaps" hurt my hunting skills, and my "aging" ain't helping, but, I would not care if baiting were outlawed. I also don't care if it is not. Either way, if I hunt enough, I will be able to take deer.


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## jiggin is livin

I honestly don't care about baiting where we hunt in the HNF. Haven't been able to bait there for years and I still see plenty of deer. It definitely is a different way of hunting though. 

Bow hunting closer to home is a lot different. If you don't have bait it's hard to get them to come away from fields and food plots. It only hurts the public land hunters though, so they don't mind. 

Sent from my E6810 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


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## Hunters Edge

DecoySlayer said:


> I would





DecoySlayer said:


> I also





DecoySlayer said:


> I hunt


I am happy for you. How long do you think you would legally be able to hunt, if just you or a few people hunted?

Every time we lose a hunter our sport, not mine, not yours but our sport is at more risk of existing. Kind of like whittling a piece of wood down to nothing. If it does not matter to you for those that do bait, it should matter greatly to you if they stop hunting.


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## DecoySlayer

Hunters Edge said:


> I am happy for you. How long do you think you would legally be able to hunt, if just you or a few people hunted?
> 
> Every time we lose a hunter our sport, not mine, not yours but our sport is at more risk of existing. Kind of like whittling a piece of wood down to nothing. If it does not matter to you for those that do bait, it should matter greatly to you if they stop hunting.



I would bet money that you would not care of I stopped hunting because of a "law" you wanted to put into place. Lots of people in here have said exactly that. Frankly, it's my belief that MANY of today's hunters, those in their prime, are just too lazy to go out and walk, learn how to find deer, and then take one. I challenge many of today's "TV" style hunters to go out, into an area they have never seen, work your way up to a deer, within say 25 yards, before you take it. No stands, no food plots, no bait, just hunt. I would be willing to bet that a very large percentage could not do that. 

I have NEVER said to ban baiting, I have just stated, and it's a 100% correct statement, that baiting is not needed to take deer.


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## Justin

skipper34 said:


> Even though I detest the use of bait, even more of that detest comes from the fact that the vast majority of those who use bait legally will also use bait illegally.


And you know this how? Just because you don't see the legal bait doesn't mean you haven't walked right past it.


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## Dish7

Hunters Edge said:


> I am happy for you. How long do you think you would legally be able to hunt, if just you or a few people hunted?
> 
> Every time we lose a hunter our sport, not mine, not yours but our sport is at more risk of existing. Kind of like whittling a piece of wood down to nothing. If it does not matter to you for those that do bait, it should matter greatly to you if they stop hunting.


Doom, doom and more doom. Baiting is illegal In 28 states and yet hunting goes on there. Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Delaware, Georgia, Idaho, *Illinois*, *Indiana,* *Iowa,* Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, *Missouri, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska,* New Mexico, New York, *North Dakota*, Rhode Island, *South Dakota,* Tennessee, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia, Wyoming. Some big hitters for whitetails are highlighted. Hunting will continue on, bait or no bait.


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## DecoySlayer

Dish7 said:


> Doom, doom and more doom. Baiting is illegal In 28 states and yet hunting goes on there. Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Delaware, Georgia, Idaho, *Illinois*, *Indiana,* *Iowa,* Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, *Missouri, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska,* New Mexico, New York, *North Dakota*, Rhode Island, *South Dakota,* Tennessee, Vermont, Virginia, West Virginia, Wyoming. Some big hitters for whitetails are highlighted. Hunting will continue on, bait or no bait.


Baiting is illegal in most of PA as well.


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## MossyHorns

Hunters Edge said:


> I am happy for you. How long do you think you would legally be able to hunt, if just you or a few people hunted?
> 
> Every time we lose a hunter our sport, not mine, not yours but our sport is at more risk of existing. Kind of like whittling a piece of wood down to nothing. If it does not matter to you for those that do bait, it should matter greatly to you if they stop hunting.


Threatening to stop deer hunting, because you can't learn to hunt without bait is quite comical. It's time for you to learn to deal with it or hang up your boots, because the ban is here to stay. None of the guys i know who hunt are having a problem with the ban. It seems to be a few people on this forum that have the problem.


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## Justin

MossyHorns said:


> Threatening to stop deer hunting, because you can't learn to hunt without bait is quite comical. It's time for you to learn to deal with it or hang up your boots, because the ban is here to stay. None of the guys i know who hunt are having a problem with the ban. It seems to be a few people on this forum that have the problem.


I haven't baited in years so it won't affect my hunting but if you think it's just a few posters here, you haven't been checking out social media.


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## DecoySlayer

All the remarks, on all the social media in the world cannot change the fact that bait is not needed to take deer.


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## Justin

DecoySlayer said:


> All the remarks, on all the social media in the world cannot change the fact that bait is not needed to take deer.


This is true. But neither is a firearm, crossbow or a tree stand.


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## Dish7

Justin said:


> I haven't baited in years so it won't affect my hunting but if you think it's just a few posters here, you haven't been checking out social media.


How many hunters do think there are in those 28 states where baiting is not allowed?


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## DecoySlayer

Justin said:


> This is true. But neither is a firearm, crossbow or a tree stand.


Never said other wise.


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