# outside wood boiler



## bigbuck (Mar 17, 2001)

I currently have a propane boiler in my home and I am looking into an outside wood boiler and have a few question.
1. What brands are preferred
2. How much wood do you burn in a year? I know this will vary with house.
3. How oftewn do you have to load it.
4. Any maintenance issues to be concerned with?
5. What price range are we talking about.


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## snaggs (Jul 20, 2005)

I don't have one however a friend who lives up near Freesoil Michigan has had one for 4 years and is in love with the thing. His is equipped for hot water baseboard heating. He can store enough wood in the unit to keep it burning for 24 hours in real cold conditions. In moderate conditions he says he can go about 40 hours. Don't know the brand,cost etc. (sorry). He has unlimited access to wood on his property so his only costs are electricity and some maintenance.


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

1. I have a central boiler and love it.
2. I burn 6 fed cords of hardwood.
3. I put wood in morning and evening. I can fill it and get 5 30 degree days or 3 cold days.
4. Keep ash to a minimum to reduce rust and putting.
5. My understanding is a new full set up is 8-10 k.


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## bigbuck (Mar 17, 2001)

Is a fed cord a full cord or a face cord?


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

A fed cord is 4x4x8, under most circumstances 3 face cords


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## N M Mechanical (Feb 7, 2008)

I would second the central boiler the customers that I have like them and have not heard of any complaints


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## sinful (Apr 9, 2008)

Im also considering an outdoor woodburner as i have propane(2.29 per gallon) also.but i have forced air heat and its all brand new, duct work and all would forced air be a little cheaper?


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

sinful said:


> Im also considering an outdoor woodburner as i have propane(2.29 per gallon) also.but i have forced air heat and its all brand new, duct work and all would forced air be a little cheaper?


 
I have a forced air system. Beyond the furnace cost you can figure
$10 a foot underground piping plus trenching.
$2 per foot interior pex without installation
$450 for a water to air exchanger plus the cost of installing in furnace plenum.
$600 for a quality pump, and other accessories (chemicals fittings)
Any related electrical work (110a to pump and unit)

As far as propane, my estimated propane bill would be $2800, I now spend $600. I do spend about $600 on logs each year. So my payoff was 4-5 years, and I keep my home at 72.


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## sinful (Apr 9, 2008)

Chromedoggy said:


> I have a forced air system. Beyond the furnace cost you can figure
> $10 a foot underground piping plus trenching.
> $2 per foot interior pex without installation
> $450 for a water to air exchanger plus the cost of installing in furnace plenum.
> ...


so its a boiler system no matter what,I wasnt sure.What brand do you have?Did you have it installed?


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

sinful said:


> so its a boiler system no matter what,I wasnt sure.What brand do you have?Did you have it installed?


 
I have a Central Boiler and did most of the installation. The unit sat for 2 years while I worked in it (thats a fast project for me!) so I had an installer over when I fired it up.
He told me a general install not including trenching for pex or electric, without plenum reconfig, and without parts averaged $1400. I am sure this varies greatly.


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## Tracker83 (Jun 21, 2005)

The wood boiler question arises about once per year. The below two links of past discussions contain some useful information for the curious:

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=170936
http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=220862


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## jeb (Nov 15, 2005)

Cost for the hole thing was 3500 4 years ago and I put it in my self. I cut my owne wood with help from my son. Propane used from the time I put in is 10 to 15%. I can keep the house at 70 most of the time with out using the blower, if the wind is down. We uses the blower 4 to 5 time in a 24 hour time and onlly have to fill the burner three times. 
My brother inlaw put one in and feeds it 5 to 6 times a day and his house is 80 to 90 most of the time. His is hooked up to a pole barn, the house, hottub and the grage plus he heats his water.


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## Taxidermist (Jan 3, 2002)

Go to www.hearth.com then go to boiler room and read about OWB they are wood eaters and smoke dragons. Check out EKO boilers or Tarm boilers I have a eko with water storage and love it.

Rob


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## Tracker83 (Jun 21, 2005)

Taxidermist said:


> Go to www.hearth.com then go to boiler room and read about OWB they are wood eaters and smoke dragons. Check out EKO boilers or Tarm boilers I have a eko with water storage and love it.
> 
> Rob


OR, simply talk to the large number of OWB owners on this very forum. I can promise you that OWBs are nowhere near as bad as many internet reports make them out to be.

To counter your link, go to http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=82985 and read about OWBs. Many, many happy owners on that site also.


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## tmanmi (Sep 20, 2005)

Just finished with my Central Boiler install 3 weeks ago, wish I would have put it in sooner. I am heating a 2300 sqft 2 story with an additional 480 of finished basement. I went with the 6048 model which is right in the middle with 2 small and 2 larger than it. Dealer said I could probably gotten by with the next small ($1500 less) but I eventually want to heat my 32x40 pole barn and possible my 28x28 attached garage so I went bigger. I only have been filling it once a day and not stuffing it clear full. I might be able to get 2 days out of a fill if I did when it's not too cold, > 15deg. We keep the house at 66 when we are gone and put it up to 70 when we are there. Had the hot water heater plumbed also and the water is very hot even with a mixing value installed at the heater. Four of us are able to shower and not run out of hot water.

I did very little of the install my self other that running a new circuit from my box and actually laying the outdoor pipe. For everything I have $14,600 invested. That includes: 165' outdoor pipe @ $11 a foot, 165' of trench dug, 16'x20' area leveled, 8'x10'x6" concrete pad, 20yd's 22a gravel, all indoor pex and installation, heat exchanger for furnace, hot water heater heat exchanger, and furnace. I thought they were a little high on the install but they are close by and have a good reputation and even worked after hours to get things done. I figure I must burn around a face cord a week. Payback will be about 5 years and the current price of propane. I have plenty of wood to cut and it gets the kids off of the couch and out of the house. My wife even runs the controls on the splitter and supervises the kids while I am cutting.

Smoke really isn't much of an issue. It came with 2 4' sections of pipe so the top of the stack is at about 12-13' and gets the smoke up in the air.


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## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

tmanmi said:


> Just finished with my Central Boiler install 3 weeks ago, wish I would have put it in sooner. I am heating a 2300 sqft 2 story with an additional 480 of finished basement. I went with the 6048 model which is right in the middle with 2 small and 2 larger than it. Dealer said I could probably gotten by with the next small ($1500 less) but I eventually want to heat my 32x40 pole barn and possible my 28x28 attached garage so I went bigger. I only have been filling it once a day and not stuffing it clear full. I might be able to get 2 days out of a fill if I did when it's not too cold, > 15deg. We keep the house at 66 when we are gone and put it up to 70 when we are there. Had the hot water heater plumbed also and the water is very hot even with a mixing value installed at the heater. Four of us are able to shower and not run out of hot water.
> 
> I did very little of the install my self other that running a new circuit from my box and actually laying the outdoor pipe. For everything I have $14,600 invested. That includes: 165' outdoor pipe @ $11 a foot, 165' of trench dug, 16'x20' area leveled, 8'x10'x6" concrete pad, 20yd's 22a gravel, all indoor pex and installation, heat exchanger for furnace, hot water heater heat exchanger, and furnace. I thought they were a little high on the install but they are close by and have a good reputation and even worked after hours to get things done. I figure I must burn around a face cord a week. Payback will be about 5 years and the current price of propane. I have plenty of wood to cut and it gets the kids off of the couch and out of the house. My wife even runs the controls on the splitter and supervises the kids while I am cutting.
> 
> Smoke really isn't much of an issue. It came with 2 4' sections of pipe so the top of the stack is at about 12-13' and gets the smoke up in the air.


Very interesting, good post.....That's a lot of wood per week, I had no idea it took that much. I've tossed up buying one of these or just a wood stove with the outside air kit and blower for my 1800 s.q. foot place up north.


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## Splitshot (Nov 30, 2000)

Remember if you have an outside boiler no matter what fuel the boiler itself creates a lot of heat. If the boiler is inside that heat is used if it is outside, the heat is wasted unless you use the heat for some other purpose.

The more energy efficient your house is the less fuel you will use. For example 28 years ago I designed all the energy features in my old sub-division about 70 houses. Year before last my heat bill for the entire year was about $234.00. I used natural gas, but had I used wood I suspect it would have used perhaps a cord depending on the efficiency of the wood furnace.

As long as the heat exchanger is intact, there is no danger with any heating appliance. A CO detector is your insurance.


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## Scout 2 (Dec 31, 2004)

I have a Woodmaster 4400. I heat a 2000 sq ft house and a 30 x 40 pole barn. The house temp is set at 75 and pole barn is set a 50. I use between 6 and 8 cords of wood a year depending how warm I keep the pole barn. I also heat our water and we never run out. One post above stated that the heat created outside is wasted heat, I disagree as there is no heat wasted. I have appox 24 inches of snow on the ground and my water temp is set at 170 and there is 15 inches of snow on the roof of the furnace. When I put it in 3 years ago the cost was around 9000.00 dollars. In this period I have used appox 50 gals of propane and the polit is shut off on the water heater.


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## tmanmi (Sep 20, 2005)

A face cord is not really that much wood. From what scout 2 said burning 6-8 cords (18-24 face cords) a year, the major part of which is going to get burned from Nov thru March with I would say half as much would be burned in Oct and April with minimal in Sep and May. Right now I'm on par with his usage and I don't intend to run the boiler just to heat my hot water for the warm months May-Sep.

Just for comparison, 1 face cord of quality hardwood = 7,000,000 btu's. 1gal of propane = 95,475 btu's. So 1 face cord equals around 73 gals of propane.

I use on an average of 1500 gals of lp a year which equals out to around 20 face cords of wood. I estimate that I will use I will use around 24 face cords this year and don't plan on buying any wood. Even if I did I have to buy wood I have a neighbor that sells it for $45 a face cord.

Propane: 1500gals @ $2.19 = $3285
Wood: 48face cords @ $45 = $1080
Savings: $2205

With your savings the first year you could by a decent splitter, saw and pay for gas for them.

I would say that most of the heat loss on an outdoor furnace goes up the chimney as they are quite well insulated these days.


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## Taxidermist (Jan 3, 2002)

Tracker83 said:


> OR, simply talk to the large number of OWB owners on this very forum. I can promise you that OWBs are nowhere near as bad as many internet reports make them out to be.
> 
> To counter your link, go to http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=82985 and read about OWBs. Many, many happy owners on that site also.


I never said they are bad but they like wood and do smoke a ton I know I watch the one next to me smoke all day. You have to live in the country as to not piss off the neighbores. I think OWB are great to set em and forget em but you have to have allot of wood. I am heating 2400sqft home and a 40x64 barn with 5 full cords of wood where the OWB would be like 12full cords.


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## Scout 2 (Dec 31, 2004)

If your wood is seasoned they don't smoke very much. If they have been sitting for a while then on start up they will smoke for maybe 5 min. A lot of people are burning green wood and this is where a lot of problems develop. I agree that if you have houses close by or are in town you should not have one. The nearest house to me is about a mile away. This year I am burning alot of popular, maple and ash so I expect to burn a little more wood that I did before. I have 40 acres of woods to cut from whereI had alot of storm damge a couple of years ago that is why I am burning popular. If it works out when the temps drop below zero I may burn a lot more in the future.


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## Firecracker (Aug 19, 2005)

lol Get a Corn boiler 

btw make sure you can even have a Wood boiler, some county's now do NOT allow them anymore due too people having problems breathing.


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## Tracker83 (Jun 21, 2005)

Scout 2 said:


> If your wood is seasoned they don't smoke very much. If they have been sitting for a while then on start up they will smoke for maybe 5 min. A lot of people are burning green wood and this is where a lot of problems develop. I agree that if you have houses close by or are in town you should not have one. The nearest house to me is about a mile away. This year I am burning alot of popular, maple and ash so I expect to burn a little more wood that I did before. I have 40 acres of woods to cut from whereI had alot of storm damge a couple of years ago that is why I am burning popular. If it works out when the temps drop below zero I may burn a lot more in the future.


Scout 2 nails it. The problem isn't as much with the actual OWBs, but it has more to do with how the manufacturers market them. Almost all of them are being marketed as being able to burn green wood, trash wood, wet wood, etc. Yes they _can_ burn that kind of wood, but that is was causes them to smoke badly. Several guys I know that have OWBs don't even start cutting wood for the year until about September/October. Yikes. I cut my wood a year in advance, let it season all summer, then cover the wood with tarps in October. As a result I have very few smoke issues. It's all about how they're used...


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## 22 Chuck (Feb 2, 2006)

48 x 45=1080?? New math.


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## Taxidermist (Jan 3, 2002)

Tracker83 said:


> Scout 2 nails it. The problem isn't as much with the actual OWBs, but it has more to do with how the manufacturers market them. Almost all of them are being marketed as being able to burn green wood, trash wood, wet wood, etc. Yes they _can_ burn that kind of wood, but that is was causes them to smoke badly. Several guys I know that have OWBs don't even start cutting wood for the year until about September/October. Yikes. I cut my wood a year in advance, let it season all summer, then cover the wood with tarps in October. As a result I have very few smoke issues. It's all about how they're used...



Yep you got it Dry wood is a hot fire and little smoke, Look at the piles uncovered next to the OWB covered in snow and wood color white as can be= GREEN WOOD it takes allot of BTU to boil off 1 pound of water so that is why they burn way more wood then they should. They will burn any wood you throw at it but remember not all wood holds the BTU value that good hard wood holds.


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## Tracker83 (Jun 21, 2005)

Firecracker said:


> lol Get a Corn boiler


I hope the LOL means that you're kidding. When corn gets up to $7.50/bushel then it's cheaper to heat with propane.


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## tmanmi (Sep 20, 2005)

CL-Lewiston said:


> 48 x 45=1080?? New math.


That would be 24 x 45=1080


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## tmanmi (Sep 20, 2005)

Central boiler supposedly has an "epa compliant" owb that may open up their use in more populated areas. http://www.centralboiler.com/e-classic.html

If an owb is smoking excessively all day, it's got something wrong with it. Most have a temperature controlled draft of some sort and should only smoke when they need to increase water temperature. I would rather cut more wood than haul wood into my house and ashes out or pay higher home owners insurance or lose my house to a chimney fire.


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## lcounty (Feb 14, 2006)

We have a Heatmore wood burner. We have owned it for approx 5 years. My family loves it. We heat approx 3600 sf home, domestic water, half of a 40 x 60 pole barn and keep 12,000 gallons of water between 85 and 90 degrees 24/7 (indoor pool). We use approx 1 1/2 face cord of wood every two weeks. I cut all my wood to approx 16" even though my burner will hold 54" pieces. My daughters can then help fill the burner. We fill twice a day. We only put one stack of 16" pieces three quarters of the way to the top. I auger out the ashes once a week. The unit smokes for about 5 minutes after filling or until the water heats up in the unit to 180 degrees after which the blowers turn off and the flame is smothered. When the water reaches 160 degrees the blowers turn back on and the process starts over, smokes approx 2 minutes this time.


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## lcounty (Feb 14, 2006)

Last winter my highest natural gas bill was $16.50. Theres a $15.00 charge a month to have the meter at the house.


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## korykoch (Nov 7, 2008)

I had done a bit of research on wood boilers and have been pretty disappointed at the efficiencies found with the commercial models. As it seems, most have to have some custom upgrades to get a higher efficiency out of them (lining the fire box with bricks, building baffles in the exhaust, etc). 

That being said, there are manufacturers out there that are working on designs to increase their efficiencies.

I would highly suggest investing in a stainless steel boiler if you are going to spend the money.

Do your research!

Best,


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## Taxidermist (Jan 3, 2002)

tmanmi said:


> Central boiler supposedly has an "epa compliant" owb that may open up their use in more populated areas. http://www.centralboiler.com/e-classic.html
> 
> If an owb is smoking excessively all day, it's got something wrong with it. Most have a temperature controlled draft of some sort and should only smoke when they need to increase water temperature. I would rather cut more wood than haul wood into my house and ashes out or pay higher home owners insurance or lose my house to a chimney fire.


Yes these are a type of gassification(sp?) unit and are forsale for the first time this year. The unit I have is a EKO 60 with a barn install 1000gal storage in basement and no issue with chminey fires as they only get around 300 deg I pay 75.00 extra a year for insurance on a solid fuel boiler.

Rob


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