# Snowmobile trail through hunting property



## Swampdog467 (Jul 6, 2017)

Bucman said:


> People do it in 50,000 dollar cars whats the difference!


$38000 so they're even more stupid


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## Trap Star (Jan 15, 2015)

MossyHorns said:


> So you don't like snowmobilers supporting those bars in the winter? :coco: Those bars and restaurants rely on snowmobilers to make it through the year or they would permanently close. I spend a lot of money each winter feeding my family at those bars and restaurants like every other snowmobiler. Most guys are in there warming up and chatting with their group. Some have a couple of beers, but definitely not in there to get drunk. I see way more guys getting plastered in those bars during firearm season than any other time of the year.


You cant be too far from Big T's in Lawton. Great food and for awhile they had the most beers on tap in the state. Little off subject but great place.


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## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

CHASINEYES said:


> It's been a few years since I have been up north riding but it used to be an almost every weekend activity. IIRC, trails have time limits during an ongoing deer season through the month of December. I thought trails were only open between like 10am - 2pm. Maybe I,m wrong or remember incorrectly.


The 10am - 2pm sounds like the rule during the firearm season, during this time trails are officially closed but if there is snow you can ride trails on public land or roads but only between those hours, maybe also after dark but it been a while since we even had snow in my area for riding in November.


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## CHASINEYES (Jun 3, 2007)

jjlrrw said:


> The 10am - 2pm sounds like the rule during the firearm season, during this time trails are officially closed but if there is snow you can ride trails on public land or roads but only between those hours, maybe also after dark but it been a while since we even had snow in my area for riding in November.


This sounds right.. I thought the closure also covered muzzy season. Any deer firearms season.


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## Jimbo 09 (Jan 28, 2013)

As an avid snowmobile and hunter that would be a tough call. There are ubfortuanatly the "slobs" of every sport that ruin it for the rest of us. It would depend on the situation for me. Anywhere near a house or through the middle of a property I wouldn't do. If it was along a property edge or ditch then I wouldn't have a problem.


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## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

DecoySlayer said:


> I don't doubt that most who ride are respectful. I would not deny access because of fear of what a tiny minority would do.
> 
> I would only deny it because of the loss of my privacy and the noise. I have yet to hear a sled that was silent. There is already far too much noise without adding more.
> 
> Now, having said that, IF I had a zillion acres, give or take a couple, I would allow a trail just off the road, as long as I could never see or hear those who used it.


I've seen all I need to see just from the few arrogant snowmobiling advocates that have posted in this thread that reaffirms my opinion, snowmobiles would have to drive over my dead body to get on my property.

I may not know much about a snowmobile, but I sure as hell know too much about human nature and the few spoil it for the many, so stay off.


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## Hillsdales Most Wanted (Jul 17, 2015)

Trap Star said:


> Anyone else have the association begging to come through your private land? Does anyone have a trail come through your property?


were u offered a lease? if so is there writing on liability incase of injury/death? heck, give me the name of the association and phone number. ill find out who is responsible


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Trap Star said:


> You cant be too far from Big T's in Lawton. Great food and for awhile they had the most beers on tap in the state. Little off subject but great place.


I have been there for lunch a few times while working near Lawton. I live near of Sister Lakes.


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Jimbos said:


> I've seen all I need to see just from the few arrogant snowmobiling advocates that have posted in this thread that reaffirms my opinion, snowmobiles would have to drive over my dead body to get on my property.
> 
> I may not know much about a snowmobile, but I sure as hell know too much about human nature and the few spoil it for the many, so stay off.


You sir are one arrogant anti-snowmobiler! You don't know the 1st thing about me or many of us on here. I have always been respectful, don't have a loud exhaust, and have never ridden drunk.

Here is something to chew on. Its legal for a snowmobile to ride in ROW in most counties in Northern Michigan. That is why you are seeing more trails going along the road through someones front yard. That's what happens when sections of trail get closed and they have to find a way around.


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## Rasputin (Jan 13, 2009)

Seems ironic that the snowmobile clubs would come asking hat in hand to use someone's property when the local club tried to close one of the roads on the federal land that has been in use year around for decades. They put up a gate and locked it, to only be opened and used for them. Somehow some parts came up missing and the gate can't close anymore, but that did seem hypocritical to me.


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

MossyHorns said:


> You sir are one arrogant anti-snowmobiler! You don't know the 1st thing about me or many of us on here. I have always been respectful, don't have a loud exhaust, and have never ridden drunk.
> 
> Here is something to chew on. Its legal for a snowmobile to ride in ROW in most counties in Northern Michigan. That is why you are seeing more trails going along the road through someones front yard. That's what happens when sections of trail get closed and they have to find a way around.


We have trails all over the place around here. And they still blast down my road, way beyond the speed limit. 

Maybe their more respectful in the SLP, but don't try to sugar coat what they do up north.


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

Rasputin said:


> Seems ironic that the snowmobile clubs would come asking hat in hand to use someone's property when the local club tried to close one of the roads on the federal land that has been in use year around for decades. They put up a gate and locked it, to only be opened and used for them. Somehow some parts came up missing and the gate can't close anymore, but that did seem hypocritical to me.


Yup, lots of those in the NLP


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## Rasputin (Jan 13, 2009)

swampbuck said:


> Yup, lots of those in the NLP


Really? What is the logic behind that? Does it indicate that snowmobilers think they are superior to the other users of the resource?


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Rasputin said:


> Seems ironic that the snowmobile clubs would come asking hat in hand to use someone's property when the local club tried to close one of the roads on the federal land that has been in use year around for decades. They put up a gate and locked it, to only be opened and used for them. Somehow some parts came up missing and the gate can't close anymore, but that did seem hypocritical to me.


There has to be more to the story. I can see the Fed's close it down like they closed the trail through Bear Swamp in Lake County.

I was reading through the Lake County Road Commission meeting minutes and read that they are closing 2 roads this winter (southern portion of Dexter Rd and all of Stems Rd), because a woman asked them to during the meeting. She wanted it closed for dog sledding. She claimed that the road was not open to traffic in the winter anyway, because it's a seasonal road. It may be seasonal, but it's still open to vehicular traffic. Dexter Rd is shown on the Lake County Ordinance map as a road open to ORV's year round. This will affect snowmobilers, ORV's, and hunters in that area.


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Rasputin said:


> Really? What is the logic behind that? Does it indicate that snowmobilers think they are superior to the other users of the resource?


Those gates are put up by the DNR and Feds. They open and close those roads based on environmental conditions. Has nothing to do with the snowmobile clubs.


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## bearnugent (Nov 7, 2012)

For what its worth, I have come upon deer across the snowmobile trail, or in an adjacent field many times, day and night. Often times herds. As a hunter and snowmobiler, the deer seem to adapt to the noise of riders pretty quickly. If your property is suitable, and large enough for a trial, I don't think you'll lose any deer off your land from the use of snowmobiles.


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## bearnugent (Nov 7, 2012)

Jimbos said:


> I've seen all I need to see just from the few arrogant snowmobiling advocates that have posted in this thread that reaffirms my opinion, snowmobiles would have to drive over my dead body to get on my property.
> 
> I may not know much about a snowmobile, but I sure as hell know too much about human nature and the few spoil it for the many, so stay off.


Fair enough. That's a very strong opinion, but it's your right to voice it. You must have previously had a bad experience with snowmobiling, or know someone that rides and you don't particularly care for them. The state is full of folks that are apposed to snowmobiling, and hunting. Not all snowmobilers are bad, nor are most hunters. It's a shame when a very few ruin it for the majority who enjoy the sport.


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

swampbuck said:


> We have trails all over the place around here. And they still blast down my road, way beyond the speed limit.
> 
> Maybe their more respectful in the SLP, but don't try to sugar coat what they do up north.


As I stated earlier, I don't ride the SLP. I only ride up north and have a firm grip on what happens up there. Speeding and riding on the wrong side of the trail seems to be the biggest problem. I just don't see guys drinking and hitting the trails like I used to. Perfectly legal to ride the posted speed limit on a snowmobile, but ORV's must stay under 25 mph.


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## Sasquatch Lives (May 23, 2011)

I would highly discourage you. The same guys will probably be back in the summer with their atv's tearing up your property. Unfortunately my experience with snowmobilers is they are a give an inch, take a mile crowd. Not all of course, but enough to be problematic.


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## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

MossyHorns said:


> There has to be more to the story. I can see the Fed's close it down like they closed the trail through Bear Swamp in Lake County.
> 
> *I was reading through the Lake County Road Commission meeting minutes and read that they are closing 2 roads this winter (southern portion of Dexter Rd and all of Stems Rd),* because a woman asked them to during the meeting. She wanted it closed for dog sledding. She claimed that the road was not open to traffic in the winter anyway, because it's a seasonal road. It may be seasonal, but it's still open to vehicular traffic. Dexter Rd is shown on the Lake County Ordinance map as a road open to ORV's year round. This will affect snowmobilers, ORV's, and hunters in that area.


Do you know if these roads are posted as closed? If not where would one find this law, I don't think we are required to read all county and township meeting minutes.


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

jjlrrw said:


> Do you know if these roads are posted as closed? If not where would one find this law, I don't think we are required to read all county and township meeting minutes.


I don't know if they sent out a notice or not. I just stumbled upon it looking to see if the bridge on our road was getting replaced. I am guessing they are going to put up barricades and that is how people are going to find out. I use Dexter Rd to get from Irons to the Big Star Lake area without going into Baldwin. A lot of guys use that road in the winter.


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## Rasputin (Jan 13, 2009)

MossyHorns said:


> Those gates are put up by the DNR and Feds. They open and close those roads based on environmental conditions. Has nothing to do with the snowmobile clubs.


The gov't does a professional job with gates. This one was amateurish and they overtly took credit for it. Open in the winter, closed the rest of the year. Actually created a fire hazard, as it was important for access. 

Anyway, I get enough snowmobile traffic on my property without being part of the trail system, so there.


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## vsmorgantown (Jan 16, 2012)

Here's a reason you may not want them on your property. Remember there's hundreds of Larry's out there who just want to......"Send It."


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Rasputin said:


> Anyway, I get enough snowmobile traffic on my property without being part of the trail system, so there.


Let me just say that I don't support trespassing and nobody should have to deal with that. The DNR will write tickets to those people who ride outside of the trail when it's on private land. The problem is that we don't have enough enforcement.


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

vsmorgantown said:


> Here's a reason you may not want them on your property. Remember there's hundreds of Larry's out there who just want to......"Send It."


My son just showed me that video a couple of days ago. He's a Canadian that's trying to earn a Darwin award or be on Faces of Death.


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## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

bearnugent said:


> Fair enough. That's a very strong opinion, but it's your right to voice it. You must have previously had a bad experience with snowmobiling, or know someone that rides and you don't particularly care for them. The state is full of folks that are apposed to snowmobiling, and hunting. Not all snowmobilers are bad, nor are most hunters. It's a shame when a very few ruin it for the majority who enjoy the sport.


Very true, I'm 100% positive that not all snowmobilers are bad people, but not all people are good people and if you give an inch, just read the trespassing threads, SOME will take a mile, so why even open up an unneeded can of worms.
So say you do open up your property, you now have given permission where others think "oh hey, that dude doesn't care if we go through there", and you're now fighting Billie Bob and Homer "just passing through".


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## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

MossyHorns said:


> You sir are one arrogant anti-snowmobiler! You don't know the 1st thing about me or many of us on here. I have always been respectful, don't have a loud exhaust, and have never ridden drunk.
> 
> Here is something to chew on. Its legal for a snowmobile to ride in ROW in most counties in Northern Michigan. That is why you are seeing more trails going along the road through someones front yard. That's what happens when sections of trail get closed and they have to find a way around.


Dude, are you breathing air? Stay off my property without face to face permission.

What don't you get? It's not just the snowmobilers.


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## jr28schalm (Mar 16, 2006)

I wish the feds would close all there roads to foot traffic only, more primitive


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## jr28schalm (Mar 16, 2006)

Jimbos said:


> Dude, are you breathing air? Stay off my property without face to face permission.
> 
> What don't you get? It's not just the snowmobilers.


Come on man, I lost my dog and I'm useing my snowmobile to search for him..lol


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## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

jr28schalm said:


> Come on man, I lost my dog and I'm useing my snowmobile to search for him..lol


For sure that's all I'm saying, and the expectant attitude I'm seeing here by a few reaffirms it...


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Jimbos said:


> Dude, are you breathing air? Stay off my property without face to face permission.
> 
> What don't you get? It's not just the snowmobilers.


1st off I don't trespass and I was stating a fact that I can legally ride through your ROW without your permission if you happen to have a place up north. I generally ride on the shoulder of the road and stay out of the ditch (too old for that).


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## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

MossyHorns said:


> 1st off I don't trespass and I was stating a fact that I can legally ride through your ROW without your permission if you happen to have a place up north. I generally ride on the shoulder of the road and stay out of the ditch (too old for that).


Good Luck.....


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

jr28schalm said:


> I wish the feds would close all there roads to foot traffic only, more primitive


The Feds and DNR allow cross country travel through the woods, so closing the roads would do very little.


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## MossyHorns (Apr 14, 2011)

Jimbos said:


> Good Luck.....


Don't need luck when it's legal. You may need a lawyer though. :tsk:


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## Rasputin (Jan 13, 2009)

Here's a thought. Each track of a snowmobile is made unique, like a fingerprint, so all you have to do is take a pic of the track that is left by a trespasser and send it to authorities, they look it up and send the ticket. Cause that's all I ever see is the tracks.


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## hawgeye (Mar 3, 2011)

vsmorgantown said:


> Here's a reason you may not want them on your property. Remember there's hundreds of Larry's out there who just want to......"Send It."


Now that guy could ride at my place anytime, he's gonna send it!


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## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

Trap Star said:


> Anyone else have the association begging to come through your private land? Does anyone have a trail come through your property?


If they asked me I would need to consider a few things, is it property I live at, where is it located. For the most part the season in Michigan is 2 months long January and February, longer in the UP shorter in the SLP. How much is the lease, how would it help with paying taxes or bills. If it was my residents I could have my kids run a Bomb fire on the weekends, sell hot dogs, chili, hot chocolate they could learn all about making money. As with anything in life lots of pros and cons.


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## BucksandDucks (May 25, 2010)

jjlrrw said:


> If they asked me I would need to consider a few things, is it property I live at, where is it located. For the most part the season in Michigan is 2 months long January and February, longer in the UP shorter in the SLP. How much is the lease, how would it help with paying taxes or bills. If it was my residents I could have my kids run a Bomb fire on the weekends, sell hot dogs, chili, hot chocolate they could learn all about making money. As with anything in life lots of pros and cons.


Don't think I'd want to be roasting hot dogs over a BOMB fire


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## BucksandDucks (May 25, 2010)

Like many people in southern Michigan I've had bad experiences with snowmobiles especially when there's a good amount of snow in December. If they can get to it then they will ride there. No Trespassing signs mean nothing to them. They know what they're doing too because as soon as you try to confront them they are out of there. There's no way you are going to catch them unless you are on a snowmobile also. 
I know that this doesn't apply to everyone who snowmobiles but it has happened enough to sour me on them. 
The few that I have actually been able to confront always say WELL WHERE AM I SUPPOSED TO RIDE THEN.


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## Jimbo 09 (Jan 28, 2013)

bearnugent said:


> For what its worth, I have come upon deer across the snowmobile trail, or in an adjacent field many times, day and night. Often times herds. As a hunter and snowmobiler, the deer seem to adapt to the noise of riders pretty quickly. If your property is suitable, and large enough for a trial, I don't think you'll lose any deer off your land from the use of snowmobiles.


This is true. Deer love hanging by the trails up north. They use them to walk down at night. have even seen herds of elk using the trails for easier walking.


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## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

$48 for trail permit this year.


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## Pat Larsen (Jul 26, 2011)

Trap Star said:


> Anyone else have the association begging to come through your private land? Does anyone have a trail come through your property?


Personal experiece... A neighbor asked permission to cross my hunting property with his ORV. I said sure, why not. Fast fwd 6 months... A pissed off Stranger comes knocking on my door and starts hollering about a bunch of us cutting a trail on state land next to his property. I don't have a clue what he's talking about. Find out it was my neighbor and 7 other friends with ORVs opening up an trail that was closed off 30+ years ago. Told the neighbor that I didn't give all his friends permission to cross my land. He gets a bit snotty and says he gave them permission. Now I'm the A hole cause none of them have permission anymore. Just be careful what you agree to. It may come back to haunt you.


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## CHASINEYES (Jun 3, 2007)

wildthing said:


> 500 Miles from morning to sundown? Whoaahh! Good thing you got rid of that old sled Chasineyes - it sounds like something was wrong with the odometer...


Probably a whole lotta slippage and the factory cheatometers . I have never recorded mileage any other way than the sleds odometer. Remember, there's a lot of twist and turns on trails, a straight line is much shorter. A typical big day of riding the yoop would have been starting in Gould City, up to Munising, east over Through Pine Stump. Of course we hit a few places for fuel and eats along the way, Grand Marais has an excellent place for White Fish. From Pine Stump we moved east to the Falls, down through Paradise, down through Stongs. Sometimes from there we would hit Rudyard or just shoot to Hulbert for some deer watching at Shirleys Happy hour. But either way the older fella's in the bunch didn't care much for riding past dark so we made our way back to Base. Us younger guys would sometimes head back out and pound more miles on after dark. Love those railroad grades and wide trails north of M28.

PS. I still have two sleds. Just don't use them much.


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## CHASINEYES (Jun 3, 2007)

graybeard said:


> Trap star
> I have a trail go through my property in the UP,they can open the gates Dec. 1 and close them April 1.They pay for a million dollars liability insurance in case some one gets hurt.Also they send a big $75 check to me each year.
> They dont open my gates until they have enough snow to groom the trails,They were still closed as of Dec.15.





MossyHorns said:


> A *BIG* thanks to you for supporting the snowmobiling community. The UP relies on that income to get them through the winter. Hopefully everyone is respecting your land by staying on the trail.


I second MossyHorns. I was always very appreciative of private property owners tying trails together with others to form miles of snowmobile trails.


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## Grizzly Adams (Oct 6, 2003)

I like the sound of sleds going by our house at night - but we're not by the road either. Could pass on the sleds with aftermarket can exhaust tho...

I know I have read there are some trails not open during deer season.? Or can't ride certain hours??


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## Grizzly Adams (Oct 6, 2003)

CHASINEYES said:


> I second MossyHorns. I was always very appreciative of private property owners tying trails together with others to form miles of snowmobile trails.


X3


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## Trunkslammer (May 22, 2013)

X4


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## Jimbo 09 (Jan 28, 2013)

X5


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## anon11252019 (Dec 1, 2005)

CHASINEYES said:


> HOLY SHAT!!! Glad I quit riding. I grew up on sleds. Depending on who went each weekend, we could have as many as 15-20 riders in our group. Smaller groups of 4-8 was faster paced. We normally put 500 miles on from morning to sundown..Several riders participated in small snowcross races and 2 in the Soo-500. Except for a beer at lunch stop, drinking was not allowed. If you wanted to drink, you waited until the evening back at the cabin, bar or hotel. That's not to say a couple young guys never branched out and had a few drinks, but only enough to take the edge off. "Send it!!:evilsmile"
> Seriously though, the drinking culture of yesteryear where alcohol was used during any activity has essentially passed.
> 
> As of late I,ve been looking at sleds with the thought of getting something a little more updated for myself then taking my boys up for a weekend or two. But, like any enjoyable recreational activity, (firearms, fishing, hunting etc..) it appears the prima donna's are restricting and regulating the joy right out of it.. On the bright side, I,ve saved tens of thousands of dollars in food, gas, sleds, parts, lodging and use fees. I'll just send a portion of that to the Japs for a larger entertainment system and game consoles, the rest to my 401.:lol:


I hear Kansas has big bucks. Maybe you can plan a hunting trip with all that cash.


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## NATTY BUMPO (May 12, 2001)

Jimbos said:


> NO WAY, no how would I EVER give permission to let unknown drunken fools on snowmobiles permission to go on my property. PERIOD!
> 
> What may start out innocently enough will turn into a hell situation very quickly. You do not need that hassle.


1000+

We own 100+ acres of recreational/hunting property in Mason County. Surrounded by all private land and farm land. No SMB trails within miles. The worst problems we have down there are from the snowmachine AZZ****** and their ATV buddies. Absolutely the worst trespassers/vandals known to man. Scum of the earth.......

Over my dead body..........


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## feedinggrounds (Jul 21, 2009)

MossyHorns said:


> You obviously don't snowmobile, so please keep the uneducated comments to yourself. I have been snowmobiling for 35 years and I can tell you for a fact that the number of guys getting drunk in a bar and then hitting the trail has been very very low in the last 15 years. You have to be pretty stupid to get drunk and then get on a $12,000 machine that goes over 100 mph.


They are in the news every winter.


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## feedinggrounds (Jul 21, 2009)

swampbuck said:


> We have trails all over the place around here. And they still blast down my road, way beyond the speed limit.
> 
> Maybe their more respectful in the SLP, but don't try to sugar coat what they do up north.


After hearing jetskis all summer I like the peace and quiet of winter.


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## feedinggrounds (Jul 21, 2009)

MossyHorns said:


> 1st off I don't trespass and I was stating a fact that I can legally ride through your ROW without your permission if you happen to have a place up north. I generally ride on the shoulder of the road and stay out of the ditch (too old for that).


Perhaps, most ROW up here are 33 ft. from centerline of road. Have at it and know where you are at.


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## NATTY BUMPO (May 12, 2001)

feedinggrounds said:


> They are in the news every winter.


Roger that.

My neighbor in the cabin across the road tells me that as soon as the bar on the highway closes (2 AM?) , the parade of 100 mph snowmobiles comes blasting down our gravel road. And God Forbid if anybody or anything gets in their way.


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## feedinggrounds (Jul 21, 2009)

MossyHorns said:


> Relax! I never said I was going to trespass or do anything illegal. I was just pointing out a fact. Several years ago a property owner had a section of a railroad bed closed that ran through their land, which is their right. Now it runs in the ROW through their front lawn.


Front lawn? how dam close to the road is the house? You got 33 foot on either side of center. State hwy may be wider but think Ogemaw co prohibits use of state hwys.


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## Wild Thing (Mar 19, 2010)

feedinggrounds said:


> Front lawn? how dam close to the road is the house? *You got 33 foot on either side of center. State hwy may be wider but think Ogemaw co prohibits use of state hwys*.


Correct on the county road right of way. Don't quote me on this because I believe it varies from road to road but the ROW on State Trunkline Highways is usually at least 150 feet (from either side of the center line). Snowmobiles can not operate on the road or shoulder of the road on state highways - only on the unplowed portion of the right of way.


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## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

Link to snowmobile regulations.
http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153-10365_14824-32293--,00.html


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## CHASINEYES (Jun 3, 2007)

feedinggrounds said:


> They are in the news every winter.


Vehicle drivers are taken in daily 365 for DUI and causing accidents. Boaters? 

If drinking or dui was a major problem with riders of modern snowmobiles, multiple deaths would be reported daily.


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## CHASINEYES (Jun 3, 2007)

NATTY BUMPO said:


> 1000+
> 
> We own 100+ acres of recreational/hunting property in Mason County. Surrounded by all private land and farm land. No SMB trails within miles. The worst problems we have down there are from the snowmachine AZZ****** and their ATV buddies. Absolutely the worst trespassers/vandals known to man. Scum of the earth.......
> 
> Over my dead body..........


Sounds like a confined problem. Bad seed youth Locals?


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## Grizzly Adams (Oct 6, 2003)

NATTY BUMPO said:


> Roger that.
> 
> My neighbor in the cabin across the road tells me that as soon as the bar on the highway closes (2 AM?) , the parade of 100 mph snowmobiles comes blasting down our gravel road. And God Forbid if anybody or anything gets in their way.


Heidi Hof bar??


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## multibeard (Mar 3, 2002)

These are small trees not big apple trees. No bigger than thumb size and three foot tall when they are planted. Being AG land it does not need to be posted to begin with so any one on it or any ag land with out permission is trespassing from the get go. I forgot to mention that this property is adjacent to the Montague to Hart Rail Trail, it runs the length of the 40 acre cherry planting. After running quite a distance though woods so many are wanting to open there sleds up and clean out the carbon. 
There is a corn field adjacent to the cherry orchard that I am sure will get run to death after there is enough snow to run over there. May be you would not run in a corn field but I am sure that there are a lot that do not know any better.

They just redid that whole trail due a lot to the damage done by snowmobile studs to the black top. Even with the signs at most access spot and cross roads that there needs to be 4 inches of snow on the trail to run on it with snowmobiles which are the only motorized vehicles allowed on it. It still gets run when there is not enough snow.

I will never forget the time I came around the corner to this field to see a couple kids running around in that field that was planted to rye. The kids dad thought it was neat to see his kids plow down the farmers rye crop. I told him he better not get caught by the farmer or he would pay. I would have called the owner and told him but this was before cell phones.


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## Waif (Oct 27, 2013)

multibeard said:


> These are small trees not big apple trees. No bigger than thumb size and three foot tall when they are planted. Being AG land it does not need to be posted to begin with so any one on it or any ag land with out permission is trespassing from the get go. I forgot to mention that this property is adjacent to the Montague to Hart Rail Trail, it runs the length of the 40 acre cherry planting. After running quite a distance though woods so many are wanting to open there sleds up and clean out the carbon.
> There is a corn field adjacent to the cherry orchard that I am sure will get run to death after there is enough snow to run over there. May be you would not run in a corn field but I am sure that there are a lot that do not know any better.
> 
> They just redid that whole trail due a lot to the damage done by snowmobile studs to the black top. Even with the signs at most access spot and cross roads that there needs to be 4 inches of snow on the trail to run on it with snowmobiles which are the only motorized vehicles allowed on it. It still gets run when there is not enough snow.
> ...


That trail does stay ground down. At least near where I cross it.
Snow depth gets blown off fast ,but it is the base getting stripped that hurts it the most.
I'm not advocating what anyone should or should not do ,but studded tracks seem to shred that base. Instead of prolonging it.

Been a while ,but I recall your neighborhood.
The general public has trails going all over. Not so bad on foot. If properties not welcoming pedestrians are respected. 
Fragile soil showed damage though with plenty of sand trails from more than foot traffic.
Long time scars that won't heal anytime soon due to soil make up and lack of loam.


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## pigeonhunter03 (Jul 7, 2016)

They were about 350 yards at the closest if they came any closer then i would have talked to them. they were messin around for only a few minutes. I was parked on the fenceline of the hay field next to the cornfield so maybe they thought I was hunting on the acre of brush on the north end or something. They could have been some kids and didn't know any better but if they do it again I'm going to have some words with em.


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## Grizzly Adams (Oct 6, 2003)

multibeard said:


> These are small trees not big apple trees. No bigger than thumb size and three foot tall when they are planted. Being AG land it does not need to be posted to begin with so any one on it or any ag land with out permission is trespassing from the get go. I forgot to mention that this property is adjacent to the Montague to Hart Rail Trail, it runs the length of the 40 acre cherry planting. After running quite a distance though woods so many are wanting to open there sleds up and clean out the carbon.
> There is a corn field adjacent to the cherry orchard that I am sure will get run to death after there is enough snow to run over there. May be you would not run in a corn field but I am sure that there are a lot that do not know any better.
> 
> They just redid that whole trail due a lot to the damage done by snowmobile studs to the black top. Even with the signs at most access spot and cross roads that there needs to be 4 inches of snow on the trail to run on it with snowmobiles which are the only motorized vehicles allowed on it. It still gets run when there is not enough snow.
> ...


Ahh - didn't know the trees were that small. Probably hard to see then with snow on the ground too. Then people see a spot with fresh powder off the rail trail & head out into it. Corn fields are bumpy & horrible to ride on imo - unless deep snow. 

Muskottawa trail asphalt gets tore up too. They should have some cams set up at a few crossings & have people check online to see if trail is open or closed that day. 

Years ago when younger - a few buds & myself made a track in this farmers field in deep snow (couldn't see farm as we were aways away). We were racing around it at night & was pretty fun. After a bit this truck comes out & towards us. My buds get out of Dodge - I stayed. The farmer started chewing my a$$ for riding on his alfalfa. I apologized & told him we didn't realize it was alfalfa under there & we would stay off. I think he appreciated the fact I didn't take off like the others & wasn't too hostile after that. We stayed out after that also.


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## Waif (Oct 27, 2013)

Drove across trail after two machines crossed in front of me. It is ground down to color by the road.
A foot of snow at least each side of trail. 
With the weather forcast,the bottom will fall out fast.


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## Grizzly Adams (Oct 6, 2003)

pigeonhunter03 said:


> They were about 350 yards at the closest if they came any closer then i would have talked to them. they were messin around for only a few minutes. I was parked on the fenceline of the hay field next to the cornfield so maybe they thought I was hunting on the acre of brush on the north end or something. They could have been some kids and didn't know any better but if they do it again I'm going to have some words with em.


Ah ok ...makes sense.


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## Grizzly Adams (Oct 6, 2003)

Waif said:


> Drove across trail after two machines crossed in front of me. It is ground down to color by the road.
> A foot of snow at least each side of trail.
> With the weather forcast,the bottom will fall out fast.


Crossings go bad because people take off spinning the track after a stop. Rest of trail should be packed down. 

I don't ride RR trails myself ...find it rather boring.


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## multibeard (Mar 3, 2002)

Grizzley
All trees start out small. These trees are now about 5 foot tall and pretty visible. He may take it down and move it to another new planting. He also may plant where the corn was this year to cherries and just tear down one side and use it in part of a new fence build if he plants more cherries where the corn was.

I helped plant asparagus where the corn was many years ago. After it got worn out he killed off the asparagus. He has been cover cropping and planting corn in it for a few years. It can not be planted back to asparagus with out some expensive disinfecting done to the field.

I got into a new Christmas tree plantation by mistake years ago. It was not easy to manually turn my sled 180* around all by my self to go back the way I came.

Waif
Have you noticed the cement crossing on M-46 north of Howard City on that trail. They put it in to keep the studded snowmobile tracks from tearing up the asphalt on M-46. They are doing it all over. At least a lot of that trail is not paved so it does not get beat up by the studs.
With the snow we have now it will not support a snow machine at all. There is no base under it so a machine will sink right through it to dirt or grass. No base to the snow at all. With the weather forecast we have, we will probably lose most of the snow we have.


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## Waif (Oct 27, 2013)

Grizzly Adams said:


> Crossings go bad because people take off spinning the track after a stop. Rest of trail should be packed down.
> 
> I don't ride RR trails myself ...find it rather boring.


It is good folks have it to run.
Would be fine for shake downs and test and tunes too. Before a run elsewhere with creeping doubts.


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## Sasquatch Lives (May 23, 2011)

My buddy has 120 acres in Schoolcraft Co. and has snowmobiling aholes trespass and trash his trails and food plots every year. Tear down or go around gates and signage. They have ruined several muzzleloader hunts by riding through and pissing all over and leaving beer cans not to mention riding all over the foodplots. Screw them.


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## Waif (Oct 27, 2013)

multibeard said:


> Grizzley
> All trees start out small. These trees are now about 5 foot tall and pretty visible. He may take it down and move it to another new planting. He also may plant where the corn was this year to cherries and just tear down one side and use it in part of a new fence build if he plants more cherries where the corn was.
> 
> I helped plant asparagus where the corn was many years ago. After it got worn out he killed off the asparagus. He has been cover cropping and planting corn in it for a few years. It can not be planted back to asparagus with out some expensive disinfecting done to the field.
> ...


Did not notice.
Have seen them farther North and West.


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