# which NRC commissioner voted no?



## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Can someone please post which NRC commissioner voted against having the limited wolf hunt? 

Seems to me we cannot afford having a NRC commissioner who voted in support of HSUS's attempt at blocking effective wolf management in Michigan. And, seeing as that individual VOTED AGAINST SOUND SCIENCE MANAGEMENT OF WOLVES....the individual has violated NRC guidelines (to make decisions based on sound science) before the ink is even dry on the new law.

The governor has the power to remove any NRC commissioner. Maybe we need to consider circulation a petition to the governor.


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## k9wernet (Oct 15, 2007)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> Can someone please post which NRC commissioner voted against having the limited wolf hunt?
> 
> Seems to me we cannot afford having a NRC commissioner who voted in support of HSUS's attempt at blocking effective wolf management in Michigan. And, seeing as that individual VOTED AGAINST SOUND SCIENCE MANAGEMENT OF WOLVES....the individual has violated NRC guidelines (to make decisions based on sound science) before the ink is even dry on the new law.
> 
> The governor has the power to remove any NRC commissioner. Maybe we need to consider circulation a petition to the governor.


I don't think a no vote is a violation of sound scientific management principle per se.

Maybe they disagreed with the length of the season or the price of the permits. Maybe they wanted 86 animals harvested instead of 43.

Point is, there's all kinds of reasons they might have voted no. I think there should be a little more info before launching a letter writing campaign.


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## Liver and Onions (Nov 24, 2000)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> Can someone please post which NRC commissioner voted against having the limited wolf hunt?
> 
> Seems to me we cannot afford having a NRC commissioner who voted in support of HSUS's attempt at blocking effective wolf management in Michigan. And, seeing as that individual VOTED AGAINST SOUND SCIENCE MANAGEMENT OF WOLVES....the individual has violated NRC guidelines (to make decisions based on sound science) before the ink is even dry on the new law.
> 
> The governor has the power to remove any NRC commissioner. Maybe we need to consider circulation a petition to the governor.


So without knowing why they voted against this, you want that person removed ?


L & O


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

I agree a no vote could have several explanations. I think sports men and women have the right to know who voted no and why?? 


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## gilgetter (Feb 28, 2006)

Bearboy said:


> I agree a no vote could have several explanations. I think sports men and women have the right to know who voted no and why??
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


Agree with that, I would like to know.


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## Seaarkshooter (Nov 5, 2009)

The hundred and twenty thousand dollar a year question is, are you smart enough and cunning enough to get a NRC commissioner to truly tell you why they honestly did or did not do something? If you are, you're in the wrong business and I want to put you in a as a representative in the government of my area so we can clean up this mess.

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## Seaarkshooter (Nov 5, 2009)

Last nite, I spent 30 minutes wrestling with a greased pig, Ellen Lipton, district 27 House of Representatives member at the Ferndale Public Library. I was given personal experience of what it's like to try and reason with a Harvard Law School Cum Laud graduate whose only experience with wildlife in the outdoors was with the two or three squirrels she's run over in her life. To prep myself for the next reasoning opportunity with her, I'm going to start off with daily beatings on my head with a three pound hammer, move up to 30 second blasts into my ear drum with an air horn and when I'm think I'm close to being ready, practice sticking needles in my eye while trying to keep a straight face.

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## gilgetter (Feb 28, 2006)

My old man told me, son dont ever mud wrestle a Pig, you cant win, and the pig likes it. 

I would like to hear what the no vote was for, If the answer dont hold water, I think I can figure that out.


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## brushbuster (Nov 9, 2009)

Steinman

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## Seaarkshooter (Nov 5, 2009)

gilgetter said:


> My old man told me, son dont ever mud wrestle a Pig, you cant win, and the pig likes it.
> 
> I would like to hear what the no vote was for, If the answer dont hold water, I think I can figure that out.


 Believe me, Gil, I wasn't there for the practice. Making public statements in front of someone like that to show that they are unreasonable and out of touch is the important part. I'm pretty sure I didn't make her Christmas card list this year. In the end, I was there for the two people that walked up to me to ask me about trapping and how they can get their kids interested.

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## gilgetter (Feb 28, 2006)

I would agree with that. and thank you for taking the time to do that. Another thing my old man told me, was never play another mans game. get them in your comfort zone, Mite be your rep would like to eat some beaver at evart? dont hurt to ask.


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## Black Powder Trapper (Feb 15, 2008)

I was at the NRC meeting and spoke in favor of the hunt and Commissioner Stienman was the no vote. When I talked to all the Commissioners after the meeting she told me that she was not sure how she was going to vote until the very end. She said that she does not appose the hunt but does not agree with the tactic that was used.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Thanks to all who responded to my post about the no vote...

I agree with you all on knowing why the no vote, and not doing anything in haste. Although, I am suggesting, if the commissioner is acting in support of HSUS there should be accountability.

Black Powder Trapper, I sincerely appreciate your information on NRC commissioner Stienman. Based on her statement to you, "she did not know how she was going to vote until the end....she does not oppose the hunt, but does not agree with the tactic used." 

Based on her statement....she voted in protest against our legislature and the governor passing the bill rather than voting on the issue at hand...that being based on sound science should there be a limited wolf hunt in 2013. Seems to me this individual's politics is a higher priority than the mandate of sound science management. As for me, I expect a higher level of professionlism from commissioners who have been granted such a high level of trust in managing our fish and wildlife. Or, am I making too many assumptions here?


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## Black Powder Trapper (Feb 15, 2008)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> Thanks to all who responded to my post about the no vote...
> 
> I agree with you all on knowing why the no vote, and not doing anything in haste. Although, I am suggesting, if the commissioner is acting in support of HSUS there should be accountability.
> 
> ...


The reason that there are seven commissioners is that they do not always agree. I make most all the NRC meetings and have seen many split votes if we removed a commissioner every time we or another group did not agree there would be a huge turn over as anytime there is a split vote someone is not happy. Just my opinion but I see no reason to try to remove her and would not support doing that. Up until this vote she has been fair and supported trappers and hunters.


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## Seaarkshooter (Nov 5, 2009)

If anyones looking for a cause to help the sportsman in the state by the means of which you suggest using, feel free to come down my way to district 27. Call and talk to anyone at MUCC and you'll find out that my representative,Ellen Lipton, has been a thorn in the side of sportsman from day one. 

Gil, she's a vegan. Matter of fact, I wouldn't be surprised if she had the canine teeth from her children removed as soon as they came in 
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## gilgetter (Feb 28, 2006)

Gil, she's a vegan. Matter of fact, I wouldn't be surprised if she had the canine teeth from her children removed as soon as they came in 
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That splains a hole bunch. you must have a bunch of them up that way.

never trust a person who dont like a good steak.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Thanks for your follow up post. Guess I should be more specific...I believe any NRC commissioner who voted in support of HSUS's attempt at a ballot initiative as an excuse to vote against managing a limited wolf hunt in 2013 does not belong on the NRC. If this individual does not exhibit an anti-hunting bias in past NRC votes, and she is not an HSUS supporter....I would consider her vote to be just poor judgement. I take that position because the vote was meant to be on the merit of holding a wolf hunt, or not.


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## QDMAMAN (Dec 8, 2004)

Seaarkshooter said:


> The hundred and twenty thousand dollar a year question is, are you smart enough and cunning enough to get a NRC commissioner to truly tell you why they honestly did or did not do something? If you are, you're in the wrong business and I want to put you in a as a representative in the government of my area so we can clean up this mess.
> 
> posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


I don't know how "smart" I am but I can tell you that when you engage in civil conversations with people (and yes, these commissioners are people) that they share their feelings and opinions on the issues.
Commissioner Steinman shared with me and another gentleman prior to the meeting of the whole, that she had been notified ONLY 2 DAYS prior to the meeting that a vote would take place on Thursday evening. She also shared that she was being flooded with information from both sides and thought that all angles desrved her thoughtful consideration. She voted in favor of the ammendments btw, but nay on they WCO.
NOW...IF you had not left the room as soon as the vote had taken place, you would have learned from Ms. Steinman WHY she voted nay because she clarified why for the same reasons I just shared. She also went on to say she supported the MDNRs wildlife management policies and after considering all the information may have voted yay.


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## QDMAMAN (Dec 8, 2004)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> Thanks for your follow up post. Guess I should be more specific...I believe any NRC commissioner who voted in support of HSUS's attempt at a ballot initiative as an excuse to vote against managing a limited wolf hunt in 2013 does not belong on the NRC. If this individual does not exhibit an anti-hunting bias in past NRC votes, and she is not an HSUS supporter....I would consider her vote to be just poor judgement. I take that position because the vote was meant to be on the merit of holding a wolf hunt, or not.


Commissioner Steinman is hardly anti hunting, in fact, she has employed the help of the QDMA branch near the Blanford Nature Center, where she is the director, to assist with deer population control hunts. Many of these hunts are enjoyed by disabled veterans with the assistance of QDMA member volunteers.
She is also pursuing the establishment of a 1 acre exclosure withing the BNC so she can demonstrate to visitors the negative impacts deer have on the flora when their numbers aren't kept in check, btw, most effectively through hunting.


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## 2tundras (Jan 11, 2005)

Black Powder Trapper said:


> She said that she does not appose the hunt but does not agree with the tactic that was used.


I will give her credit for that one. Even though Casperson isn't my rep I am up here and didn't like how he did it. 

Took a worthy issue and made it dirty and slimy rendering all honest debate on carrying capacities and what have you meaningless.


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