# Lots of leaves.....



## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

I need help with my decision on the purchase of a new HAND HELD GASOLINE leaf blower.

PLEASE........ don't recommend Craftsman, as I already have two pieces of junk, that the rings went out of right after the warrantee expired.

I need a hand held that can blow leaves........ Recommendations?


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## jpollman (Jan 14, 2001)

I've got ONE word and it's all you'll need...

*ECHO!
*
I switched to Echo years ago and haven't looked back. I've got an Echo line trimmer that's fifteen years old and still starts right up in the Spring after sitting all winter. I've had an Echo hand held blower for years that is awesome. But a couple years ago I was at Home Depot and they had an open box special on an Echo PB-200 backpack blower for HALF PRICE so I snatched it up. That thing is AWESOME! The hand held is still a very good unit but I've got a very big yard and a lot of leaves also, so the backpack is just a bit more efficient.

John


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

jpollman said:


> I've got ONE word and it's all you'll need...
> 
> *ECHO!*
> 
> ...


I was just looking at some of the reports on the different brands that are available. Here's where I'm at now... http://www.consumersearch.com/leaf-blowers/handheld-gas-blowers

It appears that Echo is the only manufacturer that warantee's their equipment for any length of time. The PB250 has a five (5) year warrantee. Now I'm wondering about if the 135mph - 390 CFM is going to be enough. I have a large yard, spread out all over the place, right in the middle of the woods, loaded with maple and oak. Needless to say, its always bad! Makes me sometime wish I'd built in the middle of an open field:lol:
I thought about the back pack but, the wife says that we're getting a new John Deere tractor with the vacuum attachment and cart next year. All we need right now it a hand held to finish the year. BUT... I'll pick them up with a fork from the silverware drawer before I buy another Craftsman........

Thanks for the reply


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## tstu2 (Apr 5, 2005)

I bought a Ryobi and got two good years out of it....
:sad:


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## walleyeguy54 (Feb 7, 2009)

Check out small engine warehouse .com They have a good selection .I bought a kawasaki kbr750 back pack blower 205 mph. Has a 2 year warranty. Not to heavy... Runs and starts great.


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## jpollman (Jan 14, 2001)

Oops, I just looked. My backpack blower is a 260L. I think the hand held is a 200. They're both very good machines. 

John


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## kroppe (May 7, 2000)

I like Echo also. I have a 10 yr old string trimmer and it works great. I have a 6 yr old hand held leaf blower and it is also good. No complaints, I would buy an Echo product again without hesitation.


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## WALLEYE MIKE (Jan 7, 2001)

Go on craigslist and try to find a commercial walk behind blower. 6-10 hp. Will get the yard done in 1/10 the time. Hand held ones are toys. Backpack is better until you get a pile a 1ft high.

If you were closer, I have a 8hp which has been sitting for a few years.


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## Ole Spike (Nov 22, 2004)

Hand held Robin. Twelve years old with no problems and only changing plugs and filters.


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## kozal01 (Oct 11, 2010)

Stihl, Echo or Husqvarna is the way to go if you want one that will last, you will pay a little more but is worth the money you pay. Depending on how large your yard is a backpack blower might be worth considering also. I just put 2 full tanks of gas through my back pack blower today and I cant imagine how tiring it would have been to have a hand held blower, just a thought. I payed around $220 for my Husqvarna back pack model.


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## oncorhynchus (Oct 1, 2001)

jpollman said:


> *ECHO!
> *


No doubt!!


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

I'd have better luck with an ECHO if I lived near the Grand Canyon. Trying to find one up here is almost impossible.

I'll get'em this year. Next year its going to be with a new John Deere and a powered vac system............ so says the wife


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## jpollman (Jan 14, 2001)

I've lived here for about eleven years. I have about 1-1/2 acres and about half of it is trees. I've got a LOT of leaves to pick up every year. When we bought the house, I bought all of the previous owner's lawn equipment too. I've since replaced the tractor but the package included a Trac Vac 580. I couldn't deal with the leaves without that Trac Vac!!! It is awesome. The first few years I ended up working my butt off with a hand held blower and after several years of that I bought a 5 hp. walk behind blower. That thing worked great but it was heavy and I've got some decent slopes on my lot so it was a bugger to use in certain areas. A few years ago I started just hooking the vac up to my mulching deck on the tractor and I just drive around and suck them up. It works great. The only thing I use the blower for now is to blow the leaves out of the planting beds, away from the trees and house. Then I just suck them up with the Trac Vac. About three years ago my neighbor bought a Cyclone Rake. That thing is sweet. It pretty much does the same job that my Trac Vac does but it's nice because at the end of the season, the power unit detaches and the bag section collapses and hangs on the wall! My Trac Vac has a steel thirty-bushel trailer/container that just takes up a lot of space. One of these years I'm going to sell the Trac Vac and use the money I get for it toward upgrading to the Cyclone Rake. 

The nice thing about using the tractor/vac combo is that I can let the leaves go a little longer and it still does a great job cleaning them up. I don't have to do the entire job five or six times a season. Usually only twice with one final cleanup in the first week or so of November and I'm all set.

John


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## redshirt32 (Aug 20, 2003)

I've had an Echo for 3 yrs. now and purrs like a kitty. Only thing that it doesn't do good is move twigs. I have the 180 mph model and it will move piles 2 ft thick no problem. it just takes a while. But they're great when you blow a big ole pile on a tarp and drag it off. Quick and easy. Another thing about an Echo is there weight. Mine is very comfortable even for extened periods. Just for ref. I paid $335 @ Home Depot.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

jpollman said:


> ... About three years ago my neighbor bought a Cyclone Rake. That thing is sweet. It pretty much does the same job that my Trac Vac does but it's nice because at the end of the season, the power unit detaches and the bag section collapses and hangs on the wall! My Trac Vac has a steel thirty-bushel trailer/container that just takes up a lot of space. One of these years I'm going to sell the Trac Vac and use the money I get for it toward upgrading to the *Cyclone Rake*.
> 
> The nice thing about using the tractor/vac combo is that I can let the leaves go a little longer and it still does a great job cleaning them up. I don't have to do the entire job five or six times a season. Usually only twice with one final cleanup in the first week or so of November and I'm all set.
> 
> John


I keep getting things in the mail from Cyclone. I've never seen one work. A friend came over last fall with his tractor and the belt powered blower and cart. That thing would suck a golf ball through a garden hose!!! I couldn't believe how efficient that thing picked up leaves. I had a pile about a foot deep and they were wet. He just drove through them slowly and it picked up every leaf. I always wondered how the Cyclone rake worked, with the motor and fan so far away from the mower deck. I think you have to have a special shoot for each brand of mower.......?


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## FERG 06 (Oct 6, 2006)

F.Y.I. Echo recently merged w/Shindahwa. Both solid companys building solid equipment. I used nothing but Echo on my lawn service for years.
Interesting story:
Had a Echo backpack blower in the shed. Shed got crushed by a tree in Dec. Left the blower in shed all summer. Water leaked in and somehow enter the blowers engine. Next fall found out about it, drained engine, checked the cylinder for rust, flushed out carb, dried air filter and fired it up. That was last year. Fired it up this year and while the engine is noisey probably due to the bearings rusting it runs great! Try that w/your Craftsman. Hee, Hee. :lol:

You want a final nail in the coffin of your Craftsman blower? Take a look at the label on the unit. I bet it says "Durabilty Period 50 hrs"!!!!
Why would anyone spend $89-99 on a Crapman when for $50 more you can get a commercial quality unit?


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## jpollman (Jan 14, 2001)

ENCORE,
Those Cyclone Rake's work great! As I said before, my next door neighbor has one. I just noticed the other day that another neighbor down the street bought one too and was using it when I drove by. They're really nice units. They start at about a grand and go up from there but the one that's second up the list from the bottom is about $1300. That's probably the one that I'll end up with. They have a lot of accessories available too but the accessories are pretty pricey. They get about $80 for the optional chute to attach to your mower deck. It's well worth it though. I know that they have a number of different chutes available for the Trac Vac units, but it looks like the ones they sell for the Cyclone Rake's might be universal. 

You mentioned something that's a real plus using a powered vacuum unit. The leaves don't have to be completely dry in order for them to work. If you're mulching them with the mower and have the vacuum attached, they mulch up a little finer if they're dry but that's not a big deal. If the leaves are a little damp it's not a problem. On more than one occasion I've been doing my final fall cleanup in November and picked up leaves with snow flurries coming down! 

John


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## FERG 06 (Oct 6, 2006)

Well my Echo backpack PB-4600 went out on me today. It quit running. Checked it out and it had no spark. The coil has gone out. I'll have to look into the cost of the coil. It will be an easy replacement as the coil is located right below the recoil.
Oh yeah, did I mention that I bought it in the early 90's? And used it on my lawn service until I retired it in about 2001 where it has just blown my leaves ever since.


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## Fishndude (Feb 22, 2003)

If you are talking about spending $1000's for a vacuum to suck up leaves, you might as well go big, and get a used Dixie Chopper, and put some mulching blades on it. Why not just chop them up, and let them fertilize your lawn? Makes crappy snowmen in winter, but you really won't need to pick up and discard any leaves if you mulch them properly. First cut keep the deck up high. Second cut drop it one notch. Third cut drop it another notch. Done, and nothing to pick up at all. Oh, and it will cut your grass great during the growing season, too. 

When I had a lawn service, I did a leaf job for a friend. He has 5 acres, and half of fully wooded - dense trees. Maples and Poplars. He had between 3" and 18" of leaves on his whole yard. Yard is about 2 acres of cutting. 3 cuts took about 75 minutes, and you couldn't tell there were mulched leaves when you drove by on his road. He was bummed when I sold the business.


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## kozal01 (Oct 11, 2010)

Fishndude said:


> If you are talking about spending $1000's for a vacuum to suck up leaves, you might as well go big, and get a used Dixie Chopper, and put some mulching blades on it. Why not just chop them up, and let them fertilize your lawn? Makes crappy snowmen in winter, but you really won't need to pick up and discard any leaves if you mulch them properly. First cut keep the deck up high. Second cut drop it one notch. Third cut drop it another notch. Done, and nothing to pick up at all. Oh, and it will cut your grass great during the growing season, too.
> 
> When I had a lawn service, I did a leaf job for a friend. He has 5 acres, and half of fully wooded - dense trees. Maples and Poplars. He had between 3" and 18" of leaves on his whole yard. Yard is about 2 acres of cutting. 3 cuts took about 75 minutes, and you couldn't tell there were mulched leaves when you drove by on his road. He was bummed when I sold the business.


unless you have maple leaves only mulching them up isnt that great of an option, especially if you have all oak trees. oak leaves are bad news for your grass


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

kozal01 said:


> unless you have maple leaves only mulching them up isnt that great of an option, especially if you have all oak trees. oak leaves are bad news for your grass


 
Well, there in lies the problem. I'm right in the middle of 20 acres of woods and most of it is oak. I have maple but, there's more oak. I'd been keeping up with it pretty good, just with my old blower. This wind has made a mess and another full day (or morer) of trying to clean them up again if the wind quits. And......... that darn oak... the stems want to stick in the grass and not blow well..........:rant:


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## slowpoke (Jan 30, 2001)

WALLEYE MIKE said:


> Go on craigslist and try to find a commercial walk behind blower. 6-10 hp. Will get the yard done in 1/10 the time. Hand held ones are toys. Backpack is better until you get a pile a 1ft high.
> 
> If you were closer, I have a 8hp which has been sitting for a few years.




The walk behind blower is the way to go if you have a lot of leaves.


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## kozal01 (Oct 11, 2010)

ENCORE said:


> Well, there in lies the problem. I'm right in the middle of 20 acres of woods and most of it is oak. I have maple but, there's more oak. I'd been keeping up with it pretty good, just with my old blower. This wind has made a mess and another full day (or morer) of trying to clean them up again if the wind quits. And......... that darn oak... the stems want to stick in the grass and not blow well..........:rant:


yeah im in the same boat. im surrounded by almost all oak and they are a pain. my blower does a good job of getting them out of the flower beds and around the tree line but i would struggle blow the whole yard with it. i usually end up borrowing my fathers pull behind vacuum system for my tractor.


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## WALLEYE MIKE (Jan 7, 2001)

kozal01 said:


> unless you have maple leaves only mulching them up isnt that great of an option, especially if you have all oak trees. oak leaves are bad news for your grass


It will have no ill effect on your lawn. If your thinking of the acid involved, not enough there to be a factor.

I agree with the mulching of them. I do it every year for customers with excellent results. Have mulched leaves up to inches thick and when I leave none are seen. Years back i had a old lady customer ask "what did you do with the leaves?". Where it used to take me hours for her lawn, now took maybe 1 hour at best. Still mulching her lawn to this day. Just think of all the organic material now in the soil. (does little if any fertilizing of the lawn but organic material is great.)

Been mulching leaves for about 10 years now will no ill effects at all on the lawns.


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## MPT (Oct 7, 2004)

Did you take either apart or have someone look at them? My son baught us a craftsman and he also baught one for himself. They're 4-5 years old and our runs great but his stopped working. It acted froze up but I took it apart to just check it out and maybe scavange parts. I found the bolts holding the head to the crank case loose. Tightened them and the blower works fine I still can't believe it. Why would the bolts come loose unless the worker had too much sali and didn't tighten correctly in the first place. Even so I can't believe just retightene-ing would fix it but it did.


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## jpollman (Jan 14, 2001)

As far as mulching them is concerned, about the only benefit I see is possibly the additional organic material in the lawn. Mulching may be fine with a $3K-$4K commercial mower but it doesn't work well with a normal residential lawn tractor. Even if it did, it looks like you need to go over the lawn at least three or four times in order to get them mulched fine enough. *NO THANKS!* I've got a lot of lawn to cut and that would mean that I'd have to go over the entire lawn 3-4 times on at least two or three occasions each season in order to mulch them. Normally I can vacuum up the leaves two or three times each season and I'm good to go. It only takes me a couple hours to do if the leaves aren't too bad. That's much quicker than trying to mulch them and the lawn looks much better when I'm done.

John


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## WALLEYE MIKE (Jan 7, 2001)

jpollman said:


> As far as mulching them is concerned, about the only benefit I see is possibly the additional organic material in the lawn. Mulching may be fine with a $3K-$4K commercial mower but it doesn't work well with a normal residential lawn tractor. Even if it did, it looks like you need to go over the lawn at least three or four times in order to get them mulched fine enough. *NO THANKS!* I've got a lot of lawn to cut and that would mean that I'd have to go over the entire lawn 3-4 times on at least two or three occasions each season in order to mulch them. Normally I can vacuum up the leaves two or three times each season and I'm good to go. It only takes me a couple hours to do if the leaves aren't too bad. That's much quicker than trying to mulch them and the lawn looks much better when I'm done.
> 
> John


Come and see my work John. Your thinking will be different.

3-4K commercial machine? Just a bit low. Brand new, 10K


Adding organic material is absolutely the best thing you can do for your lawn or garden by far. Doesn't add much if any "fertilizer" (n,p,k) but does have many micro nutrients. Think of it as a daily vitamin pill with all the extra little vitamins you might not get in your daily diet.

I took some pics yesterday while "mulching". Will post when I get on the other puter.


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## FERG 06 (Oct 6, 2006)

MPT said:


> Did you take either apart or have someone look at them? My son baught us a craftsman and he also baught one for himself. They're 4-5 years old and our runs great but his stopped working. It acted froze up but I took it apart to just check it out and maybe scavange parts. I found the bolts holding the head to the crank case loose. Tightened them and the blower works fine I still can't believe it. Why would the bolts come loose unless the worker had too much sali and didn't tighten correctly in the first place. Even so I can't believe just retightene-ing would fix it but it did.


In your case you were one of the lucky ones. Your cylinder screws came loose quick enough to basically shut down the machine. Most others come loose slowly and the consumer is able to keep using it all the while the engine is sucking in air causing a lean condition causing the engine to overheat and score the piston & cylinder. I see far more scorded engines than I do ones that are just loose and even if the unit is just loose it would cost more in labor to repair it than it's worth unless you do it yourself. It takes about an hour or so, if you've done it before, and with shop rates at $50 p/hr & up why fix it just to get your same old machine back. 
I've seen too many (usually 3-5 p/yr) for it to be 1 worker doing something wrong. It has to be a design flaw. And lately (last 2 yrs) I'm seeing other machines (trimmers) with same condition. This last spring I was able to tighten down the screws on a trimmer by drilling a hole, w/the customers permission, through the plastic housing.

Side note: For about 50% more up front you can buy a good commercial type blower. Craftsman -$89-99. Stihl, Echo-$150-160 last I checked and get a machine that will last longer and cost less to repair things like recoil ropes which are located on the outside of the blower rather than inside the housing like most Craftsman, Homelite, Troybilt, Bolens (MTD) etc.


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## jpollman (Jan 14, 2001)

I'm sure that a lot of the commercial machines out there are pushing $10K. But this past spring I was looking at an Exmark at Weingartz. It was probably a residential version of a commercial unit but it was one heck of a nice machine and I think it was around $2800 if I'm not mistaken. A machine that would probably do the job, but if I've got to cut the entire lawn 3-4 times each time the leaves need to be dealt with, it's just not worth the time involved. Before I do that, I'll dump a bag of fertilizer on the lawn once a year and save a lot of time. 

John


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## WALLEYE MIKE (Jan 7, 2001)

jpollman said:


> I'm sure that a lot of the commercial machines out there are pushing $10K. But this past spring I was looking at an Exmark at Weingartz. It was probably a residential version of a commercial unit but it was one heck of a nice machine and I think it was around $2800 if I'm not mistaken. A machine that would probably do the job, but if I've got to cut the entire lawn 3-4 times each time the leaves need to be dealt with, it's just not worth the time involved. Before I do that, I'll dump a bag of fertilizer on the lawn once a year and save a lot of time.
> 
> John


Yeah John those are residential versions. Better built than a lawn tractor but not as good as a commercial machine.

Fertilizer is nowhere the same as organic material. Apples and oranges so to speak.

Here is just part of what I did yesterday. One pass. I would rate the leaves here 4-5 on a scale of 10 for depth or thickness of leaves I do. I usually shoot for 1/3 leaf fall per visit. Lots of times its 1/2 the leaf fall. (much thicker)

One good thing for you John is that you have somewhere to put your leaves. Most people do not. They must pay for disposal somehow.










Other parts of this property where thicker especially under a couple of maple trees that required 2 passes. An additional few minutes.


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## MPT (Oct 7, 2004)

Ferg, I still can't believe mine works and you're telling me you fix 5-9 per year. As far as an hour to fix well it was about 6 hours for me. Did I say I still can't believe it's running. It was a gift from my son so I'll take your advise next time. Thanks.


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