# LSSU, ARL construction status



## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Anyone have any information regarding the construction status of the new ARL building. Interested in knowing if a fishing pier (wall) is part of the plan.
Pictures would be nice.


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## bborow2501 (Nov 12, 2007)

https://www.9and10news.com/2021/03/02/sault-ste-marie-moving-forward-with-carbide-dock-project/



I've driven by a couple of times in the last week, construction is definitely underway.

The rendering for the project clearly shows access to be restored to the water next to the Edison plant, however I haven't seen any specifics as to what that will look like. (Dock, ect.)

It seems that restoring fishing access is a priority for the city with this project, so I'm pretty optimistic.

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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

They need to push for stocking more kings up there again. When they stopped stocking Huron after the crash they stopped the Soo. There's plenty of food and they still stock 1/2 million+ between Nunns creek and Swan River in Northern lake Huron. Made no sense to me...casting at night by the powerhouse was the best salmon fishing and easiest I've ever done. 😀


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Ralph Smith said:


> They need to push for stocking more kings up there again. When they stopped stocking Huron after the crash they stopped the Soo. There's plenty of food and they still stock 1/2 million+ between Nunns creek and Swan River in Northern lake Huron. Made no sense to me...casting at night by the powerhouse was the best salmon fishing and easiest I've ever done. 😀


A lot of the kings up there are the result of natural reproduction on the Garden River. Hit and miss success. I'm sure Cork and Forest will provide additional information.

Ralph, the salmon in the river are only there for spawning. Not interested in eating while in the river. They need to introduce the fingerlings at the mouth of the Garden so they will return to spawn, then it will be game on for catching.
Years ago the trolling was fantastic all along the river, from the Canadian powerplant down to Ben's and near the Sugar Island ferry dock.


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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

Gordon Casey said:


> A lot of the kings up there are the result of natural reproduction on the Garden River. Hit and miss success. I'm sure Cork and Forest will provide additional information.
> 
> Ralph, the salmon in the river are only there for spawning. Not interested in eating while in the river. They need to introduce the fingerlings at the mouth of the Garden so they will return to spawn, then it will be game on for catching.
> Years ago the trolling was fantastic all along the river, from the Canadian powerplant down to Ben's and near the Sugar Island ferry dock.


It was phenomenal by the powerhouse from late 80s when I first started fishing there and all through the 90s right from shore there. I'd park my truck camper by where the outhouse use to be near powerhouse and walk 20' and start casting. You could smell the venny roast cooking in camper while fishing. 😆 The best of times. They used to stock alot at powerhouse and some at Aunne Osborne launch. Not sure where they had net pens, but guess they had those too.


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## Forest Meister (Mar 7, 2010)

Ralph Smith said:


> They need to push for stocking more kings up there again. When they stopped stocking Huron after the crash they stopped the Soo. There's plenty of food and they still stock 1/2 million+ between Nunns creek and Swan River in Northern lake Huron. Made no sense to me...casting at night by the powerhouse was the best salmon fishing and easiest I've ever done. 😀


The locations where the 1/2 million fish are dumped will start to make sense is a person thinks in terms of things like Consent Decree and commercial fishing. FM


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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

Forest Meister said:


> The locations where the 1/2 million fish are dumped will start to make sense is a person thinks in terms of things like Consent Decree and commercial fishing. FM


Oh I know why they still stock where the do, it's the why they don't where the used to? No reason not to bring more kings back to the Soo unless they figure they'll interfere with the Atlantics?


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Gordon Casey said:


> Anyone have any information regarding the construction status of the new ARL building. Interested in knowing if a fishing pier (wall) is part of the plan.
> Pictures would be nice.


I'm looking for a construction update on the ARL facility. Is it almost complete, if not how about a guesstimate on completion. What will the fishing pier look like?
Thank you in advance.


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## tcmsu (Feb 20, 2002)

ARL is up and running: Center for Freshwater Research and Education at LSSU


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

tcmsu said:


> ARL is up and running: Center for Freshwater Research and Education at LSSU


Had a phone conversation with the Engineering department in the city of Sault Ste. Marie. The rebuild of the Carbide dock fishing area has been delayed, delays have caused the building permit to expire. New quote requests will be issued late 2022. It will probably be 2 years before we see any completion. The pier and amenities will be a city park. I asked will the pier be open 24 hours, her reply was all City parks are closed at 10pm, didn't state when they open. She sent me detailed information on the project along with schmetics showing layout of the area. From what I could make out, the rail should be about the same length, but provisions are there for ship dockage, hard to figure how much area that includes. 
Looks to be a nice area when completed, but don't know how fishermen friendly it will be. I hope they would make accommodations for the fall salmon fishers.


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## hypox (Jan 23, 2000)

I wonder if it will be favorable for casting. The old blue railing was a bit high and wore you out quickly. As least for me it did.


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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

hypox said:


> I wonder if it will be favorable for casting. The old blue railing was a bit high and wore you out quickly. As least for me it did.


You just had to lean on it..  Better than no rail like it was when I first went up there.


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

hypox said:


> I wonder if it will be favorable for casting. The old blue railing was a bit high and wore you out quickly. As least for me it did.


I'm sure there is a standard that defines the height of the top railing. My concern is how much of the wall will be available for anglers. Those cruise ships are long. The concept sketch shows it to be gated and may have limited access. I'm selfish, keep it open 24 hours in Sept. and Oct., don't are about the rest.


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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

Gordon Casey said:


> I'm sure there is a standard that defines the height of the top railing. My concern is how much of the wall will be available for anglers. Those cruise ships are long. The concept sketch shows it to be gated and may have limited access. I'm selfish, keep it open 24 hours in Sept. and Oct., don't are about the rest.


I can't see them parking on the wall where everyone fished. It's too shallow in close. I'd get they'll park along where it straightens back out and they dump for winter. I've seen them there before. Just past the fence at end of rail....it gets deep down there for the ships that unload....


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Ralph Smith said:


> I can't see them parking on the wall where everyone fished. It's too shallow in close. I'd get they'll park along where it straightens back out and they dump for winter. I've seen them there before. Just past the fence at end of rail....it gets deep down there for the ships that unload....
> View attachment 841925


The depiction shows cleat locations on the long east/west wall, west of the fence.


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## hypox (Jan 23, 2000)

Ralph Smith said:


> You just had to lean on it..  Better than no rail like it was when I first went up there.


I leaned on it, sat on it and stepped through the areas between the sections. I prefer nothing like on a pier, but I know that ain’t happening.


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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

hypox said:


> I leaned on it, sat on it and stepped through the areas between the sections. I prefer nothing like on a pier, but I know that ain’t happening.


Been so long my back would probably give out fast now. We did have plenty of liquid pain medication though to power through!  Was nice to park my truck camper right on the end by orange net for the weekend. Could smell the venny roast in the oven! Miss those days. 3 kings a piece was pretty common back then. Great times!


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## hypox (Jan 23, 2000)




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## Forest Meister (Mar 7, 2010)

hypox said:


> View attachment 844211


My wife took a tour of that new building a couple weeks ago with a lady's group. She knows little or nothing about fisheries but was agog of what she saw and the things that were explained to them. She seemed to like the sturgeon tank the best. Said they had one smaller fish and one that was much bigger (she forgot what kind they were but when I described what I though they probably were I got the old ''that's it" response). She said the large one would respond to people. Their tour guide, the head of the F&W department, would talk to it and put her hand in the water. It would then swim over, put its nose out of the water and could be petted. After the group moved on there was some splashing behind them and they were told it did that when it wanted more attention. It had a name, but my wife could not remember what it was. Near as I could judge from the description given, the tank was about 4' deep and maybe 10'-12' across and the big fish was maybe 5' or more long.

Among the assets of the building was a covered observation deck overlooking the river. Again, this is her thoughts, but even after living in SSM for forty some years she said being up there gave a whole new perspective of the locks, river, and SSM Ontario.

This may not impress fishermen too much but the pic @hypox posted show some of the "rain gardens" they have planted around the building. These gardens feature native plants and shrubs. 

It has been a long time since I have seen my wife so enthusiastic about anything so I guess it must be truly impressive. Wish I would have tagged along on her tour but at the time following 8-10 garden club ladies for a couple hours did not appeal to me. In my defense, I thought they would mostly be oohing and aahing over the rain gardens and I had better things to do. I believe I napped. 

Might have to call a friend in the hatchery and see if they give private tours. If so, I might even take some pics. FM


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Forest Meister said:


> My wife took a tour of that new building a couple weeks ago with a lady's group. She knows little or nothing about fisheries but was agog of what she saw and the things that were explained to them. She seemed to like the sturgeon tank the best. Said they had one smaller fish and one that was much bigger (she forgot what kind they were but when I described what I though they probably were I got the old ''that's it" response). She said the large one would respond to people. Their tour guide, the head of the F&W department, would talk to it and put her hand in the water. It would then swim over, put its nose out of the water and could be petted. After the group moved on there was some splashing behind them and they were told it did that when it wanted more attention. It had a name, but my wife could not remember what it was. Near as I could judge from the description given, the tank was about 4' deep and maybe 10'-12' across and the big fish was maybe 5' or more long.
> 
> Among the assets of the building was a covered observation deck overlooking the river. Again, this is her thoughts, but even after living in SSM for forty some years she said being up there gave a whole new perspective of the locks, river, and SSM Ontario.
> 
> ...


Please, while you are there, take a picture of the proposed fishing pier/railing.


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## Tubes77 (Apr 28, 2004)

Ralph Smith said:


> They need to push for stocking more kings up there again. When they stopped stocking Huron after the crash they stopped the Soo. There's plenty of food and they still stock 1/2 million+ between Nunns creek and Swan River in Northern lake Huron. Made no sense to me...casting at night by the powerhouse was the best salmon fishing and easiest I've ever done. 😀


The Carp river back in the day was also amazing for kings. Now it's a virtual dead sea.


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## Ralph Smith (Apr 1, 2003)

Tubes77 said:


> The Carp river back in the day was also amazing for kings. Now it's a virtual dead sea.


They used to stock it.


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Tubes77 said:


> The Carp river back in the day was also amazing for kings. Now it's a virtual dead sea.


Been a dead sea for 20 years! Used to make a stop there every year from 2000, never caught a thing even a Pink.


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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

Gordon Casey said:


> Been a dead sea for 20 years! Used to make a stop there every year from 2000, never caught a thing even a Pink.


Visited the ARL facility and got a nice tour from a fisheries Professor and the lady Administrator of the facility.
Smaller that what I expected, classrooms and research rooms and an area I will call an oversize lobby. Hope PETA don't show up because those 2 huge sturgeon were in a not so huge tank.
The lady Administer was more than anxious to show me around as I was interested in the proposed concrete walkway and fishing area along the river. She sure had a lot to say. They will reconstruct the concrete all along the existing railing but here is where the controversy starts. The area will be gated somewhere along the path. A portion she thought will be for boat mooring, the remaining portion will be for "fishing". At this point this is where she got excited as that portion of the walk will have rip-rap deposited from the wall and extending downward to the water. She was frustrated as that plan makes it almost impossible to cast and retrieve. She was also frustrated about the lack of anglers attending meetings to voice their concerns. She said something about the city fathers "maybe'" trying to curtail snagging. She was also frustrated about the city fathers not making an effort to promote to provide for 
shore fishing.

Here is my 2 cents on this whole issue.
I reported earlier in a post that I got a feeling that the city was not interested in promoting that area for shore fishing. They initially made no effort to repair the railing area and let it sit idle before fencing it in. Walked over and took a look and it has deteriorated badly. I also get the feeling that the UP fishers do not want the trolls there.
Probably 2 years before re construction will be started and that should provide ample time, if enough interest is shown, to get rid of that rip-rap. Maybe those local UP fishers could help us getting that area fishable.
My comments are based on the conversation I had with the Administrator and she was vocal about the lack of fishable area.


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## hhlhoward (Mar 1, 2012)

They probably don't want us up there fishing. I don't know how many people that live up there yelled for us to stay home. They didn't want anyone up there. I don't care what they don't like. I live in this state and my taxes help pay for it so I won't stop going up there. With all the waterfront construction going on around the state, fishermen have had to fight hard just to keep what we have. Politicians are trying to get piers banned from fishing every day. When condos go up, the residents of the condos fight hard to not let people be along the water even though it's owned by the state or local municipality. I'm tired of the BS with people having all this money and thinking they can do what they and they better get it or else. There's a ton of fishermen that can't afford a boat and there are people that physically can't be in a boat. The attitude of fishermen are just a low class breed of people that are disgusting is crock of sht. I fight back with all u got for this generation and the upcoming generations. They need to realize how much money we bring to communities and without that they could go broke. Harrisville, Harbor Beach, Port Austin, and Alpena come to mind. We can't stop fighting and need to stick together. Sorry about the long rant but I had to say it.

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## Gordon Casey (Jun 13, 2017)

hhlhoward said:


> They probably don't want us up there fishing. I don't know how many people that live up there yelled for us to stay home. They didn't want anyone up there. I don't care what they don't like. I live in this state and my taxes help pay for it so I won't stop going up there. With all the waterfront construction going on around the state, fishermen have had to fight hard just to keep what we have. Politicians are trying to get piers banned from fishing every day. When condos go up, the residents of the condos fight hard to not let people be along the water even though it's owned by the state or local municipality. I'm tired of the BS with people having all this money and thinking they can do what they and they better get it or else. There's a ton of fishermen that can't afford a boat and there are people that physically can't be in a boat. The attitude of fishermen are just a low class breed of people that are disgusting is crock of sht. I fight back with all u got for this generation and the upcoming generations. They need to realize how much money we bring to communities and without that they could go broke. Harrisville, Harbor Beach, Port Austin, and Alpena come to mind. We can't stop fighting and need to stick together. Sorry about the long rant but I had to say it.
> 
> Sent from my moto z4 using Michigan Sportsman mobile app


Having you providing reinforcement to my belief that the UP'ers don't want us up there, they will never support us regarding available fishing along that waterfront.
Only available area is the marina and I'm sure down the road they will make that not available as well.
A shout out to all those UP'ers that report on here.......give up your stance, lets see where you stand regarding this issue. There are a few on here that have the ear of the powers to be in the Sault, give us your opinion. 
Looks like I did more investigative work on this subject and I live "down under". I'm betting they won't investigate because they DON'T want to investigate.


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## hhlhoward (Mar 1, 2012)

Gordon Casey said:


> Having you providing reinforcement to my belief that the UP'ers don't want us up there, they will never support us regarding available fishing along that waterfront.
> Only available area is the marina and I'm sure down the road they will make that not available as well.
> A shout out to all those UP'ers that report on here.......give up your stance, lets see where you stand regarding this issue. There are a few on here that have the ear of the powers to be in the Sault, give us your opinion.
> Looks like I did more investigative work on this subject and I live "down under". I'm betting they won't investigate because they DON'T want to investigate.


I'm thinking your right Gordon.

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