# Cougar Killed In the U.P. (For Real)



## Neal (Mar 20, 2001)

http://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/MIDNR/bulletins/9b147e


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## William H Bonney (Jan 14, 2003)

I knew someone would shoot one this season!!


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## sjk984 (Jan 4, 2010)

Man the DNR sure is coming down hard on the bay county people. First baiting ducks now assassinating cougars

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## john warren (Jan 25, 2005)

geeze next they are gonna find an untagged sasquatch hanging in someones barn....


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## john warren (Jan 25, 2005)

seriously? why shoot a cougar? did they eat it?


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## KalamazooKid (Jun 20, 2005)

Very interesting .......


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## William H Bonney (Jan 14, 2003)

john warren said:


> seriously? why shoot a cougar? did they eat it?


It probably attacked them.


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## DFJISH (Mar 30, 2009)

Get ready for the parade of fools that will proclaim that this shooting confirms the presence of cougars i*n the LP*.


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## Mr. Botek (Mar 15, 2011)

Maximum penalty seems light IMO. 

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## Liver and Onions (Nov 24, 2000)

Another event by some idiot that makes hunters look bad. I'm glad they were caught and will suffer the consequences. 

L & O


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## Swamp Monster (Jan 11, 2002)

I hope they make an example out of them. Unless it was self defense, no reason to kill it.....


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## fish_AK (Nov 10, 2009)

Here is the email I got...


FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Dec. 20, 2013

Contact: Lt. Skip Hagy, 906-293-5131 or Ed Golder,517-284-6241

Cougar illegally killed in Schoolcraft County; DNR conservation officers apprehend suspects

Michigan Department of Natural Resources law enforcement officials have confirmed a cougar was illegally killed last week in the Upper Peninsulas Schoolcraft County.

Acting on a tip that a cougar had been illegally killed at a hunting camp in northeast Schoolcraft County, DNR conservation officers and Special Investigations Unit detectives were able to successfully recover evidence and identify and apprehend two suspects from Bay County.

Upon completion of the DNRs investigation, the case will be turned over to the Schoolcraft County Prosecuting Attorney with warrant requests for charges. The state penalty for illegally killing a cougar, classified as an endangered species in Michigan, is up to 90 days in jail and fines and restitution of up to $2,500.

Anyone with information about this or any other poaching case is encouraged to call the DNRs Report All Poaching (RAP) hotline at 800-292-7800, 24 hours a day, seven days a week. Information can also be reported online at www.michigan.gov/conservationofficers. Tips and information can be left anonymously; information that leads to an arrest and conviction is eligible for a cash reward funded by the states Game and Fish Protection Fund.

A trail camera photo of a cougar near the same area as this incident was recently confirmed by the DNRs Wildlife Division. Wildlife officials believe the animal killed was most likely the same cougar seen in the recent photo.

Cougars, also known as mountain lions, disappeared from the state in the early 1900s. The last confirmed wild cougar in Michigan prior to 2008 was an animal killed near Newberry in 1906.

Since 2008, the DNR has confirmed photos or tracks of cougars on 23 occasions in 10 Upper Peninsula counties. The animals are believed to be young individuals dispersing from established populations in the Dakotas in search of new territory. There is no evidence of a breeding population of cougars in the state.

The Wildlife Divisions specially trained cougar team welcomes citizen reports of possible cougar evidence or sightings. Cougar photos and other evidence such as tracks, scat or cached kills should be reported to a local DNR office or through the DNR's online reporting form at www.michigan.gov/cougars.

The Michigan Department of Natural Resources is committed to the conservation, protection, management, use and enjoyment of the states natural and cultural resources for current and future generations. For more information, go to www.michigan.gov/dnr.


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## Blueump (Aug 20, 2005)

90 days in jail and $2,500 fine for an endangered species? No wonder poachers scoff at our laws!


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## Blueump (Aug 20, 2005)

fish_AK said:


> Since 2008...The animals are believed to be young individuals dispersing from established populations in the Dakotas in search of new territory. There is no evidence of a breeding population of cougars in the state.


So they return to the Dakotas to breed? What a bunch of crock!


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## WAUB-MUKWA (Dec 13, 2003)

Blueump said:


> 90 days in jail and $2,500 fine for an endangered species? No wonder poachers scoff at our laws!


Doesn't it make you wonder why its endangered to begin with if some states can kill them? the ESA needs to either be abolished or rewritten to dump some of these animals that aren't endangered in reality. The ESA is nothing but welfare for Universities into their grant systems. That's like saying the wolf is endangered when there might be over 100,000 in N America.


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## maurob (May 3, 2013)

Now they will be able to size, age, and take dna samples. This should help determine wether or not adults and not just juvies roam around here. It would be hard to convince people we do not have a breeding population if it is determined to be an adult with trail pics that would suggest it has a home range established. I wonder how they will skate around the data once the testing is complete?


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## HUBBHUNTER (Aug 8, 2007)

Blueump said:


> 90 days in jail and $2,500 fine for an endangered species? No wonder poachers scoff at our laws!


That's very true.

On the other hand whats the big deal? Our dear POTUS wants to give out a 30 year pass on killing bald eagles to his buddies at the government subsidized wind farms. It's not like its our national ****ing bird or anything.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/12/05/Obama-to-Sign-Rule-Allowing-Death-of-Eagles


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## Liver and Onions (Nov 24, 2000)

Blueump said:


> So they return to the Dakotas to breed? What a bunch of crock!


No one ever said that they returned to the Dakotas to breed. Why would you even think that ?

L & O


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## Blueump (Aug 20, 2005)

Liver and Onions said:


> No one ever said that they returned to the Dakotas to breed. Why would you even think that ?
> 
> L & O


Sarcasm! The DNR has admitted that they've been here for at least 6 years but they aren't breeding? Unless I'm missing something how do they stay "non breeding juveniles" for 6 years?


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## Sasquatch Lives (May 23, 2011)

Blueump said:


> 90 days in jail and $2,500 fine for an endangered species? No wonder poachers scoff at our laws!


Yeah, that's a better deal than what a legal outwest lion hunt would cost. I still do not understand why "breeding population" is such a big hang up to the DNR. The lions are here! This is proof.


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## miruss (Apr 18, 2003)

DFJISH said:


> Get ready for the parade of fools that will proclaim that this shooting confirms the presence of cougars i*n the LP*.


It's better then being a idiot for thinking there can't be any cougars in the L.P. This cougar was shot in a far eastern county of the up what you think it gets to the end of the u.p. and stops. If wolves can get from the u.p. to the lower what makes you think that a cougar that people have already said have come from as far away as the Dakotas but your right they must be to tired and they all die before they make that last 5 miles. Since 2008, the DNR has confirmed photos or tracks of cougars on 23 occasions in 10 Upper Peninsula counties. The animals are believed to be young individuals dispersing from established populations in the Dakotas in search of new territory.they must just be running to the east end of the u.p. then turn around and head back (THE FOREST GUMP OF WILD LIFE) hell we all know theres no reason for them to stop in the u.p. and start breeding i mean the u.p. is so populated they would be running in to people every mile.


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## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

If you deny their existence you don't have to manage them. Once they are acknowledged sportsmen will be required to pay for them just like the wolf issue. Sportsman's dollars will be diverted for management.


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## charcoal300zxtt (Sep 8, 2011)

Liver and Onions said:


> *Another event by some idiot that makes hunters look bad*. I'm glad they were caught and will suffer the consequences.
> 
> L & O


That's the first thing that came to my mind as well. Hope a judge throws the book at em!


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## KalamazooKid (Jun 20, 2005)

The article says they recovered "evidence" but I wonder if they have the whole carcass? It would be interesting from a research standpoint I'm guessing. Age, weight, etc.


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## CHASINEYES (Jun 3, 2007)

Luv2hunteup said:


> If you deny their existence you don't have to manage them. Once they are acknowledged sportsmen will be required to pay for them just like the wolf issue. Sportsman's dollars will be diverted for management.


 I seriously didn't think they were protected as they weren't being acknowledged. When did they become protected in michigan?


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## hiflyer (Oct 15, 2010)

CHASINEYES said:


> I seriously didn't think they were protected as they weren't being acknowledged. When did they become protected in michigan?


Probably when they voted for us to stop hunting doves!

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## Blueump (Aug 20, 2005)

CHASINEYES said:


> I seriously didn't think they were protected as they weren't being acknowledged. When did they become protected in michigan?


They've been listed in the hunting guide as "protected" for many years! There is nothing confusing about it. There is NO excuse for not knowing the law...especially since the guides are posted online and given away for free everyplace you can buy a license!


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## MEL (Jul 17, 2005)

Blueump said:


> So they return to the Dakotas to breed? What a bunch of crock!



Its said "No Evidence" of a breeding population. Soon as they find a 1 month old kitty, or a pregnant female thats been noted on trail cams. Then they will have evidence. 
Its a science thing. Its like just because people claim that we have bigfoots in Michigan the DNR dosent confirm it cause there is no proof. 

I also believe that males are the ones who wonder hundreds of miles so 
we could have dozens of cougars in the UP. However......all males...that dosent make a breeding population.


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## Huntfish247 (Dec 13, 2005)

Blueump said:


> 90 days in jail and $2,500 fine for an endangered species? No wonder poachers scoff at our laws!


Sounds light for poaching any "big game" animal to me. Jail time and fines 10 times that with adders for sale of game, wanton waste, etc., seem more realistic. 

Something that deserves to be reviewed before any licence increase IMHO.


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## outfishin_ (Jul 28, 2004)

Hmmm Where is the disbeliever crowd now? This has gotta be an urban myths..:lol: But really....

The reason someone shot that animal was to prove they actually saw one. A waste of an animal ...and to prove they saw one and to show they actually do exist in Michigan,


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## HUBBHUNTER (Aug 8, 2007)

Huntfish247 said:


> Sounds light for poaching any "big game" animal to me. Jail time and fines 10 times that with adders for sale of game, wanton waste, etc., seem more realistic.
> 
> Something that deserves to be reviewed before any licence increase IMHO.


I would agree with your punishment if it was something that brought in revenue for the state. Want to poach a whitetail, rabbit, squirrel? Go to prison and and pay a $10,000 fine! What has the cougar brought to this state?


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## BVW (Jul 25, 2002)

Blueump said:


> Sarcasm! The DNR has admitted that they've been here for at least 6 years but they aren't breeding? Unless I'm missing something how do they stay "non breeding juveniles" for 6 years?


. 

Read this article: it will explain a lot about cougar behavior and why cats are found in areas outside of their breeding ranges.

http://evolutionarytransitions.blogspot.com/2011/11/male-biased-dispersal-in-cougars.html?m=1


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## KalamazooKid (Jun 20, 2005)

outfishin_ said:


> Hmmm Where is the disbeliever crowd now? This has gotta be an urban myths..:lol: But really....
> 
> The reason someone shot that animal was to prove they actually saw one. A waste of an animal ...and to prove they saw one and to show they actually do exist in Michigan,


OMG .... We know there's been cats in the UP!!!!! The sightings have been verified (by someone other than the NWC) over the last few years. But NOT in the LP nor have they proven any breeding. 

Please try to stay informed with the FACTS - something that's really been missing in these debates.


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## Skibum (Oct 3, 2000)

Liver and Onions said:


> Another event by some idiot that makes hunters look bad. I'm glad they were caught and will suffer the consequences.
> 
> L & O


Agreed and I also agree the penalty is too light. Cougars, like wolves, bring a "wildness" to the UP. That's not to suggest a lacke of managment. I fully support hunting wolves. There is value in wildlife diversity. When i hunt in Idaho i alway have a lion tag just in case. In Michigan it saddens me that a couple of morons felt the need to kill that cat. Brainless.


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## DEDGOOSE (Jan 19, 2007)

outfishin_ said:


> Hmmm Where is the disbeliever crowd now? This has gotta be an urban myths..:lol: But really....
> 
> The reason someone shot that animal was to prove they actually saw one. A waste of an animal ...and to prove they saw one and to show they actually do exist in Michigan,


I do not think anyone doubts there has been cougars in Michigan (U.P.).. Running with your above idea of why.. I believe we should open up the killing of a cougar in the L.P. One can be killed to prove their existence.. With all the sightings it should not take very long and than they go back to being protected..


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## bheary (Dec 29, 2010)

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## 19rabbit52 (Jul 15, 2007)

Listened to a talk show on NPR about a week ago about cougars. They said there is more right now(in N.America) than there has ever been. Also said they are killing machines and will put a bigger hurting on the deer than the wolves ever did.


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## Blueump (Aug 20, 2005)

bheary said:


> I think you misread that
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Ohub Campfire mobile app


Apparently you failed to read the follow up post revealing my question as SARCASM!


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## bheary (Dec 29, 2010)

Sure did

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## bheary (Dec 29, 2010)

When I was stationed in Charleviox in 02-04 my wife swears on. The good book that she saw a cougar near East Jordan. I told her she's full of it but sure enough she described a cat that sure sounded like a cougar. 

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## chris-remington (Oct 7, 2012)

Jager Pro said:


> With that said if I saw Bigfoot, aliens, Loch Ness monster, a dragon or any other imaginary creature I would say screw the law and shoot it :lol:


I want to see puff the magic dragon. Probably wouldn't shoot him though.


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## Magnet (Mar 2, 2001)

Have they released the names of the Bay County pair that they arrested? 
Inquiring minds want to know.


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## maurob (May 3, 2013)

I am sure a group of some sort will start a fund to help them pay the fines. They may have been wrong in the eyes of the law and many others, but theyre are a lot of people who actualy live in the U.P. that would rather not have cougers n wolves running through backyards.


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## hillbillie (Jan 16, 2011)

chris-remington said:


> I want to see puff the magic dragon. Probably wouldn't shoot him though.
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


I've seen puff the magic and swore to God I'd never do that stuff again:yikes:


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## 2508speed (Jan 6, 2011)

Magnet said:


> Have they released the names of the Bay County pair that they arrested?
> Inquiring minds want to know.


 I'd like to know too since I'm originally from BC. I bet it will surprise you. Probably one of our so called experts on hunting.


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## Liver and Onions (Nov 24, 2000)

shop tom said:


> Gee, I didn't realize I stepped into the den of the all-knowing cougar experts. Next time I talk to someone who's had a sighting, I'll send them here so the "experts" can tell them how bad their eyesight is.
> 
> Don't you guys have anything better to do?
> 
> tom


The original post was about a real cougar. Not a house cat or stray lab.

What you stepped into was a group that will be very interested when 1 of these LP "sightings" ends up being true. Over the past 50 years a few thousand LP cougar sightings have been reported. So far not a single "sighting" has been able to produce a footprint, scat or photo. Not one. 
There have been a few websites set up to steal contributions(money) from the most gullible among us, like the person who posted that website where the featured picture was of two house cats. You had to notice that, right ?

L & O


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## cooner_jeff (Mar 21, 2006)

I would have shot it


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## GIDEON (Mar 28, 2008)

maurob said:


> I am sure a group of some sort will start a fund to help them pay the fines. They may have been wrong in the eyes of the law and many others, but theyre are a lot of people who actualy live in the U.P. that would rather not have cougers n wolves running through backyards.


Maybe they should move


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## Wolverick (Dec 11, 2008)

cooner, I hope you stay in NJ or where ever you are from. We have enough morons in MI already.


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## Up_North_Hunter (Dec 3, 2013)

I know a friend who was walking in the Yankee Springs area near Gun Lake and saw a cougar. He contacted the DNR and they confirmed the sighting when they found a dead deer in a tree.


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## Liver and Onions (Nov 24, 2000)

Up_North_Hunter said:


> I know a friend who was walking in the Yankee Springs area near Gun Lake and saw a cougar. He contacted the DNR and they confirmed the sighting when they found a dead deer in a tree.


Well, that's news to A. Bump who is in charge of investigating the cougar sightings for the DNR. Why don't you call Bump and find out for yourself that your friend is not telling you the truth ?

L & O


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## kaplan (Dec 26, 2011)

Liver and Onions said:


> Another event by some idiot that makes hunters look bad. I'm glad they were caught and will suffer the consequences.
> 
> L & O



yup


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