# CWAC Mtg



## goosemanrdk (Jan 14, 2003)

craigrh13 said:


> Maybe one of the CWAC guys could step in and discuss why the ridiculous late goose dates and if there is ever a chance of going back to the old dates. Other than that the dates for everything else are great.


I think the thought was trying to have the season open when we had typically had an early February thaw. The old season would progressively loose birds, due to snow and cold, thru January too have them show back up in early February on a thaw. Of course the last two winters have been anything but typical. They have been so nontypical that I can't even try and say that the new dates or old dates would be better for my areas that I hunt.


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## Brougham (Jan 29, 2010)

Looks like a focus on last week of Sept. goose shooting all zones. Teal Sept. 1-7, no additional days added this year. Youth waterfowl second weekend of Sept (12 & 13). Regular openers already set. Some more Hen Mallard chatter. Splits/specifics for August meeting. Also conversation on season openers for next three years and state zone make up discussion coming at August meeting. Bay City area Aug 1st. Info best I remember.


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

waterfowlhunter83 said:


> We are one of the first states to shoot migratory geese...if you want a bag limit of 3 be prepared for an extremely short season. Michigan and other Great Lake states have a lot of goose hunters and a lot of geese are killed here. Everything has to be balanced...higher hunter numbers, higher bag limit, and the same season length is going to put more pressure on population numbers.


This is very exaggerated, 10% of waterfowl hunters kill 90% of the birds. You should really take a stroll to N IL why the limit is not 3 is beyond me, it was 3 a handful of years ago then it got dropped. If anything more hunting makes the birds smarter and tougher. Shoot into a flock of 50 for 2 birds with 3 guys and 90% of the time I can guarantee not all three shoot their 2 birds, just educated 44 more birds. Look at the Todd farm, goose numbers can be high but we all know they get sky busted, called heavily at, and see the same spreads in the same fields. They fly further to feed. 

The population of the canada goose is not hurting. Taken directly from the DNR website.

In Michigan, the number of giant Canada geese counted each spring increased from about 9,000 in 1970 to over 300,000 today. Giant Canada geese nest in every Michigan county, but are most common (80 percent of population) in the southern third of the state.


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

goosemanrdk said:


> I think the thought was trying to have the season open when we had typically had an early February thaw. The old season would progressively loose birds, due to snow and cold, thru January too have them show back up in early February on a thaw. Of course the last two winters have been anything but typical. They have been so nontypical that I can't even try and say that the new dates or old dates would be better for my areas that I hunt.


Cut the dates and go to a March, 15 day 5 bird day season.


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## mkubiak (Feb 21, 2006)

We have shot some bands from Partridge Island, Attawapiskat, and Thunder Bay during the late season. I have seen some of these places reported from fellow MS members as well.


They probably think the risk of shooting migrators based off band returns is a lot higher during the last week of December, 1st 2 weeks of January is a lot higher than any of the other weeks in January and 1st few in February.


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

mkubiak said:


> We have shot some bands from Partridge Island, Attawapiskat, and Thunder Bay during the late season. I have seen some of these places reported from fellow MS members as well.
> 
> 
> They probably think the risk of shooting migrators based off band returns is a lot higher during the last week of December, 1st 2 weeks of January is a lot higher than any of the other weeks in January and 1st few in February.


Do away with late season, run the season with a 3 bird limit until end of January?


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## backroadstravler (Jul 12, 2006)

There is going to be an opening for a SW at large rep. I am done in Aug.


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## lastflight (Aug 16, 2005)

SBE II said:


> In Michigan, the number of giant Canada geese counted each spring increased from about 9,000 in 1970 to over 300,000 today. Giant Canada geese nest in every Michigan county, but are most common (80 percent of population) in the southern third of the state.


Exactly. And that is why we have very liberal early and late season limits that specifically target this population of resident geese.

The limits for the regular season are not based on the Michigan resident goose population. They are based on the population of migrating geese from certain areas in Ontario that come through Michigan throughout the fall.


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

lastflight said:


> Exactly. And that is why we have very liberal early and late season limits that specifically target this population of resident geese.
> 
> The limits for the regular season are not based on the Michigan resident goose population. They are based on the population of migrating geese from certain areas in Ontario that come through Michigan throughout the fall.


LOL, key number here is 80%, trust me you're not going to dent the population by having an early 5 bird season and 3 bird season that runs through the end of January. But the late season dates are garbage so it's pretty well pointless. I wonder what participation is like the past 2 years.


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## goosemanrdk (Jan 14, 2003)

SBE II said:


> LOL, key number here is 80%, trust me you're not going to dent the population by having an early 5 bird season and 3 bird season that runs through the end of January. But the late season dates are garbage so it's pretty well pointless. I wonder what participation is like the past 2 years.


Stale, educated locals vs. fresh, dumb migrants, who's gonna potentially get hammered harder(especially in the early part of "regular" season)?


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

goosemanrdk said:


> Stale, educated locals vs. fresh, dumb migrants, who's gonna potentially get hammered harder(especially in the early part of "regular" season)?


Stale is all weather driven, like in the beginning of November when there was a cold snap then after that no weather occurred everything became stale. New birds move in early to mid december, you'll get the mix of migrants and residents in feeds. This is why I say stay at 3 and run from October until the end of January. Illinois does it and have been at 2 for sometime and the population is increasing crazy and I guarantee there's A LOT more competition in IL than SW MI. 

Question would be, if you keep the early 5 and shoot 3 as described above for the regular season, what will be the numbers on harvest compared to a late season. I'm betting either identical or more, having the ability to shoot 1 more bird throughout the season might increase participation.


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## wavie (Feb 2, 2004)

Il shoots mostly MVP migrants. MI has the good fortune of shooting SJBP birds mostly exclusively in SE MI and SW Ont(unfortunately their population wasn't doing so well and lead to the reduction in bag limits). Cant really compare the two populations and bag limits. 

Why not way on the side of caution or possibly end up like the Atlantic flyway did 10 yrs ago. I would care to say that the majority of birds we've taken during the regular season are SJBP migrants, based on their size. Sure we shoot some big ones but the migrants, decoy recklessly. MI does a good job at wacking SJBP geese so I'm all for tighter restictions based on facts from reputable BIOLOGISTS.

As for the late season (the last 14 I've been in MI), I would have given my left n#t to hunt into february. These last 2 years were much colder but we still were getting on birds, just have to work harder.

I personally think the seasons are great just the way they are. Over lapping a 2 day late duck hunt with chance for some late goose doesn't make or break a season for me. Look at Ont late goose, 7-10 days the first week of march. I would much rather have a 30 day season (ie more opportunity) than a 7-10 day season.

CWAC reps your doing a good job, thanks.


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## ducksarge (Jul 3, 2011)

I personally think the seasons are great just the way they are. Over lapping a 2 day late duck hunt with chance for some late goose doesn't make or break a season for me. Look at Ont late goose, 7-10 days the first week of march. I would much rather have a 30 day season (ie more opportunity) than a 7-10 day season.


I disagree on this one. I would much rather have a quality 7-10 day season rather than a 30 day season with not much going on.


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## KLR (Sep 2, 2006)

The next couple years are going to be fairly important decision making years, and the processes by which season dates, zones, and bag limits are _potentially_ changing at the Fed level.

I believe 4 CWAC member terms expire this year, and it appears at least 1 will need to be filled - soooo.... 


http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/CWAC_Application_420772_7.pdf



We are struggling to maintain hunter numbers, let alone recruit new - I'd encourage all of you to think about getting involved in some way.


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## Far Beyond Driven (Jan 23, 2006)

Are the extra birds in IL a function of increased population or are they the result of short stopping? Ballard County in Kentucky used to be the spot for winter geese; now you can't get a bird there...


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## field-n-feathers (Oct 20, 2008)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> Are the extra birds in IL a function of increased population or are they the result of short stopping? Ballard County in Kentucky used to be the spot for winter geese; now you can't get a bird there...


Large numbers of geese in Southern Illinois and Western Kentucky are largely weather driven.


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

wavie said:


> Il shoots mostly MVP migrants. MI has the good fortune of shooting SJBP birds mostly exclusively in SE MI and SW Ont(unfortunately their population wasn't doing so well and lead to the reduction in bag limits). Cant really compare the two populations and bag limits.
> 
> Why not way on the side of caution or possibly end up like the Atlantic flyway did 10 yrs ago. I would care to say that the majority of birds we've taken during the regular season are SJBP migrants, based on their size. Sure we shoot some big ones but the migrants, decoy recklessly. MI does a good job at wacking SJBP geese so I'm all for tighter restictions based on facts from reputable BIOLOGISTS.
> 
> ...


SW MI used to be a part of this MVP zone if you recall, that zone stopped in Branch county...I'd take the 7-10 day season in March, better hunting.


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## SBE II (Jan 13, 2009)

Far Beyond Driven said:


> Are the extra birds in IL a function of increased population or are they the result of short stopping? Ballard County in Kentucky used to be the spot for winter geese; now you can't get a bird there...


Both, abundance of grains and water are major factors in the migration everywhere. I believe there was an article in wildfowl that indicate migration is occurring typically 2-3 weeks later than normal. Birds in N IL don't move, they only multiply. It takes some serious serious cold weather.


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