# Bear bait barrel holes



## Lindsey

I was reading the 2020 Michigan Bear Digest today and found two statements that seem odd to me. Maybe one of you can help me understand what Michigan DNR really intends.

https://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/Bear_Hunting_Digest_454168_7.pdf

On pages 15 and 16, the digest states:

"Bait Barrel Requirements 
• Private Lands 
◊ Barrels are LEGAL on private lands. 
◘ *The maximum hole diameter in the barrel shall be 1 inch.*​
Commercial Forest Lands or U.S. Forest Service lands 
◊ Barrels are ILLEGAL on Commercial Forest lands and U.S. Forest Service lands. 

DNR Managed Lands 
◊ Barrels are LEGAL on DNR managed lands ONLY IF ALL OF THE FOLLOWING APPLY: 
◘ Barrel is at least 33 gallons in size. 
◘ Barrel is steel. 
◘ Barrel must have a mechanically attached, securely affixed lid and *no more than three open holes, each hole no greater than 1 inch in diameter."*​
Is this a typo or does MDNR really only allow 1" diameter holes in a bear bait barrel? 
1-inch holes in a bear bait barrel seem awfully small to me.


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## shaffe48b

Yup. Forum search function will save me and perhaps others further itching. Wait I forgot a 'b' in the last word.


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## cotote wacker

Michigan Bear Hunters are the ones to blame for the 1" hole in barrels on PRIVATE LANDS...they are the ones that influence the bear regulation to there liking....reason is because most members are HOUND HUNTERS....
Its a shame that HOUND HUNTERS are so selfish to separate hunters even more by a regulation that has noting to do with them except cause more hate from private land owners...its bad enough that they have no regard for private land running there hounds and Trespass Laws are in there favor...


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## sureshot006

Lindsey said:


> I was reading the 2020 Michigan Bear Digest today and found two statements that seem odd to me. Maybe one of you can help me understand what Michigan DNR really intends.
> 
> https://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/Bear_Hunting_Digest_454168_7.pdf
> 
> On pages 15 and 16, the digest states:
> 
> "Bait Barrel Requirements
> • Private Lands
> ◊ Barrels are LEGAL on private lands.
> ◘ *The maximum hole diameter in the barrel shall be 1 inch.*​
> Commercial Forest Lands or U.S. Forest Service lands
> ◊ Barrels are ILLEGAL on Commercial Forest lands and U.S. Forest Service lands.
> 
> DNR Managed Lands
> ◊ Barrels are LEGAL on DNR managed lands ONLY IF ALL OF THE FOLLOWING APPLY:
> ◘ Barrel is at least 33 gallons in size.
> ◘ Barrel is steel.
> ◘ Barrel must have a mechanically attached, securely affixed lid and *no more than three open holes, each hole no greater than 1 inch in diameter."*​
> Is this a typo or does MDNR really only allow 1" diameter holes in a bear bait barrel?
> 1-inch holes in a bear bait barrel seem awfully small to me.


You're reading it correctly. If you use a barrel it cannot have holes any larger than 1". It nearly makes barrels useless.


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## Jaspo

I hunt private land in the Newberry unit, last year was the first year using a barrel with one inch holes for us. We filled the barrel with dog food, sweet feed, old peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and Three rocks the size of bowling balls to keep everything crumbled. The bears had no problem rolling food out of the holes. In our experience it kept the bears longer at the bait and kept out the raccoons and other vermin. So really only problem I have is not being able to use them on Federal lands and the 100yds from the road on public.


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## cotote wacker

Jaspo said:


> I hunt private land in the Newberry unit, last year was the first year using a barrel with one inch holes for us. We filled the barrel with dog food, sweet feed, old peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and Three rocks the size of bowling balls to keep everything crumbled. The bears had no problem rolling food out of the holes. In our experience it kept the bears longer at the bait and kept out the raccoons and other vermin. So really only problem I have is not being able to use them on Federal lands and the 100yds from the road on public.


"Shaker Barrels" do work good for pre-hunt baiting been using them for over 40 years...I have always used 1 1/2" holes they work better....never get clogged....I never keep a "Shaker Barrel" at the bait site when hunting....
Only problem with "Shaker Barrels" is getting the perfect shot with a bear moving most of the time or being behind the barrel....
Using a 55 gallon barrel with a 9" hole above the second ring attached to a tree upright so it doesn't move gives the perfect quartering behind the shoulder shot with its arm in the barrel getting food....I also put a couple 3' long logs in the hole it keeps even the wolves out until a bear pulls them out....never minded a squirrel or marten grabbing a cookie or donut...

Putting a barrel with a chain 8' long on State Land would cause more damage to trees and the forest floor than a barrel chained to a tree with a 9" hole....I've had to bring a couple yards of dirt to patch up holes bears have dug where a "Shaker Barrel" has been....


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## Nostromo

Jaspo said:


> I hunt private land in the Newberry unit, last year was the first year using a barrel with one inch holes for us. We filled the barrel with dog food, sweet feed, old peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and Three rocks the size of bowling balls to keep everything crumbled. The bears had no problem rolling food out of the holes. In our experience it kept the bears longer at the bait and kept out the raccoons and other vermin. So really only problem I have is not being able to use them on Federal lands and the 100yds from the road on public.


The rocks are a great idea. Nobody seems to like the new barrel rule. But they can be useful in certain situations I guess.

Good luck this season!


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## gills

The raccoons can still put on the feed bag with one inch holes! But popcorn ( crushed a little) and dog food worked fine.


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## Winterover

I agree with your reply Coyote Wacker. I am a member of MBHA and am a bait hunter. I have nothing against the hound hunters as it is a legal way to hunt and I will not go hunter against hunter bickering because we all need to stick together to preserve our sport. I know myself and a few others have been doing our best to urge more bait hunters to join so we are equally represented by the group. It is quite obvious that a lot of the barrel law was geared toward the hound hunters. Just look at the 100 yd rule. The majority of bait hunters hunt further than this from a road. I would encourage any bait hunters out there to join. The newsletter contains a lot of info and you also get a subscription to bear hunters magazine that has a lot of neat articles and information in it. The magazine alone makes the subscription worth it.


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## shaffe48b

I dont personally disagree with coyote wacker. I havent even been following this forum a year. I do know it's been over before and no one who likes this 1 inch rule is willing to admit it.

I'm part of the association. The incentives are against bait hunters getting too involved. There's only so many oportunities to hunt every year or every other and if more people did this then those wouldnt exist either. I'm interested in bear mostly because I hunt mostly out of state.

Hound hunters are always running either for someone else or just training. Anyone who owns hunting dogs know this.


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## cotote wacker

Winterover said:


> I agree with your reply Coyote Wacker. I am a member of MBHA and am a bait hunter. I have nothing against the hound hunters as it is a legal way to hunt and I will not go hunter against hunter bickering because we all need to stick together to preserve our sport. I know myself and a few others have been doing our best to urge more bait hunters to join so we are equally represented by the group. It is quite obvious that a lot of the barrel law was geared toward the hound hunters. Just look at the 100 yd rule. The majority of bait hunters hunt further than this from a road. I would encourage any bait hunters out there to join. The newsletter contains a lot of info and you also get a subscription to bear hunters magazine that has a lot of neat articles and information in it. The magazine alone makes the subscription worth it.


Was a member for several decades also a hound hunter at the time, then spent a life time of savings and still paying $5000 a year on taxes of prime bear hunting land. I quit hound hunting for deer and bear bait hunting. MBHA no longer fit in with the type of hunting I did, nor did there agenda towards bear hunting.
I have been thinking about forming a group or association aimed at strictly bait hunters. We need a group to represent bait hunters at NRC meeting and also in Lansing. I'am not trying to drive a wedge between hound and bait hunters but feel that there's no fair repesintation for bait hunters. Out of the 7000 +or- bear hunters every year most are bait hunters exclusively.


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## Luv2hunteup

cotote wacker said:


> Was a member for several decades also a hound hunter at the time, then spent a life time of savings and still paying $5000 a year on taxes of prime bear hunting land. I quit hound hunting for deer and bear bait hunting. MBHA no longer fit in with the type of hunting I did, nor did there agenda towards bear hunting.
> I have been thinking about forming a group or association aimed at strictly bait hunters. We need a group to represent bait hunters at NRC meeting and also in Lansing. I'am not trying to drive a wedge between hound and bait hunters but feel that there's no fair repesintation for bait hunters. Out of the 7000 +or- bear hunters every year most are bait hunters exclusively.


You need to get a seat at the Bear Forum that takes place in a December in St. Ignace. That’s where all the heavy lifting takes place.


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## cotote wacker

Luv2hunteup said:


> You need to get a seat at the Bear Forum that takes place in a December in St. Ignace. That’s where all the heavy lifting takes place.


No excuse it just seems the weather is bad for travel or being December family
I have in the past submitted letters on my thoughts about baiting, guides and seasons. All of them could be use to improvement for the better of the bears and quality of the hunting experience.

Guides should bid and pay fee's on individual hunting areas, that would help pay for enforcement of them, not just tell it DNR this is the county I'am in. Guides are given a resource for free to use and make money off it and not paying us anything for it. They don't even pay sales tax because its a service. I doubt many they even pay income tax on the cash. We all buy a license to use the resource they should also. Even commercial fishermen pay large license fees to make a profit, timber harvesters bid and pay to harvest our trees and oil companies also.

Bear season is too long and so are hunt periods. After the first weekend in October bears are trying to put the last couple pounds on for winter and there's not much other than mast crops then.. It's also the time that a sow that is pregnant if she does't have enough fat reserves will not have any cubs that winter. It's been noted in studies that a minimum weight of 160 lbs. is needed. With the demise of beech trees in the UP that food source is all but gone. Running dogs on bears where every pound could make a difference is wrong and not the best for reproduction or health in October. 
Most hunters only hunt maybe a week they don't need over a month having hunts over lap makes too much competition, conflicts and wasted hunting opportunities. First could be a hunt for 5 days around the 5 of September, the second hunt 7 days, third 7 days could even put a forth hunt for 10 days ending first week in October, none of the hunts over lap. Instead of having bait or hound only hunting, use the previous years number of harvested bears by bait or hounds be use to divide the tags for the first 2 hunts. So there would be a baiting or hound hunting tags only. It would give more hunting opportunities and maybe cut years off getting a tag.

Barrels should be able to be used no restrictions on hole size, must be if a "shaker type" a chain attached. If stationary must be chained or cabled to a tree or post If you want to use a barrel a "Barrel Permit'' would be need at a cost of $20 on public land. Drivers License number would need to be welded to the barrel. Removing after a hunt or the season required. There also needs to be a minimum distance that a bait can be put on public land from a dwelling, 500 yards is still close but better than the none now.

Everybody might not 100% agree with some of my thoughts, but we have had too many decades of the same old rules and laws. Some changes are needed, hopefully for the best for the bears and hunters.


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## jjlrrw

Sounds like the barrel is anchored to a post or stake, so we need to use a 4x4 post maybe a metal fence post? How does one attach a chain, does it need to be welded or can it be threaded through two holes and would these holes count toward you maximum 3 total? 

Barrel is at least 33 gallons in size. 
Barrel is steel. 
Barrel must have a mechanically attached, securely affixed lid and *no more than three open holes, each hole no greater than 1 inch in diameter.* 
*Barrel is securely anchored to a post or stake in the ground with a chain or cable no greater than 8 feet in length. *
The users or individuals possessing the barrel must permanently affix their complete Michigan driver’s license number, valid nonresident driver’s license number or DNR Sportscard number on a tag to the outside of the barrel. 
There is a maximum of one barrel per bait station. 
Barrel is placed no more than 100 yards from a state forest road or a roadway. 
Bait inside the barrel must be removed at the close of the bear season in that Bear Management Unit. 
Barrels must be removed no later than five days after the close of the bear season.


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## cotote wacker

jjlrrw said:


> Sounds like the barrel is anchored to a post or stake, so we need to use a 4x4 post maybe a metal fence post? How does one attach a chain, does it need to be welded or can it be threaded through two holes and would these holes count toward you maximum 3 total?
> 
> Barrel is at least 33 gallons in size.
> Barrel is steel.
> Barrel must have a mechanically attached, securely affixed lid and *no more than three open holes, each hole no greater than 1 inch in diameter.*
> *Barrel is securely anchored to a post or stake in the ground with a chain or cable no greater than 8 feet in length. *
> The users or individuals possessing the barrel must permanently affix their complete Michigan driver’s license number, valid nonresident driver’s license number or DNR Sportscard number on a tag to the outside of the barrel.
> There is a maximum of one barrel per bait station.
> Barrel is placed no more than 100 yards from a state forest road or a roadway.
> Bait inside the barrel must be removed at the close of the bear season in that Bear Management Unit.
> Barrels must be removed no later than five days after the close of the bear season.


Depending on what type of soil...if softer....I've used the painted green solid not the stamped steel 4" fence posts weld 2' up 1/8" x 4'x6" plates opposite the ones that came on the post  a 3" round plate welded to the top then a 3/8" rod made into a 2" I.D. ring with a heavy chain swivel on the ring about 2' from the barrel put a another swivel and weld the chain to the lip[ of the barrel....
The whole secret of not having the post (stake)pulled out is keeping the end of the chain close to the ground so the bear cannot get leverage to loosen the post (stake)....
Bears are strong and very persistent rolling the barrel without swivels they tangle a chain into a knot of steel, sticks, twigs and mud you will need a hammer to and screw driver to untangle....
Bears with a "Shaker Barrel" will turn a once beautiful forest floor to a churned up mess like a plow went threw....if thy do get the barrel free from the post(stake) it might be 100's of yards away....I remember once looking for a barrel it was 300 yards down in the swamp....


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## Neubys

Jaspo said:


> I hunt private land in the Newberry unit, last year was the first year using a barrel with one inch holes for us. We filled the barrel with dog food, sweet feed, old peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and Three rocks the size of bowling balls to keep everything crumbled. The bears had no problem rolling food out of the holes. In our experience it kept the bears longer at the bait and kept out the raccoons and other vermin. So really only problem I have is not being able to use them on Federal lands and the 100yds from the road on public.


I just finished building my barrel and I really like the idea of adding rocks to keep things from sticking together. Good thinking!! How many holes did you put in yours? I'm on private land so I added extra.


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## Neubys

Winterover said:


> I agree with your reply Coyote Wacker. I am a member of MBHA and am a bait hunter. I have nothing against the hound hunters as it is a legal way to hunt and I will not go hunter against hunter bickering because we all need to stick together to preserve our sport. I know myself and a few others have been doing our best to urge more bait hunters to join so we are equally represented by the group. It is quite obvious that a lot of the barrel law was geared toward the hound hunters. Just look at the 100 yd rule. The majority of bait hunters hunt further than this from a road. I would encourage any bait hunters out there to join. The newsletter contains a lot of info and you also get a subscription to bear hunters magazine that has a lot of neat articles and information in it. The magazine alone makes the subscription worth it.


I agree with you that more bear hunters need to join. I'm a recent member to MBHA pretty much a bait hunter, but I support hound hunting as well. In fact, I would love to either try it or tag along sometime on a hound hunt. It's no different than using beagles to run rabbits which I used to do. We need to support each other in our efforts.


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## Jaspo

Neubys said:


> I just finished building my barrel and I really like the idea of adding rocks to keep things from sticking together. Good thinking!! How many holes did you put in yours? I'm on private land so I added extra.
> View attachment 556279


in

We just used 6 holes, all going down one side. Also wired logs to act as a fence to keep barrel from tangling around anything and giving us broadside opportunities. If I use the barrel this year I may consider welding washers over the holes to prevent them from ripping.


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## Hear fishy fishy

Can you still use a 55 gallon barrel to put the bait in so when they knock it over they can get the food out? No stakes or holes just a 55 gallon drum up right? It would keep the other critters out of the bait.


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## cotote wacker

Hear fishy fishy said:


> Can you still use a 55 gallon barrel to put the bait in so when they knock it over they can get the food out? No stakes or holes just a 55 gallon drum up right? It would keep the other critters out of the bait.


It could be a way to challenge the way the law is written....it doesn't say the barrel needs to have top, bottom and sides attached....on State land it does need a chain or cable 8' or less....

Back when I first started bear hunting I used a barrel with a open top and a large rock on top holding the lid on with a crib backing and sides so when the bear pulled the barrel over it would give a broad side shot....it worked OK the big problem is once the barrel is pulled over any and all critters had easy pickins what was left of the bait....
Also with out a "lid" cover on the top rain will ruin donuts, granola and wash sweet stuff in to a mush mess wasting it....holes in the bottom will help drain water but still waste bait....


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