# Sharp chainsaw?!.



## FullQuiver (May 2, 2006)

Reading over another post here and not wanting to derail the other thread I thought that I might tackle the topic of keeping your chainsaw sharp and why even a "slightly dull" saw isn't in your best interest..

I cut wood lots of wood, my children think that it's my favorite hobby,(it's not) and I cut with a lot of people helping them out. I used to do it for a living and even a side income for many years..

I have watched the hazards and just inconvenience by many of trying to cut with dull saws.. 

In felling trees it's imperative to have a saw that is scary sharp. I mean that you should be afraid of grabbing the chainsaw by the bar even when not running sharp. That the slightest slip against even a stationary chain should cut you like a pig.. Trust me it becomes very difficult sometimes virtually impossible to make certain types of cuts with anything but the sharpest chains on your saws.. Trying to plunge cut a hardwood like white oak, hickory or hard maple with any semblance of control becomes very difficult without a very sharp saw.

Even bucking logs safely and efficiently often requires the chain to be very sharp.. Less pressure, less chance of kickbacks, and much better control of your saw is possible.

So for you guys out doing habitat work or cutting firewood or just removing unwanted debris or timber remember to keep your saw scary sharp. It might make a difference in your safety and even if it doesn't it will save you time and wear and tear in your saws..


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## scubajay (Jun 9, 2003)

I don't cut a ton of wood, but I cut a fair amount. I am with you on the sharp saw... gotta be razor sharp. I use one of the 2-1 sharpeners that cuts the top of the tooth, the gullet, and adjust the depth gauge/raker all in one motion. Also, I wear chaps, hardhat w/ hearing protection & face shield, sturdy boots, and good tight fitting leather gloves.


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## MichiFishy (Sep 17, 2019)

Everyone makes fun of the guy who files with every fill-up. Usually he's the guy who cuts the most wood. Plus it's a good excuse to take a little break and have a smoke if ya want.


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## FullQuiver (May 2, 2006)

MichiFishy said:


> Everyone makes fun of the guy who files with every fill-up. Usually he's the guy who cuts the most wood. Plus it's a good excuse to take a little break and have a smoke if ya want.


I don't smoke but I sure appreciate the break... Not to mention I take a certain amount of pride in the amount of wood I cut in a given time..


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## fog107 (Oct 31, 2014)

much easier to sharpen than to cut with a dull saw chain


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## Martin Looker (Jul 16, 2015)

A sharp saw makes the whole job easier and safer.


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## o_mykiss (May 21, 2013)

An addendum, is not only sharpen it right, but also take care to keep it sharp. Way easier to keep it sharp than re-sharpen

Don't ding it into the dirt, check for nails/wire/dirt on and in logs. Put the scabbard on if you're putting it in a truck, etc.


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## martini77 (Jan 13, 2009)

I cut wood to heat my home, I try to keep my chains nice and sharp. I cut 95% oak, so I need it sharp. I have sharpened when filling, but I am doing something wrong. I follow the angle on file guide, but for some reason I get one side either wrong or not as sharp because after a few filings I start cutting C's in the logs. Any advice on what I am doing wrong?


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## Martin Looker (Jul 16, 2015)

When I do that I take it to the saw shop and they put it back where it is supposed to be.


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## scubajay (Jun 9, 2003)

martini77 said:


> I cut wood to heat my home, I try to keep my chains nice and sharp. I cut 95% oak, so I need it sharp. I have sharpened when filling, but I am doing something wrong. I follow the angle on file guide, but for some reason I get one side either wrong or not as sharp because after a few filings I start cutting C's in the logs. Any advice on what I am doing wrong?


Here is a pretty good video on the causes of angled cuts.


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## cedarlkDJ (Sep 2, 2002)

scubajay said:


> I use one of the 2-1 sharpeners that cuts the top of the tooth, the gullet, and adjust the depth gauge/raker all in one motion.


I've always hand sharpened/rakers down but, with old age I bought one of these...https://www.amazon.com/Pferd-17301P.../B003M4LGPE/ref=psdc_3480720011_t1_B00HY96EW8
They invented it and sold the design to Stihl but then marketed it them themselves in blue instead of orange.
It's a little less expensive than Stihl and I haven't used it yet so, will have to see.
I've always had to fine tune a grinder saw chain. They are alright for really dull/hitting metal quickie.


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## cedarlkDJ (Sep 2, 2002)

scubajay said:


> Here is a pretty good video on the causes of angled cuts.


That guy is funny but, knows his stuff!


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## scubajay (Jun 9, 2003)

cedarlkDJ said:


> I've always hand sharpened/rakers down but, with old age I bought one of these...https://www.amazon.com/Pferd-17301P.../B003M4LGPE/ref=psdc_3480720011_t1_B00HY96EW8
> They invented it and sold the design to Stihl but then marketed it them themselves in blue instead of orange.
> It's a little less expensive than Stihl and I haven't used it yet so, will have to see.
> I've always had to fine tune a grinder saw chain. They are alright for really dull/hitting metal quickie.


 Being a certified cheapskate, i bought the blue one from Pferd. As I understand it, Pferd builds the Stihl orange-white version. They are made in Germany, and seems to be of very good quality.


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## scubajay (Jun 9, 2003)

cedarlkDJ said:


> That guy is funny but, knows his stuff!


Most importantly he helps you select which beer helps the repair go better.


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## StevenJ (Feb 11, 2009)

I don't cut much with my six chainsaws these days. But in the words of Farmlegend: "new chains are inexpensive, who's got time to file them?..."


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## martini77 (Jan 13, 2009)

StevenJ said:


> I don't cut much with my six chainsaws these days. But in the words of Farmlegend: "new chains are inexpensive, who's got time to file them?..."



Good point, that is why I have 6 chains, one gets dull swap it out and then take a bunch in to get sharpened.


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## grapestomper (Jan 9, 2012)

I have around 6 chains or more also. 
Usually take at least 3 with me. 
I hate sharpening with a file. I have a bench mount sharpener. 
Brings them back to like new. Sharp is the way to go. No fun and dangerous with a dull chain.


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## StevenJ (Feb 11, 2009)

What is the cost for taking them into sharpen these days? If it costs $10 to sharpen, I'd rather spend $15 for a new one and dispose of the old one. 

I would normally take them to a place called Weingartz. 

I bought an electrical grinder sharpener a while ago. But I actually never used it once.


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## usedtobeayooper (Feb 13, 2008)

I guess I'm the file at every fill up guy. Can't imagine joining the toss it and buy a new one crowd. A cared for chain can last through a whole lot of 5 minute filings... if you keep it out of the dirt, you can return a darn nice edge with very little tooth loss each time. They last a long time when taken care of. And they're sharp. 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Quack Addict (Aug 10, 2006)

StevenJ said:


> What is the cost for taking them into sharpen these days? If it costs $10 to sharpen, I'd rather spend $15 for a new one and dispose of the old one.
> 
> I would normally take them to a place called Weingartz.
> 
> I bought an electrical grinder sharpener a while ago. But I actually never used it once.


Totally depends on what kind of chain you're talking about. My cheapest firewood chains are about $30/ea; the ones for my big saw run $75/ea.

When cutting firewood I touch up the chain with a file every fill up. I usually have about 6 spare chains on hand and change out when any more than a couple licks with the file won't get it done. My Oregon bench grinder makes short work of the dullest chain, usually about 5 minutes for a 20" chain unless the depth gauges need to be adjusted.

Before we moved a few years back an old man down the road cared for my chains. He had a simple "chains sharpened" sign out in front of his house. He charged $2.50 a chain and I always felt guilty giving him less than $20 even for 3 chains. The last time he ground chains for me, we shared a beer and chatted a bit when I picked them up. A couple months later I noticed an estate sale at his house while driving by


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## Mike Kautz (Jan 22, 2017)

Get one of these and never look back


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## Dish7 (Apr 2, 2017)

cedarlkDJ said:


> I've always hand sharpened/rakers down but, with old age I bought one of these...https://www.amazon.com/Pferd-17301P.../B003M4LGPE/ref=psdc_3480720011_t1_B00HY96EW8
> They invented it and sold the design to Stihl but then marketed it them themselves in blue instead of orange.
> It's a little less expensive than Stihl and I haven't used it yet so, will have to see.
> I've always had to fine tune a grinder saw chain. They are alright for really dull/hitting metal quickie.


I have the Stihl version. Best sharpener that I have ever owned by far.


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## scubajay (Jun 9, 2003)

Mike Kautz said:


> Get one of these and never look back
> View attachment 635799


IMO, Never looking back with one of these sharpeners will have your saw chain performing poorly in short order.

Here are the problems as I see it using those things:

1. The stone wears quickly resulting in a poor gullet profile;
2. It's easy to overheat the tooth rendering it useless;
3. They do nothing to adjust the depth gauge.

There have been lots of do-dads invented trying to improve on the tried and true file, but none really have. I believe that the Pferd or Stihl file tool mentioned several times above is the best configuration of files; allowing for quick, repeatable, and accurate chain sharpening.


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## Mike Kautz (Jan 22, 2017)

scubajay said:


> IMO, Never looking back with one of these sharpeners will have your saw chain performing poorly in short order.
> 
> Here are the problems as I see it using those things:
> 
> ...


I agree it has to be used properly. But if you use it properly I believe it works awesome. I grind them with little pressure and consistent angle. My saws cut like new every time out using this tool. And I heat our home with a wood boiler so we cut a lot of wood. I rarely file the rackers on the chain cause I believe if you use this tool correctly you shouldn’t have to. I guess just grind them slower. Mine never get hot or even close to burning and my stone last a year easy.


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## Quack Addict (Aug 10, 2006)

scubajay said:


> IMO, Never looking back with one of these sharpeners will have your saw chain performing poorly in short order.
> 
> Here are the problems as I see it using those things:
> 
> ...


That is similar to my Oregon grinder and guessing by your comments, you haven't used one. I have run about 100 chains from 14" pico to 36" 3/8 on mine and the wheel has no discernable wear. Still cuts perfect gullets. When it does eventually wear down it is easy to re-profile wheels with a stone. Depth of cut is easy to adjust. I just sharpened a pair of 20" 3/8 chains earlier tonight in about 10 minutes. 

Depth gauges do not need to be adjusted every grind, especially if you're just doing a touch up. Over doing it on depth gauges is one of the fastest ways to junk a chain.

Bench grinders can overheat a tooth and anneal it - if you don't know what you're doing. The proper method is not to grind the tooth in 1 fell swoop. You take a couple bites at it to allow the heat to dissipate and cool. Even so, grinding a tooth only takes a couple seconds.

My grinder does adjust depth gauges but I have to change wheels first to do it. I had to profile that wheel with a stone as I needed an angled wheel, not square cut like it came. I hang sharpened chains on a nail in my barn that need the depth gauges ground then do 5 or 6 at a time before putting them back into service. 

There's some good videos on Youtube on how to properly set up and use a grinder.


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## 22 Chuck (Feb 2, 2006)

As important as a sharp chain or more so is the best hearing protection at least NRR of 30. 
You may not think so now but wait till 60 or 65 and you cant hear and aids are several thousand $$..


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## Martin Looker (Jul 16, 2015)

Ringing in your ears sucks


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## brushbuster (Nov 9, 2009)

People have lost the art of sharpening tools, its incredible. like how much time does it take to sharpen a damn tool? I run a bunch of chains, part of the job at the end of the job is to sharpen my tools.


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## Detroitbassist (Jul 6, 2018)

Don't forget to dress the bar! If you can feel a ridge building up along the edge, flat file or stone it off. That can cause the curved cuts mentioned earlier, and increase friction.


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## martini77 (Jan 13, 2009)

I want to say the last time I took chains in to get sharpened it was $5 or$6 each. Not sure if they are still doing it but Bader and Son's were chraging $10 for a new chain when you brought in an old one instead of sharpening them.


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## Martin Looker (Jul 16, 2015)

I don't buy the cheapest chain I can find and good ones aren't cheap but they cut better and last longer before needing to be filed.


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## Wild Thing (Mar 19, 2010)

StevenJ said:


> *I don't cut much with my six chainsaws these days. But in the words of Farmlegend: "new chains are inexpensive, who's got time to file them?..."*


All I've gotta say to this is - YOU (and Farmlegend) HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING STEVEN J. 

I guess the value of your statement is best described in the first sentence...._*I don't cut much with my six chainsaws these days.
*_
If you are going to use a chain saw - learn how to sharpen the chain and do it regularly.

I agree with Dish and others who mentioned that this is the best tool going...

The Stihl 2 in 1 sharpener...and the stump vice comes in handy as well.


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## FullQuiver (May 2, 2006)

StevenJ said:


> I don't cut much with my six chainsaws these days. But in the words of Farmlegend: "new chains are inexpensive, who's got time to file them?..."


Because I can sharpen my saws in less time than it would take you to change the chain.. Changing chains instead of sharpening is wasting time and money...


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## Wild Thing (Mar 19, 2010)

FullQuiver said:


> Because I can sharpen my saws in less time than it would take you to change the chain.. Changing chains instead of sharpening is wasting time and money...


Yep - Who's got time to go and buy a new chain when you sharpen can one much faster. SMH


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## martini77 (Jan 13, 2009)

I only run stihl chains myself.


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## Quack Addict (Aug 10, 2006)

martini77 said:


> I only run stihl chains myself.


Same here, for the most part.

I did try a cheap 20x3/8 chain on Feebay a while back and was pleasantly surprised though. It was $17 delivered to my door. Subjectively, it stayed sharp and cut as fast as my Stihl chains.

A big problem with that chain revealed itself this past weekend when cutting in ~20° weather. The drive links are not embossed like Stihl to pull oil around the bar. As such, the chain froze to the bar a couple times. After putting a sharpened Stihl back on there were no more freeze ups. Cut about 5 face cords of oak, cherry and maple that day.

I'd have to say the cheap chains without oil grooves and embossing on the drive links beat up a bar faster.


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## grapestomper (Jan 9, 2012)

You should try Carlton Chains. They sharpen well and run great. Around $14.00 each. 



FullQuiver said:


> Because I can sharpen my saws in less time than it would take you to change the chain.. Changing chains instead of sharpening is wasting time and money...


 So how long does it take to sharpen your chain. You must be super fast.


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## FullQuiver (May 2, 2006)

grapestomper said:


> You should try Carlton Chains. They sharpen well and run great. Around $14.00 each.
> 
> So how long does it take to sharpen your chain. You must be super fast.


I never timed myself before today so I went out and sharpened my chain in my 2152 Jonsered today and it took me from putting it in my stump vise to pulling it out just under 4 minutes... I didn't change a chain well because I didn't have one that needed changed.. However I can't imagine that it would be faster for me for many reasons..


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## Detroitbassist (Jul 6, 2018)

As was stated above, maintaining an edge (a stroke or 2 per link if sharpened frequently enough) is a lot quicker than sharpening a blade that's so dull it won't cut (way more metal to hog off). Plus it cuts way faster and safer.
For those cutting with dull blades but don't know it: ever see someone else glide through trunks like butter and start remembering when your saw used to cut that well (first couple trees)?
Sharp blade.


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## Quack Addict (Aug 10, 2006)

Detroitbassist said:


> As was stated above, maintaining an edge (a stroke or 2 per link if sharpened frequently enough) is a lot quicker than sharpening a blade that's so dull it won't cut (way more metal to hog off). Plus it cuts way faster and safer.
> For those cutting with dull blades but don't know it: ever see someone else glide through trunks like butter and start remembering when your saw used to cut that well (first couple trees)?
> Sharp blade.


A sharp blade pulls itself through a cut with no downward pressure. You have to push a dull one. Pushing junks the bar faster because of the increased friction between the chain and bar.

A dull chain also blows really fine saw dust, which plugs up air filters and clogs oil ports, starving the bar & chain.

The guys that claim to replace blades when they get dull are probably working them for all they can get out of a blade, and are abusing their equipment without realizing it.


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