# 2008 Lab results are in....Let's hear em



## hypox (Jan 23, 2000)

Hunted with Blue Road Bucks last year. The bear I harvested was 8 years old.


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## phillycheese (Feb 2, 2006)

a buddy of mine shot a bear last year and the results showed the bear to be 24 years old. yes 24 years old, my brother shot a boar which was 2 years old


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## Black Lake (Oct 26, 2005)

I went to the DNR site and mine still says Check back after May 15th. Am I doing anything wrong?


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## Busa Tom (Oct 6, 2005)

My Bear was aged at 13! Dam I had a GREAT time on that Hunt!


Tom


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## kristie (Apr 23, 2003)

Black Lake said:


> I went to the DNR site and mine still says Check back after May 15th. Am I doing anything wrong?


If you took a bear in the Northern Lower peninsula, we are still working on those, the results are up for the Upper peninsula. If you did take a UP bear, shoot me a PM with your info. and I'll see if I can figure it out.....
Kristie
Wildlife Disease Lab.
MDNR


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## agross (Jan 18, 2009)

i got my letter in the mail yesterday from the mnr, and it stated my bear was 7 years old, can't wait till 2010 to go again


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

When you get your bear age, could you include sex and weight? I think it would be interesting. The MDNR publishes sex and age for each BMU but not weight. I think it would give us all a bit of interesting reading. Maybe BMU.


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## Steelfishin (Jan 16, 2003)

We had four guys in our camp this year and took a 19 year, 9 year, 8 year and 2 year old. The oldest was a female and the rest were boars.


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## whitetailmonster (May 13, 2009)

phillycheese said:


> a buddy of mine shot a bear last year and the results showed the bear to be 24 years old. yes 24 years old, my brother shot a boar which was 2 years old


 
How much did it weigh?


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## kristie (Apr 23, 2003)

northern lower results should be up now.......


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## KalamazooKid (Jun 20, 2005)

hypox said:


> Hunted with Blue Road Bucks last year. The bear I harvested was 8 years old.


That's an old fart Andy! Just like the dude who shot it!:lol:

Just kidding of course, nice job on the bear. I'm just happy I got to spill a beer on it.


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## phillycheese (Feb 2, 2006)

whittail,

the bear weighed dressed out at just under 300 pounds. The color of the paws were almost silver..


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## agross (Jan 18, 2009)

the bear i shot was 7 years old and 340 pounds(boar) one of my buddies just got his letter as well 6 years old 214 pounds(sow) other two guys in our group are still waiting


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## whitetailmonster (May 13, 2009)

nice bears!


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

Must of been from Amasa, that was the only 19 year old bear killed in the UP in 2008. Just a note of interest. SIXTEEN CUBS (AGE ZERO)WERE REGISTERED IN THE UP IN 2008. 474 one year olds, not cubs but they were nursing a few months before they were shot(at least not legally cubs in Michigan). I sure hope the guys that shot them get another this year, the full mounts make nice "bookends"


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## throttle (Feb 11, 2009)

Why would anyone shoot such little bear? Don't the dnr give them tickets?


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

The Michigan DNR chooses not to issue tickets, but I think thats about to change. Why, you tell me.....I read your previous posts, planning on hunting...thats good. If you don't see a shooter....don't shoot, thats what we all should do.


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## Thumb Hunter (Mar 16, 2009)

I took my first last year, a 5 year old female, she was just shy of 300 lbs. it was a hunt I will never forget, can't wait to ga again.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Wisconsin considers any bear less than 42 inches from tip of nose to tip of tail to be illegal. Adopting their regulation would likely reduce the cub killing here in Michigan. 

Hunters could place a log of the proper length next to their bait for a reference...helping to gauge the size of bear visiting their bait.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

With sixteen age zero bear killed in the UP and a pile of age one(second largest sector) being harvested, I think a size limit or 42 inches would be a "no brainer". Who really thinks that an age zero or one is worth shooting? Not much meat, a very embarrassing trophy, and great fuel for the anti-hunting groups. The law may not classify a one year old bear in Michigan a cub, but it is. Nursing the same year you shot it, why would anyone kill such a bear? A one year old sow is a tiny speciman, as small as a male age zero. Everyone that shot such a trophy, shame on you. 

So lets hear the "majority" of the results. One age nineteen year old killed in the UP, good job. Almost 500 cubs? Most have been harvested with the help of a GUIDE????? Its all about money:help:.....Is this not the Michigan "Sportsmen" forum?


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## hubbarj (Jan 30, 2007)

These numbers are pretty upsetting. For the newberry area 13% of the bears harvest were of mature age and 87% were not. 7 of the 16 age zero bear were also killed in this area. I hope that something is done soon or we won't have a future breeding population.


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## Steelfishin (Jan 16, 2003)

Yes the 19 year old was from the AMASA unit and was taken during the second season, only weighed out dressed at 287 pounds and was a female. The others were 250 to 275 boars and were 8 and 9 years (one taken in first hunt, one in the second season) and the 2 year old was 145 pounds, taken during the first hunt. Sounds like your up on the UP information, hope to get another permit for this fall, just waiting to see


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

Steelfishin, I have the spreadsheet from the MDNR. Its real interesting. Its real sad at the same time. I am going to try to post the results. Sounds like you and your hunting party had a great hunt and used common sense before shooting. With the majority of bear shot in 2008 being very young and or cubs, its nice to hear from some real "Michigan Sportsmen"!


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## hubbarj (Jan 30, 2007)

Steelfishin: Congrats on the bears those sound like some good ones. I wish more people were as selective as your group.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

Almost all the older bear killed(last couple years) are sow bear. The number of trophies left in the UP is approaching zero. You can follow the last big cub production year(four years ago). Last year the biggest sector of bear killed were two the year before it was one. Historically the number of boar bear killed was greater than the number of sows. Not in the past few years. Most of the bear killed are sow or cubs from the four years ago. Most sow bear are not trophies, sorry this is the way I feel and how most hunters once felt. I have seen some heavy sows, but not many. Many states stop the season when x number of sow bear are killed. The numbers are down, get the stats form the last few years from the MDNR, then let me hear from you. One hundred and twelve bear were tropies in the UP in 2008. That is five year old boar or older, 6%. Cubs(I include one year old bear) not in the legal discription in Michigan, but with their mother the year they were shot. Four hundred and ninety! 26.4% See a problem yet?


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## GettinBucky (Jul 18, 2007)

Hey Bearboy.....

That is some very unsettling info!!!! I've only shot one bear, in 2006 an 8 yr old 225lbs dressed and yes it was a sow. She was all alone, no other bear in sight. If this type of attitude from hunters shooting the first bear they see continues...our bear hutning will be just like our deer hunting.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

We all can shoot a nice sow thats alone. Most would like to shoot a boar, but its hard to tell. All we can go on is size. A big sow, although not common, show up. What alot of us are trying to do is preserve whats left. The past three years have been the alarming. When the lottery system was enacted, the wise biologists of the past said," 800-1100 bear killed per year was nonsustaining. The tags went up each year to keep an artifical harvest quota. This is a panzi scheme. Just like Bernie Madeoff, the market has crashed. This is what happened in the southern states in the past, Michigan is now very short of bear. It happened in Wisconsin as well. Size limits, sex limits and less tags are only part. The real problem is the so called guiding operations in the state. "All you have to do is pull the trigger", thats a quote this year from one of the commercial baiters that is also a MDNR check station. That is not hunting, that is shooting. One month of preseason baiting is too much. Simply put, trained dump bear! The UP is very small, more guides than Idaho, lot more. Roads are everywere do to logging. This used to be beer money for a few locals, now its six figure incomes for game violators. That's right. Keep supporting them, it will all be over soon. The anti's have the same information. I love to hunt bear. They do not!


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## giver108 (Nov 24, 2004)

Bearboy said:


> The real problem is the so called guiding operations in the state. "All you have to do is pull the trigger", thats a quote this year from one of the commercial baiters that is also a MDNR check station.


From reading this particular forum on a regular basis, it is easy to see that a lot of people hunting bear these days are newcomers to the sport. That is a good thing but with more and more inexperienced bear hunters, there are going to be a lot more small bears shot because most of these hunters will think that that 80 lb. bear at their bait weighs 300 lbs. If Bearboy's numbers are correct, and I have no reason to doubt him, the amount of young bears being shot is indeed alarming (27%). I think the guides need to do more to teach their hunters on how to judge a bear's size. It could be as simple as placing a stick near the bait at a measured height or length. I am getting the impression more and more that a lot of the guides operating in MI are more concerned with telling clients about a high success rate than good stewardship of the resource and that is a shame. I would be curious to read that spreadsheet you have, Bearboy. Please post if you can.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Giver...good post. The data Bearboy has came from bear tooth survey data from 2006, 2007, and recently 2008. Adam Bump the Head MDNR Biologist provided the latest data.

Upon reading your post I am reminded of a post made by a bear guide here in this forum months ago. He stated, "we like it when a client kills a small bear, its easier to get out of the woods and the money pays the same." Obviously, not all guides have the same mind set, but I don't don't see any of them stepping up an condeming the killing of cubs and small yearlings, just yet. 

It is rewarding, in spite of the MDNR's failure to manage guiding all these years...the 18 representatives on the Bear Counciltation Team recognized the problem and arrived at a 100% agreement on licensing & regulating guides. It is part of the Bear Management Plan.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

I sent giver my email address. I don't have the time to post all the data(I don't know how to do it any way but to copy it by hand). 


The numbers are right, the harvest is wrong. Having cub bear mounted and posted on this site is not only naive, its downright harmful to our sport!


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Bearboy, I tend to believe some of the killing of sub-adult bear could be reduced through better educating new hunters. We can increase awareness through sites like these, but I believe the Michigan DNR and MBHA also have a role to play. This would not happen in Wisconsin, mostly because WBHA is extremely proactive in bear management. Seems like I'm always hammering bear guides, but considering bear guides chalk up a much higher success rate than sport hunters hunting on their own...they're also a factor and need to be held responsible for educating their clients. We have seen enough examples of their handy-work on this site.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

Unregulated. The problem is the UP is not a vast wilderness. You could drop me off any place in the UP, and I will walk to a road. I have AARP card. Thousands of pounds of bait in very small area's attract young bear and sow's. Sow bear either pregnant or nursing have to eat. You cannot scare them away from a dump! Watch the Michigan - Out of Doors television segment from last fall. Its self explanitory. I wonder what that wolf wanted, to kill a bear or eat the "GRAIN" that was placed out in a 20,000 lb quantity. I would guess the deer or small animals that eat this stuff as well, is what he was after. The UP borders a CWD state. Funny that canine did not scare the bear away. The segment shows a very small bear at the end, looks like an orphaned cub. I like the racoon and bear together scene, the **** is about the same size! 

I want to ask the MDNR an open question...ARE YOU GOING TO ENFORCE THE LAW THIS YEAR? I THINK THE FEW REMAINING BEAR WOULD BE GRATEFUL!


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## throttle (Feb 11, 2009)

Seems to me that our DNR should follow up on cub kills and start to issue a few tickets to the cub killers. I dont think that would be to much work sice they alresady registered them and admitted to killing a cub.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

Went over to the legal questions to ask Jason, got a response from a retired MDNR official who lists his favorite species to hunt is "poachers". Defending the MDNR on this very disturbing issue dosen't qualify as a "poacher" hunter. It seems from CO to Director, and I asked them all. Not one can offer an answer.....funny though....pretty tough on large groups of say...ice fishermen...were their favorite meter maid tactic can be employed. Now that really helps Michigans Natural Resources:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## throttle (Feb 11, 2009)

I just wonder if i regisered a spotted fawn during deer season would i get a succesful hunter award? or a ticket? or a lobotomy?


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## Yamirider (Oct 3, 2008)

throttle said:


> I just wonder if i regisered a spotted fawn during deer season would i get a succesful hunter award? or a ticket? or a lobotomy?


Unfortunately fawns are legal game here in Michigan. There are alot of "sportsman" on this site that would have no problem shooting one either and be proud of it.


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## T.J. (Mar 1, 2009)

Yamirider said:


> Unfortunately fawns are legal game here in Michigan. There are alot of "sportsman" on this site that would have no problem shooting one either and be proud of it.


at least they would be eating good.


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

Its not even close. A deer can breed at 6 months, bear five years(male). In comparison, shooting a one year old bear is like shooting a fawn while the mother is eating the afterbirth(you know like "dog" years).


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## Bearboy (Feb 4, 2009)

:lol: Killed my thread when asked why on the legal portion. If you cannot hear the truth....kill it....after all its historical....Hitler, Saddam Hussain, Stalin...:chicken:


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

throttle said:


> I just wonder if i regisered a spotted fawn during deer season would i get a succesful hunter award? or a ticket? or a lobotomy?


Of course it always helps to know the law prior to making a statement that shows ignorance.

Then we have bearboy who also thinks he knows everything but instead of taking a rational suggestion just likes to bash. I don't consider bearboy to know as much as he would like everyone to believe. Have you accepted the unacceptable yet?


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