# Lost Preference Points???



## Gilbey (Oct 26, 2005)

I know this doesn't pertain to many of you. And this post isn't really geared towards those that didn't apply for a year and lost their points.

But I have seen in some posts that there are a few people out there in the same boat as me - lost points!!!

I applied 3 years ago at Land N Lakes Sports in Escanaba
I applied 2 years ago at Cornell Grocery Store
I applied 1 year ago at Flatrock Grocery

So, in going to see what's happening on line last week, the DNR states that I have 2 points. I emailed them under the problems with points little link, and got an email back about my application on Cornell, and Flatrock, but nothing out of the Land N Lakes.

How often does this occur? I've seen a few posters with the same problem. What have they said to you? Is this a frequent mistake? I'm bummed out....I have only two points and know that I don't stand a very good chance in my area without 3 or 4. 

So better luck next year I guess................... Thanks DNR.


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## Ugottaluvit (Jan 29, 2003)

I had the same thing happen to me. Go to check your points the next year..... and POOF. There isn't any record of this. I had the receipt.....but, wheres it at now. Another fine DNR example. Accepted the money..then no record. Where does the money go??


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## uptracker (Jul 27, 2004)

This always scared me too. I put in for my point last night and printed the receipts, etc. I also printed my PP Results, agreed to how many I have and then printed it. The problem is, the date at the bottom is cut off at "4/16/200", therefore I have no proof really. Grrrr!!!

I bought a small Tupperware box the other day to keep all my old licenses and guide books in. You'll bet now I'll have the receipts in a certain area of the box too!

That does tick me off. Sorry Gilbey!

Not saying it is the cure all, but try and apply for it online. Maybe that way you will always have a receipt and you'll definatly know if the transaction went through correctly.


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## bigrackmack (Aug 10, 2004)

Keep your receipts!!!!...I do for all the things I apply for and my licenses....That way you have proof that you applied....I keep all mine in a box.....I always know were they are.....Hard lesson learned....Mack


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## VARMINTHUNTERLAKEORION (Jan 12, 2005)

Definately save those receipts and make sure they printed out as well - showing the area applied for and the date it was purchased along with the Stores DNR Identification number. This even applys to the Licenses you buy - lose your License, as long as you have your receipt you can repurchase that License for 3.00 - without the receipt you will pay full price.


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## Gilbey (Oct 26, 2005)

The crappy part of it all is that I'm probably not going to get my tag this year 

yeah mack, lesson learned, and not all too happy for it.


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## Reel_Screamer86 (Mar 22, 2007)

Gilbey said:


> I know this doesn't pertain to many of you. And this post isn't really geared towards those that didn't apply for a year and lost their points.
> 
> But I have seen in some posts that there are a few people out there in the same boat as me - lost points!!!
> 
> ...


I know what your saying my brother and I both apply at the same time every year and when i went to the site to check our points I had 5 and he had 3 so go figure he did the same thing you did basically the DNR said your SOL So make it a point to SAVE your reciepts thats your only proof...


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## NEMichsportsman (Jul 3, 2001)

Makes you wonder if things like this are widespread???

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10371_10402-166530--,00.html


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## uptracker (Jul 27, 2004)

That's disgusting NEMichsportsman. Grrrrrr!:evil: Glad they got him though!


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## cliffd (Jun 25, 2006)

NEMichsportsman said:


> Makes you wonder if things like this are widespread???
> 
> http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10371_10402-166530--,00.html


This is disgusting. I can't understand why a 40% void rate did not raise a red flag when 1-2% is considered normal. 

I am not saying this is the DNR's fault. Obviously, it is the fault of the dirtbag retailer. However, this should be a lesson to the state to better use some analytics to determine when potential fraud is occurring. I bet they have fraud detection in place on the lottery terminals!


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## DANIEL MARK ZAPOLSKI (Sep 23, 2002)

yep, with no paper trail for evidence you loose hands down. i have always checked the license at the store for all the correct information on it and if not correct they get it back and try again. i had an event last year in alpena getting an overthe counter doe tag at dunhams. gave the clerk D.L. AND ALL THE CORRECT INFORMATION. checked license and low and behold phone number is wrong---- i told her to void the tag and try again. her reply was that doesn't matter---my reply was, lets see, who is going to be checked by the D.N.R. you our me? me who'll get a ticket you or me? me. so re-do the tag or you don't get any money period! needless to say she was miffed but who the hell cares?
always make sure they are right before you pay and keep all reciepts and tags in gun safe, period! so even in the event you run into some SCUM-BAG voiding your tags after you leave you got the ****EVIDENCE!****


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## JWICKLUND (Feb 13, 2005)

While I have read your problems I may be able to shed a little light on your situations. When I am checking individuals I sometimes run into the same thing, especially when dealing with sportcards. I have checked guys for prior licenses and they swear they bought them. The problem is the information is provided under different id's. Hypothetical example: Michael James Smith goes and buys a license. The information entered may be as it is stated above. He goes in the next year and the information is entered now as Mike James Smith. The following year Michael J. Smith. All this is in the computer but the different people entering the information varies from store to store. If I pull up the information to see where the license is purchased I can see that a majority of the time the license that vary in information were purchased at different stores.
A manual lookup and information search can be done but I am not sure if they will combine your points. The best thing to do is make sure the person entering your customer ID information is the same everytime. I hope this helps explain things.


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## yooperkenny (Jul 13, 2004)

JWICKLUND said:


> .... The best thing to do is make sure the person entering your customer ID information is the same everytime....


Thanks - that is helpful. I have a similar scenario with my son, who started buying bear preference points using his sportsman's card before he got his drivers license. We still buy his point every year using the card # even though he now has his drivers license, and will have to do so until he cashes in for his first bear hunt. Hope that's OK, but how else would you do it without having to start over with 0 points?


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## cliffd (Jun 25, 2006)

JWICKLUND said:


> While I have read your problems I may be able to shed a little light on your situations. When I am checking individuals I sometimes run into the same thing, especially when dealing with sportcards. I have checked guys for prior licenses and they swear they bought them. The problem is the information is provided under different id's. Hypothetical example: Michael James Smith goes and buys a license. The information entered may be as it is stated above. He goes in the next year and the information is entered now as Mike James Smith. The following year Michael J. Smith. All this is in the computer but the different people entering the information varies from store to store. If I pull up the information to see where the license is purchased I can see that a majority of the time the license that vary in information were purchased at different stores.
> A manual lookup and information search can be done but I am not sure if they will combine your points. The best thing to do is make sure the person entering your customer ID information is the same everytime. I hope this helps explain things.


How can something like this happen? The primary method of storing that information should be via the customer ID, namely your DL# or sportcard ID. I can see multiple records under different customer ID's if you used a sportcard ID one year and your DL# the next but having different versions of your name cause an anomoly such as this screams of a very poorly designed system. If this is the case, I hope someone gets there act together at the state level and makes the required fixes.


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## JWICKLUND (Feb 13, 2005)

cliffd said:


> How can something like this happen? The primary method of storing that information should be via the customer ID, namely your DL# or sportcard ID. I can see multiple records under different customer ID's if you used a sportcard ID one year and your DL# the next but having different versions of your name cause an anomoly such as this screams of a very poorly designed system. If this is the case, I hope someone gets there act together at the state level and makes the required fixes.


Your Preaching to the choir..:lol:


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

I should of had 3 last year but they showed 2. I inquired and recieved no answer. so I put in for my permit which should now give me 4 or 3 by there count . I checked and I still have 2. I should have had a chance this year with 5 points. 

J. Wicklund, is there any way I can get them to correct this. they dont answer my inquiry and I used my d.l. to apply every time.


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## sullyxlh (Oct 28, 2004)

I keep all my receipts until those hunt points are used,it's the *only proof* *I* *have* in the event something like this occurs
good luck trying to convince the DNR if you don't have them....


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

I just checked my elk points and they show 2 also. I have put in for a permit every year and have never got one. What year did the start giving those points, What is the max possible to have????


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## JWICKLUND (Feb 13, 2005)

swampbuck said:


> J. Wicklund, is there any way I can get them to correct this. they dont answer my inquiry and I used my d.l. to apply every time.


I think the problem lies with the person entering the information. They make minimum wage and aren't properly trained to work the machines or they just don't care. 
A few years ago when snowmobile trail permits were blowing off, we were directing people to the local field offices to get a replacement. When they would show up we would look them up to see if they had indeed bought a trail permit. When a lot of them didn't show up as buying a permit, I went to the place where they said they bought them and interviewed the clerk. She admitted that she ran her own drivers license through because it was faster and saved them money because they didn't have to pay a dollar for the sportcard. 
I have had the same individuals register my "fake" bear and not even go outside to look at it. I gave them a fake name, address, DOB, hunt location, and I put a rock in the tooth sample pouch. They never even looked up at me.
"IF" the person running the license machine swipes you D.L., you should be fine but a lot of times it doesn't work so they manually enter the information which is where the problem starts. (I have seen individuals with 4 different variations of their name). The computer has no way of knowing any different. License control may be able to fix this for you, but that is a lot of work on their end. 

From someone who has dealt with this problem, you best bet is to be diligent when you purchase your license. Before you leave check the information. Make sure it is the same every time. Also if you buy your licence, do it at a DNR field office or sporting goods store. These people tend to do things right more than gas stations and convenience stores.


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

so basically I am screwed for life for a few more years on bear and my chance will reduced on elk for the rest of my life. THAT IS BULL


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## Gilbey (Oct 26, 2005)

swampbuck said:


> so basically I am screwed for life for a few more years on bear and my chance will reduced on elk for the rest of my life. THAT IS BULL


Pretty much how I feel:rant: 

But I will say this. It was done manually and would offer some explanations to why it's not showing. Incorrect DL# probably and knowing me I'm sure I didn't even check.


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## tbbassdaddy (Apr 21, 2006)

I apply for my bear appl every year online the DNR E-lic site... Works great!!!
tb


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## D.C.U.P. (May 24, 2002)

I could have sworn my dad had 5 points last year, thus making us very confident he'd get a tag. He didn't. Now, this year, I see he has 5 points again. So, either he only had 4 points last year (we're positive it was 5, though) or there was a screw-up.

FWIW, I have a friend who has a friend that works for the DNR, and even this guy says the bear preference point system is screwy. Oh well, there's always Canada.


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## Sprytle (Jan 8, 2005)

I have 4 bear points this year and they say 3 i save all my receipts so im going through them to find them. I dont know how you present this though. I KNOW i have four and let them know but they came back w/ a email that said i have 3????


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

make me wonder if it really is a random drawing at all. in 27 years of hunting I have recieved 1 bear permit and 2 doe permits.


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## Pinefarm (Sep 19, 2000)

Your mistake was buying a bear permit app/point at a grocery store. IMHO You did it twice and you're lucky you got 1 point out of it IMHO. If you don't want license issue's, don't go to big box stores, party stores, gas stations, etc. The clerks at those places are rarely seasoned hunters and have no clue what they are doing. Buy tags at a good sporting goods store.
To me, it's like going to a 7-11 and asking the clerk about fine wines for a nice holiday party. Sure, 7-11 has wine, but you'd be better off to go to a store that does nothing but sell fine wines.
If you had your receipt, I doubt that the info were entered correctly.


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## Pinefarm (Sep 19, 2000)

Another example of benefits of going to a good sporting goods store is advice.
For turkey apps, for example, when guys would ask what's their best chance for an area K permit, I always told them to put in for the 2nd hunt first, since most everyone always puts in for the 1st hunt first. Well, pretty much all those who asked got permits and I had a happy, loyal customer. 
For fishing licenses, many times out of state trout fishermen would want 6 daily licenses. I always steered them into the annual because it saved them money.
For antlerless tags, guys would hunt the SLP and NLP or UP, but then want to put in for their SLP tag first, with very high quota's. My advice was to put in for the lower quota'd NLP or UP first, because they could always get the SLP second.
You won't get little hints of license advice from 7-11


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## omega58 (Sep 3, 2003)

Pinefarm said:


> Your mistake was buying a bear permit app/point at a grocery store. IMHO You did it twice and you're lucky you got 1 point out of it IMHO. If you don't want license issue's, don't go to big box stores, party stores, gas stations, etc. The clerks at those places are rarely seasoned hunters and have no clue what they are doing. Buy tags at a good sporting goods store.
> To me, it's like going to a 7-11 and asking the clerk about fine wines for a nice holiday party. Sure, 7-11 has wine, but you'd be better off to go to a store that does nothing but sell fine wines.
> If you had your receipt, I doubt that the info were entered correctly.


I tried to do that the other day and both of the local sporting goods stores printers were messed up and not working. I had to go to Meijer to get me licences and I got lucky with someone who knew how to run the system and I was able to help out as well.

I try to go to my local sporting goods places, but when things happen I make sure I know what is going on and what numbers I need them to put in and everything so things can't get screwed up and if they do, I am able to double check everything. . . . always double check and triple check before you sign!!


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## Black Lake (Oct 26, 2005)

I have had 2 bear tags in the last 12 years. I am having the same troubles, I received my last tag in 2002. I apply each year, so I should have 4 points going into this year. They are showing that I have only 3 points. You know I will never find those old receipts. I sent an email into the DNR and they are showing that they have no account for 2003's application/point. Oh well, what can you do.....


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## Ninja (Feb 20, 2005)

VARMINTHUNTERLAKEORION said:


> Definately save those receipts and make sure they printed out as well - showing the area applied for and the date it was purchased along with the Stores DNR Identification number. This even applys to the Licenses you buy - lose your License, as long as you have your receipt you can repurchase that License for 3.00 - without the receipt you will pay full price.


You will pay full price for any lost license that requires a kill tag.
Replacements that do not require a kill tag (fishing license for example) are replaced at 3.00 whether you have a receipt or not.


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## bhugo (Jan 12, 2007)

Even the online application can screw up. Last year I had 3 points and I applied for just a point. This year I had 0 points. They claimed that I was successful in getting a permit. I had proof that I had only applied for a point and not a license. They only gave me 3 points back for this year. I think that they have a few glitches in the system.


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

I agree, I would like to know theyre names and phone numbers


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## bhugo (Jan 12, 2007)

this is an easy way to check

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10363_10856_10890-25983--,00.html

They seemed nice when I dealt with my issue.


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## Gilbey (Oct 26, 2005)

Well, they seemed very nice about my issue to. I still have one less preference point. I think I would rather have had nasty and another preference point.


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## thunderman (Mar 10, 2005)

ha! now i see i'm not the only one bitchin:rant: 

here's my problem. dwi took my dL. had to apply with my state i.d. card three time= 3 points
applied twice after i received my d.l. again=2 points

called dnr hq to straighteen it out all fine a dandy, but they don't show last years app. bull-lony!!!!! 
funny they show all the apps. for the elk, turkey, manito island (sp?) and baldy tags. dug out the receipts and yes i have last years bear app.

which is a good thing they didn't ask for the pervious years, as the printing on the receipts has since faded away go figiure. started looking at several of my other "big buy" receipts, and sure enough they have since started or are faded out. so i'm kinda apualled by this. so now i copy scan my receipts onto my computer and burn them to disc.


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## DANIEL MARK ZAPOLSKI (Sep 23, 2002)

now you're talking my language-----******evidence******!


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## bhugo (Jan 12, 2007)

Gilbey said:


> Well, they seemed very nice about my issue to. I still have one less preference point. I think I would rather have had nasty and another preference point.


I agree!


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## solohunter (Jan 2, 2006)

i went overseas 9/2003-7/2004 in uniform and forgot to buy a point as i had other things on my mind, anyway the DNR will not forgive the missed year and i had to start over!! red oak area hunter


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## QuakrTrakr (Apr 4, 2001)

Hey, I'm missing one too! I'm supposed to have 3 points, and it shows 2! There is a dispute page to report it. I wonder if this is the DNR's new plan to raise money?:rant:


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## uptracker (Jul 27, 2004)

swampbuck said:


> make me wonder if it really is a random drawing at all. in 27 years of hunting I have recieved 1 bear permit and 2 doe permits.


:lol: 

Sorry, that sucks.

For some of you though, if you put in for a point this year, it won't show up until after the drawing.....just FYI.


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