# St. Joe



## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

I went out several times this weekend and I did not do very good. I fished the Niles area a little and at least there was water coming over the dam. Took the boat from Niles to the Buchanan dam. Water is very clear and low. I saw a lot of bass guys out and the ones I talked to have been doing pretty good. I went to Berrien Springs dam and fish for a couple of hours and just caught small cats. I saw 1 silver fish caught by a boat below the turbine discharge. Looked kinda small and not sure what it was. I saw several guys fishing right in front of what I believe is the ladder but did not see anything caught. Water still low and only water coming thru the discharge, no flood gates open. I went back that evening but did not fish because there were several people shore fishing and a guy in a boat was set up that you could not shore fish most of the east side bar because he was close to shore and had his lines run out the back. I did not have my boat boat so just went home, did not look like fun to me. I have a boat but sometimes I also make quick shore fishing trips and I just don't understand why if you have a boat you set up where the shore guys can get to. I have not tried to get close to the dam in Berrien with my boat because I just don't like combat fishing. If the fish are there I am sure they are other places in the river also. Oh well I hope somebody has a good report for the Joe. It sure was not me. Cool temps this week could start a little something, I know we don't get a big run for while but a few fish may start coming in. Good Luck All.


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## ledhead (Sep 5, 2010)

I just got back from BS....seen folks floatin' or bouncin', but noone was gettin any.....struck up a convo w/an old timer that was just spectatin'... told me spoons were working for some earlier. I went down river with less folks and ended up w/2 SH pitchin oslos (those are da bomb) Nothin' too big, but heck its a start  Bring on some rain !!!!


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## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

Glad to hear you got into some and yes bring on the rain. I checked the weather before logging in here and I saw a 46 degree night. I will be back out next friday or sunday night. I can't wait.


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

The fish are just going right threw the ladder unless we get some rain they wont stop. Seen one jumping in there as I was walking down the hill. Nothing silver was landed this evening seen one hooked and lost. If you plan on going down and slaying them just stay home. If you just want to cast around all day and get maybe one then by all means cast away. Figures school starts tomorrow :rant:.


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## ledhead (Sep 5, 2010)

rw65hdd said:


> Glad to hear you got into some and yes bring on the rain. I checked the weather before logging in here and I saw a 46 degree night. I will be back out next friday or sunday night. I can't wait.


I seen that too....but what I wasnt seeing much of is rain... I'll be busy next weekend, but Im going to try to make it back down there 1 or 2 days this week after work.


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## Trout King (May 1, 2002)

[quoteThe fish are just going right threw the ladder unless we get some rain they wont stop. Seen one jumping in there as I was walking down the hill. Nothing silver was landed this evening seen one hooked and lost. If you plan on going down and slaying them just stay home. If you just want to cast around all day and get maybe one then by all means cast away. Figures school starts tomorrow . 


Read more at Michigan-Sportsman.com: St. Joe - The Michigan Sportsman Forums http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=347484#ixzz0ynwyZFiB][/quote]

Dude! are you serious? The fish will blow through faster if you get a good rain (high water makes the fish move and move faster). Seeing one fish doesn't mean they are blowing through...right now more likely means they aren't there hardly at all yet. They move when it rains, and that is what brings some fish in...right now the lower MI rivers need to cool off about 10 degrees to have big pushes...just sayin...give it a few weeks, I know everyone wants the fish to be in in numbers, but fact is they just aren't ready with river temps still high.


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## quest32a (Sep 25, 2001)

Trout King said:


> Dude! are you serious? The fish will blow through faster if you get a good rain (high water makes the fish move and move faster). Seeing one fish doesn't mean they are blowing through...right now more likely means they aren't there hardly at all yet. They move when it rains, and that is what brings some fish in...right now the lower MI rivers need to cool off about 10 degrees to have big pushes...just sayin...give it a few weeks, I know everyone wants the fish to be in in numbers, but fact is they just aren't ready with river temps still high.


I wondered the same thing. High water generally makes fish move faster.


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

quest32a said:


> I wondered the same thing. High water generally makes fish move faster.


I cant be giving away all my fish catching secrets but I will throw in some hints. Right now the turbines are the main current in Berrien the fish follow them up and the ladder is right there. If we get rain that all changes as long as there is water flowing. That is all I am going to say.


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## ledhead (Sep 5, 2010)

Multispeciestamer said:


> I cant be giving away all my fish catching secrets but I will throw in some hints. Right now the turbines are the main current in Berrien the fish follow them up and the ladder is right there. If we get rain that all changes as long as there is water flowing. That is all I am going to say.


Please dont give away all them secrets ....I'll need some elbow room in the next cpl weeks...


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## Trout King (May 1, 2002)

I want in on all of your secrets!


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Yippee the reports have began, lame...


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## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

I am just curious what is lame about reports. I don't think the Joe gets runs anywhere near as good a run as northern rivers so it seems like accurate reports could be helpful if you have to drive a while to get there. I live close but still like to hear how others did. I checked some of the sections including big lake and see lots of reports. I know I did noy do any good but I am kinda new to chasing salmon and steelhead. I like to hear what is working. It is a big river with some decent access so there should be room for everyone. I know it gets bad at the dams but there are a few places close that are not as crazy. If posting a report that does not talk about specific holes is wrong they need to change the stcky at the top of the page. I am not looking to get a bash session going and you can always choose to just pass on by with out comment if you see a post you think is lame. I think there is a couple of us that like reports and don't see a problem. Have a great day everyone.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

rw65hdd said:


> I am just curious what is lame about reports. I don't think the Joe gets runs anywhere near as good a run as northern rivers so it seems like accurate reports could be helpful if you have to drive a while to get there. I live close but still like to hear how others did. I checked some of the sections including big lake and see lots of reports. I know I did noy do any good but I am kinda new to chasing salmon and steelhead. I like to hear what is working. It is a big river with some decent access so there should be room for everyone. I know it gets bad at the dams but there are a few places close that are not as crazy. If posting a report that does not talk about specific holes is wrong they need to change the stcky at the top of the page. I am not looking to get a bash session going and you can always choose to just pass on by with out comment if you see a post you think is lame. I think there is a couple of us that like reports and don't see a problem. Have a great day everyone.


You are correct, reports are great! If you enjoy fishing in crowds...

Just a side note, read your post, you did give away specific holes by describing where you were, which by definition would mean you violated posting guidelines and your post should be deleted "technically". In all honesty though, I really didn't see anything wrong with your post, my comment was more aimed at the time of year you begin seeing reports means it's back to having crowds on the river, which is by my definition lame as hell, so I was not so much calling the fact you posted a report lame, but more so talking about the fact that the time of year you begin seeing reports start usually means things are going to begin to get lame on the river in some aspects. In closing, you can post whatever you want as far as I am concerned, just don't ever complain about crowds then because putting up reports on here about places like Berrien does indeed increase angling pressure, seen it happen many many times. I also don't care how far someone is driving "hate that excuse trying to rationalize the need for reports", when I head to the Mo or Big Man, I don't ask people to hold my hand and tell me whether I should be there or not, it's called fishing, not hold my hand so I can hook a fish and go home...


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## diztortion (Sep 6, 2009)

There's gonna be crowds regardless of posts. If you're fishing a spot where fish are known to pile up, then expect to see someone. 

On a side note, can I get some secret insider information on fishing? You can put me on the list behind TroutKing.


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## Spanky (Mar 21, 2001)

Salmon come in whether the water is high or low, cold or warm. They have one thing only on their mind. Most southern rivers already have many salmon in them and running the ladders. The peak of the salmon run in SW mich is usually labor day weekend at the ports. Now whether or not folks are catching them is another story.


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## wartfroggy (Jan 25, 2007)

diztortion said:


> On a side note, can I get some secret insider information on fishing? You can put me on the list behind TroutKing.


 It is all G-14 classified. He could tell you, but then he'd have to kill you.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

diztortion said:


> There's gonna be crowds regardless of posts. If you're fishing a spot where fish are known to pile up, then expect to see someone.
> 
> On a side note, can I get some secret insider information on fishing? You can put me on the list behind TroutKing.


Correct, but NOT posting can keep it quiet for an extra week or two...


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## diztortion (Sep 6, 2009)

wartfroggy said:


> It is all G-14 classified. He could tell you, but then he'd have to kill you.


Wow! I didn't realize how dangerous this fishing business was. I wonder if he has to hire body guards and have other necessary security features.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

diztortion said:


> Wow! I didn't realize how dangerous this fishing business was. I wonder if he has to hire body guards and have other necessary security features.


Whenever he walks down to the river, the secret service is down there 4 hours in advance turning over rocks to be sure there is no explosives :lol:


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## diztortion (Sep 6, 2009)

He's like the Obama of the fishing world.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

diztortion said:


> He's like the Obama of the fishing world.


Now that is just mean  LOL


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## fishing-finlander (Sep 30, 2008)

well if you consider any river in MI that has salmon a secret, the cats out that bag. If you dont want crowds, buy a boat. Then you can low hole everyone else who has a boat:lol:. 

My point is, Salmon season, and steelie season bring out crowds. Flat out. I consider a "hole" or "spot" something along these lines:

I was at (insert river name) 2 bends down from (insert land mark) lined up with crooked tree, hole is in front of you.....

I'll bet even then, that other guys could go there and not hook up. 

Me personally, I'll take you to my spots who cares, you still got to fish it! My skills are honed from years of experience on the rivers. Not because I fished Tippy, Barien, the flys only section, or the 6th. If thats your idea of actually fishing then you'll never out fish me on other rivers or lower down on any of the rivers mentioned.

I would rather send all the new guys to the more common spots, just so they have success.


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## diztortion (Sep 6, 2009)

fishing-finlander said:


> I would rather send all the new guys to the more common spots, just so they have success.


That speaks volumes right there.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

fishing-finlander said:


> well if you consider any river in MI that has salmon a secret, the cats out that bag. If you dont want crowds, buy a boat. Then you can low hole everyone else who has a boat:lol:.
> 
> My point is, Salmon season, and steelie season bring out crowds. Flat out. I consider a "hole" or "spot" something along these lines:
> 
> ...


Even according to your outlook on posting specific spots, the guidelines were still broken with the original post, keep in mind I don't care "don't even really fish right below Berrien anymore", just saying...

As for the crowds, agree they are bound to show up, doesn't mean we have to like them LOL

I do love it how it's usually non-locals whom think it's just fine to post reports, you don't have to deal with the reprocussions because you are rarely around. Oh well as long as everyone is having fun, it's fine by me, I do like to see reports to an extent, especially where younger kids caught their first steelhead or whatnot...


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## fishing-finlander (Sep 30, 2008)

KWB said:


> Even according to your outlook on posting specific spots, the guidelines were still broken with the original post, keep in mind I don't care "don't even really fish right below Berrien anymore", just saying...
> 
> As for the crowds, agree they are bound to show up, doesn't mean we have to like them LOL
> 
> I do love it how it's usually non-locals whom think it's just fine to post reports, you don't have to deal with the reprocussions because you are rarely around. Oh well as long as everyone is having fun, it's fine by me, I do like to see reports to an extent, especially where younger kids caught their first steelhead or whatnot...


Well no argument about kids fishing and posting thier fish. However "non-locals" thats highly debatable. Would Welston, or other towns that have a vested interest in the word getting out mind? Basically thats their best advertising. Word of mouth. They want and to an extent need "non-locals" posting what and how they did, where they stayed etc etc.


I wouldnt consider the dam at berien a spot, more of a destination. Like the 6th st. and tippy


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

fishing-finlander said:


> Well no argument about kids fishing and posting thier fish. However "non-locals" thats highly debatable. Would Welston, or other towns that have a vested interest in the word getting out mind? Basically thats their best advertising. Word of mouth. They want and to an extent need "non-locals" posting what and how they did, where they stayed etc etc.
> 
> 
> I wouldnt consider the dam at berien a spot, more of a destination. Like the 6th st. and tippy


He didn't just say "below Berrien" he went into detail about sand bars etc... That's where it became against the guidelines "technically" but like I said, I honestly do not care and am not bashing him in any way. In the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter, I love this river and part of loving it is loving the fact that other people enjoy being in her presence as well. Just human nature to enjoy solitude or at least my nature, but that will come soon enough...

You need to re-phrase, you mean the half dozen business owners in Wellston whom have something to gain by word getting out enjoy reports, NOT the majority of people/residents... 

Anyway, wasted enough time on here today, need to get some stuff done so when the fishing actually gets good, I can be on the river. Have a good Fall boys and toss up some photos, they make for much better reports than mere words...


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## fishing-finlander (Sep 30, 2008)

You need to re-phrase, you mean the half dozen business owners in Wellston whom have something to gain by word getting out enjoy reports, NOT the majority of people/residents... 


What?  I'm sure the residents in these areas dont mind, and probably need the tax it brings to their area. Thats like me saying I hate the new horse race track they built because it brings gamblers, but I sure like the fact that my kids school got new books, and they improved the roads. 

Were talking fishermen, not convicts.  I suppose I could take my dollars else where and not spend it in your local economy.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

fishing-finlander said:


> You need to re-phrase, you mean the half dozen business owners in Wellston whom have something to gain by word getting out enjoy reports, NOT the majority of people/residents...
> 
> 
> What?  I'm sure the residents in these areas dont mind, and probably need the tax it brings to their area. Thats like me saying I hate the new horse race track they built because it brings gamblers, but I sure like the fact that my kids school got new books, and they improved the roads.
> ...


It's love/hate, but comparing a race track that brings in millions to what the residents of the township Wellston is in see from fishing is like comparing apples to oranges...


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## CoWalSki (May 31, 2003)

You have to realize that most of us would give our right nut :yikes: to live where you do. Spending 2-8 hours in a vehicle round trip is not my idea of fun. I worked with people that live there and I tried to impress on them what a great fishery you have in the St. Joe but it just didn't sink in. I've made the trips to various locations time and time again since 1972. Some successful, some not. I've always appreciated a heads up on what's happening in the rivers and have enjoyed meeting people that are on the forum as well as talking to the locals. I always try to provide some support to the local economy (gas, food, lodging, lures, bait....). Just remember, you are a lucky man to be where you are. Please, no responses about moving to Berrien Springs. Maybe we could arrange a "Dad" swap for a week or two during the peak of the run?  Hey... Please say "Hi" to Mr. Ali for me.

Take care & be safe out there...
Cowalski


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## fishing-finlander (Sep 30, 2008)

KWB said:


> It's love/hate, but comparing a race track that brings in millions to what the residents of the township Wellston is in see from fishing is like comparing apples to oranges...



Well how much do think it brings in? I bet you couldnt buy Schmits outfitters for less than a few million. Or tippy dam camp ground, or the deer horn in or what ever its called. Really? what else is Wellston predominately known for. Its industry?:lol: I bet FORD G.M got it on their short list of places to put in a plant:lol: Oh they got a mill near by. 

Just like berien springs. I know of it because fishing. not it's a power house of industry. Berien Springs main industry is tourisim


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

fishing-finlander said:


> Well how much do think it brings in? I bet you couldnt buy Schmits outfitters for less than a few million. Or tippy dam camp ground, or the deer horn in or what ever its called. Really? what else is Wellston predominately known for. Its industry?:lol: I bet FORD G.M got it on their short list of places to put in a plant:lol: Oh they got a mill near by.
> 
> Just like berien springs. I know of it because fishing. not it's a power house of industry. Berien Springs main industry is tourisim


Actually it brings in zero in tax revenue in a sense because local taxes have nothing to do with revenue, it doesn't matter whether I bring in 6 figures or 7 figures, my local taxes are the same. The only argument you can make is that if a business was to go out of business the local economy would be without those property taxes.

While Wellston certainly benefits from tourism the majority of their taxes do not come from tourism directly, they only come from people owning land there, which people would do regardless. As I stated when it comes to a true financial gain, only about a handful of people truly gain from tourism there, the rest drive to places like Manistee for jobs and revenue which are for the most part not tourism related jobs...

Berrien Springs main industry is NOT tourism, not even remotely close. A real economy cannot survive on tourism, only individuals can make a living on tourism. This is why our ex governor failed so bad, she thought we could make it as a "service state", but she forgot people have to be able to make real money in non tourism related jobs in order to go places and spend our money with people whom rely on tourism, which make up a very small percentage of the economy...


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## fishing-finlander (Sep 30, 2008)

http://www.city-data.com/work/work-Berrien-Springs-Michigan.html#mostCommonIndustries


your right its education. But really that just this side of tourism unless your a teacher or professor. Then your in a supporting role to it


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

fishing-finlander said:


> http://www.city-data.com/work/work-Berrien-Springs-Michigan.html#mostCommonIndustries
> 
> 
> your right its education. But really that just this side of tourism unless your a teacher or professor. Then your in a supporting role to it


I am not going to sit here and give you a lesson on how the local economy works here, all I am going to say is this town would not know the difference if people came here to fish or not. It doesn't really cater to fisherman at all, it could make more money off tourism, but nobody really focuses on it, heck we don't even have a bait shop Fall, Winter and Spring and the majority of people who come here to fish, stay in surrounding towns...


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

CoWalSki said:


> You have to realize that most of us would give our right nut :yikes: to live where you do. Spending 2-8 hours in a vehicle round trip is not my idea of fun. I worked with people that live there and I tried to impress on them what a great fishery you have in the St. Joe but it just didn't sink in. I've made the trips to various locations time and time again since 1972. Some successful, some not. I've always appreciated a heads up on what's happening in the rivers and have enjoyed meeting people that are on the forum as well as talking to the locals. I always try to provide some support to the local economy (gas, food, lodging, lures, bait....). Just remember, you are a lucky man to be where you are. Please, no responses about moving to Berrien Springs. Maybe we could arrange a "Dad" swap for a week or two during the peak of the run?  Hey... Please say "Hi" to Mr. Ali for me.
> 
> Take care & be safe out there...
> Cowalski


I definitely know how good I have it, trust me on that one. I also love the fact you love fishing here...

In regards to the champ, he moved away quite some time ago, sold the house and everything, he is a great guyw hom did a whoel lot for this town, paid for our football field renovations, new track, etc... Whenever you seen him in town if you called him champ he would always do a little shuffle and smile from ear to ear, definitely will always be missed around here, but his health issues forced him to move somewhere warmer I believe.


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## Rem870Mag (Sep 5, 2010)

I'm going to have to disagree with this. I have been fishing the rivers and the lake for the past few weeks. There are a few salmon that already are running, but the good run is yet to come the lake and river water is still to warm. Lake michigan is still pushing 75 and the fish are still way deep.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Rem870Mag said:


> I'm going to have to disagree with this. I have been fishing the rivers and the lake for the past few weeks. There are a few salmon that already are running, but the good run is yet to come the lake and river water is still to warm. Lake michigan is still pushing 75 and the fish are still way deep.


I definitely agree with that, we seen a small push of skams but virtually no Salmon....


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## CoWalSki (May 31, 2003)

I'm sorry to hear about Ali having health issues and forced to move. I wish him the best, he was a great fighter. By the way, you guys know that the Cam is now working don't you? Might want to take a look...

Cowalski


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## Spanky (Mar 21, 2001)

Hmmmm...............


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Yes the cam is on, looks like a fine specimen of a "Golden Salmon" is enjoying the spotlight for now...


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## danwalleye (May 25, 2010)

i fish there every october after main lake slows down. it will be crowded no matter what is said here any where fish collect like below adam will draw acrowd in one way thats good you can find out what they are hitting on much easier


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## Rem870Mag (Sep 5, 2010)

How do you get to the cam isn't it through BJ's website?


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Rem,

http://www.michigandnr.com/fishcam/


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## CoWalSki (May 31, 2003)

Do "Golden Salmon" have rosy red cheeks? Must be a new strain...  Saw them last night on the cam.....

Cowalski


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

Rem870Mag said:


> I'm going to have to disagree with this. I have been fishing the rivers and the lake for the past few weeks. There are a few salmon that already are running, but the good run is yet to come the lake and river water is still to warm. Lake michigan is still pushing 75 and the fish are still way deep.


The fish are not deep and havent been for some time. The fish are scattered from 20 fow out to 120 fow. Surface temp no longer makes a difference the whole lake has cooled down.

I enjoy meeting all the people by the dam. The guys that live in Chicago from Poland and Russia. Guys from Ohio, upper Michigan it makes no difference.

The only thing that blows is the guys who try to sit fish down there.


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## Jay Wesley (Mar 2, 2009)

Indiana is running the trap at Berrien to collect skam broodstock. 

19 skams today

50 mix of kings and coho 

They are starting to come in.


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## earl (Sep 7, 2007)

Thanks Jay!


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## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

OK, just checked back in and all I can say is that I did not mean to offend anyone. I am sorry if I broke the specific hole rule, I honestly thought it needed to be more specific than what I posted. I did not even fish when I mentioned the sand bar, I just made I observation on what was going there. I do live local, Niles to be exact. I live 8 miles from the Berrien dam. I have lived here a little over 6 years. I am from Ohio originally but I knew about the dam and St Joe river from being a kid 30 yrs ago and fishing it with my father. I am guessing everyone knows that salmon run the Joe in the fall. You can call Shamrock for a report or check any number of websites. I heard they a caught a salmon in the Betsie or Mo or Big Man this weekend also I guess no point in going up now I am sure it will be to crowded.
The Mod should adjust or delete my original post if it is indeed to specific. Maybe the ruling body should look into this posting of reports thing and if it is proved bad for Michigan Fisheries they should do away with it. This is a very cool website, it is my favorite on fishing. I do not believe you can make everyone happy on a site like this but they do come close. I have recently seen a lot of posts making fun of newbie questions about fishing, yes I know the questions can get old but once again you can go on by without clicking on it. I mean if the title says new to salmon what do I...? and you have nothing good to say maybe just pass on by. 
So we should not post reports and we should not ask questions that may have been asked before. We probably should never post a picture either, I have heard some complaining about that also. Please not post what lure you like because it may offend someone that does not care for that lure. Do not cure your eggs or is it always cure your eggs, I will have to get back to you that one. We should not talk about what rods we use either, I like Browning but the St Criox guys will not like my post about my rod. All fishing line is the same, please do not ask about that either. Thanks all, I look forward to fishing near you in the future but I will not talk to you and I will park In the Mcdonalds lot and walk to the dam so people won't see a bunch of cars parked there and wonder what is going on. Have a great evening and a better tomorrow.


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## MAS (Jan 23, 2006)

Thanks, Jay.
How long will the trap be set? Brian and IDNR need 700- GIVE OR TAKE. So, are you going to let fish up past Berrien- or will you you use Trail weir also.
One Thought.
Genetic diverisity of "early run Skams", won't be spoiled from one "LATE" year class generation. Those fish coming thru South Bend in January will still carry early run Skamania genetics.ACTUALLY- they will be more gravid and easy to milt and egg- as opposed to keeping in a circular hatchery system.
We will not have missed a generation of early spawners like the Skamania module perscription entails.
Actually, we might have another great genetic mutation to deal with the global warming conditions - and these late runners are the key to genetic diversity???-eh!


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## wartfroggy (Jan 25, 2007)

Multispeciestamer said:


> The fish are not deep and havent been for some time. The fish are scattered from 20 fow out to 120 fow. Surface temp no longer makes a difference the whole lake has cooled down.


 There are still plenty of fish out past that. Guys have been still taking mature fish out past 250' and over 120' down. The fish don't all move in at once, there will be several waves of fish while others sort of wait their turn. Surface temp rarely matters ever, it is the down temp that matters at times, and you can always find fish out of temp.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

rw65hdd said:


> OK, just checked back in and all I can say is that I did not mean to offend anyone. I am sorry if I broke the specific hole rule, I honestly thought it needed to be more specific than what I posted. I did not even fish when I mentioned the sand bar, I just made I observation on what was going there. I do live local, Niles to be exact. I live 8 miles from the Berrien dam. I have lived here a little over 6 years. I am from Ohio originally but I knew about the dam and St Joe river from being a kid 30 yrs ago and fishing it with my father. I am guessing everyone knows that salmon run the Joe in the fall. You can call Shamrock for a report or check any number of websites. I heard they a caught a salmon in the Betsie or Mo or Big Man this weekend also I guess no point in going up now I am sure it will be to crowded.
> The Mod should adjust or delete my original post if it is indeed to specific. Maybe the ruling body should look into this posting of reports thing and if it is proved bad for Michigan Fisheries they should do away with it. This is a very cool website, it is my favorite on fishing. I do not believe you can make everyone happy on a site like this but they do come close. I have recently seen a lot of posts making fun of newbie questions about fishing, yes I know the questions can get old but once again you can go on by without clicking on it. I mean if the title says new to salmon what do I...? and you have nothing good to say maybe just pass on by.
> So we should not post reports and we should not ask questions that may have been asked before. We probably should never post a picture either, I have heard some complaining about that also. Please not post what lure you like because it may offend someone that does not care for that lure. Do not cure your eggs or is it always cure your eggs, I will have to get back to you that one. We should not talk about what rods we use either, I like Browning but the St Criox guys will not like my post about my rod. All fishing line is the same, please do not ask about that either. Thanks all, I look forward to fishing near you in the future but I will not talk to you and I will park In the Mcdonalds lot and walk to the dam so people won't see a bunch of cars parked there and wonder what is going on. Have a great evening and a better tomorrow.


No need to apologize man, you didn't do anything wrong...

Good fishing and next time post some photos


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

CoWalSki said:


> Do "Golden Salmon" have rosy red cheeks? Must be a new strain...  Saw them last night on the cam.....
> 
> Cowalski


LOL, not unless you paint them.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Jay Wesley said:


> Indiana is running the trap at Berrien to collect skam broodstock.
> 
> 19 skams today
> 
> ...


sweet


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

MAS said:


> Thanks, Jay.
> How long will the trap be set? Brian and IDNR need 700- GIVE OR TAKE. So, are you going to let fish up past Berrien- or will you you use Trail weir also.
> One Thought.
> Genetic diverisity of "early run Skams", won't be spoiled from one "LATE" year class generation. Those fish coming thru South Bend in January will still carry early run Skamania genetics.ACTUALLY- they will be more gravid and easy to milt and egg- as opposed to keeping in a circular hatchery system.
> ...


Oh jeez not this again, If this summer proves anything it proves my hypothesis that these early and late runs are exactly the same. No matter if they try to make them run early or not. They run when conditions are right.


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## fishing-finlander (Sep 30, 2008)

Multispeciestamer said:


> Oh jeez not this again, If this summer proves anything it proves my hypothesis that these early and late runs are exactly the same. No matter if they try to make them run early or not. They run when conditions are right.



I agree, Skams run when its right for them. I have been on the joe when I tought conditions would be horrible for them, and caught a dozen. Then I have been there when they by all rights with water temp, time of year, etc etc should have been there in numbers and only caught a few and only seen a few caught. I used to chase them quite hard too from river to river, and just left shaking my head with about a half dozen other guys doing the same thing. 

Funny how that works, my first year fishing them I could do no wrong, every time I went there were fish, this past few years, hit and miss


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

You guys are forgetting the most important part of the puzzle...

These fish run as soon as they can, this makes them early running fish, there are skams whom even though they could have ran already, wait until later to run. Obviously these would be considered later running fish and they could in reality eventually become mainly a later running fish if they were bread that way...


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## Trout King (May 1, 2002)

You guys talking about the skams should read STS this month. Very interesting article on pinpointing steelhead in rivers. Gives you something to think about when it is explained.


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## CoWalSki (May 31, 2003)

*Jay....* Thanks for the info. Was that you cleaning the window about 2:00 pm today?? You missed a spot.... :lol:










Cowalski


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

Trout King said:


> You guys talking about the skams should read STS this month. Very interesting article on pinpointing steelhead in rivers. Gives you something to think about when it is explained.


 I love STS


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## sport72186 (Dec 20, 2007)

Trout King said:


> You guys talking about the skams should read STS this month. Very interesting article on pinpointing steelhead in rivers. Gives you something to think about when it is explained.


I think the article you are referring to was in the August edition written by Matt Straw. Great article for sure!


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## the specialist (Dec 1, 2008)

Is STS a magazine and where do you get it?


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## sport72186 (Dec 20, 2007)

the specialist said:


> Is STS a magazine and where do you get it?


Yep. It's "Salmon Trout Steelheader" -- Not sure where you can get it by you, but I'd try Gander or local bait shops. On the east side, The Little Dipper in Rockwood carries them. They might mail you a copy if you needed. Here's their number: (734) 782-4277


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## Trout King (May 1, 2002)

I have found STS at BBT. I don't see it much so I grabbed one. I'll probably just subscribe to it since I can never find it. It deals with mostly west coast fishing but occasionally great lakes. You can apply knowledge from out there and use it here.


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## Jay Wesley (Mar 2, 2009)

BS Ladder is open 24/7 now. Skam trapping has moved to South Bend. The salmon to skam ratio was 5:1, so it took a lot of sorting.


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## ledhead (Sep 5, 2010)

what was the approx fish per hr count ? I heard a few kings were landed down that way today


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

ledhead said:


> what was the approx fish per hr count ? I heard a few kings were landed down that way today


 None were landed after 6pm today I was down there from 6pm-9:30pm seen nothing silver even hooked. River is low fish are moving in the morning and evenings. Maybe this little rain will help :sad:.


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## ledhead (Sep 5, 2010)

Multispeciestamer said:


> None were landed after 6pm today I was down there from 6pm-9:30pm seen nothing silver even hooked. River is low fish are moving in the morning and evenings. Maybe this little rain will help :sad:.


hmmm, more wild rumors ..... go figure


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

I got down there at 6:30 this morning river still low guys down there with lanterns that had been down there all night nothing but one steelhead(skam) on a stringer way down river. Not expecting much I take my first cast, letting it sink.. letting it sink.., Wham, fish on. I fight it all the way to the bank before it turns to run again and my drag was to tight. Pulled the hook right out of the bait. Straighted out my split ring :rant:. Later 1 guy landed one king and Golden eye charters boated two kings. For the other 15 or so guys down there nothing. I left at 10:00 or so.


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## ledhead (Sep 5, 2010)

Multispeciestamer said:


> I got down there at 6:30 this morning river still low guys down there with lanterns that had been down there all night nothing but one steelhead(skam) on a stringer way down river. Not expecting much I take my first cast, letting it sink.. letting it sink.., Wham, fish on. I fight it all the way to the bank before it turns to run again and my drag was to tight. Pulled the hook right out of the bait. Straighted out my split ring :rant:. Later 1 guy landed one king and Golden eye charters boated two kings. For the other 15 or so guys down there nothing. I left at 10:00 or so.


yea, not too furious as of yet.... I made it down there a cpl times last week and seen nada.... Nice to hear a cpl were landed though


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## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

Fished 3 to 6 PM on the Joe yesterday. Went 0 for 1. Lost a nice Steelhead at my feet. I was throwing large Cranks. Hit came on a flo. green no-name fat body crank 5 casts in. I did not see any other fish taken except for a cats and a dogfish. Heard the smallies were hitting earlier in day. Water still very low and clear. 
I also hooked into a snag that I was able to pull in and actually went home with 1 more lure than I arrived with. Bonus. Looking forward to next weekend already.


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

rw65hdd said:


> Fished 3 to 6 PM on the Joe yesterday. Went 0 for 1. Lost a nice Steelhead at my feet. I was throwing large Cranks. Hit came on a flo. green no-name fat body crank 5 casts in. I did not see any other fish taken except for a cats and a dogfish. Heard the smallies were hitting earlier in day. Water still very low and clear.
> I also hooked into a snag that I was able to pull in and actually went home with 1 more lure than I arrived with. Bonus. Looking forward to next weekend already.


 wow Ive never seen or heard of a dogfish down there before. As I was down there yesterday morning I seen no smallmouth caught while I was down there. In fact havnt seen a smallie over 15 inchs caught down there since like june.


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## thousandcasts (Jan 22, 2002)

Multispeciestamer said:


> Oh jeez not this again, If this summer proves anything it proves my hypothesis that these early and late runs are exactly the same. No matter if they try to make them run early or not. They run when conditions are right.


Salmon and steelhead running when the conditions are right? Man, that's one hell of a hypothesis--how long did it take to come up with that one?


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## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

The dogfish was caught on the east side by a older foreign guy. He had it on a stringer with a cat fish. I was told he fishes the pier a lot but I have seen him down here by the river a couple of times. He usually keeps everything he catches. The smallies were on the west side, did not see them myself but guys that caught them said they were smallies and they were throwing jigs. I had never seen a dogfish in the river down here either but that ain't sayin much, I was surprised to pull in a sheephead from the river. I have been doin ok on bass farther up river all summer. Nothin huge but a couple over 15".


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

rw65hdd said:


> The dogfish was caught on the east side by a older foreign guy. He had it on a stringer with a cat fish. I was told he fishes the pier a lot but I have seen him down here by the river a couple of times. He usually keeps everything he catches. The smallies were on the west side, did not see them myself but guys that caught them said they were smallies and they were throwing jigs. I had never seen a dogfish in the river down here either but that ain't sayin much, I was surprised to pull in a sheephead from the river. I have been doin ok on bass farther up river all summer. Nothin huge but a couple over 15".


 That dudes always out on the pier, I dont like him. He will use 4 rods out on the pier and stuff. What do you mean by west side, the NORTH side?


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

thousandcasts said:


> Salmon and steelhead running when the conditions are right? Man, that's one hell of a hypothesis--how long did it take to come up with that one?


 do i have to right out my hypothesis in red for you??????

"hypothesis that these early and late runs are exactly the same"


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## rw65hdd (Nov 15, 2008)

ladder side- west??? guess it could north.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Multispeciestamer said:


> That dudes always out on the pier, I dont like him. He will use 4 rods out on the pier and stuff. What do you mean by west side, the NORTH side?


It's a lot more West than it is North, therefore it's the West and East side...


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

How do you figure? At the piers one piers on the north one at the south, at berrien dam its the same way a north side, and a south side. South side is where the fish ladder is. Thats enough info.


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## Sell (Jan 24, 2002)

Multispeciestamer said:


> How do you figure? At the piers one piers on the north one at the south, at berrien dam its the same way a north side, and a south side. South side is where the fish ladder is. Thats enough info.


"Boy" Am I glad you straightened that up, like it makes a sh-- one way or the other. Typical know it all teenager.


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## Rem870Mag (Sep 5, 2010)

Deff North and South


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

Thanks


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

http://www.bing.com/maps/default.aspx?encType=1&where1=Berrien+Springs,+Michigan&FORM=MIRE1

The non ladder side is obviously a tad more North than the ladder side, but by far it's more of an East/West deal, I guess you can call it whatever you want, but everyone has always called it East/West...

Not real sure what the hell the piers have to do with anything...


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## Multispeciestamer (Jan 27, 2010)

The river runs from the east to the west. There for the banks are on the north and south. Now when the river bends and winds directions can be changed but you will still be on the north or south of the same location directly across.


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## samsteel (Oct 6, 2008)

Multispeciestamer said:


> The river runs from the east to the west. There for the banks are on the north and south. Now when the river bends and winds directions can be changed but you will still be on the north or south of the same location directly across.


please stop


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## RAD FISH (Oct 17, 2006)

Multispeciestamer said:


> The river runs from the east to the west. There for the banks are on the north and south. Now when the river bends and winds directions can be changed but you will still be on the north or south of the same location directly across.



:: I think maybe you guys should go settle this out on the elementary school play ground once and for all. I can't believe I waste my time reading this crap.


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

RAD FISH said:


> :: I think maybe you guys should go settle this out on the elementary school play ground once and for all. I can't believe I waste my time reading this crap.


How else would you be able to to learn what a failure our public schools are these days? Kids can't even read a map anymore...


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## KWB (Mar 1, 2009)

Multispeciestamer said:


> The river runs from the east to the west. There for the banks are on the north and south. Now when the river bends and winds directions can be changed but you will still be on the north or south of the same location directly across.


Ok, this is my last response to this as simply put, it doesn't matter...

The Joe is one of the few rivers in the World that flows North, South, East and West "which is the reason your theory which is generally correct, is wrong", if you would just open your eyes and look at the map you would clearly see directly below Berrien Springs Dam the river is flowing primarily North, therefore each bank would be designated as the East and West bank directly below the dam, which is where the gentleman you told was wrong was talking about. Now that has been said, I feel like I need recess or something, flash backs from years ago in grade school come to mind...

When you told the guy he was wrong for calling the area directly below the dam the West side, technically he was right, but whatever, doesn't really matter...


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## Still Wait'n (Nov 25, 2005)

Multispeciestamer said:


> The river runs from the east to the west. There for the banks are on the north and south. Now when the river bends and winds directions can be changed but you will still be on the north or south of the same location directly across.





samsteel said:


> please stop


Yes please stop, you really are making yourself look bad.


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## quest32a (Sep 25, 2001)

Multispeciestamer said:


> The river runs from the east to the west. There for the banks are on the north and south. Now when the river bends and winds directions can be changed but you will still be on the north or south of the same location directly across.


What? That doesn't even make sense. And the St Joe doesn't run from east to west. It runs every which direction. The headwaters begin in MI then head South into Indiana, then it runs West for a while, then back NW into Michigan. 

Dude, seriously. You seem like a nice kid. But stop arguing every damn point and sit back in listen. Your stay here will be be much more pleasant, and probably much longer.


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