# Wolf Shot In Cheboygan County



## Perferator

Conservation officers from the Department of Natural Resources and Environment in Gaylord are seeking information on the possible poaching of a wolf that occurred in Cheboygan County sometime between Jan. 14  19. The wolf was one of two pups that were radio-collared by the DNRE and U.S. Department of Agricultures Wildlife Services in October 2010 in Cheboygan County. The pups movements had been radio tracked with the last live signal occurring on Jan. 14. Wildlife biologists with the DNRE then received a mortality signal on Jan. 19 and located the collar from the wolf pup alongside Riggsville Road, approximately five miles east of Interstate 75 in Cheboygan County. The animal has not been recovered. The DNRE is focusing its investigation in the wolf pups territory in the townships of Burt, Inverness, Munro and Mullett in Cheboygan County

http://www.upnorthlive.com/news/story.aspx?list=194415&id=572071


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## tgafish

Maybe it was hit by a car and the scavengers ate it:evilsmile


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## Perferator

tgafish said:


> Maybe it was hit by a car and the scavengers ate it:evilsmile




It was about 7yrs ago on the eastern end of the UP the DNR found a collar in a creek.

Just taking a stab at the science of a mortality collar it seems to go into alert when the GPS has no change in movement. Oh well, I dont hunt wolves. And I'm not a farmer/rancher struggling to keep a herd intact, either.


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## Burnmtndog

I haven't read anywhere that the animal was "shot". As far as I know, the Wolf has not been found, only the tracking collar was located. If the animal was in fact "shot", hopefully they find out who pulled the trigger...


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## Perferator

Burnmtndog said:


> I haven't read anywhere that the animal was "shot". As far as I know, the Wolf has not been found, only the tracking collar was located. If the animal was in fact "shot", hopefully they find out who pulled the trigger...


I took literary luxury of making the assumption :lol:


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## Flag Up

Sounds like the trolls management is the same as the yoopers.


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## Liver and Onions

Now if the person removing the collar from the dead wolf really wanted to have some fun with the DNR, they could've tossed the collar into the back end of an out-of-state pickup truck.

L & O


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## Wildcatdad

They said on 9 and 10 news that the collar was cut off.


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## Boozer

Wildcatdad said:


> They said on 9 and 10 news that the collar was cut off.


finger prints????


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## BFTrout

collar was cut, which weakens the transmission signal. they were doing grid searches until they found it on the side of the road.


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## James Dymond

I never knew they collared any in Oct, did they put that out to the public, I have a picture of the pup they ear tagged in Aug. Jim


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## mcfish

BFTrout said:


> collar was cut, which weakens the transmission signal. they were doing grid searches until they found it on the side of the road.


How is it that the DNR has enough money to do all of this for a friggin wolf, but they don't have enough to keep a decent amount of officers in the field? Their priorities seem out of wack to me.


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## Mitchell Ulrich

Burnmtndog said:


> I haven't read anywhere that the animal was "shot". As far as I know, the Wolf has not been found, only the tracking collar was located. If the animal was in fact "shot", hopefully they find out who pulled the trigger...


..and give him a medal!

OUR DNR should be calling the Feds and saying..hey found another one or YOUR wolves dead. We'd love to work the case but since we don't have any say in how things are managed within our own State that makes it's your burden now!


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## aslongasitpullsback

May I ask the question why are they putting wovles in the northern lower?
theres not enough territory for them, plus what are they so-post to pray on... the infected whitetail population??????
I don't get it....


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## swampbuck

Perferator said:


> Conservation officers from the Department of Natural Resources and Environment in Gaylord are seeking information on the possible poaching of a wolf that occurred in Cheboygan County sometime between Jan. 14  19. The wolf was one of two pups that were radio-collared by the DNRE and U.S. Department of Agricultures Wildlife Services in October 2010 in Cheboygan County. The pups movements had been radio tracked with the last live signal occurring on Jan. 14. Wildlife biologists with the DNRE then received a mortality signal on Jan. 19 and located the collar from the wolf pup alongside Riggsville Road, approximately five miles east of Interstate 75 in Cheboygan County. The animal has not been recovered. The DNRE is focusing its investigation in the wolf pups territory in the townships of Burt, Inverness, Munro and Mullett in Cheboygan County
> 
> http://www.upnorthlive.com/news/story.aspx?list=194415&id=572071


 
Cant say I am surprised........or disapointed.


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## huntingfool43

aslongasitpullsback said:


> May I ask the question why are they putting wovles in the northern lower?
> theres not enough territory for them, plus what are they so-post to pray on... the infected whitetail population??????
> I don't get it....


 They didn't put them there. They figure they walked across the ice from the UP when the straights froze over. trouble is now that they are there and the DNR has to protect them.


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## HUBBHUNTER

aslongasitpullsback said:


> May I ask the question why are they putting wovles in the northern lower?
> theres not enough territory for them, plus what are they so-post to pray on... the infected whitetail population??????
> I don't get it....


The wolves in the NLP have not been planted there by the DNR. They have come across the ice bridge in the straits of Mack. And yes they will prey on the infected whitetail population but they do not discriminate and will also feed on healthy deer, cattle, horses, as well as your house hold mutt.


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## aslongasitpullsback

HUBBHUNTER said:


> The wolves in the NLP have not been planted there by the DNR. They have come across the ice bridge in the straits of Mack. And yes they will prey on the infected whitetail population but they do not discriminate and will also feed on healthy deer, cattle, horses, as well as your house hold mutt.


Hub, I was being sarcastic with the statement of the Infected deer bit...If they can track them with there radio collars then they should be-able to trap them... or at least shoot them with trank Gun.... on a bait... just like they did to put them in the U.P....


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## Luv2hunteup

More info.


> DNRE Conservation Officers Seek Tips on Cheboygan County Possible Wolf Poaching
> Contact: Lt. Jim Gorno, 989-732-3541, ext. 5100 or Mary Dettloff, 517-335-3014
> Agency: Natural Resources and Environment
> 
> 
> Jan. 25, 2011
> 
> Conservation officers from the Department of Natural Resources and Environment in Gaylord are seeking information on the possible poaching of a wolf that occurred in Cheboygan County sometime between Jan. 14 - 19.
> 
> The wolf was one of two pups that were radio-collared by the DNRE and U.S. Department of Agriculture's Wildlife Services in October 2010 in Cheboygan County. The pups' movements had been radio tracked with the last live signal occurring on Jan. 14. Wildlife biologists with the DNRE then received a mortality signal on Jan. 19 and located the collar from the wolf pup alongside Riggsville Road, approximately five miles east of Interstate 75 in Cheboygan County. The animal has not been recovered.
> 
> The DNRE is focusing its investigation in the wolf pup's territory in the townships of Burt, Inverness, Munro and Mullett in Cheboygan County.
> 
> Anyone with information can contact Lt. Jim Gorno of the DNRE's Law Enforcement Division in Gaylord at 989-732-3541, extension 5100. A $1000 reward has been offered by the Defenders of Wildlife and a $500 reward is being offered through the Timber Wolf Alliance for any information leading to the arrest and conviction of the person(s) responsible for killing the wolf.
> 
> The maximum penalty for poaching a wolf is 90 days in jail or a fine of up to $1,000, or both, plus reimbursement of $1,500 to the state for killing an endangered species. Poaching convictions also usually include a suspension of hunting privileges for a period of three years.
> 
> Wolves are a federally protected species in Michigan and cannot legally be killed except in the defense of human life. For more information on wolves in Michigan, go to www.michigan.gov/wolves.
> 
> Anyone with tips about this incident or other hunting violations should call the DNRE's Report All Poaching line, 24 hours a day, at 800-292-7800. Information can be left anonymously.
> 
> The Department of Natural Resources and Environment is committed to the conservation, protection, management, and accessible use and enjoyment of the state's environment, natural resources, and related economic interests for current and future generations. Learn more at www.michigan.gov/dnre.


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## Overdew

Kill em all and the yotes, Vermin


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## Mitchell Ulrich

We're not allowed to say that on here!

Thinking and doing it, well that's a different story.


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## jondahighlander

I quit hunting Newberry cuz I would only see a wolf & A LOT of their tracks....out of whack management. Way to go friggin DNR
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Robert Holmes

Mitchell Ulrich said:


> ..and give him a medal!
> 
> OUR DNR should be calling the Feds and saying..hey found another one or YOUR wolves dead. We'd love to work the case but since we don't have any say in how things are managed within our own State that makes it's your burden now!


 The DNR has wasted more money on wolves in the last thirty years then they have wasted on Kirtland Warblers in the last 100 years. That my friend is alot of money. I am sure that it did not hurt the population any as it looks like we have a nice ice bridge for them to travel on. I think that the DNR should open season on them and not close it.


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## GVDocHoliday

Robert Holmes said:


> The DNR has wasted more money on wolves in the last thirty years then they have wasted on Kirtland Warblers in the last 100 years. That my friend is alot of money. I am sure that it did not hurt the population any as it looks like we have a nice ice bridge for them to travel on. I think that the DNR should open season on them and not close it.


I love these ignorant statements. Makes it sound like the DNR actually has a say as to whether there's an open season on wolves.


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## Scott L

I posted below back in 09. Not surprising there are pups now. I wonder how many are in the NE lower now. I have not got any more on the trail cam...but also got less game of any type....wonder why? 
Check out Photos/Videos, then Home » Big Game » Trail Cam pictures title; upload_wolf.
This was spring/summer 09. 
Presque Isle County Five miles south of the Cheboygan County line 200' from US 23. 
DNR confirmed as wolf. Supposed to stop by and review area for tracks, scat, and other sign. That was scat cause I never seen a single DNR representative.


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## mjd

Scott L said:


> I posted below back in 09. Not surprising there are pups now. I wonder how many are in the NE lower now. I have not got any more on the trail cam...but also got less game of any type....wonder why?
> Check out Photos/Videos, then Home » Big Game » Trail Cam pictures title; upload_wolf.
> This was spring/summer 09.
> Presque Isle County Five miles south of the Cheboygan County line 200' from US 23.
> DNR confirmed as wolf. Supposed to stop by and review area for tracks, scat, and other sign. That was scat cause I never seen a single DNR representative.


took this pic a couple years ago on m134 a few miles west of de tour,very easy for them to cross to the lower


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## Ole Spike

mcfish said:


> How is it that the DNR has enough money to do all of this for a friggin wolf, but they don't have enough to keep a decent amount of officers in the field? Their priorities seem out of wack to me.


To me too. Saw a show where they had all these DNR guys chasing a collared wolf around with some kind of devices and the first thing I thought was "how much is all this costing?"


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## boostfan

Getting a little off subject, but they say it was 5 days from the last living signal, to the mortality signal. Is it normal to be 5 days between signals?


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## Petronius

aslongasitpullsback said:


> May I ask the question why are they putting wovles in the northern lower?
> theres not enough territory for them, plus what are they so-post to pray on... the infected whitetail population??????
> I don't get it....


Maybe the DNR wants to use wolves to get rid of the coyotes and feral pigs. When that's taken care of they can prey on our pets and children.



Liver and Onions said:


> Now if the person removing the collar from the dead wolf really wanted to have some fun with the DNR, they could've tossed the collar into the back end of an out-of-state pickup truck.


Or mail it to a DNR office in the western UP.


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## a1270

Or maybe the turkey, rabbits squirrels, partridge, elk or even to get rid of the pheasant they want to bring back.


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## U.P.Nate

Does anyone kno if these collars are visible to the naked eye? or possibly a 24x scope? not on a gun of course, strictly used for viewing only. And pics of said collars? What would the possibility of viewing one of these collared specimens? Compared to a non collared one? What is the ratio or probability of "viewing" one.


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## MDH

It is a sad situation when you look at priorities of the DNR. It's almost like they are focusing on the desires of environmentalists over the outdoorsmen. I'm all for conservation of species, but not at the expense of other ones especially when our state is bankrupt. The money could be spent in better areas.

_OutdoorHub Mobile, the information engine of the outdoors_


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## Trevor

The Feds plant the wolves, the Feds makes the laws. The state pays, and pays, hmmm.


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## MERGANZER

MDH said:


> It is a sad situation when you look at priorities of the DNR. It's almost like they are focusing on the desires of environmentalists over the outdoorsmen. I'm all for conservation of species, but not at the expense of other ones especially when our state is bankrupt. The money could be spent in better areas.
> 
> _OutdoorHub Mobile, the information engine of the outdoors_


 

Even a more sad state to see the ignorance of so many sportsmen here. People talk of the money wolves cost farmers and ranchers yet deer, *****, turkeys probably all cost them much more every year. Should we KILL OF OF THEM AS WELL??? The wolves need to be managed yes but to sit here and say things like "GIVE HIM A MEDAL" to a POACHER????? you want to reward a law breaking poacher??? The wolf is a beautiful and majestic animal. They eat meat. They need to be managed but not exterminated. lets represent ourselves in a little better light okay folks. Don't make us all look like ignorant law breakers.

Ganzer


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## Boozer

MERGANZER said:


> Even a more sad state to see the ignorance of so many sportsmen here. People talk of the money wolves cost farmers and ranchers yet deer, *****, turkeys probably all cost them much more every year. Should we KILL OF OF THEM AS WELL??? The wolves need to be managed yes but to sit here and say things like "GIVE HIM A MEDAL" to a POACHER????? you want to reward a law breaking poacher??? The wolf is a beautiful and majestic animal. They eat meat. They need to be managed but not exterminated. lets represent ourselves in a little better light okay folks. Don't make us all look like ignorant law breakers.
> 
> Ganzer


Ding Ding, we have a winner!

Finally someone with some common sense!


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## MDH

I'm pretty sure I didn't say anything supporting poaching of wolves, and I never would. I just think too much effort is put into the wolves. Not really sure why you quoted me into the group that supports poaching?





MERGANZER said:


> Even a more sad state to see the ignorance of so many sportsmen here. People talk of the money wolves cost farmers and ranchers yet deer, *****, turkeys probably all cost them much more every year. Should we KILL OF OF THEM AS WELL??? The wolves need to be managed yes but to sit here and say things like "GIVE HIM A MEDAL" to a POACHER????? you want to reward a law breaking poacher??? The wolf is a beautiful and majestic animal. They eat meat. They need to be managed but not exterminated. lets represent ourselves in a little better light okay folks. Don't make us all look like ignorant law breakers.
> 
> Ganzer




_OutdoorHub Mobile, the information engine of the outdoors_


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## MERGANZER

I don't think I did quote you. The money alot of times is fed money allocated to be spent on wolves and only wolves. That fact is, if you shoot a wolf you are poaching and if you support shooting wolves you are supporting poaching. This is a public forum seen by thousands everyday and not only by sportsmen. My point is simple. Be careful what you say and always know like it or not you are representing Michigan Sportsmen and women.

Ganzer


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## Hevi

The ignorance of the "sportsman" here never surprises me. As MERG says, most game animals cost the farmers money. However, it's usually not the farmers that are poaching the Wolves. It's some ignorant hillbilly that wants to pull the trigger on one, and then uses that logic as to why he did it. I have spent 7 years living in the Northern Lower and the U.P. and have heard more than one story about someone poaching a Wolf. It's never an upstanding sportsman....just a poacher. This type of act is nothing but fuel for the antis. If you want to call yourselves sportsman, act like it. Sounding like an idiot does nothing but make the rest of that are stewards for our sport look just as stupid as you and your uninformed posts.


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## Hevi

MERGANZER said:


> This is a public forum seen by thousands everyday and not only by sportsmen. My point is simple. Be careful what you say and always know like it or not you are representing Michigan Sportsmen and women.
> 
> Ganzer


 
Amen.


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## MERGANZER

We reached the old wolf in time to watch a fierce green fire dying in her eyes. I realized then, and have known ever since, that there was something new to me in those eyes--something known only to her and to the mountain. I was young then, and full of trigger-itch; I thought that because fewer wolves meant more deer, that no wolves would mean hunters' paradise. But after seeing the green fire die, I sensed that neither the wolf nor the mountain agreed with such a view. 

Aldo Leopold--Thinking Like A Mountain 

food for thought!

Ganzer


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## dead short

Robert Holmes said:


> Well the Alaskans and Canadians both of which have wolf seasons are probably laughing at the DNR. Michigan hunters are taking thousands of dollars out of the Michigan economy and spending the money in their territories. As far as out west goes well we have seen what wolves have done to the Elk population.


What have they done other than help bring balance to a population that was out of check and overbrowsing the woods and riparian areas?

http://www.physorg.com/news152463800.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/todd-palmer-and-rob-pringle/why-we-need-wolves-in-our_b_177209.html

http://www.yellowstonepark.com/MoreToKnow/ShowNewsDetails.aspx?newsid=12

http://www.nationalparkstraveler.co...tone-national-parks-wolf-recovery-program5358


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## Boozer

Just one question...

Essentially the main thing I keep hearing over and over again is that the Wolves need to be "managed".

I am just wondering, how is it that nature seems to do so well when we are not "managing" them in so many cases? What did Wolves do before we were here? The Deer populations sure seemed to be fine then.

Has anyone thought about the fact there is definitely a trend in Deer populations of heading South, states that never used to be wonderful Deer hunting states are now seeing wonderful populations and states which once were Deer meccas have seen declining populations.

The Cabela's over near Illinois border has this huge billboard describing the trends of Deer populations moving South, some of you may want to check it out.


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## dead short

I guess the only thing that is for sure is that the social carrying capacity for the wolf is less than the actual biological carrying capacity.

That is the opposite for deer and elk. Social carrying capacity is greater than the biological carrying capacity. Hunters want to see critters every time they hunt or some aren't satisfied with their experience. Large predators are always easy to blame for the lack of critters, when really it may be just a lack of good habitat in your location to support the numbers you want to see. If I had to bet, I would say that coyote's are at least as injurous to deer numbers if not more than wolves.










If one tenth of the coyotes in the UP were this successful, imagine what that would do to fawn recruitment year to year.

Take out the social aspect of the wolf's recovery (which I know is really impossible to do because people like to be outside), and left alone nature will balance it out.

The balance between social and bilogical is the one that needs to be made, and not by vigilante's.


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## dead short

Boozer said:


> The Cabela's over near Illinois border has this huge billboard describing the trends of Deer populations moving South, some of you may want to check it out.


After this winter, can you blame any mammal for wanting to move south??


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## Robert Holmes

I can hardly disagree with you Dead Short that wolves do play an important role in controlling wildlife populations. What happens when you have an overpopulation of wolves and a DNR/USFWS that wants to protect them at all costs? You said it yourself that the wolf is at the top of the predator totem pole. I guarantee you that I can place you at some of my deer hunting spots and you will see more wolves than deer. That should tell you something. Makes you wonder what they will eat when there is no deer left. Thus the reason that no longer go into the woods without being armed.


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## Boozer

Robert Holmes said:


> I can hardly disagree with you Dead Short that wolves do play an important role in controlling wildlife populations. What happens when you have an overpopulation of wolves and a DNR/USFWS that wants to protect them at all costs? You said it yourself that the wolf is at the top of the predator totem pole. I guarantee you that I can place you at some of my deer hunting spots and you will see more wolves than deer. That should tell you something. Makes you wonder what they will eat when there is no deer left. Thus the reason that no longer go into the woods without being armed.


You keep taking what fits your ideals to support your ideas, but you aren't taking the entire facts together as they need to be to create an accurate statement...


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## dead short

Robert Holmes said:


> I guarantee you that I can place you at some of my deer hunting spots and you will see more wolves than deer.


That would be awesome. I saw a wolf around Felch when I was at a friends dads camp (mid 90's). That was the only time I saw one in the wild. I did my senior thesis on the reintroduction program out west. I have to admit that I really like the family structure, organization, and capabilities that wolves exhibit.

Thought this was interesting but a bit scientific for my liking...

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dnr/Peyton_et_al_SCC_wolves_PDF_for_online_295701_7.pdf


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## DIYsportsman

heres my experience with wolves

last time that i went hunting deer in the up (2008), near rudyard,my cousin and I were riding our atv's turned a corner and there was a wolf growling at us about 5 feet away, we hit the brakes and gunned it in reverse. im sure it was probably frightened of us (although it did stand its ground),but that was the last time we went unarmed to and from our blinds.

another thing i didnt see a single deer in the 4 days i hunted...

maybe if there was a season for them, they might be a little scared of us when they encounter us in the woods, or perhaps not so bold...

another thing,
is there a possability that it could have been mistaken for a coyote? because it was a young wolf, sometimes they can look like a coyote when they're young, expecially to the untrained eye


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## Robert Holmes

I found it interesting on how much money people will pay to see a wolf in Yellowstone. I also agree that coyotes propably kill more deer than wolves. I hardly doubt that people would pay much money to see a wolf in the UP. Unless you really know where to be and when to be there your chances of seeing a wolf up here are slim to none as they are pretty elusive. As far as a hunting season goes the DNR could probably issue 500 permits per year on a lottery and I would bet that mabey 50 wolves would be tagged. From November to present I have had 5 wolf sightings in the deer yard where I fish. The number of sightings is down from previous years I believe due to the lack of snow and the deer are not yarded up as much as they used to be. I would think with a colder winter that more wolves moved across the ice this winter to help the population down in the LP.


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## kingfisher2

Interesting thread....I have hiked hundreds of miles of trails out here with bear, wolf, and cougar tracks everywhere......never had a problem. So if you're scared to walk your dog in the UP where there is just a few of these preditors, you're really missing out....just my opinion.

Marc


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## WAUB-MUKWA

DIYsportsman said:


> another thing,
> is there a possability that it could have been mistaken for a coyote? because it was a young wolf, sometimes they can look like a coyote when they're young, expecially to the untrained eye


The young wolves always have longer legs than any sized coyote.


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## Buddwiser

dead short said:


> Sometimes you can tell a lot about a "Michigan sportsman" by the posts they make.


Yep, you can. Seems as though the old boy in my signaure had it right when he said it. Whats funny here is the hysteria over the wolves now that they are in th LP. When it was a UP problem, the remarks and attitude towards wolves were intirely different. It was a "quit yer crying" type of attitude. I remember reading a post by one UP member saying something along the lines "wait until they're (wolves) in your backyard. Then we'll see how you feel about them". By the tenor of mosts of the replies to the op, we've see how most feel about them.


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## DIYsportsman

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> The young wolves always have longer legs than any sized coyote.


yes of course there are difference hense they are different species, i was just saying they look similar, expecially to the *untrained eye*...

what i was trying to point out is perhaps it wasnt an intentional act, still poaching, but maybe under different circumstances that many people might be assuming.


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## boostfan

The reality is that the engenuity and opposable thumb of humans put us at the top of the predator list thousands of years ago. As such we have proven that without management, we can extinct a species despite the balance of nature. That is why in my humble opinion we need some form of a management plant for wolfes as well. Unfortunately the DNR seems reluctant to be proactive in management efforts, which means it will probably be when a kid gets eaten. If what I heard earlier is true, that certain areas see more Wolf than their critical food source deer, it will not be long befor the wolves need to hunt other food sources.


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## DIYsportsman

boostfan said:


> The reality is that the engenuity and opposable thumb of humans put us at the top of the predator list thousands of years ago. As such we have proven that without management, we can extinct a species despite the balance of nature. That is why in my humble opinion we need some form of a management plant for wolfes as well. Unfortunately the DNR seems reluctant to be proactive in management efforts, which means it will probably be when a kid gets eaten. If what I heard earlier is true, that certain areas see more Wolf than their critical food source deer, it will not be long befor the wolves need to hunt other food sources.


its actually the federal government that has all the power in this matter, the states have to propose a management plan to be accepted by the feds, then taken off endangered species list. the problem is that every step forward they take they get sued by some group, which has been going on for a few years

if i am wrong please correct me, but this is my understanding


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## a1270

You are correct!!


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## bear50

Robert Holmes said:


> I can hardly disagree with you Dead Short that wolves do play an important role in controlling wildlife populations. What happens when you have an overpopulation of wolves and a DNR/USFWS that wants to protect them at all costs? You said it yourself that the wolf is at the top of the predator totem pole. I guarantee you that I can place you at some of my deer hunting spots and you will see more wolves than deer. That should tell you something. Makes you wonder what they will eat when there is no deer left. Thus the reason that no longer go into the woods without being armed.


Amazing !! When is the last time you were attacked by a wolf or anybody else ? Thats right never !! Control the wolves ? Yes, but with facts not crap shooting out of somebody's clueless trap. I've been biting my tongue lately but just cant do it anymore. And the reason why you seen less wolves this year is because the deer numbers are down and no other reason. When there is a high food supply then there will be a high predator population and vise versa !! It's called " proven SCIENCE " not some crap you were told by your drunken buddy down at the local water hole.


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## WAUB-MUKWA

DIYsportsman said:


> yes of course there are difference hense they are different species, i was just saying they look similar, expecially to the *untrained eye*...
> 
> what i was trying to point out is perhaps it wasnt an intentional act, still poaching, but maybe under different circumstances that many people might be assuming.


It could of been mistaken identity yes. The collar is pretty easy to see at a few hundreds yards though.


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## WAUB-MUKWA

bear50 said:


> Amazing !! When is the last time you were attacked by a wolf or anybody else ? Thats right never !! Control the wolves ? Yes, but with facts not crap shooting out of somebody's clueless trap. I've been biting my tongue lately but just cant do it anymore. And the reason why you seen less wolves this year is because the deer numbers are down and no other reason. When there is a high food supply then there will be a high predator population and vise versa !! It's called " proven SCIENCE " not some crap you were told by your drunken buddy down at the local water hole.


1,000's of people have died in Russia the past 100 years from wolves. Guess they might be different than these non violent cousins we have here?


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## boostfan

DIYsportsman said:


> its actually the federal government that has all the power in this matter, the states have to propose a management plan to be accepted by the feds, then taken off endangered species list. the problem is that every step forward they take they get sued by some group, which has been going on for a few years
> 
> if i am wrong please correct me, but this is my understanding


Thank you for the correction, but the point is still the same, the reactive government will not do anything until somebody gets hurt. Which I personally think will happen. I don't believe that wolves will sit back idle when deer populations fall. They are hunters and they will search for new food sources, which will eventually include a child.


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## Boozer

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> 1,000's of people have died in Russia the past 100 years from wolves. Guess they might be different than these non violent cousins we have here?


Natural selection.... 

You could also look at it as, there are too many humans, perhaps we should go up to the UP and "manage" them as well?

99% of the guys screaming for Wolf management are just looking for an excuse to kill them legally.

Just because our thumbs make us an advanced species doesn't mean we are the most advanced, we are laying waste to the very Planet we depend on for the survival of our species, doesn't sound very advanced to me...


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## WAUB-MUKWA

Boozer said:


> Natural selection....
> 
> You could also look at it as, there are too many humans, perhaps we should go up to the UP and "manage" them as well?
> 
> 99% of the guys screaming for Wolf management are just looking for an excuse to kill them legally.
> 
> Just because our thumbs make us an advanced species doesn't mean we are the most advanced, we are laying waste to the very Planet we depend on for the survival of our species, doesn't sound very advanced to me...


1,000's of farm animals killed and no means to control them because of anti human statements like yours that keeps them on the list away from proper management? Failed non lethal controlling measures by the DNR. If that puts me in your 99% wanting them to be controlled then so be it.


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## doogie mac

kingfisher2 said:


> Interesting thread....I have hiked hundreds of miles of trails out here with bear, wolf, and cougar tracks everywhere......never had a problem. So if you're scared to walk your dog in the UP where there is just a few of these preditors, you're really missing out....just my opinion.
> 
> Marc


 I agree with this....
I lived in Alaska for several years before moving here to MI. Aside from hunting,I never felt the need for weapon protection when I fished,hiked etc. Same goes for here in MI. Common sense dictates my actions I guess.
Wolf management?? Yeah,probably.Kill all the "@*!!$##'s?? No way. We cant compare Mi to Alaska and Canada because of the vastness of real estate.Wolves are everywhere in Alaska,but with room to roam,they are pretty much not the topic as they are here. I think management needs to happen to sustain a sizeable wolf population. A slightly similar local comparison could be the Pigeon river Elk herd.Why do you think we have hunting seasons on these creatures? My guess is probably because they have increased in numbers and their area is much larger than the Pigeon R area. 
Who knows what the Feds will decide as far as wolves go. Anyone who has followed the delisting process out west knows this is a volitale topic. As far as Mi (the U.P. especially)deer herd goes,there are a lot of problems related-wolves and coyotes included.But also habitat,poaching,harvest regs and so on.


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## MERGANZER

Well you know thousands of Russians have been killed by wolves so they must go!!!!!!! THE SKY IS FALLING THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!! This thread has become very comical. Thousands of Russians are you kidding me????? This is hilarious.

Ganzer


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## WAUB-MUKWA

MERGANZER said:


> Well you know thousands of Russians have been killed by wolves so they must go!!!!!!! THE SKY IS FALLING THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!! This thread has become very comical. Thousands of Russians are you kidding me????? This is hilarious.
> 
> Ganzer


Look it up, its there. In two years 1996-1998 wolves in Asia had killed or injured 74 people. Igonorance is in the eyes of the nay sayers.


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## Robert Holmes

This has been an ongoing battle with wolves in the UP since at least the early 1980"s. The DNR and Feds have made promise after promise concerning wolf management and each and every promise has been broken. Business owners and land owners in the UP have lost thousands of dollars over the last few years as the deer population has declined. I will not blame it all on wolves as there are a number of other factors to include. Tree hugging liberals are to blame for not having a sound management plan in place that would include hunting. Tolorance levels from local people are the reason that they are poached. I guess you could call it vigilante hunting and it usually is a local resident that will kill one. I cannot blame some people for shooting at them if they have them in their backyards. It is not like the DNR will come out and set a trap for them like they do bears. This battle will go on for another 20 years and the tree huggers will continue to win. Mabey the DNR needs to tell the feds to jump in the lake or something. On the other hand mabey the DNR should spend some of its cash cow in the UP on "deer management".


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## Boozer

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> Look it up, its there. In two years 1996-1998 wolves in Asia had killed or injured 74 people. Igonorance is in the eyes of the nay sayers.


Read your signature, talk about ignorance!


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## doogie mac

Come on guys! 
Discussion is key here,not bashing. I know this is a hot topic and I get as passionate as the next guy,but cooler heads gotta prevail man! We arent gonna solve this ourselves....


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## WAUB-MUKWA

Boozer said:


> Read your signature, talk about ignorance![/
> 
> 1,000's.


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## 2PawsRiver

71, 72, 73, 74, thousands, thousands and one, thousands and two, thousands and three..............


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## Boozer

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> Boozer said:
> 
> 
> 
> Read your signature, talk about ignorance![/
> 
> 1,000's.
> 
> 
> 
> OK, I will bite...
> 
> 1,000's of people have been killed by Wolves in the past 100 years in Russia, which by the way allows them to be "managed" by Man, yet here in the states where they are not "managed" nobody has been killed...
> 
> Looks like your facts are actually working against you :lol:
> 
> I thought you Yoopers were supposed to be tough???
Click to expand...


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## WAUB-MUKWA

2PawsRiver said:


> 71, 72, 73, 74, thousands, thousands and one, thousands and two, thousands and three..............


1,000 people killed in Russia by wolves in the past.


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## 2PawsRiver

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> 1,000 people killed in Russia by wolves in the past.



Just giving you a hard time. We have a difference of opinion when it comes to the wolves, doesn't mean I can't rib you from time to time.


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## WAUB-MUKWA

Boozer said:


> WAUB-MUKWA said:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, I will bite...
> 
> 1,000's of people have been killed by Wolves in the past 100 years in Russia, which by the way allows them to be "managed" by Man, yet here in the states where they are not "managed" nobody has been killed...
> 
> Looks like your facts are actually working against you :lol:
> 
> I thought you Yoopers were supposed to be tough???
> 
> 
> 
> Many people have been killed by wolves in the U.S. whether managed or not. Now i'm not tough enough? Where did you get that? From your world travels?
Click to expand...


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## Boozer

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> Boozer said:
> 
> 
> 
> Many people have been killed by wolves in the U.S. whether managed or not. Now i'm not tough enough? Where did you get that? From your world travels?
> 
> 
> 
> Well maybe tough enough by your standards, but I will say, I am disappointed.
> 
> I thought you Yoopers were supposed to be born in the woods tough as nails bad ass dudes who feared nothing, here you are afraid of some Wolves...
> 
> I have seen Wolves and Black Bear in the wild in Ontario, many many times, was never armed and those animals were more interested in getting away from me than harming me. I was about 12-15 years old the times I seen them and had nothing but a fishing pole with me. Was cool to see them, something I hope one day I can see down here in my neck of the woods, truly species to be respected.
> 
> So.... based on that, I am either one tough ass troll or you boys have just gotten too weak up there, maybe us Trolls need to cut off the gravy train of financial aid up there in the UP and get you boys back on track... :lol:
> 
> Like I said before though, if the MDNR claims they need to be managed, I am not against that, I am just against this "we need to kill them all" backwoods crap...
Click to expand...


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## DIYsportsman

WAUB-MUKWA said:


> It could of been mistaken identity yes. The collar is pretty easy to see at a few hundreds yards though.


ive never seen a radio collar on a wolf so i would not know how visable it is but good point none the less


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## Robert Holmes

For all who are interested go to biggameforever.org and sign the petition to get the gray wolf delisted.


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## Boozer

Robert Holmes said:


> For all who are interested go to biggameforever.org and sign the petition to get the gray wolf delisted.


Can you tell me or point me in the direction of some un-biased information that lists the effects de-listing would have on the Wolf Population as a whole, not just in Michigan, but as a whole.

I am interested in reading up on it...

Thank you


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## WAUB-MUKWA

Boozer said:


> WAUB-MUKWA said:
> 
> 
> 
> Well maybe tough enough by your standards, but I will say, I am disappointed.
> 
> I thought you Yoopers were supposed to be born in the woods tough as nails bad ass dudes who feared nothing, here you are afraid of some Wolves...
> 
> I have seen Wolves and Black Bear in the wild in Ontario, many many times, was never armed and those animals were more interested in getting away from me than harming me. I was about 12-15 years old the times I seen them and had nothing but a fishing pole with me. Was cool to see them, something I hope one day I can see down here in my neck of the woods, truly species to be respected.
> 
> So.... based on that, I am either one tough ass troll or you boys have just gotten too weak up there, maybe us Trolls need to cut off the gravy train of financial aid up there in the UP and get you boys back on track... :lol:
> 
> Like I said before though, if the MDNR claims they need to be managed, I am not against that, I am just against this "we need to kill them all" backwoods crap...
> 
> 
> 
> Cool. Never, ever said I needed to carry in the bush to feel safe,and never said to kill them all, but always said the wolf needs to be managed and the problem ones taken care of. Go ahead, we've been in a recession for over 15 years now. We've done so long with so little your footprint here doesn't matter.
Click to expand...


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## MERGANZER

Wolves are people too!!!!!!:evil:

ganzer


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## Grey Mare

I've been reading a lot of your opinions, and seeing your passions, and thinking about this for a long time, and just want to say that I would rather be eaten by a wolf than to be killed in a car accident, especially because of a drunk driver, or G..D.. cancer. I'm just sayin'......
How many people die in Michigan every year due to car accidents?


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## trout

Grey Mare said:


> I've been reading a lot of your opinions, and seeing your passions, and thinking about this for a long time, and just want to say that I would rather be eaten by a wolf than to be killed in a car accident, especially because of a drunk driver, or G..D.. cancer. I'm just sayin'......
> How many people die in Michigan every year due to car accidents?


I suppose you could hand cuff yourself to a tree in the UP and the wolves would be happy for the meal.
Me? I'd rather have the chance to hunt or trap a wolf and help out as a conservationist.
Welcome to the forums.


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## Perferator

Grey Mare said:


> I've been reading a lot of your opinions, and seeing your passions, and thinking about this for a long time, and just want to say that I would rather be eaten by a wolf than to be killed in a car accident, especially because of a drunk driver, or G..D.. cancer. I'm just sayin'......
> How many people die in Michigan every year due to car accidents?


You ever been attacked by a snarling, snapping dog? Hop the fence into the wrong yard when you were a kid? You sound like another hopeless wolf romantic. Really, have you thought through what you just said?


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## WAUB-MUKWA

Robert Holmes said:


> boostfan said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Robert Holmes said:
> 
> 
> 
> There is a certain number of DNR employees who are employed because wolves are in Michigan and they will decide.
> I assume it will not be Peta, HSUS, Defenders of Wildlife, or any one of 200+ other tree hugging weekend warriors who never leave their pavement paradise. In other words the guys & gals who enjoy hunting , fishing, & trapping. You know the ones who always foot the bill. It will come right out of your license funds and P-R taxes.
> 
> 
> 
> Every place where the wolf is placed or "wanders in" the new federal monies start to flow. Thats why some people want wolves in all 48. So they can get the money too.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


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## doogie mac

Perferator said:


> You ever been attacked by a snarling, snapping dog? Hop the fence into the wrong yard when you were a kid? You sound like another hopeless wolf romantic. Really, have you thought through what you just said?


 Was kinda thinking the same.
Being eaten alive aint doin it for me!!!


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## dead short

Grey Mare said:


> I've been reading a lot of your opinions, and seeing your passions, and thinking about this for a long time, and just want to say that I would rather be eaten by a wolf than to be killed in a car accident, especially because of a drunk driver, or G..D.. cancer. I'm just sayin'......
> How many people die in Michigan every year due to car accidents?


 
I would have to agree that I would not want to be chewed on, mauled, then pulled and quartered by anything, wolf, big cat, hyenas, bears.... whatever.

If you got to choose, there are plenty of more admirable ways to go that are far less painful.


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## 2PawsRiver

Lots of ways to die.........eaten alive is somewhere near the bottom of my list, near being beat to death


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## doogie mac

Now a pack of horny,hungry cougars........


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## WHITE BEAR

Wolves belong here period. Anyone who disagrees can go down when the Great Mother flushes all the poop down the drain. See ya and good riddance.


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## Spartan88

I'm sure Great Mutha would agree that we should have a wolf mgmnt plan to keep the numbers in check, period.


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## Perferator

The Great Mother? Does she use Sani-Flush?


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## WAUB-MUKWA

Make sure you flush twice. Its a long way to pagon-neverland. :lol:


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