# ANyone ever cut out seats in jon boats



## SWMIH20FOWLER (Nov 17, 2005)

Planning on taking my boat to a metal fab shop my cousin owns and having the back seat cut down...it is over 2 feet deep and am going to have it cut out and have two side seats with metal running along the floor...Also going to have permanent metal flat floor installed, and possible new gun box fabbed.

Any ideas, or warnings?


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

SWMIH20FOWLER said:


> Planning on taking my boat to a metal fab shop my cousin owns and having the back seat cut down...it is over 2 feet deep and am going to have it cut out and have two side seats with metal running along the floor...Also going to have permanent metal flat floor installed, and possible new gun box fabbed.
> 
> Any ideas, or warnings?


I've done few. You removing valuable flotation tho. Ones I've done we added floatation somewhere else.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## limige (Sep 2, 2005)

thats the two big concerns, floatation and strength to the boat. you better tie the new seats in solid to the bottom and sides to give the boat strength. stay away from welding, it causes issues. rivits with a dab of 3200 i think is the way to go.


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## smoke (Jun 3, 2006)

Make sure you replace the floatation you removed. Either by filling up the two pod seats you are making from your original seat or by adding pods inside the boat. 

I am speaking from experiance, since I sunk my 14' flat bottom last year in Ms, in 12' of water! You don't want to remove to much floatation. I sunk it even with rear pods added. 

And I'm certain it would have floated back up had I not removed most of the floatation in the middle seat by adding dry storage, and all of the rear seat floatation as well. Not a smooth move on my part, won't happen again, that I can assure you. Welding is fine if you know what your doing. IMO better than rivets. sorry Limige but I just don't like rivits!  They work themselves loose eventually. 
Smoke


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## pikenetter (Mar 28, 2009)

funny you asked, just ripped out both of the seats in my boat yesterday. welding up the rivot holes from the seats. adding two pedestal seats with a track on the floor to make them movable back and forth. this way when i fold the blind up the seats will not be in the way. will post some pics as the project goes along.


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## Branta (Feb 6, 2002)

We've done it as well and share the same comments as above; just be concerned about the strength and floatation.

for our situation, the center bench was removed, leaving the rear bench and platform at the bow. Dad being a tin knocker, kept the bench, flipped it, added a lid and just made it into a removeable bench seat running lengthwise vs. cross. (shooting bench seat and gun holder)

we also added a floor and stuck a bunch of foam under that and more inthe bow - now, she's good to go.

worked out fantastically.


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## limige (Sep 2, 2005)

smoke said:


> Welding is fine if you know what your doing. IMO better than rivets. sorry Limige but I just don't like rivits!  They work themselves loose eventually.
> Smoke



i only posted that because i've known quite a few aluminum boats spring leaks after welding, some used lead to seal seams, others i don't know whatever they had under them rivets seems to leak if you get it too warm. if you can localize your heat sure. maybe some boats are fine but if you wanted to play it safe rivets are the way to go.

now as for leaking, its a duck boat, i think we can all expect some amounts of water in the boat coming off waders, splashing waves ect. so make of it what you will.

welding a lot easier but also creates stress in the metal that can cause fatigue problems down the road..


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## jward (Feb 16, 2009)

SWM,
Last I knew Wolfs Marina still carried the two part foam that you can just mix and pour into cavities to replace the flotation.


jward


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## bias (Aug 29, 2004)

SWMIH2OFOLWLER: Here's my .02:

I had two john boats that had no seats, one worked well, the other not so much. 

I had a 20ft. polarkraft MV that was welded, and would flex tremendously and break welds if I hit rough water with it. Never sunk it, but it had 2" of foam under the 3/8 marine plywood floor, and I am confident it would float well if swamped. (You can find calculators on the internet that will help you figure how much flotation you need.)

My 16 Mud motor Jon has every seat removed, and only a front deck that runs 4 feet back from the bow. It also has a 1 1/2" foam under the floor, in between the ribs. I know from unfortunate experience that it is more than enough to float the boat when swamped--it will even float it high enough to bail/bilge pump it out. My 16 foot is riveted, and I will never had a welded boat again. Welds break, and rivets leak. With an impact hammer, an auto body dolly, and another set of hands, I can remove the floor and buck every rivet in my boat in about an hour to make it bone dry. I have to do this every couple of years. I don't weld aluminum, so the cracked welds in my 20ft. Jon were a p.i.t.a. to get fixed. 

I have no other side supports in my 16 foot, and the sides do flex a little in moderate seas, but it doesn't seem to be a problem. I run a river/lake system that is seven miles from the boat launch to my hunting camp, and I make 25 or more round trips every year, for the last six years. Other than swamping my boat a 5:00 a.m. opening day last year due to my own foolishness, I've never had an issue. I highly recommend rivets, and plain old pink styrofoam under your floor. Angled supports from the floor to sides might help too, particularly if you'll be in rough water. One final suggestion--don't use stainless screws to attach your floor to the ribs on the floor. They are too brittle, and break easily when putting them in or taking them out. 

Good luck, and please post up photos of what you end up doing.


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## jward (Feb 16, 2009)

I need to add that if you add sheet foam insulation ensure that you use the closed cell foam. I learned the hard way that some of the insulation will soak up water. In fact the foam under my center seat must have weighed about a hundred pounds. 
By the way hows that new baby ? 


jward


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

my rig that i flipped in the river few years ago had removed seats. it sunk like a rock. obviously if it had the seats in it, it would have been a much easier recovery operation.

this year i removed the seats out of my dads rig, but we installed a floor with stringers of flotation underneath. much better idea.


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## SWMIH20FOWLER (Nov 17, 2005)

Already have the 2 inch pink closed cell foam under floor and will remain in when he puts in new floor, so that is added on top of what is under the front platform and rear seat..The boat is a 1754 Polar Kraft MV...I had a wood floor in it for the past 3 years and was pretty much done, built a wood gun box/bench, and it is very heavy, so going to go with aluminum.

I will post some pics of before and after...the before is pretty basic pic of above boat since I have ripped out the old wood floor already..so the after pics will show the new stuff!

Thanks for all the advice!


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## pikenetter (Mar 28, 2009)

seats are out and boat is prepped for weld. going to cover the rivot holes with 1/8" inch aluminum plate and weld in place. the seats will be able slide back forth for proper placement when the blind is up and when it is folded down.

after weld next stage will be modification to the blind. going to raise the back of the blind to allow head room for the new highback seats. then alter the roof angle to allow for shooting without needing to raise the roof.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

is this gonna be a big water hunter?


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## Ken Martin (Sep 30, 2003)

You're overkilling with 4 pieces of item stock. 2 should be just fine. That stuff doesn't flex. I would run 2 the width of the floor and up the sides about 4 inches.

Ken


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## pikenetter (Mar 28, 2009)

Ken Martin said:


> You're overkilling with 4 pieces of item stock. 2 should be just fine. That stuff doesn't flex. I would run 2 the width of the floor and up the sides about 4 inches.
> 
> Ken


those bars are strictly for the seat post to slide on. they will have t-nuts in them that the post will slide back forth on. they are peices of scrap from work.


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## pikenetter (Mar 28, 2009)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> is this gonna be a big water hunter?


 primarily a river moblie with the full blind on it, do some lake hunting mainly with the boat up against the shore.


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## SWMIH20FOWLER (Nov 17, 2005)

You can see on the rear seat where the cut out will be...going to be reinforced to floor and to transome...next pic you can see old gun box, and floor...pink floatation that was put in before will stay under new floor...diamond plate....gun box will be much smaller as not needed to be framed in...You can see where livewell was, also wood gun box was built around livewell, both will be removed and sealed...SHould get boat back mid sept!!...Will post After pics then!



















This pic is what boat looked like when I first bought it...1993 Polar KRaft 1754MV...and trailer...good deal...1K.


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## Branta (Feb 6, 2002)

have you considered flattening out the bottom? might take more geometry in cutting/forming your floatation, but it certainly has it's advantages.


I have another suggestion for you to consider as well;

off the gun box - just takes up room. 
you can use a waterproof bag for storing gear (we use one of those large ATV bags)

when guys are building a box/bench, they tend to forget about the physical layout of the blinds they'll be putting on the boat after. I've seen plenty of boat benches that are nearly unusable because you're hunched over so bad. they're too narrow to be used effectively with a blind.

so my real suggestion might be to get those folding aluminum framed chairs.
combined with a flat floor, you can position the hunters anywhere in the boat, infinitely more comfortable than a bench and you're using the space to your best advantage (both for more decoys and customized to the number of shooters you have - spread em out!)

and at $10/chair.... durn cheap!


I mentioned earlier that we cut the center seat out of my Dads polarcraft and he made a bench out of it. why this works for us is that it's completely portable. we slide it to the side when going out and then move it to slightly off center for gunning when the blinds up. That's his rig.

my 14 is exactly as I suggested to you above; I removed everything that added weight and took up space. replaced box with waterproof (camo'd, of course!) ATV bag and folding chairs for gunning.


just something to think about.


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## SWMIH20FOWLER (Nov 17, 2005)

Thanks for the input..floor will be flat, he is going to built risers off of the stringers that go across floor and flatten the floor out....he showed me a bunch of stuff how he was going to do it, some is hard to explain, should have taken camera to shop with me and taken some pics of what he has done...amazing stuff...built a barrell sander that has to run off of hydraulics and pneumatics for an amish shop...had no plans, designed and built everything...I was floored when he showed me that project...then I said...this will be easy as hell for you...

He and I talked about the gun box also, size will be just big enough to hold guns, and not as a bench...seats will be on a bring your own damn chair to the boat, or dont come at all basis...LOL...Just kidding, but thinking of putting in some sort of seats, just not sure which ones I want to put in...

Any ideas on seats would be great also...not sure if I want to do permanent pedastals with removable seat, or some sort of fold up, or just not really sure.

Branta, tell me more about those seats you had in yours.


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