# Mouillee rollers



## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

and here is your introduction to fsamie, the solver of all problems and know it alls without ever being to a meeting or throwing a helping hand in personally...just bomb throwing from the sidelines telling you how to do it and his way is right. all because he paid $20 bucks for his hunting license!!!!

you guys that are bitching about the rollers....do what we did...go fix it or shut up and hunt it. you got 2 choices.


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## Jerry Lamb (Aug 3, 2015)

fsamie1 said:


> It is a waste of funds to spend 150K for a handicapped blind. Harsens has one and I have not seen it used yet. I used the rollers last year, it sure needs some work. First roller is too far from water and sure a winch will help couple of older folks take their boats over. Someone should contact 7-11 crew, as much as they use the area, they should volunteer to fix the rollers. If someone knows how to fix them and mount a winch, I can help out. Not having money is just excuse, they probably wasting it on something else. All Michigan tax, sale tax, license fees cannot fix a few rollers.


Regarding the handicapped blind at Harsens: I know it gets used. It got used at least 3 times in 2011. It was used by my dad and I that year. By then he was so sick from Chemo and cancer he couldn't walk. The zone is marginal, but he shot his last duck out of that blind, a hen mallard. I'm grateful for it. I know an Afghanistan vet that has shot out of it as well


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## WATERFOWLFANATIC52 (Feb 17, 2016)

craigrh13 said:


> $150k for a blind???!!!!! That's outrageous. If they can afford the blind then I would think they could afford to replace some rollers.


It can be expensive to build a proper blind for the handicap to sit in without worrying if the wheelchair they are in will get stuck or if they will sink in the ground. The cost is probably do to all the regulations they have to follow.

I'm by know means saying the replacement of the rollers should be pushed aside, but like most things being constantly developed or upgraded, sometimes its one thing at a time. Now to decide if and when they are replaced and by what, that's something that still needs to be discussed planned and budgeted for. I'm sure they didn't just decide they were going to build the blind without some sort of research.


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## craigrh13 (Oct 24, 2011)

I'm just playing Devils advocate here. I will never use them rollers at Mouillie. 

I'm also all for their being a blind for the handicap. I was just shocked to hear the price tag. Doesn't FP have one in the 60's field?


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Jerry Lamb said:


> Regarding the handicapped blind at Harsens: I know it gets used. It got used at least 3 times in 2011. It was used by my dad and I that year. By then he was so sick from Chemo and cancer he couldn't walk. The zone is marginal, but he shot his last duck out of that blind, a hen mallard. I'm grateful for it. I know an Afghanistan vet that has shot out of it as well


We want the blind is zone 11 because it is a pretty darn good zone. It will use the wind well. The blind will face the Huron River and will have crops all around it. It is not a marginal zone. 

I have seen the blind at Harsens, it's not in the best place for sure. We are trying to avoid that problem.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Socks said:


> Not cool. I like the idea of handicapped people being able to gain access.


It can be used by anyone if not reserved by a handicapped person. Those details will be worked on as the project advances. It will also be used during the off season for bird watchers etc.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

WATERFOWLFANATIC52 said:


> It can be expensive to build a proper blind for the handicap to sit in without worrying if the wheelchair they are in will get stuck or if they will sink in the ground. The cost is probably do to all the regulations they have to follow.


Much of the cost is due to have to comply with regulations but the bulk is due to building in the marsh. It may turn out to be a lot less depending on what we learn when we start looking for the bottom.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Big Frank 25 said:


> How are you getting around this? The blind needs to dismantled each year.
> 
> *3.401 Waterfowl hunting blinds; erection and removal, name and address; assessment of costs;
> hunting rights.
> ...


There are other handicapped blinds at other managed zones. The DNR has laws for handicapped hunting. Laws that allow shooting from vehicles or allows legally blind people to hunt. There is great interest in providing access for as many people as possible. 

We are working with the DNR every step of the way.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

folpak said:


> Decoyslayer, thanks for looking into the rollers. Let me know what the outcome is if you would be so kind.
> Good luck with the blind too! If donors are paying for it even better! I hope some wounded veterans get to use it, that's worth more than 150k.


No problem, I will look into this week.

The blind will be paid for by PRIVATE funds, it is NOT a DNR project. The Festival is spearheading the effort. We are actively looking for corporate sponsorship. Lowes has a program for helping on projects like this one and we are talking with them. We have been in touch with the Boy Scouts, they will provide some Eagle Scout candidates for labor. Many of our conservation partners are aware of this and will be looking into ways they can help.

What we need is major corporate sponsorship. We will need steel, use of building equipment etc. 

We also need as many "everyday people" sponsors as we can get. The Festival has sponsorships for as little as $100 per year.


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## zx10r2004 (Sep 24, 2005)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> what hike. we got a discount.


Then maybe we can raise our hunting licenses fees to pay for some rollers!


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## gr8lakefisher (Jan 17, 2009)

https://m.grainger.com/mobile/product/ASHLAND-CONVEYOR-Steel-Replacement-Roller-1VBT2 

Depending on the specs, start taking up collections at the ramps or buy a few and fix it up.


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## fsamie1 (Mar 8, 2008)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> what hike. we got a discount.


you are not good at $ either. change from $35 to $50 is not a discount. As I said, I am in to help if someone wants to fix the rollers. We should also ask Winchester and Remington to contribute since they sell so much shells to skybusters. How about NRA, how much they contribute? If blind is paid for by private fund, we do not have no say about it. It is got be a less expensive way to take handicaps duck hunting. Kid is not in favor of installing winch on the dikes because he wants to sell his winch design on every boat.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

fsamie1 said:


> As I said, I am in to help if someone wants to fix the rollers


So I can expect you be be joining the Festival committee? Working at the Muskrat dinner? I will let you know when we have planning meetings for the dinner. They won't be until sometime in December, so you have time to think about it! We sure could use the help!


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

fsamie1 said:


> you are not good at $ either. change from $35 to $50 is not a discount. As I said, I am in to help if someone wants to fix the rollers. We should also ask Winchester and Remington to contribute since they sell so much shells to skybusters. How about NRA, how much they contribute? If blind is paid for by private fund, we do not have no say about it. It is got be a less expensive way to take handicaps duck hunting. Kid is not in favor of installing winch on the dikes because he wants to sell his winch design on every boat.


we got a discount. state license is cheaper today than before the license re-works...specially if yer a managed area hunter (which is topic of conversation). federal duck stamp has nothing to do with this conversation.

doesn't joe robison live right by this place? you telling me joe can't find someone to get this fixed up? c'mon guys. i think i'm getting dumber everytime fsamie posts a solution to something. Someone get on the phone with joe and solve the problem.

i'm all for any method to make it easier for everyone fsamie....don't really care for winches.

if i had my way, winches would be banned. higher ups don't agree with me.


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## Jim Orman (Aug 21, 2012)

Decoyslayer I applaude you and everyone else on festival committee you guys do so much for duck hunters and you guys get little to no appreciation to the time and effort you guys put into it I have always been a put up shut up kind person send me agenda with activities and I will help when I can thank Jim Orman 313-475-1972


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> we got a discount. state license is cheaper today than before the license re-works...specially if yer a managed area hunter (which is topic of conversation). federal duck stamp has nothing to do with this conversation.
> 
> doesn't joe robison live right by this place? you telling me joe can't find someone to get this fixed up? c'mon guys. i think i'm getting dumber everytime fsamie posts a solution to something. Someone get on the phone with joe and solve the problem.
> 
> ...


I'll get in touch with someone from the office this week and see if I can find out what the story is.

Ban winches? LOL! You guys don't EVEN want to hear what I would like to see banned!


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## folpak (Feb 6, 2008)

Shikid, I have to disagree with not being able to use winches. I don't know if you have ever hunted Mouillee but a single person or elderly person cannot make it over the 10' tall *****. I'm 30 and in good shape, I just barely can do it without assistance


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

folpak said:


> Shikid, I have to disagree with not being able to use winches. I don't know if you have ever hunted Mouillee but a single person or elderly person cannot make it over the 10' tall *****. I'm 30 and in good shape, I just barely can do it without assistance


I am 65 and I walk in. I put my canoe on a two wheel cart, put all my toys in the canoe and walk back. It's not too bad. It will be better after I get my new knee in January! LOL! I don't hunt out there more than a couple of times a year, I prefer hunting on the open water, catch more perch that way!


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## folpak (Feb 6, 2008)

DecoySlayer said:


> I am 65 and I walk in. I put my canoe on a two wheel cart, put all my toys in the canoe and walk back. It's not too bad. It will be better after I get my new knee in January! LOL! I don't hunt out there more than a couple of times a year, I prefer hunting on the open water, catch more perch that way!


Canoe would be ok but my motor weighs more than a canoe haha


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

folpak said:


> Shikid, I have to disagree with not being able to use winches. I don't know if you have ever hunted Mouillee but a single person or elderly person cannot make it over the 10' tall *****. I'm 30 and in good shape, I just barely can do it without assistance


lol. one thing i know. once the public has something, you ain't taking it away without a fight.  hunted 30 years without winches and spinners and did fine. the reason these new wave stuff is kept is an effort to broaden the base of users so i get it....but i think the 2 things i mentioned hurt quality of hunt in the long runs...but i get it.

and just for the record folpak, not sure if you're aware but i install winches as a business...so i'm giving a pretty honest opinion...i benefit directly from winches being allowed.


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

DecoySlayer said:


> There are other handicapped blinds at other managed zones. The DNR has laws for handicapped hunting. Laws that allow shooting from vehicles or allows legally blind people to hunt. There is great interest in providing access for as many people as possible.
> 
> We are working with the DNR every step of the way.


Have you looked at the construction of the blinds at the other sites. Blue Water Chapter of Michigan Duck Hunters built and maintains the blind (dismantling and rebuilding each season) at Harsens Island. It has been there a number of years. Perhaps you should touch base with those that have been there.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Big Frank 25 said:


> Have you looked at the construction of the blinds at the other sites. Blue Water Chapter of Michigan Duck Hunters built and maintains the blind (dismantling and rebuilding each season) at Harsens Island. It has been there a number of years. Perhaps you should touch base with those that have been there.


I don't see any way possible to build, and then dismantle, a 150' walkway, each year. There is no way to get around that walkway and still have the blind in an area where you should have a good chance at some good hunting.

We have seen a few others and will be talking to more people. We do have some serious professionals working on this. People who's business is building.


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## BFG (Mar 4, 2005)

DecoySlayer said:


> We can't build into the side of the ****, the water on one side is far too deep and if we put in on the other side the birds would not work right for most winds. At most that blind will be hunting only two days a week, that is all the draw area is hunted.
> 
> We don't want to strictly limit it's use since we are putting it in an area that people really like to hunt in. Handicapped people will have first choice on it.


Trying to build the blind in 11 is a tough one, considering they progressively flood those fields as the season wears on to keep the birds from eating all the food too quickly. No matter where you put it, the birds are going to wise up to it in short order, whether it's hunted 2 days a week or 2 days a month. But it does provide access, and that is what it is all about.


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## just ducky (Aug 23, 2002)

fsamie1 said:


> Just say you were wrong Donald, total cost of license is higher now.
> Also, like to order one of the winches you designed before it is banned and you go out of business. Like my chain saw engine with electric start please, I have done pulling cord, do not think those engines start good in freezing temperature.
> By the way, how the heck can you get any dumber.


Regarding the license fee issue, no he's not wrong. But remember...he said it dropped for those of us who hunt managed waterfowl areas. Trust me...I was in on the discussions when the bill's were being proposed to change the law, and the deer hunting contingent was none too happy that we waterfowlers were going to pay less, and they would have to pay more.

As it is currently, we pay $11 for a base license, and $12 for a waterfowl license, for a total of $23 to hunt waterfowl ANYWHERE, managed area or not. In the past, we had to buy the old small game license, which was either $13 or $15 I believe? Then we had a Michigan waterfowl stamp, which if I'm not mistaken was $5. And then we had a managed waterfowl area permit, which was $13 for a seasonal, or $4(maybe?) for a daily? So add that all up, and we used to pay approximately $30, and we now only pay $23. The federal stamp price increase is out of our control. But Shi Kid was not wrong...if you want to hunt managed areas.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

BFG said:


> Trying to build the blind in 11 is a tough one, considering they progressively flood those fields as the season wears on to keep the birds from eating all the food too quickly. No matter where you put it, the birds are going to wise up to it in short order, whether it's hunted 2 days a week or 2 days a month. But it does provide access, and that is what it is all about.


Just trying to the best job we can. There SO many laws and regulations to adhere too. There is also access to parking lots etc to deal with.


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## BFG (Mar 4, 2005)

Yeah...the more you get into it, the tougher it is going to be to accomplish what you hope to accomplish.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

U


BFG said:


> Yeah...the more you get into it, the tougher it is going to be to accomplish what you hope to accomplish.


You got that right!


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## mmac1318 (Feb 5, 2007)

fsamie1 said:


> It is a waste of funds to spend 150K for a handicapped blind. Harsens has one and I have not seen it used yet. I used the rollers last year, it sure needs some work. First roller is too far from water and sure a winch will help couple of older folks take their boats over. Someone should contact 7-11 crew, as much as they use the area, they should volunteer to fix the rollers. If someone knows how to fix them and mount a winch, I can help out. Not having money is just excuse, they probably wasting it on something else. All Michigan tax, sale tax, license fees cannot fix a few rollers.


 I am glad that your opinion has no real value to what the plans are or have been at these managed areas. I am disabled and have not been able to hunt P.M. yet because it is too hard to access. I am happy to hear that they are going to build a blind and make it more accessible. As far as Harsens I just found out about it at the open house and plan on using it, but they told me it is a much better hunt later in the season around November maybe this is why you haven't seen much use out of it yet.


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

DecoySlayer said:


> I don't see any way possible to build, and then dismantle, a 150' walkway, each year. There is no way to get around that walkway and still have the blind in an area where you should have a good chance at some good hunting.
> 
> We have seen a few others and will be talking to more people. We do have some serious professionals working on this. People who's business is building.


Not the walkway. Just the blind itself. Ken Martin, a member here, designed the blind. I know when discussed before construction, John Shaffer mentioned using 5 gallon buckets filled with pea gravel or concrete to hold the posts. With proper bracing of course! This subject should have it's own thread. PM Ken!


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

mmac1318 said:


> I am glad that your opinion has no real value to what the plans are or have been at these managed areas. I am disabled and have not been able to hunt P.M. yet because it is too hard to access. I am happy to hear that they are going to build a blind and make it more accessible


It's going to take a while to get this done. We HOPE to have it ready for next season, but I cannot promise that. This is not an easy task. We will do the best we can. I can't wait to see it get used.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Big Frank 25 said:


> Not the walkway. Just the blind itself. Ken Martin, a member here, designed the blind. I know when discussed before construction, John Shaffer mentioned using 5 gallon buckets filled with pea gravel or concrete to hold the posts. With proper bracing of course! This subject should have it's own thread. PM Ken!


The walkway is about 90% of the cost.


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## folpak (Feb 6, 2008)

DecoySlayer said:


> There was a "suggestion" made to the effect, but not exact wording, that things could be fixed quicker if people would just call the office and leave a msg than by "complaining" on line.


Well I appreciate you contacting Joe. I don't remember complaining. Just asked if anyone knew about a plan to fix them. Now that we know the office can be contacted to fix the rollers I will for sure do so in the future.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

folpak said:


> Well I appreciate you contacting Joe. I don't remember complaining. Just asked if anyone knew about a plan to fix them. Now that we know the office can be contacted to fix the rollers I will for sure do so in the future.


I did not mean to imply that YOU were complaining.


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## folpak (Feb 6, 2008)

Just a suggestion... Would floating dock sections work for a walkway? Then they could be pulled out or moved if need be.


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

folpak said:


> Just a suggestion... Would floating dock sections work for a walkway? Then they could be pulled out or moved if need be.


No, we looked into that. We would still have to have a fixed walkway because of the height of the ****. Then there would have to be "someone" who would be responsible to put them in and take them out before and after each season, more work, more equipment, more chance of breaking.

Keep the ideas coming! They may not all work but some will!


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

DecoySlayer said:


> The walkway is about 90% of the cost.



Here is the blind in the Island. Walkway maybe 50 - 75 feet looking at the legend. I was not involved in the construction of this blind. How deep is the water be traversed?


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## DecoySlayer (Mar 12, 2016)

Big Frank 25 said:


> Here is the blind in the Island. Walkway maybe 50 - 75 feet looking at the legend. I was not involved in the construction of this blind. How deep is the water be traversed?


I THINK the canal is about 8' deep. The dike wall is high and there in lies the problem. There is a limit to the number of feet it can fall over a certain distance.


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

DecoySlayer said:


> I THINK the canal is about 8' deep. The dike wall is high and there in lies the problem. There is a limit to the number of feet it can fall over a certain distance.


Sorry! I'll add the image of the island blind here as well. I'm having power issues with the PC. 1:12 to be ADA compliant. 12.5' drop over 150' Tall dike!


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## fsamie1 (Mar 8, 2008)

mmac1318 said:


> I am glad that your opinion has no real value to what the plans are or have been at these managed areas. I am disabled and have not been able to hunt P.M. yet because it is too hard to access. I am happy to hear that they are going to build a blind and make it more accessible. As far as Harsens I just found out about it at the open house and plan on using it, but they told me it is a much better hunt later in the season around November maybe this is why you haven't seen much use out of it yet.


I read here that it was private funds to make the handicapped blind. They can spend a million dollar of private fund and I am all for it. I wonder at what cost would you object state of Michigan build a handicapped blind? Look at the map below, I do not understand why it takes 150k to make a walkway from parking lot to zone 11. May be zone 17 or 19 are better choices. How about installing a 1000 dollar crane at the boat ramps to lift people on wheel chair and put them in the boat. Then, everyone, with floor and blind in their boats can take them hunting. Like Shi Kid, you misunderstood what I said. I am saying that state can do a lot better things with 150K for handicaps.
I am glad you can hunt another place beside Harsens. Note that blind 20 is a hot zone when wind blowing from south over 20 mph.


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## Ken Martin (Sep 30, 2003)

I designed, planned, organized, etc. the handicap blind at Harsens Island. It took *two years* from the first draft to the actual start of building. It took two days to build. One to set posts, and then a few days later the walkway and platform were built in about ten hours of terrific volunteer work. When is you next meeting? If you would like I could come down and answer any questions and I could give you the hurdles, roadblocks, and enablers that I went through.

The walkway is 90 feet with a 10' X 6' platform. It traverses an 8-10 foot deep canal from the dike to a cropped field. We attached posts to plastic 55 gallon drums cut in half and then added 400 pounds of quickcrete to each half drum. They found bottom. I designed adjustment capability but after over ~15 we have not had to adjust for a sagging walkway. We also laid 0.4 miles of crushed limestone along the dike at the DNR's request. Getting that across a ferry is not fun but Tom's Aggregate company stepped up graciously and we only paid for material.

Trade offs need to be considered for where an access is put. Another blind was planned in the marsh at Harsens but it was determined not to be a prudent venture due to safety, cost, impact. 

Cost was just over $10,000 and it would have been north of $30,000 if done without donations of material and labor.

Nothing is dismantled year to year. Camouflage is removed and added along with maintenance. Originally it was determined by the Harsens Management team, Tim Payne-DNR Regional Director, and MDHA Bluewater that the blind would only be used by handicap parties. If the zone was used by others they were not allowed in the blind. That is not the policy now. 

Ken

P.S. I have severe Hemophilia A. I have spent a good portion of my life on crutches or in a wheelchair and while I am blessed to walk most of the time I have a perspective that allowed for an understanding of the project.


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## fsamie1 (Mar 8, 2008)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> i'd let Putin shoot my birds...


now you are on Putin's side just to disagree with me? that is deplorable. He does not like to post his kill charts either.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

craigrh13 said:


> Can you imagine the twitter updates and exaggerations? It would be "the greatest hunt of all time".


it would be the greatest hunt of all time.


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## Far Beyond Driven (Jan 23, 2006)

Do a guest hunt at Shiawassee, pass out Trump and Putin masks to the guests, see how quiet the boat gets...


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## Divers Down (Mar 31, 2008)

Hate to say but Pooty would outshoot Trump big time.


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## Shiawassee_Kid (Nov 28, 2000)

shot with Eric trump last year. likes to hunt, shoots clay better than most i've shot with. Don't believe the hype about Putin...just a dude like everyone else.


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## jwinks (Mar 20, 2014)

Shiawassee_Kid said:


> shot with Eric trump last year. likes to hunt, shoots clay better than most i've shot with. Don't believe the hype about Putin...just a dude like everyone else.


Yeah, just a dude like every other former KGB murderer-dictator, although i like his pike fishing propaganda photos.


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

DecoySlayer said:


> Money is the reason, it's just not there. The state does not have it for "non-habitat" work. The Festival is working on a really big project right now and does not have the funds available. We are in the process of costing out a "handicapped" blind that will be built in zone 11. That is going to cost a LOT of money.
> 
> Many of the "nice" things you see out there are paid for by the hard work of volunteers and private funds. Get involved, find a "sponsor" to work with the DNR to put in new rollers or what ever you would like to see. That is how it gets done.
> 
> ...


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## Divers Down (Mar 31, 2008)

Big Frank 25 said:


> View attachment 784999
> 
> 
> View attachment 785000


Is that in zone 11?


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## lastflight (Aug 16, 2005)

Divers Down said:


> Is that in zone 11?


Yep


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## sparky18181 (Apr 17, 2012)

Bring back decoyslayer.


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## Divers Down (Mar 31, 2008)

lastflight said:


> Yep


Ughhh..I mean.. sweet!


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