# Just picked up my new Muzzleloader, Advice requested



## TurboGN87 (Nov 3, 2004)

Hello all- I have never owned a ML so looking for help and if i purchased the right stuff LOL i tried to research a bunch before leaping into this so please help :gaga::help:

Picked up a wonderful new Muzzleloader- Thompson Pro Hunter XT with Endeavor Barrel :SHOCKED:

Picked up Blackhorn 209 powder, as recommended for its easy clean up and good, consistent performance (or so i have read)

Shooting some cheaper Hornady SST 300GR just to get used to the gun, will most likely switch to Barnes for the hunting season

For primers, picked up Winchester triple se7en 209 Primers 


Now... something i have no idea about, how to clean the gun
Every shot? every other shot? I understand the cleaner and less residue on the barrel the better/more consistent it should shoot. 

I have Hoppe's NO. 9 Solvent and Hoppe's Lubricating oil to use
-Are these sufficient for Blackpowder rifles?


I am totally new to ML Rifles and looking for any and all advice

I have read the manual- front to back- 2 times and saw no reference to the cleaning process.

So excited, cant wait to go shooting tomorrow at the Detroit Sportsman Club but just want to make sure i know what i'm doing and how to properly clean and shoot the gun before going

Pics to come, for any of those who care to see

THANKS ALL


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## TurboGN87 (Nov 3, 2004)

Woot


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## erodrig4 (Oct 10, 2005)

You got yourself one heck of a gun there...Congrats.

As for cleaning, I have no experience with BH209, but everything I have heard is you do not have to clean every shot or even every other shot with it. When I clean (in between shots) I generally just run a wet patch down the barrel, followed by a dry patch (don't really know if the dry is actually needed, but this is just my routine). No need to tear it down and give it a regular cleaning job while you are shooting. You are basically just trying to keep the fouling to a minimum. Those who are more experienced with that powder will be able to give you a few pointers on when to clean.

Good luck with it, like I said, you got one heck of a gun. I have an older Encore and love it. Do you plan on putting a scope on it?


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## thumbgoodfisherman (Dec 6, 2005)

Turbo, nice choice of ML!!! One thing with Blackhorn 209 you are going to want to use different primers. Federal 209A or CCI 209M are recommended because BH209 doesn't ignite as easy as blackpowder, pyrodex does. For alittle more info on inlines check out modernmuzzler.com. Hope this helps ya.


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## TurboGN87 (Nov 3, 2004)

I *am *going to put a scope on it, prolly after next weekend
This was my birthday present to myself-which was yesterday- and it was quite expensive, so i had to put the scope off til another time

tried modern muzzleloader like 3 weeks ago and my activation got all screwy and wont work... sigh

thanks for advice on primers... i want to try pyrodex also and see what works best with me and my gun

Have heard some people say pyrodex is better, others say BH209... but according to my encore manual, they really say that the pyrodex has much higher FPS and in turn, kinetic energy

regardless, thank you all for advice looking forward to shooting tomorrow


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## frontier gander (Aug 26, 2006)

anyone who says pyrodex is better than blackhorn209 is someone that needs to be slapped up the side of the head and then ignored.

those 777 primers will not work the blackhorn209, you need full strength primers like the cci 209m or the remington sts. federal 209a's i tried and they are just down right filthy.

Pyrodex is a lot slower than blackhorn209.


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## thumbgoodfisherman (Dec 6, 2005)

Turbo, I have used them all, and by far BH209 hands down is my choice for my omega. My advice is start with a lighter load say 80 grains or so then work up and find the best combo for your gun. One of the best features of BH is the clean up it is so easy. I put a Leupold Ultimate Slam scope and really like it.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

*Welcome to the world of muzzleloading*! You picked a great rifle that will bring you years of great shooting. 

*BH209* does just what it says it will do. If you search around here, you'll find many of us that are using it and WILL NOT switch back to any other propellent. You *DO NOT* have to swab the barrel between shots. Shoot it as many times as you want! The most that I've fired at one setting was 21 rounds and never swabbed the barrel. Shots 19, 20 and 21 grouped 1" at a TRUE 100yds. Others have fired many more rounds and not swabbed between shots with continued accuracy.

Get a good volume measure. Another thing that you can get, usually free and all you want, is 35mm film containers. They work excellent for the range and you can pre-measure all your rounds prior to going. Shooting in the rain or snow will not bother the powder in the 35mm containers. You don't have to worry about trying to get a couple pellets out of a box and keep the rest dry. Start out shooting 90grs by volume and work your way up. * DO NOT EXCEED 120grs. OF BH-209!* Follow your rifle and propellent manufacturer's recommendations.

You picked a good bullet to start with. I will admit though, that I've had some trouble with them and what they did when hunting. I've switched back to Barnes and couldn't be happier. When you buy Barnes, the cheapest way to get them is right through Cabelas. Buy the large pack and you save a bunch of money. Buying them 15 at a time gets to be expensive. Some rifles (or shooters) prefer 250gr and some the 300gr bullets. Personally, I prefer the 250gr TMZ. I've shot the expanders with blackpowder and they never failed me. The 300gr will stabilize better at longer ranges.....

You're starting out with top of the line equipment and are very lucky to do so. I started back around "77", and if I would have had my Encore back then........ WOW!!!! :evil:

I can't remember if you have glass but, get GOOD GLASS for it. Practice and practice some more. You're going to like it.

Report back after shooting it and let us know how things went.....


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## TurboGN87 (Nov 3, 2004)

thanks for advice on Primers, greatly appreciated

i was at Bass Pro and they only had 2 options, so i picked 777s as they were more money and i thought might be better lol

I will try to find a better primer as you recommended, 

Michigun recommended the Ultimate slam to me, i am just a bit broke for a little

I will start at a low load, and work my way up, cant imagine the need to exceed like 120gr from what everyone has sad about a good shooting combination


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

TurboGN87 said:


> thanks for advice on Primers, greatly appreciated
> 
> i was at Bass Pro and they only had 2 options, so i picked 777s as they were more money and i thought might be better lol
> 
> ...


Its the MAXIMUM allowable charge. *DO NOT EXCEED IT*. Its marked on the jug............

Scopes.......... don't get caught up in the hype of "its a muzzleloader scope" or a scope just because its got lots of "dots" in it. More clutter to have to look through or guess at. GET GOOD MOUNTS.


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## TurboGN87 (Nov 3, 2004)

Thanks for that, will not exceed

so BH209 you can use 120gr MAX... but pyrodex shoots at a faster FPS and you can use 150gr?

i am just so new and taking in all the information, just the Encore manual says the FPS for all the different loads, and doesnt really list BH209-

Not trying to argue and say one is better, as obviously i have NO experience, just trying to learn what i can from guys who know their stuff

Thanks again for the useful info


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## thumbgoodfisherman (Dec 6, 2005)

Encore, you are so biased!!!! Just kidding!:lol: My only other advice Turbo is to find a buddy that has some knowledge with muzzleloaders and go to the range with him. There is alot to learn but once you get your feet wet it is probably one of my favorite guns to shoot.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

TurboGN87 said:


> Thanks for that, will not exceed
> 
> so BH209 you can use 120gr MAX... but *pyrodex shoots at a faster FPS and you can use 150gr?*
> 
> ...


No. Pyrodex does not shoot faster. Different propellents have different burning rates, which will cause a difference in velocity by volume. I highly suggest that you pick up a good book about muzzleloading (a new book and not one 10yrs old), to read up. You can also check out the BH-209 web site: http://www.blackhorn209.com/ and read there.


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## thumbgoodfisherman (Dec 6, 2005)

ENCORE said:


> Scopes.......... don't get caught up in the hype of "its a muzzleloader scope" or a scope just because its got lots of "dots" in it. More clutter to have to look through or guess at. GET GOOD MOUNTS.


Encore is right on about scopes and mounts. For a beginner sometimes less is better with a scope. Encore by the way what load of BH209 are you using in your gun. My best groups have come at 100grs. I tried heavier loads but the consistency was not there.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

thumbgoodfisherman said:


> Encore, you are so biased!!!! Just kidding!:lol: .


Who, me??:lol::lol:


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## BigSteve (Sep 7, 2009)

I don't have much experience with the Barnes bullets, but I love the TC shockwaves or the Hornady sst's, have flattened quite a few deer with em. If they shoot good with what you have i wouldn't switch. Great gun by the way. I love my encore pro hunter, they truely are a gun for all seasons.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

thumbgoodfisherman said:


> Encore is right on about scopes and mounts. For a beginner sometimes less is better with a scope. Encore by the way what load of BH209 are you using in your gun. My best groups have come at 100grs. I tried heavier loads but the consistency was not there.


I'm shooting 100grs. and Barnes 250gr. TMZ's, using a Nikon Monarch 2.5-10x50. The rifle will group much better than my ageing eyes are starting to let me but, 1" to 1 1/4" groups. I haven't figured out why I'd need to increase the charge. However, I can assure you, that each and every charge that I fire is *EXACT* to the charge that I fire before it or after it.

I'd suggest that you try a heavier bullet, 300gr, with the heavier charge and see what that does.


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## thumbgoodfisherman (Dec 6, 2005)

ENCORE said:


> I'm shooting 100grs. and Barnes 250gr. TMZ's, using a Nikon Monarch 2.5-10x50. The rifle will group much better than my ageing eyes are starting to let me but, 1" to 1 1/4" groups. I haven't figured out why I'd need to increase the charge. However, I can assure you, that each and every charge that I fire is *EXACT* to the charge that I fire before it or after it.
> 
> I'd suggest that you try a heavier bullet, 300gr, with the heavier charge and see what that does.


I shoot 250 shockwaves with real good results. I think alot of hype with the big load is way overrated. I started along time ago with my TC Hawken rifle, then my TC Thunderhawk (because when it thunders it rains red) and now to my Omega.


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## BigSteve (Sep 7, 2009)

thumbgoodfisherman said:


> I shoot 250 shockwaves with real good results. I think alot of hype with the big load is way overrated. I started along time ago with my TC Hawken rifle, then my TC Thunderhawk (because when it thunders it rains red) and now to my Omega.


 
Me too. I love the TC shockwaves in 250 gr. The deer I have shot with them have folded like a bad hand of cards.


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

thumbgoodfisherman said:


> I shoot 250 shockwaves with real good results. I think alot of hype with the big load is way overrated. I started along time ago with my *TC Hawken rifle*, then my TC Thunderhawk (because when it thunders it rains red) and now to my Omega.


I sure shot a lot of deer with that ol' Hawken that I had. I guess I should have kept track of how many pounds of 2f that I went through:lol: Those days were loads of fun, no doubt. I've got a bunch of lead balls around here, molds and other stuff, for 50's and 54's from those days. Going to be putting them in a "MAN'S SALE" in the spring. I gave the rifles away to nephews that wanted to get started in muzzleloading. The Hawkin is still being used!!!

Didn't mean to hi-jack the guy's thread but, he'll learn a bunch of things just reading. Good suggestions were posted for him......... Heck, I'm like a kid waiting for Christmas, just to find out how he did today :lol: Sure hope he finds someone to help teach him and not just try to tell him.


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