# Pump house



## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

We are looking at purchasing a new cabin and would like to use it year around, location in NLP Michigan so hard freeze in the winter.

Our current cabin has a well pit and we never had any issues with freezing, we do close it down when leaving draining and blowing out lines with compressed air. We plan to do the same with new cabin.

This new cabin seems to have only been used during spring, summer and fall. The well and expansion tank are located outside under the cabin that extends out from a river bank. So I have easy access without crawling under the building. I was thinking about building a well house around the pump and tank ~4' x 4' x 4' just big enough to have a little room to do any repairs and fit a small air compressor. the front would be a door for access that would be latched and locked. The main feed line going into the cabin I plan to use heat tape and wrap good with insulation, it will be drained when were gone but exposed so when were there in the winter I will need to keep it from freezing.

I was thinking of using 6" thick walls, door, top and bottom thinking of using foam insulation, either the sheets or spray or batt insulation?? Based on the price of foam I am leaning toward R19 batt insulation. Also thinking about getting a line thermostat and using three higher wattage incandescent light bulbs to keep temperature >40 degrees F. Figured using three bulbs for redundancy in case one or two burn out.

Anyone have experience with above ground well pumps? Am I way off if left field with my thinking? 

thanks to all for any input!


----------



## Kennybks (Mar 29, 2010)

jjlrrw said:


> We are looking at purchasing a new cabin and would like to use it year around, location in NLP Michigan so hard freeze in the winter.
> 
> Our current cabin has a well pit and we never had any issues with freezing, we do close it down when leaving draining and blowing out lines with compressed air. We plan to do the same with new cabin.
> 
> ...


Did you ask the previous owners how they winterized? If there is a power failure the pump will crack. If there is a pressure tank it should be drained if it has the potential for freeze.

Just draining and filling with antifreeze may be your best action.


----------



## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

Kennybks said:


> Did you ask the previous owners how they winterized? If there is a power failure the pump will crack. If there is a pressure tank it should be drained if it has the potential for freeze.
> 
> Just draining and filling with antifreeze may be your best action.


I have not talked with the owners yet, Based on the setup I think they only used it during the warm months or it would freeze even while in use. Maybe draining the pump and tank is the way to go but I was hoping for a quick startup when we get there on Friday nights. What we do today at the current cabin when we leave is shut off the main just after the pressure tank, then open a drain value just after the shutoff both located in the well pit, everything is drained and blown out with the air compressor, when we return all we need to do is close the drain and open the main, the pump stays primed and the tank is still pressurized. 

If I were to drain the tank and pump I feel I will need to prime it every time meaning I would then need to carry water with me. 

Good point on the electric I may just take the chance if there was a power failure it would be back up before any damage was done, or if it looked like a long outage I could run up and drain during the week. Over the past 15 years the electric up there has been very solid compared to my main residents.


----------



## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

An incandescent light bulb will work but why not pay a little more for something that is designed for a heat source.
http://www.processheating.com/index.php?page=Coneheater2


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

Fiberglass insulation will just be one huge mouse nest. Use foam board.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

If the pump house is fairly tight, not to big and insulated good, a 20 watt incandescent bulb will be good to -20 f.

Hook one bulb up to heat the pump house, a second on a light sensing switch:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Woods-Outd...02636800b626&gclid=CJb7w9CSi9QCFQyNaQodn0YBkw

...and you could put a third in there that operates on a temperature switch
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...ntent=162570&gclid=CNe4pbiSi9QCFQMJaQodvmYIkw


----------



## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

Thanks for all the replies and ideas!!! I did think about using an electric heater in place of the incandescent bulb(s) but was thinking the bulbs would have a safer failure mode. I never seen one of those bulb style heaters, I would hate to be screwing it in or out and have the electric get turned on.

I do plan to build a tightly sealed box using PT plywood for the exterior and sealant on all seems keeping any rodents out. The reason I was leaning toward batt insulation I can get a higher R-value for about 1/4 the cost. 3" foam R15 = ~$150, 6" Batt R19 = ~$40

I am still a few weeks away from closing just trying to learn all the pros and cons before my first trip to the lumber yard.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

All you need for heat is a regular light bulb. If you use an Eden Pure or some type of heater like that you'll be throwing a lot of money out the window and those bulbs are around $100 to replace.

https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/2857/IN-0025A19FR12V.html


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

You'll never make it rodent-proof.


----------



## Waif (Oct 27, 2013)

I don' t trust heat tape.
Or electric supply when I' m not around to provide back up should an ice storm knock it out.

Well pits are frowned on today but took advantage of the earths temp to reduce frost at a certain depth.
Four foot of dirt over a pipe with no traffic above it ,and straw or leaves above it MIGHT be enough on your site. 

A drained system with a dose of nontoxic anti- freeze in low spots would allow me to sleep better away from it.


----------



## Steve (Jan 15, 2000)

I have a hand driven well with pump in a six foot pit, with cement cover on top. Never had a problem even with the severe winters. Never had to blow that out.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

Steve said:


> I have a hand driven well with pump in a six foot pit, with cement cover on top. Never had a problem even with the severe winters. Never had to blow that out.


Adequately below frost line, especially in sand.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frost_line


----------



## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

Steve said:


> I have a hand driven well with pump in a six foot pit, with cement cover on top. Never had a problem even with the severe winters. Never had to blow that out.


That's exactly what we have now at the current cabin no issues, New cabin we're looking at though has the pump outside above ground.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

FYI, in most townships, well pits are a no-no. So don't advertise or make it easy to see.


----------



## jjlrrw (May 1, 2006)

FREEPOP said:


> FYI, in most townships, well pits are a no-no. So don't advertise or make it easy to see.


You're fine if you already have a well pit but if you needed a new well they would mandate it be up to code and would not allow a pit. Our electric was the same, I needed a permit and inspection to get it turned on because it was off over a year, after the inspection the county told me it needed to be updated from 60A service to a 100A. I ask if that was the law or recommendation they then said "we recommend it" I told them I would consider in the future I had electric within the hour.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

jjlrrw said:


> You're fine if you already have a well pit but if you needed a new well they would mandate it be up to code and would not allow a pit. Our electric was the same, I needed a permit and inspection to get it turned on because it was off over a year, after the inspection the county told me it needed to be updated from 60A service to a 100A. I ask if that was the law or recommendation they then said "we recommend it" I told them I would consider in the future I had electric within the hour.


Correct, old pits are grandfathered. You won't get an occupancy permit if you created a new pit feeding a new structure.


----------



## Steve (Jan 15, 2000)

Yeah I forgot about the old code thing. Anything to keep people from doing things themselves.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

We made my parent's a walk out pit.

I'm sure there's many reasons, one being flooding and contamination down the well and safety, people falling in them, both new and old.


----------



## Scout 2 (Dec 31, 2004)

What about those small ventless heaters. They use to make one for one room and it had a thermostat on it you set. You would need propane or nat gas but no electric would be needed. My neighbor to the west has a set up like you are describing and his light bulb burned out. He now needs a new well, pump and pipe to the house


----------

