# Please don't export MI hunting attitudes...



## jafurnier (Jun 7, 2008)

I am feeling the need to be hated, since the political season is over and I cannot rant about that. So...start swinging.

I didn't want to hijack earlier threads. I am also not interested in a huge QDM/TDM/ blah blah blah debate. I won't even quote the people who said the things that churned my gut, because I am not sure of their intent. But several recentposts just made me cringe...talking about going to high quality buck states...but settling if needed.

Sorry...but I have heard it over and overwhen hunting out of state, "You Michigan hunters can't eat a tag." In the places I hunt...if everyone shot the 115"-120" two yr olds...the quality would suffer greatly. I cannot see a 150" deer in MI. They do not physically exist. I WILL see 150's where I hunt out of state...and Booner is a real possibility. Why? There are no soy beans where I hunt. There are millions of stands. And there are no huge expanses of cover. The simple fact is...the MI shooter bucks walk. The only small deer I see killed are by MI hunters who hunt the areas. I have eaten 4 tags out of 5 years.

It may be legal to shoot dinks. My antlerphile attidues may offend you and step on "your rights". But nothing stinks than having a good thing...and someone coming in and ruining it. This is especially true when I spend serious money leaving this lousy state to get away from it. I have absolutely seen quality areas ruined...by fellow Michiganders.

If you hunt great states like IA, KS and OH...usually your tag is either sex. Shoot a doe if you just have to have the meat. A two yr old rack is just no big deal.

The replies should be fun to read...


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## motdean (Oct 23, 2011)

Don't expect more than about 5 replies....This one will get shut down quickly.....


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

You're 100% right!
Seen it first hand..


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

Agreed. Michigan Mentality. 


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## Dennismeyers333 (Jan 20, 2011)

How long have you been hunting? How big was your biggest buck? How many properties do you hunt in Michigan?


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## heatwave (Feb 11, 2009)

Get no fight out of me I seen it happening to the state land I've been hunting in Ohio. Michigan guys thinking if I don't kill something it was a unsuccessful hunt.. Your 100 percent right in my eyes..


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## KPC (Jan 29, 2000)

jafurnier said:


> It may be legal to shoot dinks. My antlerphile attidues may offend you and step on "your rights". But nothing stinks than having a good thing...and someone coming in and ruining it. *This is especially true when I spend serious money leaving this lousy state to get away from it. * I have absolutely seen quality areas ruined...by fellow Michiganders.


You have every right to feel that way. You can however, go to places that impose and inforce minimums on the bucks that are harvested, and they don't allow just any Jo Schmo in. Stop trying to take a trophy on the cheap. If you bump it up from *"serious money"* to *mega bucks*, you can leave all those MI losers behind, and truly realize your antler dreams.



:lol:

KPC


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

Sounds to me like you need to become an active participant in protecting the trophy resources of the high quality buck states.
Pretty sure there are plenty of Antlerphiles from the High Quality states that feel the same way you do.
All you need to do is find them, group together and* impose your will* on the organization that manages the resource.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

I'm not quite getting what the op is saying?


Are you saying that when I go to Ohio I should pass on a 130" buck?
Don't shoot nothing under 150"?

You said pass the Michigan shooters?

Well to me a Michigan shooter is a 3.5 or older.........reguardless of the antlers. My same target in Ohio is going to be a 3.5 or older.
I'm not going to shoot a 2 y/o I have no interest in doing that here or anywhere. I might even pass a 130" class if I see some bigger ones.........even if they are out of range. 
I live by the rule.......if you won't shoot it on the first day, don't shoot it on the last day.
By the way Hadley Creek Outfitters has a 140" min or 4.5 y/o requirement (Illinois) and they are extremely managed.........unlike public land in Ohio.

So I'm still confused as to what you are requesting me not to export to other states.
The brown its down, 100" shooters, shoot a buck to have a buck, or only shoot 150" +

I don't disagree .............a lot of Michigan mindset needs to stay right here.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

heatwave said:


> Get no fight out of me I seen it happening to the state land I've been hunting in Ohio. Michigan *guys thinking if I don't kill something it was a unsuccessful hunt.*. Your 100 percent right in my eyes..


 
See now that kind of thinking I can agree with. If and that is if, you left Michigan in search of more opportunities to kill bigger bucks don't settle.
I got a 1 week hunt planned for the 2013 season in Ohio. I will not kill just to kill. It has to meet my standards.........which is going to be based on age........but because I am in Ohio...........anlter size will also factor in too. 
If I don't kill something in that week.........oh well. That just will give me an opportunity to head back to Ohio after our season ends. Either to fill my doe tag or possibly kill a nice buck. I eat tag soup more than I don't, so I have aquired a taste for glue and paper:lol:


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

Part of the problem are forums like this. Guys reading about the giant bucks roaming wild all over Ohio. Why shoot a 150 when you can shoot a 180 blah, blah, blah. They get down there, hunt for a few days, and realize that's not the case. Michigan Mentality instantly kicks in and down goes sparky. These aren't stupid hillbilly deer, you still have to hunt them. 

A 120" deer is a great deer in Michigan. Why? Because that's usually a 3 1/2 yr old that survived 3 killing seasons. When life expectancy is less than 2 yrs, anything older than that shouldn't have lived that long. Kill it. 

At least I filled my freezer. 


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

bucksnbows said:


> I don't disagree .............a lot of Michigan mindset needs to stay right here.


Really?
If ones decision for legal harvest in another state does not meet the self imposed harvest regs of another person they should not be afforded an opportunity?
How much control do you Antler Nazi's need?


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## KPC (Jan 29, 2000)

bucksnbows said:


> I live by the rule.......if you won't shoot it on the first day, don't shoot it on the last day.
> By the way Hadley Creek Outfitters has a 140" min or 4.5 y/o requirement (Illinois) and they are extremely managed.........unlike public land in Ohio.


Just for the record, I've hunted with Hadley Creek and if you don't think there are bucks taken there that score less than 140, you are mistaken. They even have a name for them there. They call them *"Friday bucks."* In other words, when Friday rolls around, standards change...sometimes drastically.





bucksnbows said:


> I got a 1 week hunt planned for the 2013 season in Ohio. I will not kill just to kill. It has to meet my standards.........


Nothing wrong with that. But what if your *"standards"* are less than the OP's standards, which apparently they are? And what if my standards are less than your standards? And what if someones standards aren't always the same based on different situations? And what if, and what if, and what if... 

 

KPC


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

bucksnbows said:


> I got a 1 week hunt planned for the 2013 season in Ohio. I will not kill just to kill.


But think about how much money you've spent to get town there. Time off work, lodging, gas, food, whatever else. 

You have to come back with something. 


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## 1ludman (Jun 26, 2012)

I have been hunting out of state for over 25 years and enjoy that most all of the states I hunt in do not allow garbage hunting (baiting). If you want to condition animals to eat off a small pile of food and shoot every young dumb deer just to be successfull you will always have poor quality deer in this state.There is to much emphasis place on tagging a deer or you won't be a great hunter sad but true.My question is what percentage of our hunter have actually hunted in another state and seen what good management does for the deer herd.


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## jafurnier (Jun 7, 2008)

wintrrun said:


> Really?
> How much control do you Antler Nazi's need?


I could just as easily state..."how much control to brown it's down people need?

****
@BNB

People can shoot what they want.

What is irritating is...shooting sparkies not because they have never shot a buck...not because they need the meat. It is the mentality that drive MANY of those shots. "I am not getting skunked no-way now-how and I sure and not taking home a doe." I "need the meat" but somehow could spend $1000 going to IA. I bought a tag...I am owed a deer.

I see it all the time in out of state hunts. People are people everywhere and there are locals with the same attitude in the big buck states. It is just worse here. At least amongst the tons of hunters I know. 

Worse yet...and this drives part of my irritation...I took a guy who turned out to be "a settler" to one of my spots with the edict...you never go back unless with me. 9 newbies later (thanks "friend")...and lots of great two year olds and sparkies later...the place took a crap. 

Michigan mentality...it can ruin a good thing.


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## Munsterlndr (Oct 16, 2004)

Threads like this illustrate a couple of things;

1) For many hunters it really is about the size of the antlers and not about age, which is the common rationalization that we hear from antlerphiles.

2) That antlerphiles are not satisfied setting their own personal harvest standards based on inches, they also want to impose those standards on everyone else. 

3) It's abundantly clear that for many the quality of a hunting experience seems to be based solely on the size of the antlers of the deer harvested. 

4) Antlerphiles seem upset that someone else may "ruin" their hunting but ironically seem to have no issue with forcing regulations on others, that may "ruin" what others perceive to be a desirable hunting experience.


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## uptracker (Jul 27, 2004)

I've seen it too. Hunted an area in 2006 out of state that was awesome. 2 years later, it was horrible...all because others came in an shot ever 2 1/2 year old they saw after word got out that the area was producing big deer. It is sad that someone doesn't want to eat an out of state tag too. The notion that "you have to come back with something" is killing areas. The same thing happens up here: people drive 5-10 hours from southern MI and shoot sparky on the last day of the trip (or first for that matter) because they spent money, vacation and time to get there.

It's gotten to the point that I'm not sure I even want to put in my own time anymore for this very reason...and then we wonder why deer hunter numbers are dwindling.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

Tiarafied said:


> But think about how much money you've spent to get town there. Time off work, lodging, gas, food, whatever else.
> 
> You have to come back with something.
> 
> ...


 
..........and I will definately come back with something........the experience of hunting another state........enough for me if that is all I get out of it.


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

Munsterlndr said:


> Threads like this illustrate a couple of things;
> 
> 1) For many hunters it really is about the size of the antlers and not about age, which is the common rationalization that we hear from antlerphiles.
> 
> ...


If you ever left Northern Michigan, you would realize;

1) With age comes antlers. When there's just as many 4 1/2s as there are 2 1/2s, you automatically have larger antlered animals. 

2) When the majority of your neighboring hunters are like minded (and neighbors a few and far between) then along comes a total different mindset, tensions are created. 

3) When you finally see quality, older, bigger deer on an average basis while on stand and not in a magazine you may understand the difference between a Michigan hunting experience and a quality hunting experience. 

4) Spoken like a true sparky killer. You haven't experienced a quality, well managed hunting area to where your mindset still reflects your "it's good enough for me, screw you, have never seen it so it must not exist" Michigan attitude. 


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## jafurnier (Jun 7, 2008)

Munsterlndr said:


> Antlerphiles seem upset that someone else may "ruin" their hunting but ironically seem to have no issue with forcing regulations on others, that may "ruin" what others perceive to be a desirable hunting experience.


All regulations are forcing someone to do something they do not want to do. To do something they do not desire. Ruining someone else experience. That is fact. People who resist change are usually blinded by this fact.

Also, if someone fails to see a horde of Michigan hunters invading an area in a high quality state...changing the quaility of the hunting in the eyes of the locals...for the "bad"...as perfectly fine because it is legal. This person is crazy!

I do not support APRs in MI...I don't beat my neaighbors over the head for being selfish and shooting dinks instead of does cuz "they gotta shoot a buck" (aka..they are antlerphiles). I choose to leave the state and go where I can hunt with like-minded people. All I ask of my fellow Michiganders is...don't follow me if you want to make my KS, IA and OH spots like Hope, MI. Keep your butt home! As side of beef is cheaper than that sparky you feel entitled to shoot to save face and to fill your tag.


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

jafurnier said:


> I could just as easily state..."how much control to brown it's down people need?


Really?
Seems to me that the "brown its down" crowd just like to hunt under the current rules of the game (regs) that each state sets.
The reg sets a minimum requirement for harvest that all hunters have to abide by.
I don't see that group crying about restrictions or wanting to control what you decide to shoot.
So wheres the control?


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

bucksnbows said:


> ..........and I will definately come back with something........the experience of hunting another state........enough for me if that is all I get out of it.


It's funny, those who never experienced it will never understand, will they?


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## casscityalum (Aug 27, 2007)

KPC said:


> Just for the record, I've hunted with Hadley Creek and if you don't think there are bucks taken there that score less than 140, you are mistaken. They even have a name for them there. They call them *"Friday bucks."* In other words, when Friday rolls around, standards change...sometimes drastically.
> KPC


If your going to post, post the whole story. Yes they may have "Friday Bucks" but it also comes with a cost. $1000 for any buck under 140. Most be a lot of rich people out there on Friday! :lol:

To the OP. No slack from me as I look at it this way. 

If Im heading out of state to hunt. It is about the antlers. No ifs ands or buts. Yes I like to see new areas and hunt different spots, but I can do that for a lot less here at home. I could hunt the west side, UP or NELP, but Im choosing to spend my money out of state for a chance at something far less abundent than in Michigan. Whats that? Big Bucks. If I wanted to shoot a sparky or a 2.5 year old, well then I could have just stayed in Michigan. 

So it does bother me when I see some photos of guys going out of state and coming home with a 1.5 year old deer. If they wanted it that bad, spend the money up north at some local town bar, store, or hotel. Michigan could use that money. It just irks me as I know before they leave, their all hyped up on the big bucks and their going to do hunt where they can shoot a monster. Thats the reason for their trip in the first place, why settle?


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

jafurnier said:


> I could just as easily state..."how much control to brown it's down people need?
> 
> ****
> @BNB
> ...


 
Got ya.

Here is my thing.
I'm not shooting a "sparkie" or a basket 6 any where.
When out of state I will shoot a buck more than likely if he is 3.5 or older if given the chance. I need to experience what an out of state truely holds for me to determine if my standards need to be upgraded. I hear the stories of how great it is, but until I actually see it with my own eyes I won't truely know.


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

bucksnbows said:


> I'm not quite getting what the op is saying?
> 
> You said pass the Michigan shooters?
> 
> *Well to me a Michigan shooter is a 3.5 or older*.........reguardless of the antlers. My same target in Ohio is going to be a 3.5 or older.


 That's what I'm talking about right there, you won't be in MI. so don't apply MI standards.
First of all three year old bucks are far from mature, if you're even a half way decent hunter on the right property you'll see them in OH. Why? Because those bucks are passed on down there, but you'll go there targeting them?
Going to another state to accomplish what you fail to accomplish here is just to stroke your own ego. 
It wont be an accomplishment by Ohio standards. 
It won't make you a "great hunter".
Hunt the top 5% of the bucks that the property provides..
Challenge yourself, raise your standards before you head south..


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

casscityalum said:


> If Im heading out of state to hunt. It is about the antlers. No ifs ands or buts. Yes I like to see new areas and hunt different spots, but I can do that for a lot less here at home. I could hunt the west side, UP or NELP, but Im choosing to spend my money out of state for a chance at something far less abundent than in Michigan. Whats that? Big Bucks. If I wanted to shoot a sparky or a 2.5 year old, well then I could have just stayed in Michigan.
> 
> So it does bother me when I see some photos of guys going out of state and coming home with a 1.5 year old deer. If they wanted it that bad, spend the money up north at some local town bar, store, or hotel. Michigan could use that money. It just irks me as I know before they leave, their all hyped up on the big bucks and their going to do hunt where they can shoot a monster. Thats the reason for their trip in the first place, why settle?


Exactly. If you are leaving the state to hunt for big bucks........why settle. I hunt for big bucks in Michigan and don't settle.


Blueump is a perfect example. Read some of his out of state threads or posts. He is all about shooting what ever in Michigan, but when he heads to OHio his standards change...........why is that? I would guess because he didn't head to Ohio for just any buck.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

Hulk said:


> That's what I'm talking about right there, you won't be in MI. so don't apply MI standards.
> First of all three year old bucks are far from mature, if you're even a half way decent hunter on the right property you'll see them in OH. Why? Because those bucks are passed on down there, but you'll go there targeting them?
> Going to another state to accomplish what you fail to accomplish here is just to stroke your own ego.
> It wont be an accomplishment by Ohio standards.
> ...


 

I agree with you.......but I have yet to see how good I am.:lol: I struggle in Michigan to get them in bow range. I see them but can't kill them.
Now lets say my first trip in Ohio shows me how much different things are .....you can bet your last dollar my Michigan standards will not apply.


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## jafurnier (Jun 7, 2008)

bucksnbows said:


> ..........and I will definately come back with something........the experience of hunting another state........enough for me if that is all I get out of it.


My sentiments exactly.


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## Apple Knocker (Feb 7, 2009)

Deer hunting is not as important to me as it is to many, many others on this forum. I try to "leave it to the experts" in most cases when it comes to these types of discussions. I enjoy the sport, live on a wonderful piece of deer property, and obey all the laws. But, I don't think that insulting and demeaning the choices of others will ever accomplish anything. What seems to me to be missing is the acceptance that most hunters are happy and secure with their own hunting choices. I tend to not shoot spikes/forks, and, yes, I hope that Bullwinkle walks out from behind the tree, but it doesn't really matter to me, really, honest. 2 1/2 yr. old 8 pt, fine with me, bigger one, cool, we shoot does, and if I feel like it, late in the season, I may shoot something smaller. Eat venison year round. I respect the choices and passion of those who are trophy hunters. If the laws change, I'll obey them. Have bought UP combo tags for 11 yrs, used the second tag twice.


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## Hawgleg (Jan 3, 2009)

You have to be willing to eat a tag to take a trophy buck no matter where you hunt. I am from Michigan and have hunted all over the state. I have been an Ohio resident for 12 years now and I can tell you these Ohio Monsters are not behind every tree as some think. Most guys dont have the patience to let a 2 1/2 year old buck walk to take the big boy that may or may not be in the area. This goes for people hunting Mi,Oh, Iowa or any state as far as I am concerned. The guys who consistently take large bucks put in a ton of hours, let young bucks walk and earn a trophy. (In my opinion)


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## KPC (Jan 29, 2000)

casscityalum said:


> If your going to post, post the whole story. Yes they may have "Friday Bucks" but it also comes with a cost. $1000 for any buck under 140. Most be a lot of rich people out there on Friday! :lol:


Your correct, which prostitutes the process even more. 

First of all, the 1000.00 "fine" is rarely, if ever enforced, (not that it even could be legally) at least when I was there, and yes, there were a *number* of "Friday bucks" taken. If you go to HC's website, you will see dozens of bucks that were taken over the years did not score 140, some not even remotely close. 

Oh, and for the record, I had a number of opportunites on nice bucks, and came home without ever having taken a shot...and I was fine with that. As a matter of fact, I would say that it may well have been a few thousand of the best dollars I have ever spent in deer hunting. It has probably saved me tens of thousands since, not to mention tought me a few very important life lessons. It was money well spent.



KPC


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## Ranger Ray (Mar 2, 2003)

Every year Ohio sees an increase in hunters, so will they see a decrease in older deer. Its a product of percentages and its happening in Iowa, Kansas, etc.... The more the trophy hunters descend on a state, the less trophies there will be. The property we pheasant hunt in Iowa used to have 10 and 12 points running around like rabbits. Now its an exception to see one, not the norm. First the 12's disappeared, then the 10's and now its mostly 8's and 6's coming off the property. Mo people! Mo people! Equals less trophies. Wait till Ohio sees 1.7 million hunters. Its not the brown its down crowd ruining it, its the trophy hunters. They are descending like rats on these once less hunted areas. If you shoot all the trophies, whats left? Dinks. So I say, stay in Michigan jafurnier, us brown its down hunters shot bigger bucks when you trophy hunters didn't know about the trophy deer out of state.


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## brushbuster (Nov 9, 2009)

I'll just say this. Set your standards and stick to them. I dont care what that standard is. If you go to ohio and spend a grand and your standard is a spike have at it man. It's your money. When i leave the state mine is 125. Seems low i know but up till last season i never reached that mark. Now i have. Next year my standard is to go higher and not lower. But hey thats just me.
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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

Hawgleg said:


> You have to be willing to eat a tag to take a trophy buck no matter where you hunt. I am from Michigan and have hunted all over the state. I have been an Ohio resident for 12 years now and I can tell you these Ohio Monsters are not behind every tree as some think. Most guys dont have the patience to let a 2 1/2 year old buck walk to take the big boy that may or may not be in the area. This goes for people hunting Mi,Oh, Iowa or any state as far as I am concerned. The guys who consistently take large bucks put in a ton of hours, let young bucks walk and earn a trophy. (In my opinion)





Ranger Ray said:


> Every year Ohio sees an increase in hunters, so will they see a decrease in older deer. Its a product of percentages and its happening in Iowa, Kansas, etc.... The more the trophy hunters descend on a state, the less trophies there will be. The property we pheasant hunt in Iowa used to have 10 and 12 points running around like rabbits. Now its an exception to see one, not the norm. First the 12's disappeared, then the 10's and now its mostly 8's and 6's coming off the property. Mo people! Mo people! Equals less trophies. Wait till Ohio sees 1.7 million hunters. Its not the brown its down crowd ruining it, its the trophy hunters. They are descending like rats on these once less hunted areas. If you shoot all the trophies, whats left? Dinks. So I say, stay in Michigan jafurnier, us brown its down hunters shot bigger bucks when you trophy hunters didn't know about the trophy deer out of state.


 

Ya know if you two posters were ever "bathed in the experience and self enlightenment" that the others have, you would take that common sense you bring to these forums and burn it in the fireplace.


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## Radar420 (Oct 7, 2004)

Ranger Ray said:


> Every year Ohio sees an increase in hunters, so will they see a decrease in older deer. Its a product of percentages and its happening in Iowa, Kansas, etc.... The more the trophy hunters descend on a state, the less trophies there will be. The property we pheasant hunt in Iowa used to have 10 and 12 points running around like rabbits. Now its an exception to see one, not the norm. First the 12's disappeared, then the 10's and now its mostly 8's and 6's coming off the property. Mo people! Mo people! Equals less trophies. Wait till Ohio sees 1.7 million hunters. Its not the brown its down crowd ruining it, its the trophy hunters. They are descending like rats on these once less hunted areas. If you shoot all the trophies, whats left? Dinks. So I say, stay in Michigan jafurnier, us brown its down hunters shot bigger bucks when you trophy hunters didn't know about the trophy deer out of state.


I've heard a similar thing about "the golden triangle" of Illinois. Everyone started hearing about all the great bucks coming out of that area that outfitters came in and snatched up all the leases. After that, the increase in competition from out-of-state hunters put an enormous amount of pressure on the mature age classes (5.5+) to the point that people are killing a lot of the nicer young bucks (2.5-3.5) that haven't reached their full potential (ie antler size)


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## heatwave (Feb 11, 2009)

Tiarafied said:


> If you ever left Northern Michigan, you would realize;
> , screw you, have never seen it so
> 1) With age comes antlers. When there's just as many 4 1/2s as there are 2 1/2s, you automatically have larger antlered animals.
> 
> ...


 Well said.. You wrote exactly what I was thinking.. I want to add one thing you guys keep stating you shoot what you want and I`ll shoot what I want.. One problem if we keep letting them go to grow and you keep shooting them at 1 1/2 to 2 1/2.. I know your all not that stupid..What we want will never happen..


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

Radar420 said:


> I've heard a similar thing about "the golden triangle" of Illinois. Everyone started hearing about all the great bucks coming out of that area that outfitters came in and snatched up all the leases. After that, the increase in competition from out-of-state hunters put an enormous amount of pressure on the mature age classes (5.5+) to the point that people are killing a lot of the nicer young bucks (2.5-3.5) that haven't reached their full potential (ie antler size)


 
It was bound to happen when you consider it was turned into a whitetail gold rush.


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## Radar420 (Oct 7, 2004)

wintrrun said:


> It was bound to happen when you consider it was turned into a whitetail gold rush.


It reminds me a little of this allegory (this was originally discussing deer overpopulation but seems to fit well here):



> "In the September 1950 _Pennsylvania Game News_, commission deer biologist Roger Latham wrote about a man who was presented by a good fairy with a pile of gold and a cloth bag. The fairy warned him not to take too much because the bag would rip, and he'd have nothing. But, blinded by greed, he kept piling in the gold until the seams gave way and he "was left holding the bag.""


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## whitetailassassin (Oct 16, 2012)

heatwave said:


> Well said.. You wrote exactly what I was thinking.. I want to add one thing you guys keep stating you shoot what you want and I`ll shoot what I want.. One problem if we keep letting them go to grow and you keep shooting them at 1 1/2 to 2 1/2.. I know your all not that stupid..What we want will never happen..


They don't care so long as they get theirs. Try to allow some growth and age for potential while they continue shooting what they want and our patience becomes their reward


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## johnhunter247 (Mar 12, 2011)

I think we out of state hunters should stop bringing it up about the great hunting to be had elsewhere. Just keep up the front that this is the best hunting in the world. I don't want the Michigan mentality spreading beyond state lines. The op should just hunt Missouri. Great hunting and with the 4/4 apr you don't have to worry about any of the meat hunters showing up there.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

I can't believe we are arguing over what happens in another state.

How about we stick to Michigan and its problems.


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

Munsterlndr said:


> The deer in those counties grow big and old because a substantial amount of land is controlled by outfitters who strictly control what is harvested :


Wrong again

While there are outfitters that do lease a lot of land , the majority is private. 

Of the 4 counties in Ohio I've hunted in, Knox, Coshocton, Tuscawaras, Licking, I have yet to see it overrun with outfitters. In fact, in October you hardly see any other hunters. 



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## johnhunter247 (Mar 12, 2011)

bucksnbows said:


> I can't believe we are arguing over what happens in another state.
> 
> How about we stick to Michigan and its problems.


 BNB, I think the op has grown tired of trying to fix our problems and spends his hard earned money to go elsewhere now and don't want the mentality following him and ruining it there too. At least that's the way I understand his post. Have to say I agree with him. But not sure it was a good idea to put it on here.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

johnhunter247 said:


> BNB, I think the op has grown tired of trying to fix our problems and spends his hard earned money to go elsewhere now and don't want the mentality following him and ruining it there too. At least that's the way I understand his post. Have to say I agree with him. *But not sure it was a good idea to put it on here*.


 
I'm starting to think it isn't good to put anything on here:lol:


I answered a post on scent control........any wager I get called an idiot for being that extreme. 
Some of the anti APR guys say we do nothing but attack and belittle people........some of them need to take a look in the mirror.......at least I know I'm an Ahole:lol:


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

While we are on the subject of out of state hunts and the mentality...
This review of Ohio's gun season sure is interesting.........Makes you wonder how they let bucks grow when they hunt this way:lol:

QUOTE=Blueump;4394893]This is an honest review for those of you considering heading down to Ohio for one of their firearm seasons. First, let me say I LOVE hunting Ohio. I've done it the last 2 years; all DIY stuff on public land. I saw some real bruisers during archery this year and also had a good experience during last year's muzzleloader trip.

This year I decided to put the "bonus firearm" season on my calendar. Now I've heard from others that hunting public land during these shortened seasons is totally different. Many hunters have shared with me that they "hang it up" during the firearm seasons and wait until archery opens again. I simply laughed at them. They told me that the amount of pressure from the "orange army" is crazy! I felt that if I went deep and got off the beaten path I may have some success. I've hunted public land in Michigan most all of my life - in Lake County none the less, and felt I knew what pressure really was. I was wrong!

The mentality of these 2 day orange hunters is INSANE! I was so far back in the thick stuff that I had to literally crawl on my hands and knees through inch long thorns to get there. The sign I found where I decided to sit was impressive. I sat all day on Saturday. I saw a total of 3 hunters. Two guys walking through, busting limbs, talking loudly, smoking...that is what they call "still hunting" down here. The 3rd guy was wearing brown, no orange. He was part of a 9 man "drive". No deer. :sad: No biggie, its a 2 day season!

On Sunday, the final day, I tried a new spot. I got there really early, again crawling on my belly in many places, up and down hills. I could not hear anything; the nearest road was at least a mile away. I found rubs on trees much larger than my arm. This was definitely the place! I figured that if they decided to drive this, I would be in a prime area for an ambush. Did I say "if"? I forgot this is a different mentality of "hunting", maybe due to the brief nature of the bonus season and the desperation of the hunters. A total of 3 different groups "drove" by me by noon. Every hunter I saw had a smoking cigarette in his mouth. Most were talking to their buddies as they walked. Some had walkie talkies, some were yelling back and forth to other hunters, one even had his iPod blasting music. I've seen fewer people in a mall! 

There is no such thing as a hunting from a blind on this public land down here. Even the huge tracts of land, like the WNF, get overrun by entire regiments of the orange army - all moving and driving. There is no skill needed, no advantage to the patient, no amount of experience that can make a person successful in a hunt like this. Unless I can be fortunate enough to find a tract of private land to hang out in, I won't be back for another Ohio firearm season. Its a total waste of time! :rant:[/QUOTE]


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## johnhunter247 (Mar 12, 2011)

bucksnbows said:


> While we are on the subject of out of state hunts and the mentality...
> This review of Ohio's gun season sure is interesting.........Makes you wonder how they let bucks grow when they hunt this way:lol:
> 
> QUOTE=Blueump;4394893]This is an honest review for those of you considering heading down to Ohio for one of their firearm seasons. First, let me say I LOVE hunting Ohio. I've done it the last 2 years; all DIY stuff on public land. I saw some real bruisers during archery this year and also had a good experience during last year's muzzleloader trip.
> ...


[/QUOTE]

Someone must have unlocked the gate on I75 at the Michigan border!:lol: Seroiusly though that does suck. I believe deer drives have no place in the whitetail woods. The guy in all brown on a deer drive must have been a real genius.:help:


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## miruss (Apr 18, 2003)

Munsterlndr said:


> It's just illustrates how bogus the argument put forth by a lot of antlerphiles is that they only care about age and not about the size of the rack. I wouldn't hesitate for a second to shoot a 5 year old buck that had dropped it's antlers but a whole lot of people, apparently yourself included, would think that it would be a travesty to do so. The question is why? If it's all about age, not antlers, then it should make no difference. The same is true with the OP's request that only deer over a certain number of inches be harvested by Michigan hunters when hunting out of state. Some bucks will never reach 150", regardless of how old they may get to be. If the goal is just to shoot bucks older than yearlings, why would it matter if they had not reached 150"? The answer is because for many, it's all about bone, not age.


They don't even have to be totally dropped how many times have we heard if his g3 wasn't broken or if he was just a little bit wider i would have shot him that has nothing to do with age just the way the almighty antler looks


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## MIhunt (Dec 18, 2011)

whitetailassassin said:


> Nor would you. Also most non-"antlerphiles" wouldn't pass a 2 year old 8 point for 5 year old doe either. That's was not your best effort mihunt, I'm gonna call that a failure. Try again


Well your wrong. I'd be willing to bet that the 5 yr old doe would be bigger than 2 yr old. I shoot deer on body size. For example, I would normally shoot a spike but I passed on one on December 30 because I knew there was a bigger doe still alive that I wanted to try and get. I realize there is a difference between a spike and an 8pt. However, I shoot deer on body size, not age or antler size



Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


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## glen sible (Dec 11, 2004)

If there is anything around more important than my ego I want it caught and shot right now.:help:


thanks for reading and carry on

glen


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

MIhunt said:


> Well your wrong. I'd be willing to bet that the 5 yr old doe would be bigger than 2 yr old. I shoot deer on body size. For example, I would normally shoot a spike but I passed on one on December 30 because I knew there was a bigger doe still alive that I wanted to try and get. I realize there is a difference between a spike and an 8pt. However, I shoot deer on body size, not age or antler size
> 
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


 Don't bet the farm on that one, a 2 yr old buck will have a larger body than a 5 yr old doe any day.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

MIhunt said:


> Well your wrong. I'd be willing to bet that the 5 yr old doe would be bigger than 2 yr old. I shoot deer on body size. For example, I would normally shoot a spike but I passed on one on December 30 because I knew there was a bigger doe still alive that I wanted to try and get. I realize there is a difference between a spike and an 8pt. However, I shoot deer on body size, not age or antler size
> 
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


 
Unlike bucks........age doesn't play a role as much in body size with the does.


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## SpecialEd (Nov 29, 2011)

The bucks are the ones with the pointy things sticking out of their head right?

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

Want to compare mentality?

Look at Ohio's deer hunting contest on the Ohio site.
Then look at ours.

I counted 3 bucks that would not break 100"



Hard to say for sure how old they(bucks) were, but in the antler catagory they were all pretty impressive in the 130 range give or take.


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## Munsterlndr (Oct 16, 2004)

SpecialEd said:


> The bucks are the ones with the pointy things sticking out of their head right?
> 
> posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


Only during certain times of the year but apparently it's not Ok to shoot them when they don't have the pointy things because their age is important. :lol:


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## Munsterlndr (Oct 16, 2004)

bucksnbows said:


> Want to compare mentality?
> 
> Look at Ohio's deer hunting contest on the Ohio site.
> Then look at ours.
> ...


Don't let Jfurnier know that those guys in Ohio are shooting bucks that have not met his 150" minimum or he's liable to be pissed! :yikes:


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## MIhunt (Dec 18, 2011)

Hulk said:


> Don't bet the farm on that one, a 2 yr old buck will have a larger body than a 5 yr old doe any day.


Any day besides New Years right? A friend took a buck and a doe on New Years Day and the rough aging of them is 5 on the doe and 2 on the buck. The doe outweighs the buck and even appears bigger.


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

bucksnbows said:


> Want to compare mentality?
> 
> Look at Ohio's deer hunting contest on the Ohio site.
> Then look at ours.
> ...


 Now go look at Q1buckpole (south central MI), we have damn good deer here, just as good as Ohio if not better.
A lot of the hype about Ohio is just that, hype!

Lots of guys on this site hunt Ohio, start a new thread and ask them to post their bucks. I'll bet there wont be much of a response.

I own 200 acres in central Ohio, in the #2 county, I have half as many acres in S. MI. with 4x the amount of shooters over 130" vs. my OH property. Go figure.. The grass isn't always greener. You'll see.


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

MIhunt said:


> Any day besides New Years right? A friend took a buck and a doe on New Years Day and the rough aging of them is 5 on the doe and 2 on the buck. The doe outweighs the buck and even appears bigger.
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


 
It is not a general rule that the older the doe the more she weighs.
On the other hand older bucks tend to weigh more than younger bucks.


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

MIhunt said:


> Any day besides New Years right? A friend took a buck and a doe on New Years Day and the rough aging of them is 5 on the doe and 2 on the buck. The doe outweighs the buck and even appears bigger.
> 
> 
> Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


"Rough aging" :lol::lol:
Got pics?


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## SpecialEd (Nov 29, 2011)

Munsterlndr said:


> Only during certain times of the year but apparently it's not Ok to shoot them when they don't have the pointy things because their age is important. :lol:


They look similar on a dinner plate. Shoot to grille!

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


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## ENCORE (Sep 19, 2005)

Anybody read the March issue of Deer & Deer Hunting?

Starting on page 35, the title, THE NEW FACE OF WHITETAIL HUNTING, read that article.

Pay close attention to what the author writes, starting on page 37 and with the sub-title of, The Ugly.

That's all........


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

Hulk said:


> Now go look at Q1buckpole (south central MI), we have damn good deer here, just as good as Ohio if not better.
> A lot of the hype about Ohio is just that, hype!
> 
> Lots of guys on this site hunt Ohio, start a new thread and ask them to post their bucks. I'll bet there wont be much of a response.
> ...


 
Again I agree with you Hulk.........don't know why you seem to always be fighting against me. 
I have no clue what Ohio hunting is like outside of pictures, posts and talking to a few that have gone there.
QDMAMAN,Pez, and their crew have been going for three years. They like it, and have killed some nice bucks but it isn't like they are behind every tree from what they say.
Your SLP property is just like any property anywhere.......some are better than others. (your doe theory holds water that I must addmit)

I check out Q1 from time to time. Ya Michigan has some great bucks. I see them, I've killed a couple and flung some arrows at some but missed. This season I saw 8 bucks that were easily 3.5 largest one probably mid 140's smallest around 120. 

Here is my reasons for starting my out of state adventures.....

I hear so many good things compared to Michigan if you are a trophy hunter (which I am not, but I do target older/bigger bucks....more into the QDM thing)
I have never hunted anywhere but Michigan and want a change.

Ohio was my first pick because..........

Fairly close.
Over the counter tags
Reasonable tag prices
Heard that the public grounds are not too pressured during the bow seasons
Their deer season ends February 3...........I can always drive a couple of hours south hunt some public ground after our season ends. Maybe fill a doe tag, maybe get lucky on a nice buck, but most importantly keep hunting when I am not really ready to hang it up.
And of course known for being pretty good for big bucks.

I am also going to start applying for Iowa. Hope to build up enough points to draw a tag in 3 years.
Might check out Missouri in between.
Want to head out to Kansas some time in my life.
Indiana sounds pretty good too.
Wouldn't mind Illinois.
Wisconsin is probably in the near future.


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

Hulk said:


> Now go look at Q1buckpole (south central MI), we have damn good deer here, just as good as Ohio if not better.
> A lot of the hype about Ohio is just that, hype!
> 
> Lots of guys on this site hunt Ohio, start a new thread and ask them to post their bucks. I'll bet there wont be much of a response.
> ...


 

You can offer it up from first hand experience but don't expect the slappies to drink from the well of knowledge.
There are trophy bucks behind every tree in Ohio!
There is better hunting in the Walmart parking lot in Toledo then on any managed property in Michigan.
Well there was til all the michigan guys started hunting and there wives started shopping there.


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## Craves (Feb 16, 2010)

jafurnier said:


> I could just as easily state..."how much control to brown it's down people need?
> 
> ****
> @BNB
> ...


Yep...and happens here in Michigan as well.


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## jafurnier (Jun 7, 2008)

wintrrun said:


> Really?
> Seems to me that the "brown its down" crowd just like to hunt under the current rules of the game (regs) that each state sets.
> The reg sets a minimum requirement for harvest that all hunters have to abide by.
> I don't see that group crying about restrictions or wanting to control what you decide to shoot.
> So wheres the control?


About people who live in the status quo not understanding...

Whether they cry or not...the resistance to change is a control tactic.


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

bucksnbows said:


> Again I agree with you Hulk.........don't know why you seem to always be fighting against me.
> QUOTE]
> 
> I'm not trying to fight against you, sometimes when words are written instead of spoken the message is interpreted wrong. Maybe I was a bit abrasive trying to get my point across.
> I wish you luck, I really do, if you need some public land leads in solid Ohio counties, pm me.


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

wintrrun said:


> You can offer it up from first hand experience but don't expect the slappies to drink from the well of knowledge.
> There are trophy bucks behind every tree in Ohio!
> There is better hunting in the Walmart parking lot in Toledo then on any managed property in Michigan.
> Well there was til all the michigan guys started hunting and there wives started shopping there.


You're probably right! 
Oh well!


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## jafurnier (Jun 7, 2008)

johnhunter247 said:


> BNB, I think the op has grown tired of trying to fix our problems and spends his hard earned money to go elsewhere now and don't want the mentality following him and ruining it there too. At least that's the way I understand his post. Have to say I agree with him. But not sure it was a good idea to put it on here.


You understand one of my main points...

WRT not being a good idea to post it on here. With the election over...I was looking for some laughs. Surely you have read some of these posts and laughed out loud. My wife has asked several times...what's so funny over there?


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

Hulk said:


> bucksnbows said:
> 
> 
> > Again I agree with you Hulk.........don't know why you seem to always be fighting against me.
> ...


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## heatwave (Feb 11, 2009)

glen sible said:


> If there is anything around more important than my ego I want it caught and shot right now.:help:
> 
> 
> thanks for reading and carry on
> ...


I keep reading this ego bull.. Remember were the ones letting the small bucks live and shooting does instead..Your the one telling your buddies how great of a hunter you are, got me another 6pt. That's 20yrs in row I shot my buck.. My hero...lol


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

jafurnier said:


> You understand one of my main points...
> 
> WRT not being a good idea to post it on here. With the election over...I was looking for some laughs. Surely you have read some of these posts and laughed out loud. *My wife has asked several times...what's so funny over there*?


 
Ya this one I just read and I laughed. I find it true


heatwave said:


> I keep reading this ego bull.. Remember were the ones letting the small bucks live and shooting does instead..Your the one telling your buddies how great of a hunter you are, got me another 6pt. That's 20yrs in row I shot my buck.. My hero...lol


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

heatwave said:


> I keep reading this ego bull.. Remember were the ones letting the small bucks live and shooting does instead..Your the one telling your buddies how great of a hunter you are, got me another 6pt. That's 20yrs in row I shot my buck.. My hero...lol


Sitting in a heated shack, overlooking a bean field and a pile of carrots. Typing away "live from the stand" with his pocket computer. 

Shhhh.... I hear one coming. 

POW


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire


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## Craves (Feb 16, 2010)

Munsterlndr said:


> Larger antlers come with age but there are a whole lot of antlerphiles who could care less about age and use inches as the defining metric for what they harvest. I highly doubt many of you trophy hunters who are choosing to go out of state would shoot a 5 year old buck in December if his antlers had already dropped. Admit it, it's all about antlers for you guys, not age.


Gotta agree with G3s on this one...not one of your better efforts.


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## Munsterlndr (Oct 16, 2004)

Craves said:


> Gotta agree with G3s on this one...not one of your better efforts.


So are you saying that you would shoot a mature buck that had dropped his antlers if you knew it was an older buck? Somehow I kind of doubt that the majority of antlerphiles would, given some of the warnings that have been given in threads on these forums warning late season hunters about potentially shooting bucks. In fact, when extending archery season into January has been suggested, there are always a bunch of complaints that too many shed bucks would be harvested. Again, if age is the primary goal in your buck harvest decision, why would it matter?


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## Craves (Feb 16, 2010)

Munsterlndr said:


> So are you saying that you would shoot a mature buck that had dropped his antlers if you knew it was an older buck? Somehow I kind of doubt that the majority of antlerphiles would, given some of the warnings that have been given in threads on these forums warning late season hunters about potentially shooting bucks. In fact, when extending archery season into January has been suggested, there are always a bunch of complaints that too many shed bucks would be harvested. Again, if age is the primary goal in your buck harvest decision, why would it matter?


Like some of your fellow Anti APR Antlerphiles you like to put words in other peoples mouths. I have stated all along that antlers are *part* of the reason I am in support of this measure. No doubt you have read my posts before and all ready know that. From what I have read, most if not all of the pro APR hunters don't deny this.

So...would I shoot him under the scenario you have drawn up...probably not. But then again, I never stated that age was a *primary goal.*

For whats its worth, as much as I would like to still be in the stand with my bow, our season is long enough. After 3+ months of being hunted, the deer need a rest!


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## johnhunter247 (Mar 12, 2011)

Munsterlndr said:


> So are you saying that you would shoot a mature buck that had dropped his antlers if you knew it was an older buck? Somehow I kind of doubt that the majority of antlerphiles would, given some of the warnings that have been given in threads on these forums warning late season hunters about potentially shooting bucks. In fact, when extending archery season into January has been suggested, there are always a bunch of complaints that too many shed bucks would be harvested. Again, if age is the primary goal in your buck harvest decision, why would it matter?


I guess I don't follow here. Why would one have to defend not shooting a mature buck for shedding his antlers? Antler size and age go hand in hand so of coarse age and score play a role when considering to harvest or not. Would I harvest a shed buck? Hell no, don't care how big or small he is and if I am not 100% certain it's a doe I will not shoot. Sure there is the needle in the hay stack but the majority of mature bucks (not by Michigan standards)are going to have a large set of antlers. It's rediculous to think one has to defend himself for being a selective hunter. I hunt mainly for horns and am not afraid to admit it. It takes a lot of time, money,effort and commitment to hunt mature deer. It becomes more than a hobby. Hell if I was a meat hunter my season would be over every year on Oct.1. But I would have a box full of 50"/60" deer antlers in the garage that I pull out once a year to throw the next two sets of antlers in. What an accomplishment. Like I said, there is no point to this B.S. Someone lock it already!


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## William H Bonney (Jan 14, 2003)

I'm confused about the title of this thread...

What exactly does that mean, "_don't export MI hunting attitudes"_ ?


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## johnhunter247 (Mar 12, 2011)

William H Bonney said:


> I'm confused about the title of this thread...
> 
> What exactly does that mean, "_don't export MI hunting attitudes"_ ?


I was hoping when you chimed in it would be something funny or a picture or something. Normally when you post I am left laughing!


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## Munsterlndr (Oct 16, 2004)

johnhunter247 said:


> Would I harvest a shed buck? Hell no, don't care how big or small he is and if I am not 100% certain it's a doe I will not shoot. Sure there is the needle in the hay stack but the majority of mature bucks (not by Michigan standards)are going to have a large set of antlers. It's rediculous to think one has to defend himself for being a selective hunter. I hunt mainly for horns and am not afraid to admit it. It takes a lot of time, money,effort and commitment to hunt mature deer.


Thank you for making my point. Obviously, for you, antlers are the deciding factor, not age, hence your reluctance to shoot a shed buck even if it's a mature one. Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticizing you for that, I have no problem with people basing their harvest decisions on the size of the antlers and I applaud your honesty in admitting it. 

What I don't understand is why it matters if I or someone else chooses a different standard to base our harvest decisions on? The only logical answer is because it might hurt someone elses chance to bag a buck with bigger antlers. I personally don't care what you or others choose to harvest or what methods you care to employ to do so, as long as it's legal. It's kind of a shame that so many others won't take that approach and instead want to criticize other hunters over their harvest decisions or the methods they choose to employ. :sad:


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## Ranger Ray (Mar 2, 2003)

bioactive said:


> :lol::lol:
> 
> I select the buck I want to kill based mainly on age.


Interesting concept man of logic.


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## johnhunter (Jun 17, 2000)

Munsterlndr said:


> As to who is more of an antlerphile, I don't know many hunters who have to shoot any deer that they see that has legal antlers. I know many who will shoot the first legal deer that they have the opportunity to shoot and due to the fact that yearling males tend to be less wary than family groups led by mature does or the fact that for many, shooting a doe is not a legal option, that deer may turn out to be a younger buck a lot of the time but it's not the desire to shoot a deer with antlers that is the deciding factor like it is with antlerphiles who admittedly will only consider killing a buck if it has certain sized antlers.


So long as we're throwing out our personal anecdotal observations, allow me to share mine. In the vicinity of my hunting property, I am quite confident that most hunters fall into the former category, preferring to shoot the first deer with legal antlers over the first legal deer. No doubt in my mind. The quantity of yearling bucks harvested absolutely overwhelms the quantity of antlerless deer taken, in an area of essentially unlimited antlerless tags.


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## Bomba (Jul 26, 2005)

farmlegend said:


> So long as we're throwing out our personal anecdotal observations, allow me to share mine. In the vicinity of my hunting property, I am quite confident that most hunters fall into the former category, preferring to shoot the first deer with legal antlers over the first legal deer. No doubt in my mind. The quantity of yearling bucks harvested absolutely overwhelms the quantity of antlerless deer taken, in an area of essentially unlimited antlerless tags.


 
I agree, it's like this in most areas. Munster is just trying to put his "spin" on the obvious.


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## KPC (Jan 29, 2000)

*"Originally Posted by bioactive 

If it does not matter to you why on earth do you spend so much energy fighting APRs?

If it doesn't matter it doesn't matter.

BTW, I am sitting in a cabin in the Shawnee State Park in southern Ohio. Saw 1 buck (fork) in 2 days of hunting and thoroughly enjoying the experience. There is definitely not a buck behind every tree. 

But I will come back.." *

Why? Except for the *"thoroughly enjoying the experience"* part, that sounds exactly the way some of you describe hunting in MI, and why you don't like hunting here. 


Talk about laughing out loud. That one did it for me.

:lol::lol::lol: 

Reminds me of one of those 60 Minutes or Dateline (I forget which) episodes I saw a number of years ago. They were talking about premium vodka and whether or not it was worth the cost, or if the majorty of the people could even tell the difference, or if the perceived difference was actually all in their minds and something that they just wanted to experience.

Making a long story short, the vodka "officionados" described, in detail, why the Gray Goose was so much better, smoother, and more refined than the rot gut Popov.

They went on and on about how they would never drink the Popov, and how they could tell the difference a mile away...yada, yada, yada.

Right up until they found out that it was actually Popov in both bottles.

:lol:

KPC


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

KPC said:


> *"Originally Posted by bioactive *
> 
> *If it does not matter to you why on earth do you spend so much energy fighting APRs?*
> 
> ...


Why, because of the scenery and terrain, nothing like it here in MI.
When it comes to hunting Ohio, your either hunting a fantastic parcel with multiple buck sightings, or your not!

What I'm saying is that the hunting varies greatly from county to county, and woodlot to woodlot. If your not hunting the right piece of land in Ohio, you might as well stay home. From my experience, the deer population down there is not spread out as broadly as S. MI., they live in pockets, even more than here. 

Access to quality property in Ohio is nearly impossible, unless you want to pay $2500+ for a week or buy your own.
It's feast or famine down there!

Why do so many want to hunt Ohio? Simple, because of the stories they hear about all the monster bucks seen. Very few get on any forum and say how they were skunked or saw only a couple deer in Ohio, but they are the majority.

I'll sum it up,
The state of Ohio as a whole, overrated hunting!
Get on the right property in Ohio, amazing hunting!


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## KPC (Jan 29, 2000)

Hulk said:


> Why, because of the scenery and terrain, nothing like it here in MI.
> When it comes to hunting Ohio, your either hunting a fantastic parcel with multiple buck sightings, or your not!
> 
> What I'm saying is that the hunting varies greatly from county to county, and woodlot to woodlot. If your not hunting the right piece of land in Ohio, you might as well stay home. From my experience, the deer population down there is not spread out as broadly as S. MI., they live in pockets, even more than here.
> ...


Sounds like Popov at the price of Gray Goose to me.

:lol:

Just so I get this straight, it sounds like if you want to shoot a big buck in Ohio, you need to do your homework, hunt where the big deer live, and be patient.

Unlike Michigan, where if you want to shoot a big buck, you have to do your homework, hunt where the big deer live, and be patient.

:16suspect

:lol:


KPC


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## Hulk (Dec 18, 2009)

KPC said:


> Just so I get this straight, it sounds like if you want to shoot a big buck in Ohio, you need to do your homework, hunt where the big deer live, and be patient.
> 
> Unlike Michigan, where if you want to shoot a big buck, you have to do your homework, hunt where the big deer live, and be patient.
> 
> ...


In a nutshell, yes!


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## beer and nuts (Jan 2, 2001)

Outfitters, including Hadley, don't impose all those fines and such on everybody..all depends on how many times you have been a client with them or who the client might be...Friday Bucks work differently, client to client. I know a group of guys that spend $2500/person to hunt outstate..last days came around..two guys shot smaller bucks...the outfitter was not happy with one guy shooting a smaller buck, but was good with the other. Why? One guy had been hunting with him for several years and the other was just his second year.


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## beer and nuts (Jan 2, 2001)

Facts -Ohio buck harvets, 2010...47% were 1.5 year olds compare to Michigan with 57%. 10% difference in states. Is this a big "mentality" difference..or are the 1.5 year old deer antlers size the deciding factor for you...most 1.5 year olds in MI support 5 point or less, where Ohio 1.5 year olds support "larger" antlers than MI..so that makes it OK???

Also Ohio hunters in their antlerless harvest are killing 11% to 30% button bucks depending on which county. But it seems to avg. around 22% or so. Is this a difference in mentality than what we see in MI??

Just some thought.


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## beer and nuts (Jan 2, 2001)

Also outstaters make up about 5% of the total harvest, last stat I saw for Ohio. 

Mind you MI hunters make up alot of outstaters but there are plenty of WV hunters and southern guys..I met 5 guys from Kentucky this year down in Ohio hunting. Not sure of the breakdown state to state of outstaters.


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

beer and nuts said:


> Facts -Ohio buck harvets, 2010...47% were 1.5 year olds compare to Michigan with 57%. 10% difference in states. Is this a big "mentality" difference..or are the 1.5 year old deer antlers size the deciding factor for you...most 1.5 year olds in MI support 5 point or less, where Ohio 1.5 year olds support "larger" antlers than MI..so that makes it OK???
> 
> Also Ohio hunters in their antlerless harvest are killing 11% to 30% button bucks depending on which county. But it seems to avg. around 22% or so. Is this a difference in mentality than what we see in MI??
> 
> Just some thought.


Take those stats with a grain of salt. 

The kind of hunters that participate in those surveys are the "I got my buck" type of guy. 

There are those in every state, just appears Ohio has 10% less of them. 


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

beer and nuts said:


> Facts -Ohio buck harvets, 2010...47% were 1.5 year olds compare to Michigan with 57%. 10% difference in states. Is this a big "mentality" difference..or are the 1.5 year old deer antlers size the deciding factor for you...most 1.5 year olds in MI support 5 point or less, where Ohio 1.5 year olds support "larger" antlers than MI..so that makes it OK???
> 
> Also Ohio hunters in their antlerless harvest are killing 11% to 30% button bucks depending on which county. But it seems to avg. around 22% or so. Is this a difference in mentality than what we see in MI??
> 
> Just some thought.


 
Same thing in Illinois. 
1.5 buck harvest usually hovering just below 40%
Button bucks on avg make up 10% of the harvest.
The stringent regs set by some outfitters have softened.
Kumbaya!


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## beer and nuts (Jan 2, 2001)

> Take those stats with a grain of salt.
> 
> The kind of hunters that participate in those surveys are the "I got my buck" type of guy.
> 
> There are those in every state, just appears Ohio has 10% less of them.


 Uh..Ohio is a call in your deer state...survey? Give me another excuse...


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## Tiarafied (Nov 12, 2012)

beer and nuts said:


> Uh..Ohio is a call in your deer state...survey? Give me another excuse...


That was kind of my point. 


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## beer and nuts (Jan 2, 2001)

> That was kind of my point.


 Well I guess ya need to "kind of" explain your point?! Are you questioning Ohio's checkin deer/turkey system??


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## heatwave (Feb 11, 2009)

billmitch said:


> Anyone force you to hunt that way?


 absolutely not.. your so right I guess I just didnt have anymore room in my garage to put those boxes of sparky racks so I decided to up my game..


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## anonymous7242016 (Aug 16, 2008)

Yes.

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## November Sunrise (Jan 12, 2006)

I'm long past the point of caring what MI hunters do while hunting here, but I will say that I'm especially entertained by the idea that I should care what they do when they leave this state. Some of you guys are apparently just really into worrying. 

I'll pray for your misery to cease :lol:.


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## wintrrun (Jun 11, 2008)

November Sunrise said:


> I'm long past the point of caring what MI hunters do while hunting here, but I will say that I'm especially entertained by the idea that I should care what they do when they leave this state. Some of you guys are apparently just really into worrying.
> 
> I'll pray for your misery to cease :lol:.


 
Well put, NS.
You gotta wonder if these guys go out and hunt without alot of time spent staring off at the property lines worrying what the neighbors are doing.:lol:


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## Pez Gallo (Sep 20, 2008)

You'll be happy to know that I just passed up a 120ish 8 not but 10 minutes ago. We set up a date for next year.

Have a good day, Pez

P.S. For Munster, he may have been 3 1/2, but his pointy things didn't meet my standards for my location.
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