# How to settle a property line "issue"?



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

I'm in the process of having a building build my house. So I own the lot through the builder. The builder's surveyor has staked my corners. The house behind my house had been for sale for quite some time and finally sold/closed about a month ago. The new people have moved in and are cleaning up things. There is a 10-15' tree row behind the houses. When you look at the stakes, the tree row is actually inside my property. My lot was woods prior to my purchase. It looks like the previous owner had "crept" over the property line expanding his yard 5-8' and using what is now my property as the receiver of all of his leaves, sticks, logs, etc. They even put up a play structure that one corner sits on the line. So fast forward to present time. The new owners of the house had an invisible fence installed late last week. I went out over the weekend and noticed the flags. The pretty much followed the edge of the "yard" which crosses into my lot. I had my builder confirm the stakes were actual line stakes and not offsets. I visually confirmed the steel pins are present. So I left my name/number and asked them to call. The owner called me last night. The call was cordial and I stated I think the fence is over the line and I didn't want to do something on my property and end up disrupting his fence. He said the selling realtor told them their lot went to the tree line. I told him I'd print out my survey, my sub's plat map, and his sub's plat map (we're in 2 different phases) and I'd call him to arrange a time to review.

The stakes are flagged and very visible. I don't think he intentionally did it. I have decent faith in the fact that the registered surveyor's drawing and stakes are correct. Should I go run a string from stake to stake to stake? It will look like I'm heading into his yard.... Any other suggestions on how to handle it? I don't want this tree row to be a collecting place for his dog waste either (I could smell it as I walked it yesterday, not saying it was intentional again.) 

Thanks for the help guys.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

Stop the encroachment now or it will only snowball (voice of experience)


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

FREEPOP said:


> Stop the encroachment now or it will only snowball (voice of experience)


Do I make an issue of the play house? They didn't put it in but by eye-ball it looks like one of the 4 posts is over/on the line. Which means their kids playing on it are in my yard. The family seems nice and I plan to be here a long time so I don't want to be that neighbor but I also don't want people tramping all over my yard.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

If your not "That Guy" then your the doormat, usually.
Unfortunately that's the way it usually is.

I'd talk to him about the fence you re going to put up. Run the string and then see what he has to say.
Personally, I'd follow through with the fence.


----------



## 2508speed (Jan 6, 2011)

NittanyDoug said:


> Do I make an issue of the play house? They didn't put it in but by eye-ball it looks like one of the 4 posts is over/on the line. Which means their kids playing on it are in my yard. The family seems nice and I plan to be here a long time so I don't want to be that neighbor but I also don't want people tramping all over my yard.


Since you are building new, you should let the neighbors know you don't want their playground or dogs and waste on your property. Fences make good neighbors. If he neighbors are nice as you say there should be no problems. You should find out who their agent was and go slap him though! lol Another case of a realtor not having all the facts and the buyer not having the property surveyed. You are fully in the right to have them move their stuff.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

The old saying "Give them an inch......." comes to mind.


----------



## Petronius (Oct 13, 2010)

I was going to say you should put up a fence, but these other two guys said it first.


----------



## jimbofish (Dec 15, 2002)

I'd wait till you see what the guy has to say when you show him your info. If he disagrees, then his beef should be with the Realtor, not you. No one can give someone else the right to use your property.
Aren't there usually are setbacks that specify how close a structure can be to the property line? I'd give him a reasonable time to move it or you'll hire someone to do it at his expense.
Maybe he's a nice guy and you can get him to split the cost of a rail fence to mark the line.


----------



## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

FREEPOP said:


> Stop the encroachment now or it will only snowball (voice of experience)


Hell yes,,,, get it straightened out now!


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

Even if they are good and you don't have any problems, they could sell, then it could go bad.


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

Thanks guys. I'll try to hook up with him this weekend and ask him to move things back onto his side. We'll see how that goes. The steel pins are there so it really shouldn't be a very debatable issue with me. Now he may not like the realtor....but that's not my problem. There are setbacks in the township but I'd bet that no permit was required or pulled for the playhouse and I'm sure none was required for the invisible fence. Why the installer didn't question it is beyond me. Heck the one stake is probable 10' into what he thinks is his yard. He should look at it this way, I just cut 10 minutes off his mowing time. There is a drain easement with a swale in the middle of it and it's all on my property, same with the bulk of the trees. I can see how he was confused (minus the flagged stakes).


----------



## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

His feelings will be bruised, but oh well.

I'm in the middle of a property line/tree mess and the person at fault will come with that "oh, I just didn't know", "I was told it was there", all the while utilizing what you're paying the taxes on.


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

Granted I'm not living there yet and it will be next year before I get that part of the yard cleaned up, I just want to take care of it now so when the time comes there are no issues.


----------



## 2508speed (Jan 6, 2011)

jimbofish said:


> I'd wait till you see what the guy has to say when you show him your info. If he disagrees, then his beef should be with the Realtor, not you. No one can give someone else the right to use your property.
> Aren't there usually are setbacks that specify how close a structure can be to the property line? I'd give him a reasonable time to move it or you'll hire someone to do it at his expense.
> Maybe he's a nice guy and you can get him to split the cost of a rail fence to mark the line.


Whatever a realtor tells you has no legal binding. He collects money is all.


----------



## mi duckdown (Jul 1, 2006)

I would try to do this by talking to the neighbors, Hell they may good friends in the future. But your survey is what it is.


----------



## 2508speed (Jan 6, 2011)

mi duckdown said:


> I would try to do this by talking to the neighbors, Hell they may good friends in the future. But your survey is what it is.


They very well may be. Put a hinged gate and give them the key. You have to establish the lines IMO.


----------



## plugger (Aug 8, 2001)

Duel, whether sword or pistol is the only sure way to resolve an issue of this magnitude.


----------



## jasonvanorder (Feb 23, 2009)

plugger said:


> Duel, whether sword or pistol is the only sure way to resolve an issue of this magnitude.



THIS! And if that doesnt work do what you have planned. Get the maps and surveyors reports and just have a sit down with him and talk things out first. No reason to be an a hole right of the bat. As you said hes going by what he was told by the realtor and from experience they dont know much sometimes


----------



## Jimbos (Nov 21, 2000)

jasonvanorder said:


> THIS! And if that doesnt work do what you have planned. Get the maps and surveyors reports and just have a sit down with him and talk things out first. No reason to be an a hole right of the bat. As you said hes going by what he was told by the realtor and from experience they dont know much sometimes



That "I was told by my realtor", is pure b.s. and just an excuse. What home purchaser buys something and has no idea where the property line is located?


----------



## jasonvanorder (Feb 23, 2009)

Jimbos said:


> That "I was told by my realtor", is pure b.s. and just an excuse. What home purchaser buys something and has no idea where the property line is located?



You'd be surprised. Last month just moved back into my childhood home. A few houses on each side of me have strange lots. Our lot is wide but not deep. One house south has just enough for the house garage and tiny back yard. The house south of that owns behind him and a strip that is about 20' wide and 100' long. The 3 houses to the north all have narrow but deep lots. When the house next to us on the north sold last year the realtor told them the small fenced in back yard was all the land they had but instead they had another 5-600' behind that yet. So sometimes realtors dont know what they are selling they just care about the money they make at the end


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

Thanks for the help everyone. We met this morning and everything seems pretty copacetic. He moved the dog fence and the play house is just off the line. He offered to help clearing out the underbrush. He's originally from downriver and just moved back from Minnesota. He's into ice fishing too so it could all work out ok.


----------



## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

Great ending.


----------



## brushbuster (Nov 9, 2009)

Glad it worked out for you.
Realtors are a joke. I had one post signs on 2 of my properties. I called the office and told them they posted my property and please remove your signs
2 weeks go by and people are walking my properties. I yank the signs. The signs show back up a week later. I yank em again. The realator calls me back all mad and says quit yanking the signs. I calmy say your selling my property. She says no your property has your house on it. I say correct but the properties you posted also belong to me. After 2 weeks of me yanking signs and her keep posting them we meet at the courthouse where I receive an apology.


----------



## Petronius (Oct 13, 2010)

brushbuster said:


> Glad it worked out for you.
> Realtors are a joke. I had one post signs on 2 of my properties. I called the office and told them they posted my property and please remove your signs
> 2 weeks go by and people are walking my properties. I yank the signs. The signs show back up a week later. I yank em again. The realator calls me back all mad and says quit yanking the signs. I calmy say your selling my property. She says no your property has your house on it. I say correct but the properties you posted also belong to me. After 2 weeks of me yanking signs and her keep posting them we meet at the courthouse where I receive an apology.


If she was posting the property for sale, did she also list it on the MLS?.


----------



## brushbuster (Nov 9, 2009)

petronius said:


> If she was posting the property for sale, did she also list it on the MLS?.


I couldn't say for sure. I never paid any attention. I just saw signs up on my land and I would remove them. She was certain she had the right properties. But the ones she was actually selling were 2 of my neighbors parcels. Each parcel belonged to a separate neighbor.Evidently she couldn't read the plat map.


----------



## Petronius (Oct 13, 2010)

brushbuster said:


> I couldn't say for sure. I never paid any attention. I just saw signs up on my land and I would remove them. She was certain she had the right properties. But the ones she was actually selling were 2 of my neighbors parcels. Each parcel belonged to a separate neighbor.Evidently she couldn't read the plat map.


She probably had the right properties listed, but was confused when putting up the signs.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

NittanyDoug said:


> Thanks for the help everyone. We met this morning and everything seems pretty copacetic. He moved the dog fence and the play house is just off the line. He offered to help clearing out the underbrush. He's originally from downriver and just moved back from Minnesota. He's into ice fishing too so it could all work out ok.


Glad that everything went well and you got this worked out. 

Get him a gift back of some Fiscous Jigs or something to show your appreciation.


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

FREEPOP said:


> Glad that everything went well and you got this worked out.
> 
> Get him a gift back of some Fiscous Jigs or something to show your appreciation.


You know, that is an excellent suggestion and I'll have to remember that once I get moved in and the purchase ban is lifted. (The wife imposed purchase ban that is...)


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

NittanyDoug said:


> You know, that is an excellent suggestion and I'll have to remember that once I get moved in and the purchase ban is lifted. (The wife imposed purchase ban that is...)


It's something I'd do to say thank you for being agreeable and putting up with me.


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

FREEPOP said:


> It's something I'd do to say thank you for being agreeable and putting up with me.


So I should get my wife a bunch of them?


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

NittanyDoug said:


> So I should get my wife a bunch of them?


Definitely......and some new boots too (providing you wear the same size)


----------



## POLARBEAR (May 13, 2002)

Some bad advice from Freepop. I'd go big. Like a new UTV. Swing for the fences.


----------



## FREEPOP (Apr 11, 2002)

POLARBEAR said:


> Some bad advice from Freepop. I'd go big. Like a new UTV. Swing for the fences.


I must concede. The boots could be a compromise, if the UTV fails.


----------



## NittanyDoug (May 30, 2006)

You guys are too much. Thanks for the advise!


----------



## d_rek (Nov 6, 2013)

Your legal survey is only disputable in a court of law now and not by a realtor. The realtor, unless instructed to contract a surveyor to perform a legal survey of the neighboring property and having intricate knowledge of the survey and property lines, doesn't know the legal property lines from timbuktu. 

You were right to be cordial with your neighbor. But you also have to be firm. Your property is your property, not someone elses play area. If you let them take advantage of it they will continue to do so. This is not an opinion this is a fact. It may be a simple misunderstanding, or it might be that he's a d**head. You won't know until you bring the hammer down. But it's best done sooner than later before things get ugly. 

Since you now have a legal survey and staked property lines the neighbor is now trespassing on your property anytime he crosses the property line without your permission. I'll remind you that trespassing is a punishable fine. If the neighbor wishes to continue to use a portion of your property for whatever, and you wish to allow him to do so, you would need to draft up a right-of-way agreement explicitly defining the boundaries of the area you wish to provide the neighbor access to, including any easements they may use to access the property. A right-of-way agreement is legally binding and once granted is hard to revoke. Unless you have provided the neighbor with this kind of agreement they have no legal argument to continue to trespass onto your property. 

I know that sounds dire, and you'd probably wish to be cordial, but your property is your property. The legal survey establishes this clearly and without bias. If your neighbor chooses to ignore legal fact then you have options. If it gets to that point i'd suggest consulting with a real estate attorney.


----------

