# ccw and bow hunting ?



## fatboy (May 8, 2002)

Was told today that ccw holders can carry while bowhunting.Is this true? Law change ?


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## Bob S (Mar 8, 2000)

No, not true.

Read this thread: LINK.



boehr said:


> As for example, if you are bow hunting during bow season and you are carrying a pistol even with a CCW, you are still going to get arrested.


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## duhunter (Jan 17, 2004)

I beg to differ from Boeher and say that because it does not state "activities" in the law, any former bans are void. "The SHALL not promulgate or enforce a rule that prohibits" is the key point in the bill. I say if I have a general CCW I can carry bowhunting as it is not prohibited in the CCW law. 
That being said the other interesting point in the law is that even if the DNR were to come up with a new rule/order concerning CCW and bowhunting or wanted to try and enforce the old rule/order it is now only a civil infraction. Which means NO arrest can be made, only a ticket issued.


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

Well, you do as you choose but you have been given the correct answer. Just remember a misdemeanor arrest in the last 3 years does away with your CCW too and I promise you, there will be an arrest if you are caught with a concealed pistol when you are bow hunting.


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## Eastern Yooper (Nov 12, 2000)

Why is this such a hot-topic issue?

Quite frankly, I don't know why a person would want to or otherwise feel the need to carry a pistol while bowhunting.

Whats the big deal, and how would we as hunters "benefit" if this law were changed?


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## mich buckmaster (Nov 20, 2001)

duhunter said:


> I beg to differ from Boeher and say that because it does not state "activities" in the law, any former bans are void. "The SHALL not promulgate or enforce a rule that prohibits" is the key point in the bill. I say if I have a general CCW I can carry bowhunting as it is not prohibited in the CCW law.
> That being said the other interesting point in the law is that even if the DNR were to come up with a new rule/order concerning CCW and bowhunting or wanted to try and enforce the old rule/order it is now only a civil infraction. Which means NO arrest can be made, only a ticket issued.


Just so you know Duhunter, Boehr is a CO for the Michigan DNR. I think he knows the laws little better than we do, and yes I do have a CCW permit. YOU CANNOT CARRY A HANDGUN WHILE BOWHUNTING IN BOW SEASON!!


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## duhunter (Jan 17, 2004)

Boehr: Please list the rule/order that it falls under and why it is able to vary from what the new law is stating? State Laws, rules and orders are amended all the time, misdemeanors go to civil infraction, felonies go to misdeameanors, etc. Things that used to be banned/prohibited acts no longer are, boy I'm thinking hunting mourning doves here for some reason. 

Please explain why this is any different?


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## SteeliePollock (Mar 14, 2004)

Archery Deer Seasons
During the archery deer seasons, it is illegal to carry afield a pistol, revolver or other firearm while bow hunting for deer. Exception: During special antlerless firearm deer seasons, a firearm deer hunter may carry afield a bow and arrow or firearm.

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10363_10919_11749-31578--,00.html

here is the link to the rule


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## deputy (Feb 2, 2002)

Boher is correct. as ccw instructor and leo you will be nailed period. it is a no no


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

You have a choice, you can go bow hunting legally and not carry your pistol or you can carry your pistol and not bow hunt. The law that passed allows people to carry concealed in place (locations) like state parks where the state parks prohibited firearms before. Like I stated in the other thread, the new law has to do with carrying a pistol in certain places and has nothing to do with carrying a pistol while participating in certain activities (bow hunting, turkey hunting etc.)


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## answerguy8 (Oct 15, 2001)

Eastern Yooper said:


> Why is this such a hot-topic issue?
> 
> Quite frankly, I don't know why a person would want to or otherwise feel the need to carry a pistol while bowhunting.
> 
> Whats the big deal, and how would we as hunters "benefit" if this law were changed?


My reason for wanting to be able to carry while bow hunting is that I have been threatened by trespassers while bow hunting. A bow is a lousy weapon to defend yourself with. That's one reason. Another would be that I don't think it's a good idea to leave a pistol in the car because of theft concerns.


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## fatboy (May 8, 2002)

"You have a choice, you can go bow hunting legally and not carry your pistol or you can carry your pistol and not bow hunt" 

Agreed and obeyed ! The question is what purpose does the law serve? Is this a question that could be fairly debated in this forum? Is the mindset that bowhunters will start shooting deer with there pistol? I really cannot understand the logic.


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## Swamp Monster (Jan 11, 2002)

I understand the law and would obey it (haven't bothered to get my license yet). One of my concerns is the proliferation of meth labs and the thugs that inhabit those labs.


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## duhunter (Jan 17, 2004)

Boehr: A misdemeanor arrest is not a disqualification for a CCW, the other portion of a conviction is needed. Also you are only partially correct regarding the 3 year part of your reply. In order for that to occur the misdemeanor has to fall in the list denoted in MCL 28.425b(7)(i), from (i) to (xxiv). That changed back in 2003. 
If your are saying that someone would lose their CCW permit for being arrested and convicted under WCO 3.101(5). 
I think you will find the definition of Misdemeanor in 28.425(17)(d) interesting as it states an order, rule or regulation of a State Agency and it is punishable by imprisonment or fine is NOT a misdemeanor, under that MCL.


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

Playing word games there duhunter, arrest and conviction? I think you new exactly what I was taking about. But yes I stand corrected, a misdemeanor conviction which if I arrest you for that charge, you will be convicted.

The penalty section for possission of a firearm while bow hunting.

_MCL 324.40118 (1) A person who violates this part, an order or interim order issued under this part, or a condition of a permit issued under this part, except for a violation specified in subsections (2) to (12), is guilty of a *misdemeanor* punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not less than $50.00 or more than $500.00, or both, and the costs of prosecution. In addition, a permit issued by the department under this part shall be revoked pursuant to the administrative procedures act of 1969, 1969 PA 306, MCL 24.201 to 24.328._

What we have is two individuals stating the opposite. Everyone can take the opinion of who they want to believe for themselves. I will testify in court as to what I tell people. I hope you will do the same.

Lt. Ray Boehringer
District 12 Law Supervisor.

Feel free to list your name so people know who to contact when they want you to testify.


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## Randy Kidd (Apr 21, 2001)

"latrine lawyers" gotta love em :lol:


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## duhunter (Jan 17, 2004)

No word games at all Boehr. Just because a person is arrested on a charge, does not mean a warrant is authorized under that charge or in the end convicted of it. 
In my first I said my opinion differed with yours. I never told anyone to follow that opionion, just opened what I thought was a debate. Instead of saying I don't agree because of trespassers, etc. I used what was already written down and thought it could be done that way, Like you saying read AGO 7123. 
Thanks for providing 324.40118(1). Which still says that it is a violation of an order, but attaches misdemeanor penalities to it, which is still not denoted in 28.425b. 
I see now by checking other threads and former questions raised about your answers, you don't like to debate. 
Sorry as I was under the impression that a forum worked that way, I see that this one doesn't.


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## mich buckmaster (Nov 20, 2001)

Duhunter, So what you are saying is that it is OK to be a VIOLATOR because you are just going to get a misdemeaner. That is RIDICULOUS!!!!!

Boehr, Close this BS!!!!!!!


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

Serves no purpose to debate what the law says. If you wish to debate, go to Sound Off. I see you continue to hide in anonymity though.


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

fatboy said:


> "You have a choice, you can go bow hunting legally and not carry your pistol or you can carry your pistol and not bow hunt"
> 
> Agreed and obeyed ! The question is what purpose does the law serve? Is this a question that could be fairly debated in this forum? Is the mindset that bowhunters will start shooting deer with there pistol? I really cannot understand the logic.


fatboy asked a legit question and I did want to answer this for him.

I can't tell you why the law came about because that law was written before my time, decades ago. I can tell you that every year, yes 'every' year, all over the state we do catch people with firearms while bow hunting.

If you were to check with some of the deer processors in your area providing they will talk with you they could tell you that they find bullets in deer that they cut up during bow season that were supposedly shot with a bow. Some of the processors in my District have a very good relationship with the local officer and provide that type of information to the officers. That is also why my officers do routine inspections of deer processors, looking for deer taken illegally, not just bullets but many different things. That is just from the dummies that take a deer that was poached to a processor.

The next thing is, why should it be ok for one person that has a carry permit to have a pistol while bow hunting and for a person who doesn't have a carry permit to wear the pistol exposed (wear it legally) while out bow hunting? Why don't we make it legal for a guy to take their shotgun while out bow hunting so it they see a grouse or squirrel they could shoot it with their shotgun? My main concern is, where does it stop?

Bow hunting is suppose to be a recreational activity. It has been done legally without a person having to carry a pistol for decades. Now all of a sudden, people come up with excuses like for protection from bears, trespassers, protection in general. These great hunters, that we lost so many prior to the change in the carry law, must have had one heck of a time before the change in the carry law.


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