# ATTN. Dog Shooters



## Andy Drumm (Dec 23, 2008)




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## Cpt.Chaos (May 28, 2006)

Costly, both in money and probation terms, for the idiot who shot the dog and money still can't replace a dog in my eyes.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

The article is a real eye opener. Michigan's local prosecutors and LEO's are just begining to learn about animal cruelty statutes our state law makers wrote into law, and have been on the books for awhile. Currently, a dog shooter can spend a maximum of 4 years in jail along with penaltiesapplied in the enclosed article.


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## wall-ib-jiggin (May 31, 2009)

Wrong on both sides in my opinion!! Hounds man should be fined also for not keeping there dog under control.. Trespassing is trespassing. No it is not right for a person to kill an animal for something the owner has done. They need stricter laws against hounds man for trespassing then maybe we wouldn't have this problem. I get tired of the excuse they cant control where dogs run or dogs don't know boundaries.. Maybe this person should have spent more time on obedience training than the dog would have listened. As far as I am concerned if the dog is running without owner near by and it is on my property than it is not under control. It should be treated as any stray dog. If hunter is near then it is tresspassing..Plain and simple..


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## micooner (Dec 20, 2003)

"It should be treated as any stray" which means what in your opinion??


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## Andy Drumm (Dec 23, 2008)

well Mr jiggin , most houndsmen want there dogs on property without permission no more than the land owners .. Obviously your ignorance to the way hunting with dogs goes is the reason you believe this .. Animals "DO NOT" trespass .. hunting dogs have a desire to pursue game .. whether it be birds or bears .. why dont you get the state to teach their game animals to stay off of your property ? lol .. j/k

Fact is "most " dog hunters do their best to avoid the confrontation of being on property they are not wanted on ... But dogs will do it .And yes there are those who have no respect for others, just as there is other hunters who dont use dogs .... Most will pay the respect to not pursue their dogs onto private property , If they get on it .. They will try and "call" their dogs out .Or "attempt to talk to the land owner ,and see if they can retrieve their dogs .. If the land owner refuses , then they wait .. If the land owner makes threats !! The DNR and State Police will be called .. We dont want our dogs shot and dont want land owners being pi$$ed , as it makes things difficult in the future .. 
there is nothing worse than having to talk to a pi$$ed land owner when all you want to do is hunt .. 
I live next to a large area of state land and have never had others dogs cause problems .. I even had some guys running a coyote around in my swamp last monday .. But they paid the respect not to go on my property and wait the dogs out .. (Not that i wouldve minded them taking the coyote out )..Hunting dogs pursue game !! period ..


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## solohunter (Jan 2, 2006)

All the hunting dogs I have had find me in the woods have been very friendly, I have shared a little water with them, checked the name on the collar / radio gear and shoed them away as I was ussualy bird or tree rat hunting. this was public land also.


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## lang49 (Aug 1, 2005)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> The article is a real eye opener. Michigan's local prosecutors and LEO's are just begining to learn about animal cruelty statutes our state law makers wrote into law, and have been on the books for awhile. Currently, a dog shooter can spend a maximum of 4 years in jail along with penaltiesapplied in the enclosed article.


I think these people need to examine the definition of the word cruelty. Why should shooting a dog automatically be classified as cruelty or torture?? I'm not suggesting the shooter is in the right. But, why is it cruelty or torture when a dog is shot but not cruel when a deer is shot?


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## Andy Drumm (Dec 23, 2008)

lang49 said:


> I think these people need to examine the definition of the word cruelty. Why should shooting a dog automatically be classified as cruelty or torture?? I'm not suggesting the shooter is in the right. But, why is it cruelty or torture when a dog is shot but not cruel when a deer is shot?


 So if I shoot your dog for $#iting in my yard its the same as shooting a woodchuck for digging under my barn foundation ??


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## Frantz (Dec 9, 2003)

Andy Drumm said:


> So if I shoot your dog for $#iting in my yard its the same as shooting a woodchuck for digging under my barn foundation ??


Yes.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Lang49, in response to your question...shooting a dog is not "automatically" classified as cruelty or torture. The action is the result of a court trial. 

As for...how is it not cruelty when shooting a deer...a deer is a big game animal. A domestic dog is someone's private property, and a dog is an easy target for a coward who does not have enough backbone to try taking out their frustration on the dog's owner.


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## Sam22 (Jan 22, 2003)

The answer finally!I have been following this.


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## Frantz (Dec 9, 2003)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> Lang49, in response to your question...shooting a dog is not "automatically" classified as cruelty or torture. The action is the result of a court trial.
> 
> As for...how is it not cruelty when shooting a deer...a deer is a big game animal. A domestic dog is someone's private property, and a dog is an easy target for a coward who does not have enough backbone to try taking out their frustration on the dog's owner.


What I learn every year.

1. All other animals are not as important as someones stray dog.

2. Dogs are private property.

3. A dog owners private property far outweighs the importance of a land owners private property.

4. Dog owners who allow their dogs well out of their control are superior, legally or morally, other private property owners should suck it up as their "private" property rights are meaningless in the scope of things.


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## Cpt.Chaos (May 28, 2006)

It is ILLEGAL to shoot stray dogs....period. The only time when it would be justified is in the case of a dog attacking you or another person.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Franz, have you suffered any damages from dogs that have come on to your property, or is it just a matter of you resenting a dog interrupting your privacy?


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## Frantz (Dec 9, 2003)

Both, and the people that follow the dogs. Rooster, I am really not directing my frustrations at anyone in general, but at everyone in general. The whole dog thing is always a one way street. It seems to always favor those who do not have control over their private property (dogs) vs those who do have control (land owners). You just never hear a dog owner bragging or salivating over how they offered the private land owners some cash for their troubles and for the abuse of their private property, but you hear them hooting and hollering about how valuable their private property (dogs) are and how you will pay if you harm or violate it.

And yes I am a dog person, I currently have 4, 2 purebreds and 2 mutts.


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## southtroll (Dec 5, 2008)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> Franz, have you suffered any damages from dogs that have come on to your property, or is it just a matter of you resenting a dog interrupting your privacy?



Question Rooster, would you mind if I let my steer go take a few *****s in your front yard next week, and then a couple more times in front of your treestand while you are hunting out of it? I know you wont mind all but I thought I would ask. Even more, if it works out well for the both of us I might consider to continue to let my steer and maybe a couple of my other cows over to your place every couple of days just to freshen up their piles.

You sound like a great neighbor and its my way of showing my appreciation.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Southtroll...that actually happened when about 25 head wandered onto my place from a neighbor's farm about 2 miles from here. Around here we're mostly all neighbors and do not buy into the territorial stuff quite as much as some in other areas of the state. Most likely you are in a more populated area and your tolerance has worn thin. I can actually understand your position and don't fault you for it.


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## Frantz (Dec 9, 2003)

Rooster Cogburn said:


> I can actually understand your position and don't fault you for it.


This in itself, says a lot more then most dog owners I have tried to get to better understand the other side of the fence. Thank you Rooster.


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## Rooster Cogburn (Nov 5, 2007)

Thanks Franz. I have experienced timber trespass, dirt bikes riding down the creek running through my place and a few other things over the years. Always tried to live and let live and not be too territorial, but we all have our limits.


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