# screw in bow/gear hangers



## turkey track (Sep 18, 2008)

I hunt mainly public land, and know that screw in steps are illegal. My question is in regards to screw in bow hangers. Tree stands that require one to screw into a tree are legal, so would bow hangers fall into the category of, not a step, so it's legal? I'm using a tree saddle this year, and there is no place to rest the bow. Any advise would be appreciated.


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## JWICKLUND (Feb 13, 2005)

Anything that penetrates the cambium layer of a tree on public land is illegal. It doesn't apply to just tree steps.


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## turkey track (Sep 18, 2008)

That's not totally correct, and this is where my question comes from. The guide states that stands with "a t-bolt or similar device" can be used. Also, it states that "it is illegal to use any item that penetrates through the bark of a tree in the construction or affixing of any device _to assist in climbing a tree_". Since the bow hanger is not used for climbing, shouldn't it be legal?


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## malainse (Sep 2, 2002)

Ok, he should have said -Anything other then a "T-bolt".... is illegal. 

Are other Laws/rules that are not part of the hunting guide (land use rules)that state can not damage trees on state land. They would apply to a screw in bow hanger or anything else. The tree stand "T-bolt" is the exception and that is why law was written to allow them. 

Remember that is just a guide and can not list every law/rule that might apply..


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

My first reaction was it is illegal too but then I looked at and read the law. I'm not so sure now. Here is the law;

_2.8(1) Permanently construct or affix to a tree or other natural feature a scaffold, platform, ladder, steps or any other device to assist in climbing a tree, or use any item that penetrates the cambium of a tree in the construction or affixing of any device to assist in climbing a tree._

Everything here has to do with climbing a tree. Although I believe that the intent might be that you can't, the law doesn't say that.

Unless there is another part of law that I am forgetting, I'm leaning towards legal.


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## malainse (Sep 2, 2002)

REGULATION OF LANDS ADMINISTERED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF NATURAL RESOURCES

299.922 Unlawful acts generally

h) To destroy, damage, or remove trees,.........
--------------
The law does not state how much damage, just to cause damage. Placing a hole in a tree is damage !


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## TrekJeff (Sep 7, 2007)

malainse said:


> REGULATION OF LANDS ADMINISTERED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF NATURAL RESOURCES
> 
> 299.922 Unlawful acts generally
> 
> ...



Based on that, trimming branches for shooting lanes would also be against the law. Using a climbing tree stand also damages the tree bark. How far do you want to go with it. With Boehr's experience I'd lean on his advice.


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## bigcountrysg (Oct 9, 2006)

2.8(1) Permanently construct or affix to a tree or other natural feature a scaffold, platform, ladder, steps or any other device to assist in climbing a tree, or use any item that penetrates the cambium of a tree in the construction or affixing of any device to assist in climbing a tree.


What I highlighted in red is the key phrase. A slef climbing tree stand does not penetrate the cambium. The cambium layer is located between the outside bark and the wood of the tree. It is like the arteries and viens in our body. The cambium is what transports the nutriants from the roots up the tree. 

So to answer the question correctly according to the law. As long as you do not penetrate the cambium layer you are legal. 

Does a self climber do this? No it does how ever mar up the outside bark. But it does not damage the cambium layer. 

The DNR looks at damage to the tree by cutting into the cambium layer. Not by putting marks on the tree from a self climber.


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## TrekJeff (Sep 7, 2007)

I agree with ya sarge, I was just exaggerating the definition of "damage" in 299.922 Unlawful acts generally

h) To destroy, damage, or remove trees,......


The interpretation of the law can always be subject to discretion. Some thing are just not as black and white as some people may like.


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## DANIEL MARK ZAPOLSKI (Sep 23, 2002)

turkey track said:


> I hunt mainly public land, and know that screw in steps are illegal. My question is in regards to screw in bow hangers. Tree stands that require one to screw into a tree are legal, so would bow hangers fall into the category of, not a step, so it's legal? I'm using a tree saddle this year, and there is no place to rest the bow. Any advise would be appreciated.


if your treestand requires you to use a screw in device and you use it --YOU'RE-BUSTED in michigan. try to make up a t-bar and strap it to the tree like 95% of other treestands.


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## TrekJeff (Sep 7, 2007)

Dan, He is asking about a bow holder, not a tree stand.
Something like this while he is using a tree saddle.


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## DANIEL MARK ZAPOLSKI (Sep 23, 2002)

TrekJeff said:


> Dan, He is asking about a bow holder, not a tree stand.
> Something like this while he is using a tree saddle.


i didn't missunderstand his question at all about the bow hanger. if you re-read his post he states that a screw in device for certain treestands are legal THEY ARE****NOT****LEGAL****. as the law clearly and decisively states anything that penetrates the cambium layer of the tree is strickly forbidden and ILLEGAL. AT THE CLUB I BELONG TO WE ALSO IMPLORE THIS LAW and i bust all kinds of idiots every year that are in violation. i just busted the son of a board of director of the club for using tree steps in an oak tree (15 of them). this law is a good one and a very simple one at that.


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## TrekJeff (Sep 7, 2007)

Dan, you are incorrect regarding the "T" screw, below comes straight form page 27 of the current hunting guide...

Raised Platforms and Tree Stands
The following persons may hunt from a raised platform or tree stand:
&#56256;&#56442; All bow and crossbow hunters.
&#56256;&#56442; Bear and deer hunters when using a fi rearm.
&#56256;&#56442; Fox and coyote hunters from one-half hour before sunrise to
one-half hour after sunset.
All other fi rearm hunters are prohibited from using a raised
platform or tree stand. A raised platform means a horizontal surface
constructed or manufactured by a person that increases the fi eld of
vision of a person using the horizontal surface beyond the fi eld of
vision that normally would be attained by that person standing on
the ground.
If you hunt on public land, your tree stand must be portable and
your name and address must be affi xed in legible English that can be
easily read from the ground. Hunting platforms cannot be affi xed or
attached to any tree by nails, screws or bolts; however, a &#8220;T&#8221; bolt or
similar device supplied by a tree stand manufacturer can be used.


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## DANIEL MARK ZAPOLSKI (Sep 23, 2002)

TrekJeff said:


> Dan, you are incorrect regarding the "T" screw, below comes straight form page 27 of the current hunting guide...
> 
> 
> If you hunt on public land, your tree stand must be portable and
> ...


try re-reading your own post please a "t" bolt is not a "t" screw--t bolts don't screw into the tree they are ATTACHED TO THE TREE usually with ropes or straps. i only have 5 of them, i think i remember how they attach to the tree and the stand:lol:
Anything that penetrates the cambium layer of a tree on public land is illegal.:Modified_ It doesn't apply to just tree steps
you can tell it to the judge right after the MDNR C.O. writes you or anyone else for that matter of violating this law.
as with must of these threads everyone interperts the law their own way and then the judge tells you his way, which usually ends up with big buck fines and a few wammies thrown at you, loss of hunting priveledges comes to mind.


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## malainse (Sep 2, 2002)

TrekJeff said:


> Based on that, trimming branches for shooting lanes would also be against the law. With Boehr's experience I'd lean on his advice.



IT IS and always has been....... and I AM following his advise.....

6 months ago Boehr said it was illegal to tap a tree for syrup. That involves drilling a small hole 2 " deep into the tree. Screwing a bow holder into a tree, involves a small 2" deep hole...  

"would seem pretty obvious to me that if a law that states: Sec. 2.8. (1) Permanently construct or affix to a tree or other natural feature a scaffold, platform, ladder, steps or any other device to assist in climbing a tree, or use any item that penetrates the cambium of a tree in the construction or affixing of any device to assist in climbing a tree.; is illegal then I also believe that a normal person would have to believe that drilling a hole to tap a tree will also cause damage."




In that same thread a DNR forest tech said it was illegal because: 

"Follow this link to the land use rules. It is considered damaging the tree.

http://www.state.mi.us/orr/emi/admin...Dpt=NR&RngHigh=


R 299.922 Unlawful acts generally.
Rule 22 part (h)"

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=274115&highlight=damage

Daniel: The DNR is using a T-bolt and T-screw as the same thing and it is the only thing that is allowed per that rule...


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## turkey track (Sep 18, 2008)

I appreciate all the input on the subject. As you can see, there are different ways to interpret this rule. I e-mailed this same question to the DNR today, and should get a response within 10 days. I will post the results when I receive them.


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## TrekJeff (Sep 7, 2007)

Mal, I see your point, that makes the picture clearer. 

Dan...reel your self in a bit, BUT thanks for doing your part to improve the financial situation the DNR faces today...lol

To the OP, I have seen bow hangers that actually strap onto the tree and have a base with small teeth that lock into the surface of the bark. You may want to go with something like that and avoid the whole issue of screwing something into the tree all together.


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## swampbuck (Dec 23, 2004)

TrekJeff said:


> Based on that, trimming branches for shooting lanes would also be against the law. Using a climbing tree stand also damages the tree bark. How far do you want to go with it. With Boehr's experience I'd lean on his advice.


 Trimming a shooting lane is illegal. I personally watched a hunting buddy recieve a ticket for that......cost about $500 total.


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## TrekJeff (Sep 7, 2007)

Swamp,
Good thing I mainly stick to private property...lol Although I see the main purpose. Taking a walk through the woods to see branches broken, saplings bent over would look like hell. Even on our property, when lanes get cut they are done with pruners and if something is removed, it's done as close to the ground as possible.


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## JWICKLUND (Feb 13, 2005)

The thread will be closed until TrekJeff gets his response back from the DNR. As you can all see, several interpretations can be made here. We all know what would happen if I left this open for discussion.


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