# First Timer (Trolling)



## BRAD10281 (May 2, 2006)

I'm going to try trolling for Salmon in Lake Michigan next spring/summer. I've never trolled before. Since I got a bunch of Cabela's gift cards for X-Mas I thought I'd go buy some gear. So far the only thing I picked up is a DepthMaster trolling combo. It's a 9' DepthMaster rod and DepthMaster II reel. I was only planning on using a dipsy diver followed by a lure. I realized after I got home that the rod says "Planer Board" on it so it is not the "Dipsy Diver" version. Does this make a difference and if so what is the difference? Should I return it? I'm not sure what I'm looking for in a Dipsy Diver so any info on this would help. Any general trolling info would be greatly appreciated also.

Thanks,
Brad


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## salmon_slayer06 (Mar 19, 2006)

To get in on the action, I think all you would need to start with for now would be 2 dipsy diver setups. I would not go too inexpensive on the dipsy equipment because I think these get the most abuse. Return that combo and use the money to buy 2 Okuma Convector line counter reels...........

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat20166-cat600378&id=0030238119719a&navCount=3&podId=0030238&parentId=cat600378&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=IG&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat600378&hasJS=true

I think alot of guys like useing the 30's but I prefer the biggest one. Now, you have a decent reel for the combo. 

Next is the rods. I would run 30 pound fireline on these dipsys. If you want to use wire, you would need to buy a rod that is made for wire line. A good rod for the money for braided line is the Daiwa hearlands rods. Buy the 10 footers. The longer ones have just enough backbone to use magnum dipsy divers. The okuma reel and daiwa rod is a pretty common set up on the bigwater. Its affordable, and it lasts. I see that Cabelas doesn't carry them. I would go into Cabelas and talk to the guys in the fishing department. They know there stuff and will give you the best deal possible. The Cabelas gold seried trolling reels are made by okuma and are good reels for the money too. They might direct you to go that route. 

One thing I can't stress enough is spend the extra money and buy a GOOD rod holder. Plastic is junk amen I said it! Get this and save yourself headaches and yelling.

http://www.bigjon.com/store/list.asp?SubTypeID=2&ProductID=54

You can pull a boat from one of those things, super glue the red rubber ring to the holder or you won't have one after the first fish.

Get two twili tips for the rod tips. Have Cabelas do it for you. Get these, they work good for fireline and wire and save the line and saves replacing the eye tip. When you spool the reels up, spool on some 30 pound mono first and then tie the fireline to that. This will keep the fireline from spinning around on the spool when you have a big fish on. So 30 pound fireline, 30 pound big game. Daiwa 10 foot rods, convector reels.

For the dipsys, I would get either all black ones, or all clear ones. The color ones are the last resort. Theres reasons why its hard to find the black ones and clear ones. Everybody has them. Buy 4 standard size dipsys, and 4 magnum dipsys. Buy 8 dipsy shock absorber cords in clear, not the lure jensen colored ones. Buy 2 spools of 30 pound flourcarbon leader material for making up your rigs, and 1 spool of 50 pound for retying flies and squids. Use 50 not the 30. You'll know why after the first 20 pounder is landed.

Also, buy the precision trolling big water edition trolling guide. It will show you what depths the dipsys will go down at certain speeds, line size, amount of line out, and ring choice. Its a must. When you fill the reels, fill them all the way. Better yet, when you fill them, before you cut the line reel the line in close to the reel. Reset the line counter and pull out 10 feet of line by going by the line counter. Take a tape measure and measure that amount. If it reads more than 10 feet, take more line off the reel so it reads 10 feet. If less, add more line. Make sense? Its important when targeting certain depths and going back to that depth everytime. 

This is a good start for salmon gear. It will work great, and if you know what you are doing this is all you need for Lake MI. By the time you buy this stuff, you will have spent way more than what you wanted. Hell, the fireline will cost as much as the rods together. The flourocarbon will cost you probably 60 bucks. The dipsys will cost you almost 200 bucks. 

rods.....60
reels......140
fireline.....50?
flouro.....60
dipsys.....160
book....20
mono.....8
rod holders......160?

Hopefully this was a help. -Jason


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## duckhunter382 (Feb 13, 2005)

last year I bought the depth master combos after having all my rods stolen. I didnt get out much but when I did the Cabelas rods worked really well and the reels were good quality. The best way to get started is to get good rod holders and then run dipseys. off dipseys I have had more success off the flasher fly combo than anything else. I suggest the pearl/white fishcatcher(hootchie) with a blue or green fly although color is more of a spur of the moment thing. I recomend a marine radio more than anything because that is where you get the best tips also weather info is nice. just remember you dont have to go broke to have a little fun and catch some fish.


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## STEINFISHSKI (Jan 30, 2001)

Here is a good link to read up on divers and use.

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=92565&highlight=diver


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## TimT (Feb 16, 2000)

You have to start with holders. Don't buy anything plastic. Start with putting a track on your gunnel and 2 holders for each track. Do some searching in the forums. There's lots of good info related to track installation.


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## GrtWhtHntr (Dec 2, 2003)

For rod holders, go with the Bert's ratcheting holders. They are the only way to go for running dipsies (and about anything else for that matter). A good start would be to get 2 downriggers and 2 dipsy set ups. Lead core is very effective, but if you're just learning, it can be a pain. Aside from that, your best bet is to either go out on a charter (expensive) or hook up with someone from this site to take you out and show you what they use and how it's used. You'll learn more in one day on the water with someone who knows what they're doing than you'll learn in a year trying to learn on your own.


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## trappintees (Jul 12, 2005)

Are there any books you guys recommend for setting up for trolling? Something with good illustrations?
Thanks


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## salmon_slayer06 (Mar 19, 2006)

Keating on Kings. .


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## BRAD10281 (May 2, 2006)

So you're saying this guy won't hold up: http://www.scotty.com/marine/products/product/rodholders/rodMII_images/351.jpg

I have two of these mounted on the boat right now but wasn't ever planning to go trolling for salmon when I purchased them. I need to do this on the cheap and trust me, I know "you get what you pay for". The salmon fishing is going to be a one or two time occurance per year so you can see why I'm hesitant to spend a bunch of money. I wanted to buy two rods/reels but money didn't permit at this time.

What are the chances of these rod holders holding up? Maybe I should tether the rod/reel to the boat also to minimize chances of losing it in the case that the rod holder snaps.

The fact that I will be trying this in an 18' bow rider may prove a bit difficult. I've had the boat on L. Erie and L. Michigan before but never trolling. When I attempt to go trolling it may be the first and last time depending how the experience goes. I'll be out with my father-in-law and a couple other boats.

I just want to get the basics at first to see if its something I'll be doing more often or not.


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## salmon_slayer06 (Mar 19, 2006)

Put it this way....even a salty rod holder won't even work. And guys who use them..... you must have not been in the lake yet trolling with 7 foot waves useing magnum dipsys going almost 3 mph. I wittnessed myself on my buddies sportcraft almost 4 rod losses in a row. The saltys ripped off the side od the boat on one, and got hung up in the downrigger....I saved that one. Another time it opened up just out of the blue and twice, I saved those too. After the first one ripped off the side of the boat we tried to tork down the clamps with pliers and snapped off the wings on the clamp. We placed the rod back in it, and ripped off one more time and we threw it in the drink. The rest of the trip we took turns holding the rod. Well, tried to anyways. What a hellacious day that was. 

You are better off doing this....

Get a 3"x3" peice of 1/2 inch aluminum stock. Weld to it 90 degrees a peice of 1 1/2 inch diameter steel tubing 1 foot long. Bolt that in place of the scottys and you can save a bunch of money. Easy as that. It only needs to be in one spot parralel with the surface of the water and straight out from the side of the boat. Its stronger than any rod holder out there and cheapest.


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## DangerDan (Mar 10, 2005)

Tethering your rod to the boat would be a good idea if your using that rod holder on a 9'r. It's a matter of time but it's gonna break if you troll fast enough to be effective with a dipsy.

I've only been fishing Lake Michigan for about 4 years now. I remember the first time I took my boat out to "troll for salmon". Prior to that I had only fished flats and the gulf. I only had a couple 6' Penn boat rods for saltwater fishing. The rod started hammering away and letting out line. I thought to myself, must be dragging the bottom. Started realing in the rod and wow.. fish on! So thats what it feels like..... That was about $9,000 ago..:lol:


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## live2fishdjs (Sep 9, 2003)

I have fished on boats with Scotty's and they will hold up if your not fishing every weekend and just want to get a feel for whether or not you'll even enjoy it. Take some of the answers you are getting with a grain of salt-JMO.


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## TimT (Feb 16, 2000)

It only took one combo in the drink for me to give up on plastic.

You have a plastic post that you're putting a lot of pressure on. The pull of a dipsy and then the slam of a fish will break those posts off of the boat, leaving you with 4 screws and pieces of plastic. I don't think there's a question of "if" but "when". 

Subscribe to Great Lakes Angler.

Purchase one of the books by Dan Keating.


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## TimT (Feb 16, 2000)

What kind of fishing have you done from your boat? Is that the one in your avatar?

A couple of 12" tracks with step pads will be nice. If you don't want to fish anymore, you can just leave the step pads in. If you're tight on money, keep an eye open for the classifieds and buy some used. Some of the tracks and holders are interchangable by brand. You're going to put holes in the boat to mount stuff, it might as well be worth while if you have a dual-use boat. (fishing and family)


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## BRAD10281 (May 2, 2006)

Tim, Yes thats my boat. I mostly fish the small lakes of Jackson/Washtenaw county. Took it out on Erie once last year to do some Walleye fishing (drifting). Its a dual purpose boat, family fun and fishing for me. I'm not crazy about drilling a bunch of holes in the gunwale but I guess I'll do what I have too. The last thing I want to happen is for the rod holder to get ripped out of the gunwale and leave me with a torn up boat.


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## paulywood (Sep 2, 2005)

Brad,
I was in the same situation last year. I have a 20' bowrider and wanted to see if I would use it enough before purchasing a boat strictly for salmon fishing. Here are a few things that I learned about salmon fishing in general and off a bowrider specifically.

1. Leave your bow cover on. It stops a lot of water from getting in the boat.

2. It is real hard to get anything mounted on your boat. They just aren't designed for it. I put 2 of the flush mount rod holders on my boat but only trust them for leadcore. I wouldn't putdipsey rods in them, they just pull to hard.

3. Plastic rod holders will break when pulling dipsey's. This happened on my friends boat when we were fishing the Dreamweaver tourney. Good thing we tied it off (like you mentioned). But it is a pain to fight fish and reset lines with it tied off. My friend invested in some used aluminum holders this winter.

4. You can fish from a bowrider. It isn't ideal but it can be done. I didn't want to drill a bunch of holes in my boat, either. What I did was remove the cleats in the rear of the boat. Then I had 2 aluminum brackets made that used the cleat holes and had a thick aluminum plate underneath to distribute the weight. I put a 2'x10' board between the brackets. I mounted riggers and rod holders to the board. This actually works quite well. At least until I get a new boat! A guy I work with also fishes out of a bowrider. He mounts his board to his swim platform. There are 2 large aluminum blocks on each side of the platform. Underneath he put 2'x12' plamks to spread out the weight. He has a platform that bolts to the tops of the aluminum blocks on each side. This has his riggers and rod holders. He used to use plastic Cabela's rod holders to run dipsey's. They were the kind that you could change the angle. They stripped out and he always had to tie them so they would stay straight. He lost a dipsey combo when one turned on him. After that he bought Bert's ratcheting holders to hold his dipsey combos. 

Here is 1 idea that might work for you. Look on the site (or ebay, wherever) for a pair of used Tite-Lok adjustable rod holders (metal). They do not require tracks to be installed. Remove your cleats on the back of the boat. Mount the rod holders to a piece of aluminum. Put bolts through the aluminum and through the holes for your cleats. Put a piece of aluminum or wood underneath to distribute the weight. Then you would have 2 rod holders that are strong enough to pull dipsey's without spending a lot of money or drilling holes in your boat. Or you could figure out a way to clamp a board or holders to your cleats but I'm not sure how you would do that. 

Sorry fo rthe long response. If you want to see how I rigged my boat feel free to contact me. I could always use an extra man.
Nick


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## Bruce William (Feb 11, 2004)

BRAD10281 said:


> So you're saying this guy won't hold up: http://www.scotty.com/marine/products/product/rodholders/rodMII_images/351.jpg
> 
> I have two of these mounted on the boat right now but wasn't ever planning to go trolling for salmon when I purchased them. I need to do this on the cheap and trust me, I know "you get what you pay for". The salmon fishing is going to be a one or two time occurance per year so you can see why I'm hesitant to spend a bunch of money. I wanted to buy two rods/reels but money didn't permit at this time.
> 
> ...



I had a couple of hand rails mounted on the side of my boat at the back then made a running board that I put on with U bolts then put the downriggers and rod holders via Berts custom system. It has worked for me on two boats since 1989 and I use it to troll dipseys on Lake Erie.


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## CaptChaos (Dec 31, 2005)

Brad,
You can use the lighter plastic rod holders if you only fish occassionally and if you don't put too much strain on the holder. You should stay clear of mag dipseys with these holders. Try a regular size and superbraid without the dipsey ring to acheive max depth with lowest pull on your rod holder. 
The rods you have will work, but I have two used reels and rods for dipseys that I will sell you for the cost of the rods. $30 each. They are 10'6" Rapala Rods and Okuma Magda reels. If the reels don't hod up for at least a season(but they will), I'll replace em for you. 

Then take the board rods you have, put on a half core setup on one and a full core on the other. and get a couple flatline rods and you'll be set up for fishing shy of a couple riggers. But good enough to get a yourself some fish. 

I would tell you to take a charter to learn the ropes(me of course:evil:,I am a supastaaa), but if money is an issue, tag along as a rider in one of the tournaments with one these yahoos and you'll pick up enough knowledge to be dangerous.

Good Luck! And catch a bunch!


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## Jason Adam (Jun 27, 2001)

This is the best advise I can give you. Don't buy anything right now. Wait until spring. Get out with a few different guys on a few different boats and get a feel for what your actually gonna be doing out there. Have somebody that knows setup come look at your rig, then go from there. In the mean time, shoudl you find great deals on equipment(i.e. good rod holders, rods, etc..) you can pick them up. I go out with a few people every year just to help them setup their rigs.

I am a huge fan of the track systems, especially on a multi-purpose boat. Add machined aluminum tube style rod holders, and some swivel mounts for riggers, and your good. I say put the longest sections of track on each gunnel that you can and mount them solid. From there, you're ready to rock.

Rod's and reels are like Fords and Chevys. Everybody agrees to disagree. I say your fine going with a cheap rod. $30 Shimano TDR's or Diawa Heartland for riggers and dipsey rods. I have some old $18 yellow "Pro Angler" rods that have caught 1000's of fish and are all still rockin. For reels though, buy quality. A cheap reel will begin to get worse with every fish, and will cause you to lose fish, and eventually replace it with a quality reel you should have bought in the first place.

My other suggestion is to check out a salmon fishing club in your area. You'll get some valuable input from people who do it all the time, and it will get you out there and reduce your learning curve substantially.


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## BRAD10281 (May 2, 2006)

Looks like a custom setup may be my best bet. The following picture is of my boat and 4 possible (existing) holes that I could utilize to mount a track to. Any thoughts/ideas? Would these hold up to the riggors of trolling? Since these seem to be attached with just bolts/washers/nuts I may make a metal plate to fasten to the bottom side. My main concern is to not tear up my boat while trolling...and to spend as little money as possible.


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