# CO search request



## flinch (Aug 10, 2003)

Does a CO have any legal right to search my boat or look in my cooler. I know that I need to produce a fishing license if he did in fact see me fishing, but outside of that can I decline any request to search my person or property. I certainly would decline any requests to search anything during a traffic stop, so are stops with COs any different?


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## tdejong302 (Nov 28, 2004)

Great question. I can hardly wait for Boehr to respond.


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

boehr said:


> For the sake of arguement, I have no idea what the laws state in Minnesota but the law in Michigan states:
> 
> 324.1602 Department or officer; prosecution; search without warrant; private property; definition; common carrier not liable; issuance of warrant; seizures; probable cause.
> Sec. 1602.
> ...


For now.


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## flinch (Aug 10, 2003)

Geez people I have nothing to hide. I am just trying to get an answer to the question. Hopefully malainse with delete everything but the answer. Per what boehr responded with, it appears that I have the same right to refuse a search request whether I am in a boat or in my car. Basically I don't have to consent to a search unless the officer believes a crime is committed, in which case he can search anyway.

I was once stopped on two track by a CO and he rifled through my car without my consent looking for a gun, he claimed. I had a bow in the car and he just didn't believe I didn't have a shotgun as well. It wouldn't have mattered anyway since small game season was open. Next time I am simply going to tell him that I don't consent to searches of my person or property.

For those of you that think I am just trying to cause trouble, nothing could be further from the truth. I am just trying to understand how the basic right against unecessary search applies to these situations. Some of you appear to have no problem giving up your rights so that you can "be on your way faster". What if you consent to a search and you miscounted the number of bluegills you have? You would feel kinda silly at that point.

And for the record, if I haven't caught any fish and the CO is being friendly, I probably would open my livewell and let him look. But if he is all business then so am I.


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## bigcountrysg (Oct 9, 2006)

Can you refuse a search. Yes you can. A boat is treated like an automobile. In which you are referring to a Terry Stop or Terry Search. Which is when you are stopped and questioned about your activity. How ever the investigation should stay on track of the intial reason for stopping you. No warrant is needed to conduct a Terry Search. How ever probable cause should have been established. How ever it doesn't take much for some one to come up with probable cause. 

If you are not doing anything wrong and you know you have nothing illegal in your possession. Then aggree to the search. For one thing it will get you back on your way quicker.


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## malainse (Sep 2, 2002)

bigcountrysg said:


> If you are not doing anything wrong and you know you have nothing illegal in your possession. Then aggree to the search. For one thing it will get you back on your way quicker.



I agree..... But, people do have rights and some like to invoke them more the others..




flinch said:


> Hopefully malainse with delete everything but the answer.


Done...



flinch said:


> Per what boehr responded with, it appears that I have the same right to refuse a search request whether I am in a boat or in my car. Basically I don't have to consent to a search unless the officer believes a crime is committed, in which case he can search anyway.


Correct....It was a reply that Boehr gave a few years ago but same applies.
Link to that thread..
http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?p=190398#post190398


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## flinch (Aug 10, 2003)

You missed the close but thank you anyway. I would like to add that a CO approaches you for the sole reason of conducting an investigation. It is in your best interest to shut up since you are being investigated, but what you do is your business. And yes I have been spending too much time on gun rights forums but the basic knowledge extends to any police interaction.


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## Big Frank 25 (Feb 21, 2002)

While we're at it.

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/f...ad.php?p=2453554&highlight=search#post2453554


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## jward (Feb 16, 2009)

I am going add just for info purposes that that entrance upon some federal property ( like some military bases i.e Ft Custer ) is an implied consent to search . I was an MP for years and our abilty to stop and search any vehicle on base came as a shock to many civilians . Even bases that do not have guardhouses or stop people upon entrance may stop and search without cause . Just a heads up to those that may hunt in those areas . 



Jward


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## Drisc13 (May 6, 2009)

jward said:


> I am going add just for info purposes that that entrance upon some federal property ( like some military bases i.e Ft Custer ) is an implied consent to search . I was an MP for years and our abilty to stop and search any vehicle on base came as a shock to many civilians . Even bases that do not have guardhouses or stop people upon entrance may stop and search without cause . Just a heads up to those that may hunt in those areas .
> 
> 
> 
> Jward


 
Thanks Jward! Good to know. I hunt a military base in Wisconsin and though I never have anything to hide, I'll be much more acceptable if I do get searched.


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## jlcrss (May 17, 2006)

Maybe I misread this but it appeared to me by what I read they have the power to search vehicle, boat, or recepticle without a warrant or consent. The only exclusion is a private dwelling. That case they need a search warrant.


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## flinch (Aug 10, 2003)

jlcrss said:


> Maybe I misread this but it appeared to me by what I read they have the power to search vehicle, boat, or recepticle without a warrant or consent. The only exclusion is a private dwelling. That case they need a search warrant.


I believe you misread it.


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## bigcountrysg (Oct 9, 2006)

jlcrss said:


> Maybe I misread this but it appeared to me by what I read they have the power to search vehicle, boat, or recepticle without a warrant or consent. The only exclusion is a private dwelling. That case they need a search warrant.


 
They need to have probable cause to conduct a search. I don't care what type of Law Enforcement Officer they are. You are still protected by your Constitutional Rights.


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## bigcountrysg (Oct 9, 2006)

jward said:


> I am going add just for info purposes that that entrance upon some federal property ( like some military bases i.e Ft Custer ) is an implied consent to search . I was an MP for years and our abilty to stop and search any vehicle on base came as a shock to many civilians . Even bases that do not have guardhouses or stop people upon entrance may stop and search without cause . Just a heads up to those that may hunt in those areas .
> 
> 
> 
> Jward


But this is posted at the enterance of the installation.


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## jlcrss (May 17, 2006)

bigcountrysg said:


> They need to have probable cause to conduct a search. I don't care what type of Law Enforcement Officer they are. You are still protected by your Constitutional Rights.


Yeah thats what I said its still a warrantless search. He asked if they could still search if he didn't give consent and the answer is yes if they have probable cause.


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

Correct, probable cause is needed and the motor vehicle exception would apply to a boat too. I believe anyone could find probable cause for a cooler/live well or other places in a boat where there is fishing equipment and such is found. Where else are you going to keep the fish? Keep in mind I am talking about search/checking your catch, not about trying to find marijuana or something on your boat.


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## flinch (Aug 10, 2003)

boehr said:


> Correct, probable cause is needed and the motor vehicle exception would apply to a boat too. I believe anyone could find probable cause for a cooler/live well or other places in a boat where there is fishing equipment and such is found. Where else are you going to keep the fish? Keep in mind I am talking about search/checking your catch, not about trying to find marijuana or something on your boat.


Having fishing equipment on a boat is probable cause that a crime has been committed?


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## boehr (Jan 31, 2000)

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(bh....aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-324-48711

324.48711 Possession of fishing devices; prohibition; confiscation; exceptions; evidence; certain controls not affected. 

Sec. 48711.

A person shall not have in his or her possession any net, set lines, jack or other artificial light of any kind, dynamite, giant powder, or other explosive substance or combination of substances, hook and line, or any other contrivance or device to be used for the purpose of taking fish in violation of this part or any other act or part. Any such property, contrivance, or device found in the possession of a person or found in a boat, boathouse, or any other place on any of the waters of this state or along the shores of the waters of this state shall be confiscated and disposed of in the manner provided by law. A person shall not have a gaff in his or her possession on or along any trout stream in this state or use, except from June 1 to Labor Day, on any trout stream a single hook of any kind that is more than 3/8 inches between the point of the hook and the shank. This section does not prohibit the use or possession of minnow seines, minnow traps, or dip nets as provided in section 48730 or the use and possession of seines, nets, spears, or artificial lights for the use of which a lawful permit or license has been issued by the department. A person may have in his or her possession an artificial light of any kind for taking white bass. Commercial anglers who have licenses to take fish in the Great Lakes may have in their possession nets or hook lines for that purpose only. In prosecutions for the violations of this section, and in proceedings for the confiscation of the property described in this section, *the possession of any such property, contrivance, or device or, when not found in possession of any person, the presence of any such property in a boat, boathouse, or any other place on the waters of this state or along the shores of the waters of this state is prima facie evidence that the property is owned, possessed, or used for the purpose of violating this part.* The possession of any such property, contrivance, or device on the waters of this state that are closed to all fishing during the closed season on or along those waters is prima facie evidence that the property is owned, possessed, or used for the purpose of violating this part. This act or any other act does not apply to the department in its program in fisheries management or in the control of aquatic vegetation by individuals under permit issued by the department when, in the opinion of the department, that control is not inimical to the public interest.


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