# Long Range Shooting



## shanny28757 (Feb 11, 2006)

Went to the range yesterday and did some shooting past the 100 yd. marker for my first time. Shot at 200 and 300 which was fun. I was able to hold pretty tight groups for the longer distances but was shocked to see how much bullet drop I have. I shoot a browning A-bolt in .270 and was using Federal 150 grain bullets. 1 inch high at 100, 6 inches low at 200, and 18 inches low at 300. Anyone else shooting .270 have similar balistics?

Also, what is a flat shooting but powerful cartridge which can be used for big game at long distances? Not shopping yet just doing some initial background work.


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## skipper34 (Oct 13, 2005)

shanny28757 said:


> Went to the range yesterday and did some shooting past the 100 yd. marker for my first time. Shot at 200 and 300 which was fun. I was able to hold pretty tight groups for the longer distances but was shocked to see how much bullet drop I have. I shoot a browning A-bolt in .270 and was using Federal 150 grain bullets. 1 inch high at 100, 6 inches low at 200, and 18 inches low at 300. Anyone else shooting .270 have similar balistics?
> 
> Also, what is a flat shooting but powerful cartridge which can be used for big game at long distances? Not shopping yet just doing some initial background work.


 
Actually, 18 inches low at 300 is pretty flat for a cartidge of that size. A lighter bullet will be flatter but it won't carry as much energy downrange as the 150 grain. A 25-06 is pretty flat shooting at that range. Take a look at a ballistics and trajectory table. They are pretty accurate with factory loads.


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## Nick Adams (Mar 10, 2005)

My experience with a 130 (sierra SBT) @ 3,050FPS is more along the lines of:
1.5" high at 100 yards
On at 200 yards
~6.5 inches low at 300 yards

-na


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## Swamp Monster (Jan 11, 2002)

To take advantage of the .270, you really need to sight the gun in properly for long range. My .270 gets dialed in between 2.5" to 3" high at 100 yards if I'm taking shots 200 yards and farther. Try that at the range and, while it won't change how much drop the cartridge has, it will change the poi at those distances. With a sight in of 2.5" high at 100 with 150 grain Nosler partition handloads, I'm good to go from 5 yards to 300+ without any holdover. The .270 is already one of the finest long range cartridges in existance. Experiment with some loads and some different POI at 100 yards and you'll be highly impressed with the capability of your .270.

I also use old school round nose 150 grain Core Lokts in my .270 and while they are not a long range bullet by any stretch of the imagination, they are hell on deer at moderate ranges!!


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## jmoser (Sep 11, 2002)

Once you get the trajectory figured out shoot at 300 on a windy day and see what the real challenge in long range is all about!


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## Swamp Monster (Jan 11, 2002)

jmoser said:


> Once you get the trajectory figured out shoot at 300 on a windy day and see what the real challenge in long range is all about!


Now, don't scare him off already!! :lol:


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## shanny28757 (Feb 11, 2006)

When I finally am able to make it out west I will set up my gun differently but this season I will be using it in a cedar swamp in the UP. I understand the concept and advantage of being zeroed at 200 for long distance shooting. I also will experiment with more premium ammo. I was just a little shocked to see the amount of bullet drop. Are there cartridges that perform better? 

My uncle hunts in Wyoming most years and told me the aiming point on his last buck was the black tip of his nose to compensate for wind and yardage. He shoots a 7mm I believe.


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## Nick Adams (Mar 10, 2005)

Your trajectory numbers indicate an abnormally low velocity for a 150 gr in a 270 Win. Something on the order of 2100-2200 fps. My experience says you should be able to get 2600-2800 fps out of that combination.

Are you shooting them in something weird (e.g. very short barrel, gas operated semi-auto, etc)?

-na


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## glockman55 (Mar 9, 2006)

I shoot 130's out of my .270, plenty for Deer.
[Load No Caliber Grains/ Grams Bullet Style Brand Use 
P270F 270 Win. 130 / 8.42 Nosler® Ballistic Tip® Vital-Shok® 


Velocity in Feet per Second (To nearest 10 FPS) 
Velocity 
Load No Caliber Muzzle 100 Y 200 Y 300 Y 400 Y 500 Y 
P270F 270 Win. 3060 2837 2626 2424 2231 2046 


Energy in Foot Pounds (To nearest 5 Foot Pounds) 
Energy 
Load No Caliber Muzzle 100 Y 200 Y 300 Y 400 Y 500 Y 
P270F 270 Win. 2703 2324 1990 1695 1436 1209 


Wind Drift in Inches (at 10 MPH) 
Wind Drift 
Load No Caliber 100 Y 200 Y 300 Y 400 Y 500 Y 
P270F 270 Win. 0.6 2.8 6.4 11.9 19.4 


Average Range 
Average Range 
Load No Caliber 50 Y-0.3, 100 Y 0.0, 200 Y-2.9, 300 Y-10.7 

Long Range 
Long Range 
Load No Caliber 50 Y 0.5, 100 Y 1.4, 200 Y 0.0, 300 Y-6.4, 400 Y -18.8, 500 Y -38.2,


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## shanny28757 (Feb 11, 2006)

Nick Adams said:


> Your trajectory numbers indicate an abnormally low velocity for a 150 gr in a 270 Win. Something on the order of 2100-2200 fps. My experience says you should be able to get 2600-2800 fps out of that combination.
> 
> Are you shooting them in something weird (e.g. very short barrel, gas operated semi-auto, etc)?
> 
> -na



Nothing unusual. Bolt action 22" barrel. Next time I buy ammo I think I will buy some different bullet types to test.


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## Luv2hunteup (Mar 22, 2003)

Here's a link to an article about the 270 maximum point blank range.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/ultra-long-range.htm


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## mipete (Mar 26, 2002)

If you are really interested in ballistics of diffrent rifles and comparing them against each other, remminton has a great ballistics section on their web site. You can compare diffrent cartridges and bullet weights against each other. say a 270 with a 130 grain bullet vs a 30-06 with a 150 grain bullet. I personally shoot a remington 7mm ultra mag and have shot deer out to 500 yds. anyone looking to get a new rifle should really check this site out.


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## 8iowa (Jan 28, 2008)

Using my Sierra V6 ballistic program I get these numbers for a .277 diameter 150 grain Remington CLSP bullet;

At a muzzle velocity of 2400 fps;
100 yd ......+.97 inches
200 yd......-3.94 inches
300 yd.....-18.18 inches

This performance is obviously indicitave of a muzzle velocity much lower than the factory rating, which should be around 2850 fps.

I've been loading the 270 Winchester for thirty years and have taken five elk with a rifle chambered for this cartridge. Your experience above shows why it's a great idea to begin "loading your own". With chonographs now offered at very reasonable prices, this would also be a good addition to your shooting gear.


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## glockman55 (Mar 9, 2006)

I check all my factory loads with my chronograph and they do vary some, not that much,(400fps) 
Here's a good info forum to check out.. www.longrangehunting.com


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## KLR (Sep 2, 2006)

glockman55 said:


> I check all my factory loads with my chronograph and they do vary some, not that much,(400fps)
> Here's a good info forum to check out.. www.longrangehunting.com


I'd consider a variance of 400 fps HUGE- on a round thats going 2800 fps thats a change of as much as- 15%?? 

The last load I chony'd for my .260 had a maximum variance of 30 fps. If you are talking about serious long range shooting- consistiency in your ammo is a major factor in getting things dialed in.


IMO the .270 is fine for deer sized game as far as most of us have reason to shoot.


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## glockman55 (Mar 9, 2006)

KLR said:


> I'd consider a variance of 400 fps HUGE- on a round thats going 2800 fps thats a change of as much as- 15%??
> 
> The last load I chony'd for my .260 had a maximum variance of 30 fps. If you are talking about serious long range shooting- consistiency in your ammo is a major factor in getting things dialed in.
> 
> ...


 
You Think? I was referring to 8iowa's post..I don't get 400 fps difference, It's not more than 10-15 fps. on most factory loads I check.


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## KLR (Sep 2, 2006)

glockman55 said:


> You Think? I was referring to 8iowa's post..I don't get 400 fps difference, It's not more than 10-15 fps. on most factory loads I check.


gotcha- misunderstood your previous post.


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## 78CJ (Jun 26, 2009)

What ammo were you shooting?


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## shanny28757 (Feb 11, 2006)

.270 Federal SoftPoint RN 150 grain

From the Federal website...


Yardage Muzzle 100 200 300 400 500
Velocity fps	2830 2486 2166 1871 1606 1374

Yardage 100 200 300 400 500
Impact in +0.9 zeroed -9.4 -29.2 -62.6


I did a quick comparison to different 150 grain federal bullets and at 300 yds the trophy bonded bear claw has bullet velocity of 2270 fps and only 7.6 in of drop. Also, he Trophy bonded bear claw has impact energy or 1760 ft lb while the soft point is only 1166. I'm not that familiar with balistics but I assume this means my killing power at 300 yds will be significantly lower with the soft point than with the TBBC?

Is there a formula/calculation/correlation between bullet velocity at a given distance and rate of drop when zeroed at 200 yds for example?


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## 8iowa (Jan 28, 2008)

Shanny:

Plugging the Federal 270 RN bullet at 2830 fps into my Sierra V6 program gives the following results;

range velocity energy drop/height
Muzzle 2830fps 2667 ft lbs +1.5 inches
100yds 2482 2052 +0.96
200 2161 1556 -2.25
300 1864 1158 -12.97
400 1596 849 -33.76
500 1363 619 -68.32

This will vary from Federal's published figures because I have done these calculations based on your 1 inch high zero at 100 yards, and also because I have used more typical Michigan environmental conditions; 38 degrees F, 800 ft altitude, 75% humidity.

I'll go out on a limb somewhat and state that this load is somewhat less than sparkling for the 270 Win. The round nose bullet is probably good for all around terminal performance for ranges up to 200 yards, but should not be used for longer range shots due to the rapid fall off of velocity and energy, and increasing wind drift due to the bullets comparitively low ballistic coefficient.

For longer range hunting with the 270 Win. I would suggest a load with 130 or 140 grain spire point boat tail bullets.


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## clattin (Jul 8, 2000)

If you're looking for a great, flat-shooting cartridge capable of hunting up to Elk-sized animals, take a close look at the .257 Weatherby Magnum. If you don't reload, the ammo can be cost prohibitive. It is a SUPER flat shooting, low recoil (relatively), great ballistics cartridge. The .25-06 is a also a very good flat shooter and ammo is a lot less costly. I own both cartiridges and love them both!

If you think you'll want to hunt larger game such as Elk, then you'll want to maybe look at the .300 magnums. A LOT of elk have fallen to the .270 Win and .30-06 too though! The .300 magnums will give you another couple hundred yards of terminal performance, I think. I would take a poke at an Elk at 400 with a .300 Win Mag but I don't think I would feel confident past about 200 with a non-magnum cartridge.

Bottom line....whatever cartridge you choose to shoot at long range. Practice, practice, practice! Its fun to shoot at long ranges, so practicing is fun!

Chris


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## shanny28757 (Feb 11, 2006)

8iowa said:


> Shanny:
> 
> Plugging the Federal 270 RN bullet at 2830 fps into my Sierra V6 program gives the following results;
> 
> ...



8Iowa, is Sierra V6 a computer program that you can do ballistic calculations with?


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## Jnamo (Apr 14, 2006)

clattin said:


> If you're looking for a great, flat-shooting cartridge capable of hunting up to Elk-sized animals, take a close look at the .257 Weatherby Magnum. If you don't reload, the ammo can be cost prohibitive. It is a SUPER flat shooting, low recoil (relatively), great ballistics cartridge. The .25-06 is a also a very good flat shooter and ammo is a lot less costly. I own both cartiridges and love them both!
> 
> If you think you'll want to hunt larger game such as Elk, then you'll want to maybe look at the .300 magnums. A LOT of elk have fallen to the .270 Win and .30-06 too though! The .300 magnums will give you another couple hundred yards of terminal performance, I think. I would take a poke at an Elk at 400 with a .300 Win Mag but I don't think I would feel confident past about 200 with a non-magnum cartridge.
> 
> ...


 
Good info...Also, the 7mm Rem. Mag. is a sweet one too...


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