# Is this illegal in Michigan? I think not, but curious to hear everybody's input.



## Lamarsh (Aug 19, 2014)

The way I see it, this is merely hiding behind a decoy. But what if you sneeze or go to itch your nuts while you're hiding behind it and a CO sees your decoy blind move and accuses you of reaping? I would guess the CO would be cool if you just told him you had to itch your balls and accidentally moved the decoy that you weren't planning on moving until after hunting hours. 




__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10153403019797595


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## DEDGOOSE (Jan 19, 2007)

Nobody knows how to call any more. Lot of cutawaya after the shot


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## RMH (Jan 17, 2009)

Just lop their fool head off with a sword...forget the gun.
Looks like fun. Too bad it's not legal in Michigan.


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## SKUNK (Jan 6, 2001)

What makes this illegal if you place it and don't move it?


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## William H Bonney (Jan 14, 2003)

RMH said:


> Just lop their fool head off with a sword...forget the gun.
> Looks like fun. Too bad it's not legal in Michigan.


I beg to differ, I believe the same rules apply to turkey as they do to geese.

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/f...er-regarding-goose-hunting-legalities.152199/


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## benster (Jul 31, 2006)

SKUNK said:


> What makes this illegal if you place it and don't move it?


Nothing!


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## Firefighter (Feb 14, 2007)

The question was asked, and an answer was given by a CO. 

You did not like the answer and bring it up again.

Did you dispute every test question you ever got wrong in class with the teacher too growing up?


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## Firefighter (Feb 14, 2007)

DEDGOOSE said:


> Nobody knows how to call any more. Lot of cutawaya after the shot


Because there were a lot of misses and body swatted birds that will die a long way from where they were shot in that video...


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## RMH (Jan 17, 2009)

William H Bonney said:


> I beg to differ, I believe the same rules apply to turkey as they do to geese.
> 
> http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/f...er-regarding-goose-hunting-legalities.152199/




I bolded how the law is written. Dead short pretty much laid it out in his post and in the thread below.




dead short said:


> Under this particular WCO a person picking up and moving a fan around is "mechanical".
> 
> I don't think it is being overly interpreted, I think it is being literally interpreted. This is what it says....
> 
> *"whose only motion is derived exclusively by power of the natural wind."*


http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/threads/is-reaping-legal-in-michigan.559680/unread


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## William H Bonney (Jan 14, 2003)

RMH said:


> I bolded how the law is written. Dead short pretty much laid it out in his post and in the thread below.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks. :lol:


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## srconnell22 (Aug 27, 2007)

William H Bonney said:


> Thanks. :lol:


Like most laws, the legality of fanning turkeys is up for interpretation from the CO. 

At last count we were up to 7 votes legal to 1 vote illegal by members of the DNR law enforcement division. 

Confirm with your local CO prior to use. I wouldn't recommend it in the thumb.


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## RMH (Jan 17, 2009)

William H Bonney said:


> Thanks. :lol:


Just read that whole goose thread. Sorry WHB I knew I should have read it before I responded.

Thanks :lol::lol:


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## Lamarsh (Aug 19, 2014)

Firefighter said:


> The question was asked, and an answer was given by a CO.
> 
> You did not like the answer and bring it up again.
> 
> Did you dispute every test question you ever got wrong in class with the teacher too growing up?


My question is simply about hunting/hiding behind a stationary decoy with no movement, but I apologize if that was somehow unclear. I don't think that question was answered by a CO, but please show me if it was. Somebody may have brought up whether you can hide behind a stationary decoy, but I don't think that was ever really discussed, as the main topic was reaping/fanning and whether that type of movement was a violation of the reg we were all discussing. The answer is unclear, but we seemed to have all sort of concluded it is illegal (with even Dead Short appearing to reserve some uncertainty about the language of the reg). If you go and read that thread you'll see that I played devil's advocate on both sides in order to highlight the confusion of the reg's language and the points folks are making on both sides of that fence. 

My point about scratching yourself and moving the otherwise stationary decoy you're hiding behind was just separately highlighting the absurdity of the purported mechanical decoy rule, because that could _techinically_ be interpreted as movement/visual stimulus. 

That being said, did you misinterpret every test question in class growing up? But to your question, growing up, I didn't dispute every test question I got wrong, but if a teacher ever indicated that I got a test question wrong that I thought was actually correct, I certainly disputed it.  



Firefighter said:


> Because there were a lot of misses and body swatted birds that will die a long way from where they were shot in that video...


Agreed. Those shots in the video looked terrible. That is arguably the downside to this tactic, since there is so much movement in both the hunter and the targeted turkey when the hunter pops out from behind the "blind". I've always called turkeys in and taken calculated shots to put a handful of shot in their neck and head and they have all just crumpled right there. Only one time have I ever seen a turkey shot and taken off far in flight, and it was a buddy of mine shooting at a moving turkey while he was also moving. 

But my point does remain, that if you are hunting in an area where you know where they strut, but for whatever reason have otherwise not figured out the location of their roost or patterns they take from roost to feed or strut, setting up a stationary decoy before hunting hours that you simply post up and hide behind, may be something to simply consider, and so long as you're not moving it I don't see any way a CO could interpret that as a mechanical decoy. Steadying your gun for a shot without them seeing you would be the challenge.


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## Lamarsh (Aug 19, 2014)

SKUNK said:


> What makes this illegal if you place it and don't move it?


Correct. That is my point, and that is the crux of the joke which apparently flew over a few people's heads.


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## Ack (Oct 3, 2004)

So here's a question for you...if you come walking out to your truck with a turkey over one shoulder and your reaper deke in your other hand, will you be able to convince the officer (that is waiting for you) that you were only sitting behind your decoy and not moving it?


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## srconnell22 (Aug 27, 2007)

Ack said:


> So here's a question for you...if you come walking out to your truck with a turkey over one shoulder and your reaper deke in your other hand, will you be able to convince the officer (that is waiting for you) that you were only sitting behind your decoy and not moving it?


You don't have to. It's his responsibility to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you were using it in an illegal manner. On top of that, the state had better have one hell of a lawyer to convince the judge that moving a decoy by hand is considered a "mechanical decoy". 

Especially considering most of the CO's peers agree that it would not make it mechanical. 

The other option is actually sitting down next to a tree and calling a bird in. Not sure if anyone still does that or not but if you don't, you're missing out.


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## iLiveInTrees (Jun 29, 2010)

srconnell22 said:


> You don't have to. It's his responsibility to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you were using it in an illegal manner. On top of that, the state had better have one hell of a lawyer to convince the judge that moving a decoy by hand is considered a "mechanical decoy".
> 
> Especially considering most of the CO's peers agree that it would not make it mechanical.
> 
> The other option is actually sitting down next to a tree and calling a bird in. Not sure if anyone still does that or not but is you don't, you're missing out.


Agreed, I guess I'm old fashioned already at 29.........there is always a cooler more attractive way to kill things these days.....stick to what works.


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## DEDGOOSE (Jan 19, 2007)

Ack said:


> So here's a question for you...if you come walking out to your truck with a turkey over one shoulder and your reaper deke in your other hand, will you be able to convince the officer (that is waiting for you) that you were only sitting behind your decoy and not moving it?


I agree and only one way to solve this no visual stimulas.


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## Lamarsh (Aug 19, 2014)

Ack said:


> So here's a question for you...if you come walking out to your truck with a turkey over one shoulder and your reaper deke in your other hand, will you be able to convince the officer (that is waiting for you) that you were only sitting behind your decoy and not moving it?


Yes, I think I could.


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## Lamarsh (Aug 19, 2014)

srconnell22 said:


> You don't have to. It's his responsibility to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you were using it in an illegal manner. On top of that, the state had better have one hell of a lawyer to convince the judge that moving a decoy by hand is considered a "mechanical decoy".
> 
> Especially considering most of the CO's peers agree that it would not make it mechanical.
> 
> The other option is actually sitting down next to a tree and calling a bird in. Not sure if anyone still does that or not but if you don't, you're missing out.


That is correct, it's the gov's and CO's burden of proof. What a silly drain of resources that would be, huh? 

For the record, I've never personally taken a turkey any way other than sitting against a tree or behind some natural cover calling them in two my two crappy rubber hen and jake decoys, and I don't own any sort of reaper decoy or tom decoy big enough to hide behind. But I sure as heck am thinking about it because my property has a huge cherry orchard and whenever I miss the turkeys on their route from roost to feed or strut (my usual plan, which is usually successful), they are almost always smack dab in the middle of that cherry orchard by mid morning. My idea this year, if I'm not successful the first morning, is to maybe set up a tom decoy large enough to hide behind (not necessary one designed for "reaping") before hunting hours or by walking out there without my shotgun, near the center of the cherry orchard, and just sit and wait. The problem I've always had is they're never in range once they reach those orchards, and the few times I attempted to belly crawl towards them did not work. They don't seem to care about me when I'm walking around out of shotgun range though lol.


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## Kennybks (Mar 29, 2010)

www.crowbegone.com › federal_regs
That's not the right URL a pdf with multiple state comparison of decoy use is what I was looking at...

Interesting to review how other states view and relay the interpreted verbiage in their laws.

Several states mention mechanical, however I couldn't find any other state that mentions anything to limit to "the power of the natural wind ".

Here ya go
http://naturalmotiondecoy.com/pages/Regulations/


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## TSS Caddis (Mar 15, 2002)

Would that work for bearded hens in the fall?


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