# Just a heads up



## ausable_steelhead (Sep 30, 2002)

Anyone hitting the river in the near future, beware of iffy conditions, more than likely. Bad flow management lately has caused the lower, slower portions to lock up and there will be varying degrees of shelf/anchor ice in the upper portion.

When they drop the flow to 600cfs on a cold night, with the water temp already flirting with freezing, you get very bad, very extensive shelf ice. When they jack it back up, the previous shelf is now under water, and covered by new shelf. Makes for slick, and sometimes dangerous footing. 

These low flows also cause ice flows, as the river being a smidge above 32* will start it freezing or "making ice". Sometimes this is just slush, sometimes it's actual ice flows. I've had mornings where you couldn't fish till 1-2-3 in the afternoon, as this can take time to burn off. Some holes can turn unfishable, even in the upper section, due to substantial shelf ice. It sometimes extends right out to the current edge. The fish typically lay right off that edge, and are therefore, inaccessible.

This is the chart from the last few days. Consumers is so predictable, it's comical. Notice a steep drop down to almost 300cfs for a bit last night, then a quick rise. Same thing they did the previous day...


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## GrizzlyAdams237 (Jan 29, 2010)

Thanks for the info looks like a no go for me 2morrow.


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## Ron Matthews (Aug 10, 2006)

ausable_steelhead said:


> This is the chart from the last few days. Consumers is so predictable, it's comical. Notice a steep drop down to almost 300cfs for a bit last night, then a quick rise. Same thing they did the previous day...


switching units back and forth.


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## Fishndude (Feb 22, 2003)

When it gets real cold out - like now, the water sources that create the river freeze up, and less water flows down. It IS a fact, although that doesn't make it any more palatable for fishermen. Consumers can't just run the impoundments dry to keep the flows artificially high. I agree that the crazy spikes and drops they have lately could be avoided to some extent. But the truth is that there simply isn't as much water coming down the river as there would be if temps were higher. 

The flip side of this is that the water that isn't flowing down is backing up in the watershed in some way. More frozen water actually in/on the river. More frozen water in the ground. When the spring thaw hits, it should be real heavy this year, and should last a lot longer than we have grown accustomed to. That will stretch the spring Steelhead season, and we might see spawning fish in decent numbers all the way through May, like we used to have. I always enjoyed catching Steelhead on Memorial Day, years ago. I can remember catching both Manistee strains, and Skamanias that weekend. There was a very noticeable difference. Those Skams were just white, and almost seemed to glow.


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## MichiganStreamside (Jan 19, 2014)

Fishndude said:


> When it gets real cold out - like now, the water sources that create the river freeze up, and less water flows down. It IS a fact, although that doesn't make it any more palatable for fishermen. Consumers can't just run the impoundments dry to keep the flows artificially high.


Could use explain to us then why the other dams just upstream (Cooke, Loud and 5 Channels) are not effected by the cold weather? There flows are all very stable now and the ponds level do not vary more than and a few inches this time of year in the backwaters above Foote.


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## Fishndude (Feb 22, 2003)

MichiganStreamside said:


> Could use explain to us then why the other dams just upstream (Cooke, Loud and 5 Channels) are not effected by the cold weather? There flows are all very stable now and the ponds level do not vary more than and a few inches this time of year in the backwaters above Foote.


Nope. I can't explain that at all, Kelly. I thought Consumers had linked all the dams by computer, and they worked in tandem to make the flow changes smoother, and less adverse on the environment. That sure sounds like User Error to me. 

I did just check the flow histories for Red Oak, Mio, and Foote (Ausable), and *they all showed significant dips in the last 2 days,* and all went back up. I would not say those flows were stable, although Foote seems to have fluctuated my more widely than the others. Strangely, they don't show the same dips at the same time, on all dams. That would indicate to me that, if the dam's flows are being controlled by computer, and are linked, that there is something wrong with the programming. But I am not an expert in this. I just know that when water freezes, it doesn't flow downstream very well.


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## MichiganStreamside (Jan 19, 2014)

Fishndude said:


> Nope. I can't explain that at all, Kelly. I thought Consumers had linked all the dams by computer, and they worked in tandem to make the flow changes smoother, and less adverse on the environment. That sure sounds like User Error to me.
> 
> I did just check the flow histories for Red Oak, Mio, and Foote (Ausable), and *they all showed significant dips in the last 2 days,* and all went back up. I would not say those flows were stable, although Foote seems to have fluctuated my more widely than the others. Strangely, they don't show the same dips at the same time, on all dams. That would indicate to me that, if the dam's flows are being controlled by computer, and are linked, that there is something wrong with the programming. But I am not an expert in this. I just know that when water freezes, it doesn't flow downstream very well.


When you look at the three dams above Foote they are the most stable dams on the system.

Croton Dam and Tippy Dam dont seem to much effected by the cold weather either! 

Foote's data comes from basically the Mckinnely gauge which is off Alcona Pond and completely buried in an ice jam all winter about 50 miles upstream from Foote. They picked the most unstable spot in the entire system to obtain what they wanted to see happen in the winter months and generate more power. Tippy and Croton run off their backwaters and if Foote did you would have consistent stable flows with less ice build up below Foote all winter. Consumers Energy is driven by money and has complete control over overseeing agencies!


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## Ron Matthews (Aug 10, 2006)

all that would be an ice dam above Alcona Hydro and because what comes in goes out, the bad information is applied to all facilities or a manual adjustment is needed., and you Don't want the system offline! It'll take longer to fix a manual adjustment than to just leave it alone. ASK them they'll tell you

Don't forget about time adjusted travel, They shouldn't all show something at the same time.

I didn't see anything terribly upsetting....Fix the icing issue at the known location or move the data point or both. they know the issue, But how do you get them to fix it. 

ya'll knew it would be like this still, with ponds Not allowed to fluctuate that's how it is... It makes ice, ice dams form, auto system responds, Tomorrow they'll be dumping water cause they can't store it, so in a few day's it will be running higher than it really should so the next event will cause it to crash again and so it goes...


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## ausable_steelhead (Sep 30, 2002)

I just feel the Au Sable is abused to a point. Granted, it has more dams along its mainstream than both the Manistee and Mo, but they rarely get this treatment. I'm younger than all you guys, but I don't remember this crap occurring 10-15 years ago. The 90's are too far back, plus they went to run-of-river in the early part of that decade.

This happens every year and is a known problem, yet is allowed to occur. It messes the river up and creates potential hazards. It just seems like it could be averted. Oh well, I guess I'll find out Wednesday what it looks like and where I can fish...


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## herb09 (Jan 11, 2009)

Don't forget the butter worms.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Ohub Campfire mobile app


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## ausable_steelhead (Sep 30, 2002)

herb09 said:


> Don't forget the butter worms.
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Ohub Campfire mobile app


Lol...I won't.


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## Davelobi (Feb 14, 2012)

I've fished very little below Foote in the past years but used to fish there over thirty years ago. I remember the thundering when the big jets out of the air force base blasted over the canyon.
What I remember about water flow was that it changed constantly throughout the day. The river would be slowly getting lower then a loud alarm from the dam would go off indicating that they were going to let more water through. The river would start to rise and you would have to back up as it would start to come up on your waders. Sometimes shore ice would have formed and would now be under water and invisible. Talk about slicker than cat ***** on a freshly waxed floor, under water ice is not fun. 
Still work that way? I don't recall seeing/hearing it like that the last couple of times I was there.
Anyone else remember what I described? Memory isn't what it used to be but that is how I remember it.


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## ausable_steelhead (Sep 30, 2002)

Davelobi said:


> What I remember about water flow was that it changed constantly throughout the day. The river would be slowly getting lower then a loud alarm from the dam would go off indicating that they were going to let more water through. The river would start to rise and you would have to back up as it would start to come up on your waders. Sometimes shore ice would have formed and would now be under water and invisible. Talk about slicker than cat ***** on a freshly waxed floor, under water ice is not fun.
> Still work that way? I don't recall seeing/hearing it like that the last couple of times I was there.
> Anyone else remember what I described? Memory isn't what it used to be but that is how I remember it.


Back in 1992 or 94, they went to "run-of-river", instead of a peaking operation. The surges and subsequent drops you see now are not the same thing. They stopped the peaking because of MASS bank erosion, which used to wash tons of sand into the river. The Au Sables name means "river of sands" and that is why it's nickname is the "Big Sandy". 

Winter is the only time you see the flows managed as they've been. The biggest issue is the steep draw downs, that ends up locking most of the river up, and the creation of treacherous at times, shelf ice. The slick footing you describe is anchor ice, and it is indeed dangerous.

While we all understand the slushing/freezing nature above Alcona, it's a problem they could fix. Change the location to a deeper, more stable section of river. There is no reason for the Au Sable river below Foote dam to ever go below 800-900cfs. That exposes gravel, killing insects, invertebrates, and any salmon/trout eggs from late fall. The gauge excuse is just that it seems; an excuse to do what they wish in order to make the most money. Profit should NEVER be put above a natural resource.


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## herb09 (Jan 11, 2009)

Well said Jon.


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