# Crazy



## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)




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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

Planted birds, I'm sure plenty are wild also, but they have a 4 a day limit, plus look at the tail on this bird. Still Crazy I agree but, it could have been an hour after the let 1000 early release birds go.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

The claim on the video and on their web site is that they are all wild birds! A quote from their web site says, "You can expect to see hundreds if not thousands of wild pheasants everyday during your hunt."

I guess that's why a 3 day hunt with them is almost $1900.


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

Right.... 


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

Well the bird in the photo is not wild imo. Plus the Sodak limit is 3 a day unless you have a preserve license.

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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

I don't know but I do see their website pictures and write-ups promotes skies filled with birds. The video interviews also talk about nesting areas for hens and the host clearly states, "Folks, these are not pen raised birds." I don't think that lying would bode well for a business or for the longevity of an outdoor television show promoting that business.


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## Duece22 (Mar 30, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> I don't know but I do see their website pictures and write-ups promotes skies filled with birds. The video interviews also talk about nesting areas for hens and the host clearly states, "Folks, these are not pen raised birds." I don't think that lying would bode well for a business or for the longevity of an outdoor television show promoting that business.


Does the owner consider early released birds pen raised? 


RH


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> I don't know but I do see their website pictures and write-ups promotes skies filled with birds. The video interviews also talk about nesting areas for hens and the host clearly states, "Folks, these are not pen raised birds." I don't think that lying would bode well for a business or for the longevity of an outdoor television show promoting that business.


Right....

Plus it's on the interweb.... Gotta be true. 


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

And there's an outdoor television show involved. Just adds to the validity. Right...


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

RecurveRx said:


> And there's an outdoor television show involved. Just adds to the validity. Right...
> 
> 
> Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine


And because you seem to think you're a self proclaimed expert about everything, nothing but your opinion is valid..... Right!


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## wannabapro (Feb 26, 2003)

No way those are 100% wild. I wouldn't want to hunt them like that anyways. 

My dad and I limited every day this year on our SD trip and every single bird was pointed and held by the dog(s) for one of us to physically flush and shoot and I would not have it any other way. That's how it's meant to be IMO.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

Duece22 said:


> Does the owner consider early released birds pen raised?
> 
> 
> RH


Good question. I do note that the video was late season. The facts seems that they promote this type of hunt all season and there are other write ups about this place and the crazy bird numbers.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

wannabapro said:


> No way those are 100% wild. I wouldn't want to hunt them like that anyways.
> 
> My dad and I limited every day this year on our SD trip and every single bird was pointed and held by the dog(s) for one of us to physically flush and shoot and I would not have it any other way. That's how it's meant to be IMO.


I agree about the way to hunt them. They promote this driving with blocker style of a hunt calling it a traditional SD pheasant hunt.


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> And because you seem to think you're a self proclaimed expert about everything, nothing but your opinion is valid..... Right!


Right!


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## Rokane24 (Dec 19, 2011)

Hmmm..... Look's like a garden to me!


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## hehibrits (Mar 10, 2007)

I like it when they are spooky as Hell and put on their track shoes, roosters sitting through a point are boring...

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## JJ_Jeruzal (Oct 25, 2011)

All my favorite grouse covers produce very similar "skies filled with birds". Don't yours?


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## chewy (Mar 27, 2006)

couldn't even watch all of it. crazy is right. there are too many birds for the habitat to even hold. those are probably preleased. I have been in fields with about 20 or 30 birds fly up. but 100s. not buying that. if it is true I guess I am missing out. 


mysignature http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=1295


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

chewy said:


> couldn't even watch all of it. crazy is right. there are too many birds for the habitat to even hold. those are probably preleased. I have been in fields with about 20 or 30 birds fly up. but 100s. not buying that. if it is true I guess I am missing out.
> 
> 
> mysignature http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=1295


I've seen bird numbers like that twice out in Sodak. One was a food plot of milo at 10:00 in the morn. It was only 10 yard wide and 500 yards long. There was easily 1000 birds in it. It was incredible walking into it. The other was a big slough early morning just driving by it and it exploded with an unbelievable amount of birds. Both were miles away from any homes and were not planted birds. Just watching some of those birds fly makes me think a bunch were early release. Those Dakota birds can fly into a headwind faster than you can imagine.


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

Just checked their website 4 birds a day plus 35 for each extra bird. Not to mention they only have 2.400 acres. Definitely a ton of pen birds there. Wild bird only places in Sodak is always 3 birds a day. It's the law.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

BIGSP said:


> Just checked their website 4 birds a day plus 35 for each extra bird. Not to mention they only have 2.400 acres. Definitely a ton of pen birds there. Wild bird only places in Sodak is always 3 birds a day. It's the law.


Clarification: 2400 acres of designated cover for hunts connected to a 12000 parcel.

Maybe all the pictures of their website of trophy bucks, skies filled with mallards and geese are all pen raised as well. It may be worth a trip just to see these pens!


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> Clarification: 2400 acres of designated cover for hunts connected to a 12000 parcel.
> 
> Maybe all the pictures of their website of trophy bucks, skies filled with mallards and geese are all pen raised as well. It may be worth a trip just to see these pens!


You can't debate that they are shooting a ton of pen raised birds. 4 birds a day plus 35 bucks for each additional bird. The legal limit is 3. Sure they kill a pile of wild birds too but it is undebatable that they are also shooting pen birds. End of story.


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> Clarification: 2400 acres of designated cover for hunts connected to a 12000 parcel.
> 
> Maybe all the pictures of their website of trophy bucks, skies filled with mallards and geese are all pen raised as well. It may be worth a trip just to see these pens!


Even if they were all wild they have a preserve license in order to shoot more than 3 a day, by SoDak law they have to keep track of harvest and replace the harvest under some calculation.

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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

Four bird limits only proves that they have a preserve license.

I can't find anything in SD regs that says preserves have to replace harvested birds. Not saying it isn't there.... just I don't see it.

However this likely would answer the question:
http://legis.state.sd.us/statutes/DisplayStatute.aspx?Type=Statute&Statute=41-10-10

Can any "eagle eye" viewers of videos or pictures find any evidence of banded or marked birds?


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

The eye ball test tells me the tail on the picture I posted hasbeen dragging on the bottom of a pen for some time. 

Chewy, I've seen 75 birds in one 80 in michigan, in the last ten years. I've seen 500 plus on public and private land in 3 states out west.

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## chewy (Mar 27, 2006)

northwinsetter said:


> Clarification: 2400 acres of designated cover for hunts connected to a 12000 parcel.
> 
> Maybe all the pictures of their website of trophy bucks, skies filled with mallards and geese are all pen raised as well. It may be worth a trip just to see these pens!


do you get commission from this place? you seem to be very defensive of the place. 


mysignature http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=1295


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

chewy said:


> do you get commission from this place? you seem to be very defensive of the place.
> 
> 
> mysignature http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=1295


You read my mind.


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## Merimac (Jan 17, 2006)

It would be more fun if you hunted with a bow. I have hunted in Sodak with big bird #s like that. It is neat to see the first time but then it gets old quick. It isn't so good for your dog either.

ben


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## wirehair (Oct 16, 2007)

northwinsetter said:


> The claim on the video and on their web site is that they are all wild birds! A quote from their web site says, "You can expect to see hundreds if not thousands of wild pheasants everyday during your hunt."
> 
> I guess that's why a 3 day hunt with them is almost $1900.


It only costs $120 for 10 days. (if you hunt walk-in areas and sleep in your SUV) :yikes: Start off in Eureka and make a loop.


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## hehibrits (Mar 10, 2007)

Merimac said:


> It isn't so good for your dog either.
> 
> ben


Why is that??

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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

chewy said:


> do you get commission from this place? you seem to be very defensive of the place.
> 
> 
> mysignature http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=1295


No commission here. I do get weary of those who claim that others are liars without offering one ounce of evidence that it indeed is the case. If it's presented as an opinion is one thing but until some concrete proof can be offered to this discussion to prove otherwise I chose to treat people with the same courtesy I would want to receive.... to be believed until I've shown that I can't be believed! 
The SD law states that pen raised birds have to be identified. At this point being a preserve hasn't been shown necessarily to mean that birds are released. 
The ranch claims their birds are not pen raised. Several reputable groups promote the info & affirm they are not pen raised birds. The video host claims they are not pen raised birds. And then to top it off I have yet to find one negative review to what they offer or their claims. But now some self proclaimed experts from Michigan Sportsman's Forum whom have no personal experience with them claims they aren't legitimate. There is something called "benefit of the doubt" that some need to learn about extending to others since it's something they would viciously demand if the tables were turned.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

Sorry folks but there is something going on here that can't be explained by the pen raised argument. Please note the time of year. The existent of these types numbers in the dead of winter wouldn't exist if there wasn't a feeding and cover restoration program. I can't imagine birds of this number being released after the season is over just for the purpose of a 2-3 minute video.


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## chewy (Mar 27, 2006)

are you booking a hunt there?


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

chewy said:


> are you booking a hunt there?


If I had $1900 I would.... maybe you could spear head a fund raiser on my behalf! I'd cover the gas!


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## Laphroaig (Dec 13, 2011)

hehibrits said:


> Why is that??
> 
> Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine



I agree that it's not good for a POINTING dog. Too much scent. That is an a-typical situation relative to most upland hunts. The dog learns nothing with all that scent, running birds, flying birds and pressure. Perhaps it's Ok for a flusher if you don't require steadiness. Yet, I would think that all manners and training go out the window for all breeds, all dogs in that situation. If you're a meat hunter unconcerned with your dogs style, manners, steadiness then that would be heaven for you. I like the dog work way more than the kill. That is no place for a dog with the goals I have for my dogs.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

I do note that the only dogs I saw were only retrieving.


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

Laphroaig said:


> I agree that it's not good for a POINTING dog. Too much scent. That is an a-typical situation relative to most upland hunts. The dog learns nothing with all that scent, running birds, flying birds and pressure. Perhaps it's Ok for a flusher if you don't require steadiness. Yet, I would think that all manners and training go out the window for all breeds, all dogs in that situation. If you're a meat hunter unconcerned with your dogs style, manners, steadiness then that would be heaven for you. I like the dog work way more than the kill. That is no place for a dog with the goals I have for my dogs.



Well thought out post.


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## Merimac (Jan 17, 2006)

Laphroaig said:


> I agree that it's not good for a POINTING dog. Too much scent. That is an a-typical situation relative to most upland hunts. The dog learns nothing with all that scent, running birds, flying birds and pressure. Perhaps it's Ok for a flusher if you don't require steadiness. Yet, I would think that all manners and training go out the window for all breeds, all dogs in that situation. If you're a meat hunter unconcerned with your dogs style, manners, steadiness then that would be heaven for you. I like the dog work way more than the kill. That is no place for a dog with the goals I have for my dogs.


Well put.


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## dauber (Jan 11, 2010)

Laphroaig said:


> I agree that it's not good for a POINTING dog. Too much scent. That is an a-typical situation relative to most upland hunts. The dog learns nothing with all that scent, running birds, flying birds and pressure. Perhaps it's Ok for a flusher if you don't require steadiness. Yet, I would think that all manners and training go out the window for all breeds, all dogs in that situation. If you're a meat hunter unconcerned with your dogs style, manners, steadiness then that would be heaven for you. I like the dog work way more than the kill. That is no place for a dog with the goals I have for my dogs.


You are correct about the steady flusher too:SHOCKED:. We had this happen back in 2006 on a public area near Eureka SD, it was a drought year and some of the corn fields failed, this one was then opened to hunt in. We saw some birds fly in before morning opening and went in at opening with one of our steady cockers. HOLY CRAP, at least 1000 birds came out if 1 did. They were flying just like in the video. The poor dog was running 5 feet, stopping at the flush of gobs of birds, we would shoot 1 or 2 roosters, poor dog would head out to make the retrieve and sit countless times on the way to the retrieve as more birds flushed, then would even flush some more on the way back from the retrieve. I just brought him in to heel until we got out of there.

I believe the birds are legit wild, I've seen it close to that enough times on public areas in ND and SD that I believe a well managed and rotationally hunted private land would hold birds like that especially late in the season. In fact we saw that in 2010 in one private corn field in ND that was hunted 3 times a week that was adjacent to public hunting. The big places in SD get a preserve lisc. so they can offer their clients a 4 bird limit. 
Steve


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> No commission here. I do get weary of those who claim that others are liars without offering one ounce of evidence that it indeed is the case. If it's presented as an opinion is one thing but until some concrete proof can be offered to this discussion to prove otherwise I chose to treat people with the same courtesy I would want to receive.... to be believed until I've shown that I can't be believed!
> The SD law states that pen raised birds have to be identified. At this point being a preserve hasn't been shown necessarily to mean that birds are released.
> The ranch claims their birds are not pen raised. Several reputable groups promote the info & affirm they are not pen raised birds. The video host claims they are not pen raised birds. And then to top it off I have yet to find one negative review to what they offer or their claims. But now some self proclaimed experts from Michigan Sportsman's Forum whom have no personal experience with them claims they aren't legitimate. There is something called "benefit of the doubt" that some need to learn about extending to others since it's something they would viciously demand if the tables were turned.


The evidence is you can shoot as many birds as you want. That is evidence. You can only shoot 3 birds per day in Sodak. What don't you get about that.


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## mudbat2128 (Sep 7, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> Interesting. I still tip my hat to those that found a way to increase numbers and develop habitat. That likely will never happen in MI since the "purist" police are ever on patrol to criticize and undermine legitimate attempts to advance a dying sport.... upland bird hunting. Sad!


Their also running a buisness and I see nothing wrong with what they are doing other than telling people their hunting all will birds when they are not.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

mudbat2128 said:


> Their also running a buisness and I see nothing wrong with what they are doing other than telling people their hunting all will birds when they are not.


Hmmm.... last time I checked false advertising was illegal. Here's an opportunity for someone to seal their retirement. How come no one has? Could it be because some "experts" aren't as much of an expert as they believe themselves to be? The Warne Ranch promote they have only wild birds. They are still in business since the early 90's. No one has sued them. No legal authority has charged them. Maybe it's the Michigan experts that have missed something. 
Again I would never put my dogs into a scenario like any of these videos but i think many have missed what they are promoting. For the unbiased, go to their website & watch the videos.... listen.... what you will hear is them promoting the outcome of habitat restoration combined with favorable winter climate. Good for them!


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> Hmmm.... last time I checked false advertising was illegal. Here's an opportunity for someone to seal their retirement. How come no one has? Could it be because some "experts" aren't as much of an expert as they believe themselves to be? The Warne Ranch promote they have only wild birds. They are still in business since the early 90's. No one has sued them. No legal authority has charged them. Maybe it's the Michigan experts that have missed something.
> Again I would never put my dogs into a scenario like any of these videos but i think many have missed what they are promoting. For the unbiased, go to their website & watch the videos.... listen.... what you will hear is them promoting the outcome of habitat restoration combined with favorable winter climate. Good for them!


I just looked at their website and they never claimed they were all wild birds. Just that you would see 1000's of wild birds which again I don't doubt. I just think this particular ranch has a fair amount of pen/ early release birds.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

BIGSP said:


> I just looked at their website and they never claimed they were all wild birds. Just that you would see 1000's of wild birds which again I don't doubt. I just think this particular ranch has a fair amount of pen/ early release birds.


And maybe that's the case but not once has anyone on this thread complimented or celebrated the habitat restoration that has been introduced that allows for the sustaining of these bird counts. Too bad... I think.


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> And maybe that's the case but not once has anyone on this thread complimented or celebrated the habitat restoration that has been introduced that allows for the sustaining of these bird counts. Too bad... I think.



Because it is not natural. It is a business. I can appreciate it for a great business plan, but what they're doing for the pheasant population, other than profiting, is questionable. They're not sustaining bird counts. They're supplementing them. That sucks. It means that there isn't enough habitat. We all know that. And on top of it, they're billing it as a natural/wild experience. 

Seriously? False advertising illegal? You would make a great customer.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

RecurveRx said:


> Because it is not natural. It is a business. I can appreciate it for a great business plan, but what they're doing for the pheasant population, other than profiting, is questionable. They're not sustaining bird counts. They're supplementing them. That sucks. It means that there isn't enough habitat. We all know that. And on top of it, they're billing it as a natural/wild experience.
> 
> Seriously? False advertising illegal? You would make a great customer.


Well, I have just posted a "contact us" email to their website requesting clarification to their practices and claims. If I receive a response I will post. The crazy thing is that I wonder whether the naysayers around here will ever believe anything other than their own opinion. I will post any response I receive and admission of misunderstanding if that is what is discovered. How many around here would do the same? Chime in!

Sorry but I won't be able to respond further. I'm on a preserve pheasant hunt in the a.m. with 7 dogs and who knows how many birds.... but I will be enjoying every minute of it.... as will our dogs! Have a good day doing whatever you're doing!


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## RecurveRx (Jun 21, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> Well, I have just posted a "contact us" email to their website requesting clarification to their practices and claims. If I receive a response I will post. The crazy thing is that I wonder whether the naysayers around here will ever believe anything other than their own opinion. I will post any response I receive and admission of misunderstanding if that is what is discovered. How many around here would do the same? Chime in!
> 
> Sorry but I won't be able to respond further. I'm on a preserve pheasant hunt in the a.m. with 7 dogs and who knows how many birds.... but I will be enjoying every minute of it.... as will our dogs! Have a good day doing whatever you're doing!


Thank you for the well wishes.

Enjoy your day.


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## chewy (Mar 27, 2006)

northwinsetter said:


> Finally someone offers a logical explanation with some substance! Thank you. Now the question becomes whether you consider summer released hens that mate with wild roosters actually wild birds. I would. Again I applaud those who aggressively advance breeding & restoration habitat which seems to be paying off.


join pheasants forever u will learn it doesn't work


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## chewy (Mar 27, 2006)

the


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

chewy said:


> and to answer About releasing hens to mate with wild birds. it doesn't work that is why Michigan is importing from Kansas. secondly habitat is more important than pre releasing so your clients have lots of birds to shoot.


I do agree with that. That's what I've been trying to say for a while..... something bigger than pre-releasing going on. Another of their videos seems to confirm that.

http://www.warneranches.com/videoclips


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## FieldWalker (Oct 21, 2003)

What a great place! I'm going to go celebrate their efforts! Pheasants rejoice!


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> I do agree with that. That's what I've been trying to say for a while..... something bigger than pre-releasing going on. Another of their videos seems to confirm that.
> 
> http://www.warneranches.com/videoclips


You know for someone who says capitalism is greed you sure have embraced their business practices. 

You know let's celebrate what Apple has done for music, phones, etc. give me a break. If these guys could make more money planting corn and soybeans on their property they would. Not hatin just sayin.


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

Northwinsetter,

Curious if you have ever hunted the pheasant rich west, say in the peak years of mild winters high CRP enrollment say from 05-10? 

Have you been out there to see how pheasants on public or private land react to pressure?


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## Shotgun Kennel (Feb 9, 2007)

I have hunted near some of these ranches in the Pierre area. Some of the birds we kill leave the private property and are clearly pen raised. Also, some ranches may not use pen raised birds but they will release birds from a surrogator so they may not be lying when they say they are not pen raised. Will these released birds winter over and breed? They sure will. Will releasing hundreds of hens in the spring to breed with wild stock work? I have had lodge owners tell me it does work and it works pretty well.

As for the question of "Wild", marketing is a wonderful thing. Walk the fields and birds run and fly away. They are not "Tame" so they are acting wild so the actors on the program say "Wow these birds are wild." A captive born tiger (Ohio Nut Job) will eat you and everyone calls these "Wild animals."

It is really pretty simple. As others have said, if you are hunting an area with a preserve license and you are allowed to kill as many birds as you want, some of the birds are released. If you ask the SD Game and Fish they will tell you the same thing. They closely monitor the ranches (preserves).
[/COLOR] 
Also, for the record I have also seen pheasants by the many hundreds on public land nowhere near a ranch. One awesome sight. And it only cost my license fee not a couple grand.

My dad gave me some wise advice. Don't believe everything you see on TV.


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## Shotgun Kennel (Feb 9, 2007)

hehibrits said:


> Nope, crazy B.S. is what it is. Just have to learn to see the forest from the trees. We shot 15 roosters today, all over points, held steady, retrieved to hand. Put at least 200 birds out of one field and the dogs style and steadiness were never compromised. Took good film of and will post when I get home. Maybe its the dog and not the birds making your pointy dog lose his style in flusher country. The second bird I shot today put us over 300 wild birds shot over our dogs this season and whether it is sharpies, ruffed, wdck, pheasant, perdix perdix, or chikens, they handle em all the same. Overstimulation is not a problem with my hamsters. Glad it is for others
> 
> Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine


Now come on, you have very experienced dogs and understand how to handle them on wild birds. Putting some young dogs down in an area of hundreds of birds is not the best for them.


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## Shotgun Kennel (Feb 9, 2007)

A *minimum of 300* rooster pheasants must be released within the preserve during the first year of operation and a *minimum of 600 *rooster pheasants each season thereafter. Hen releases are allowed on the preserves, but their numbers *cannot* be included on the game release records, nor can they be used to meet the required minimum release total for the preserve. The total harvest of released and wild birds cannot exceed 100% of each species of birds released. For example, if 800 pheasants (680 marked and 120 wild) were harvested on the preserve, release records must show that at least 800 rooster pheasants have been released on the preserve acres. All birds released on the shooting preserve must be marked by either toe clipping or by the enlarged nares from some type of anti-pecking device. In either situation, this marking must be done before the birds are six weeks of age. A department representative MUST verify the marking method and release of the birds. All birds must be kept until they are at least 15 weeks of age. Species of game birds hunted and tagged on the preserve may include only those species listed on the preserve permit. All birds must be released on preserves from August 1 through March 31.
*Birds MUST be released on the preserve before hunting can be started.*
Waterfowl and other game species not listed on the preserve permit may be hunted within the preserve, but *ONLY* with the appropriate licenses and during legal seasons, according to state laws and regulations.


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

Thanks Tim, I guess the common sense opinions of many on this thread were right after all.


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## Jim58 (Jan 16, 2010)

Steelheadfred said:


> Thanks Tim, I guess the common sense opinions of many on this thread were right after all.


Thats what I like about this forum it's ultra competitive and there is always a winner.

......Or maybe not :sad:


Jim


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## Laphroaig (Dec 13, 2011)

hehibrits said:


> Nope, crazy B.S. is what it is. Just have to learn to see the forest from the trees. We shot 15 roosters today, all over points, held steady, retrieved to hand. Put at least 200 birds out of one field and the dogs style and steadiness were never compromised. Took good film of and will post when I get home. Maybe its the dog and not the birds making your pointy dog lose his style in flusher country. The second bird I shot today put us over 300 wild birds shot over our dogs this season and whether it is sharpies, ruffed, wdck, pheasant, perdix perdix, or chikens, they handle em all the same. Overstimulation is not a problem with my hamsters. Glad it is for others
> 
> Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine




Ummmm....where is your video of your dogs hunting in the same bird frenzy as the video in the original post?

You said I was B.S. crazy when I suggested that the birds in the OP video were not good for my pointing dogs and then went on to say that you had a video of your dogs handling in such a swarm of pheasants as the OP video?

Where is the video?


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## Lucky Dog (Jul 4, 2004)

northwinsetter said:


> And maybe that's the case but not once has anyone on this thread complimented or celebrated the habitat restoration that has been introduced that allows for the sustaining of these bird counts. Too bad... I think.


Really?

Do you really see habitat restoration as being the reason there are a lot of birds there?

I see a artificially high bird population that was made that way by releasing birds and supplemental feeding. You see good habitat, and I see milo rows so hunters can kill the bird easier. Get that much of anything in one small area, and you are asking for disease and predators to run rampant. 

No thanks.


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

Hawgleg said:


> First time reading the upland threads, I thought the deer hunting baiting debate was bad, you guys take the cake.


Thanks. Wait till someone asks about pointing labs.


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## hehibrits (Mar 10, 2007)

Hawgleg said:


> First time reading the upland threads, I thought the deer hunting baiting debate was bad, you guys take the cake.


Yup, just like to stir the pot...tastes better if you add your own flavor...everyone has their own style and comfort zone...when others get outside it, they get nervous...when you get nervous, you have a grand son with a dog collar...don't have a grandson with a dog collar...(sorry, that commercial is funny) just getting through Chanute. I am done with this thread. Thank me later...


Oh, and go find a stick, pound sand, and piss up a rope....then we will talk  by then their dogs might be semi steady......and the funny thing is that these "big trial" guys are bringing two set of dogs, their trial dogs and their hunting dogs...but I am sure A. Greer, J. Hires, L. Johnson, D. Smith, H. M. Biebel and others have no clue on how to hunt wild birds...I will watch and learn, but I hate horses..........

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine


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## I'm with Brandy (Aug 5, 2007)

This is the law in SD.

*"What is a pheasant preserve in South Dakota?*
A pheasant preserve has different laws than regular farm or hunting ground in South Dakota. The preserve is set up by the land owner, specifically for hunting pheasants, and hence has specific hunting regulations. Preserves allow hunters to shoot more birds, and take home (possess) more birds.

Since you can shoot more birds on a preserve, when a bird is harvested (shot and retrieved), it must be replaced. The birds can be replaced either before or after the hunt. All pheasants that are harvested in a South Dakota pheasant preserve are tagged."

Here is a google map location of the hunting land. I tried to find pens but the google maps are to fuzzy. But as you can see if you can take more than 3 they have to put pen raised birds out to cover the extra you take.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=29774...code_result&ct=image&resnum=1&ved=0CB8Q8gEwAA

The preserve has to keep records and if at the end of the year they have not released enough replacement birds they can release them all at once.

If you spend a little time you can find it all on the internet. And some times you can even find true facts.

I think I read on the web if you stick your finger up a rooster and then taste it you can taste the difference between wild and pen raised.

I know that is just plain sick, but there are a lot of gullible people out there I just wanted to see if I could get someone to do it.


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## Shotgun Kennel (Feb 9, 2007)

And just think we can thank Al Gore for all this fun on the INTERWEB.


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## kwas (Nov 17, 2007)

I went to SD deer hunting a pheasant ranch this year after first day I tagged out and pheasant hunted the remainder four days. I noticed all the birds shot had blinders on them at one time I could see throu there beaks where they were at one time. I asked the ranch if they were wild birds they said yes:lol:.. Don't know how it came up but they admitted to releasing in spring so they were wild by fall And hunting one farm I noticed the huge bird pens no birds in them.. But the habitat was there.... That is till the end of season when all the Milo fields are harvested because that is what happens with there's anyways.. Upon talking to them they talked about the hundreds of thousands of birds released around the major cities to accompany the hunting of the city folk.. So wild bird SD is in my opinion not.. But it does beat mich phes hunting.. O and to answer a old question not intended for this post (yes I have hunted habitat where it's set up for pheasant).......


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I was going to email Warne Ranch (the location of these videos) and ask about their wild bird claims. Imagine my surprise when i found this email in my inbox this a.m..
>
>
Thanks for the e-mail! Our family farm and Ranch is 8,000 contiguous acres with about 2,400 dedicated to dense nesting cover, food plots and wintering cover. We do all wild bird hunts on this property and we also lease 3 more farms within 10 minutes of ours, one of them has a preserve license which the state requires you to release 600 15 week old birds which we do starting the first of September until about the first of October while the cover is the best. Most people who want to come all the way out to SD want the option to shoot more then the 3 bird state limit per day so almost all of the commercial operations that I know of have a preserve lic. to be able to offer more shooting for those who want it, that's why we also offer it. The birds in that video are all wild as I'm sure you can tell if you've ever been to SD late season by how bunched up and spooky they are, the walkers never got close enough to get a shot, if you've ever hunted late season wild pheasants you would know exactly what its like. That's what people want to see when they come to SD, lots of wild birds getting up. Compare the birds in my video with the ones in these other lodges and see if you can tell the difference, other then there isn't hardly any hens! If you ever get out to SD look me up, I'd love to show you around and host you on a hunt so you can explain exactly what its like to the naysayers!! I usually have some dates open in December if you want to come out and check it out!! I'm putting together a video in the next few days that we shot the last day of the season this year that will blow your mind! It shows what good habitat can produce if you put all the right things together!! People also have to remember it's taken about 15 years to build a bird population like this and yes, lots of $$$$$. If people still want to see what the good ole days are like in SD, they better hurry up and make plans, within the next 5 years and the high grain prices the way they are, wild pheasants numbers will be one tenth of what they are today, maybe worse, guaranteed. 

http://www.scattergunlodge.com/video.htm
http://www.signaturelodge.com/ 
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC_N-JymskA&feature=player_embedded"]R&R Pheasant Hunting Introduction - YouTube[/ame]

Thanks and Happy Hunting,

Cody Warne


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## Tujax (Mar 23, 2005)

I have been going out to SD for the last five years not to far from this ranch and the bird numbers are just like seen in the video. The place I hunt also has a preserve lic. and must plant birds but they also do it early in the season and we go in December. All I can say is if you ever get a chance to go do it. You will have a great time and see more birds than you can imagine.


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## BIGSP (Sep 16, 2004)

God I love being right.


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## northwinsetter (Aug 1, 2011)

BIGSP said:


> God I love being right.


However they don't pre-release any birds on the 2400 acres where hunts take place. It appears those are released a minimum of 10 miles a way. I guess the question is how far will birds migrate.... the answer will likely be dependent on feed and cover between release point and the 2400 acre parcel. 
Regardless of that, the owner, in writing confirms the hunts they offer are only for wild birds.... which may be subject to ones definition of what a wild bird is or is as stated, after 15 years of hard work & dollars. I do find it interesting that the owners confirm that the numbers are unusual and will be short lived. And I also appreciate his straightforward candid response.


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## Jim58 (Jan 16, 2010)

BIGSP said:


> God I love being right.


So you agree that the birds in the op's video were all wild? I believe that was the bases of this debate originally and was confirmed by the owners email (if I am reading it right). Having never been there (the Dakotas) I would love to know the truth so that when I go this year I know what I am getting into.

Jim


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## Tujax (Mar 23, 2005)

From my experience in that area all the birds are wild. I have spoke in depth with the owner of the place I go to and have hunted with the SD Game Commissioner the last couple have years I have been there. It is an amazing area to go to.


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