# Mood Last Night



## Sam22 (Jan 22, 2003)

I am seriously surprised I am the first one to comment on this! Didn't anyone else see the segment of the "Hooligans" fishing the clay banks with fly gear for spawning salmon? One guy had the gumption to use the old "they swat it with their tails" line! The fish in the net during the credits was a real nasty male.


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## quest32a (Sep 25, 2001)

Man I thought the same thing. Most those guys were rather clueless. I think they only showed one fair hooked fish, the rest were all fouled.


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## Sam22 (Jan 22, 2003)

and don't get me wrong, I love mood. Jimmy and I have spent some time together, and I love the direction the show is going. That segment was just a miss, rather than a hit.


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## samsteel (Oct 6, 2008)

yeah, that was pretty sad....my wife even said "you don't fish like that do you?" hell no!!


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

Its a shame they represent one of the few remaining fly fishing outlets in SE Michigan. Besides the many explanations of snagging and flossing, Hank made a comment along the line of "we release them for our kids and grandkids to catch again" Kings? uh- ok
At least the showed the fun of participating in the great outdoors.


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## Treble (Sep 13, 2009)

I kinda see the point of releasing the kings for kids and grandkids. Who knows, maybe my young son will catch one of the kings I let back this years great, great, great grand fish when I can finally bring him out with me.


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## thousandcasts (Jan 22, 2002)

quest32a said:


> Man I thought the same thing. Most those guys were rather clueless. I think they only showed one fair hooked fish, the rest were all fouled.


Lemme guess...it wasn't a skein, crank or plug fishing segment, right?


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## Betsie steel (Jul 21, 2009)

I love the comment made about how the salmon will hit egg flies readily on their beds, yet almost all fish were foul hooked.


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## Flyfisher (Oct 1, 2002)

http://www.michiganoutofdoorstv.com/shows.cfm

Truly one of the saddest segments of "sportsmen" I have ever seen. Foul-hooked nasty salmon being held up for glory shots and excuses being made for snagged fish.  MOOD should be ashamed of themselves for even broadcasting this episode when a week or two earlier they could have filmed guys floating skein, casting plugs, or even stripping big flies/streamers to fish that were actually biting. Says a lot for the supposed "experts" that MOOD were interviewing. 

Basically folks, this is what goes on with the majority of "fly guides" that fish to both salmon AND steelhead when they are on gravel. These are the same folks that advocate flyfishing as the most "sportsmanlike" method of angling, and the same folks that want to turn our rivers into "flyfishing only". Snagging is illegal, whether its done with a big yellow $25 Eagle Claw rod or a $700 Sage 8wt flyrod.

Personally, I have flyfished for nearly 20 years, but generally reserve if for saltwater or trout on dry flies anymore, with the occasional mid-winter "strike-indicator" action for trout/steelhead. What I saw in this episode is unfortunately what a lot of "flyfishermen" see as more ethical than bait and lures...sad!


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## Mitch (Jan 10, 2003)

Hmmm, unfortunate segment. I'd be embarrassed beyond all belief to go on television and do that. Those guys are better at keeping a straight face than I am!

Mitch


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## William H Bonney (Jan 14, 2003)

I didn't even really care that they were snagging fish, I just thought it was a bad show choice all together. Might as well have just strung together a bunch of the home video tapes that people sent in for that contest they're running. Or just show an old rerun of deer hunting..


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

In my opinion those "fly anglers" are worse then the guys out with white shark rods and trebbles. 

At least the guys with white rods and trebble hooks are being honest about what they are trying to do snag fish. 

What a joke of a bunch of "fly shop owners."


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## oldexscrew (Aug 19, 2007)

It looked to me that all fish were released -foul hooked or not- they all enjoyed just fishing for the sport or fun of it. Every fisher person might not fit into other peoples perfect model.
PG


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## Flyfisher (Oct 1, 2002)

oldexscrew said:


> It looked to me that all fish were released -foul hooked or not- they all enjoyed just fishing for the sport or fun of it. Every fisher person might not fit into other peoples perfect model.
> PG


I would hope the fish were all released, as they were in the NO KILL/Flies only stretch of the PM. Personally, I see little "sport" or "fun" out of fighting half dead snagged salmon, and most self-respecting sportsmen should feel the same way.

I think you missed the point that they were making laughable excuses for snagging fish like _"the salmon will swat their tails at flies" _. Its illegal to snag fish, regardless whether its with a treble hook or a fly. If someone foul-hooking more fish than they are getting in the mouth, something is wrong with their program. Either move to another pod of fish that may be more active, change tactics, or hang it up.


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## ausable_steelhead (Sep 30, 2002)

I just wonder why they seem to go for graveled fish so much, when doing a fall salmon episode? It's not that hard to find good kings, and get some actual biters. Even with a flyrod, if they fish hard, they should get a few fish to go.


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## Flyfisher (Oct 1, 2002)

ausable_steelhead said:


> I just wonder why they seem to go for graveled fish so much, when doing a fall salmon episode? It's not that hard to find good kings, and get some actual biters. Even with a flyrod, if they fish hard, they should get a few fish to go.


I guess I should give MOOD the benefit of the doubt. They plan these trips well in advance and are under pressure to produce a show every week. Notice the female host, Jen Olsen, even asked them why they are foul-hooking so many fish. They were probably mortified as they were filming the show. I noticed the show focused a lot more on the "Hooligans" themselves, their motor homes, and how these guys have been doing this for years. 

One could only assume that the owner of a flyshop should have the experience and knowledge to hook fish legally? What I have found with a lot of people in the fishing industry is that they know their products well but don't necessarily know how to use them. 

I am sure there are guys that would take the MOOD crew fishing for kings in a much less questionable fashion, but its just a matter of how does MOOD make these connections?


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

Flyfisher said:


> I guess I should give MOOD the benefit of the doubt. They plan these trips well in advance and are under pressure to produce a show every week. Notice the female host, Jen Olsen, even asked them why they are foul-hooking so many fish. They were probably mortified as they were filming the show. I noticed the show focused a lot more on the "Hooligans" themselves, their motor homes, and how these guys have been doing this for years.
> 
> One could only assume that the owner of a flyshop should have the experience and knowledge to hook fish legally? What I have found with a lot of people in the fishing industry is that they know their products well but don't necessarily know how to use them.
> 
> I am sure there are guys that would take the MOOD crew fishing for kings in a much less questionable fashion, but its just a matter of how does MOOD make these connections?




I agree - well said


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## Nighttimer (Jul 24, 2001)

Steelheadfred said:


> In my opinion those "fly anglers" are worse then the guys out with white shark rods and trebbles.
> 
> At least the guys with white rods and trebble hooks are being honest about what they are trying to do snag fish.


I agree 100%.


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

Nighttimer said:


> I agree 100%.


If you guys feel pursuing fish with illegal methods is better than pursuing with legal methods and gear, you must be one of "those snaggers"


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## Nighttimer (Jul 24, 2001)

Chromedoggy said:


> If you guys feel pursuing fish with illegal methods is better than pursuing with legal methods and gear, you must be one of "those snaggers"


:lol: I don't fish for river kings, and the way some "fly anglers" fish for river kings _should_ be illegal. But fly shops such as the one on MOOD keep promoting the lie that is fly fishing for river kings as we know it. :sad:


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## Chromedoggy (Mar 25, 2007)

Nighttimer said:


> :lol: I don't fish for river kings, and the way some "fly anglers" fish for river kings _should_ be illegal. But fly shops such as the one on MOOD keep promoting the lie that is fly fishing for river kings as we know it. :sad:


THAT I agree with completely


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## Pier Pressure (Dec 21, 2008)

What's next, a segment of "crank 'n' yank" below Tippy?


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## Troutlord1 (Jun 6, 2007)

My favorite part was when the guy said something like..
when you know they are foul hooked the best thing to do is fight it hard and get it to the net as quick as you can to release it :lol:
I am a fly fisher and I agree that segment really did make fly fishers look bad. If it was foul hooked just point the rod at the fish and hold the line and break it off.
just a side note ... with Hanks being a sponser on M.O.O.D. all fly fishing stories on M.O.O.D has to be shot with his staff and shop.


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## Fishndude (Feb 22, 2003)

I love the explanation for why a Salmon got hooked (apparently, but not absolutely sure) in the mouth by an egg imitation. "If it is one of his eggs, he wants to put it back into the nest; and if it isn't, he wants to crush it." Fish have no thoughts of that sort. The grab stuff with their mouths because they don't have hands. I am thinking that fish didn't have a whole lot of control over that fly going into it's mouth, either - although it kind of looked like it was hooked under the chin when I saw it. I could be wrong. 
"They had lots of "fish on, fish off," that day." Not a real great depiction of ethical fly fishing for spawning Salmon, for sure. REAL skanky fish, too. I would hate to even grab most of those, if I couldn't keep some eggs from them. :evilsmile


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## Flyfisher (Oct 1, 2002)

Troutlord1 said:


> with Hanks being a sponser on M.O.O.D. all fly fishing stories on M.O.O.D has to be shot with his staff and shop.


That's really too bad...I suppose we'll see a similar episode in the spring with steelhead?


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## Crowhunter (Aug 27, 2005)

They were having a good time with friends and doing nothing wrong .Bud


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## samsteel (Oct 6, 2008)

Crowhunter said:


> They were having a good time with friends and doing nothing wrong .Bud


yeah, they were having a good time and probably "technically" were not doing anything wrong....but they definitely were not doing anything that took skill or that was sporty, not sure why it deserved to get airtime....might as well do a segment on the east corner of 6th street in late August/early September.


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## Steelheadfred (May 4, 2004)

Chromedoggy said:


> If you guys feel pursuing fish with illegal methods is better than pursuing with legal methods and gear, you must be one of "those snaggers"


 
Now you are putting words in our mouth? Who said anything about the legal pursuit of fish? It was for sure not on TV last thursday night.


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## diztortion (Sep 6, 2009)

Yah! East(easy) Side Wide! Just put some orange/pink/green yarn on a treble hook and set the hooks multiple times in ONE cast! You'll catch a FISH!


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## Big Brown (Sep 18, 2007)

"very healthy fish very exciting, unbelievable, great fight, I am worn out":16suspect

there is nothing healthy about a half dead crusty salmon. I bet dragging him in by the tail was a GREAT fight. what a pathetic segment.


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## Troutlord1 (Jun 6, 2007)

I would like to add a little more to it.... I was on M.O.O.D. in 04, Gabe did the segment,very professional and a great guy. I also met Jimmy when I approached him to do the story, again, very professional and a great guy.What was the 1 thing that you normally see on an episode
when they go out fishing..??? the host usually gets to drop the camera and get into the action.Jenny did not fish. She was sent to do a story and was put in that environment and did the best she could(and I give her credit for pointing out the foul hookings).
99.9% of the blame lays on the other ppl involved. thats just my thoughts.


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## Floater (Feb 8, 2003)

I loved Jenny's comment:
"Then again, these guys are not your average sportsmen."


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## Sam22 (Jan 22, 2003)

Fishndude said:


> I love the explanation for why a Salmon got hooked (apparently, but not absolutely sure) in the mouth by an egg imitation. "If it is one of his eggs, he wants to put it back into the nest; and if it isn't, he wants to crush it." Fish have no thoughts of that sort. The grab stuff with their mouths because they don't have hands. I am thinking that fish didn't have a whole lot of control over that fly going into it's mouth, either - although it kind of looked like it was hooked under the chin when I saw it. I could be wrong.
> "They had lots of "fish on, fish off," that day." Not a real great depiction of ethical fly fishing for spawning Salmon, for sure. REAL skanky fish, too. I would hate to even grab most of those, if I couldn't keep some eggs from them. :evilsmile




Yeah that was interesting.

I don't want to throw mood under the bus. I love the show, and Jimmy is a great guy, doing great things. The method they were using doesn't make for good television is all, I don't blame them one bit. Jenny did a good job with what she had to work with.

They have done a great river salmon segment, with our very own STELMON, bobber fishing and everything, couple years ago. I have made two little appearances on the show, and am trying to enter a video in this years contest! I love MOOD!


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## thousandcasts (Jan 22, 2002)

Flyfisher said:


> I am sure there are guys that would take the MOOD crew fishing for kings in a much less questionable fashion, but its just a matter of how does MOOD make these connections?


If you're talking about the whole skein/crank/plug fisheries, then No self respecting salmon or steelhead angler is going to drag a camera crew to the places where they fish...nor should they.


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## Fish Eye (Mar 30, 2007)

I think Whit needs to make that video a sticky on this thread, lol.

Some guide would be delighted to take those guys back bouncing or plug tossing. No doubt about it.


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## Fish Eye (Mar 30, 2007)

Notable quotables from the segment;

_Lot's of fish on, fish off!_

_ Those guys know alot about the fish they pursue._

_ You never know what you're going to hook into._

_ He was grabbing the egg (fly) to put it back into the nest, or crush it if it if it wasn't his to get it out of the nest._

_ These guys are not your average sportsmen!_


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## chicagoj (Jun 5, 2008)

Funniest line is the one about picking up the eggs and putting them back in the nest! He actually said it with a straight face - is he kidding or what!

Pretty smart for a bunch of guys who have "fished all over the world".

The first clue was a group of guys who "name" themselves...did they ride their bikes up to the PM or what..."the Hooligans"...gimme a break!


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## cane crazed (Jul 22, 2008)

they are a very small majority of fly fisherman. i have been at this game a long time and the biggest problem i face is people being rude ( to the point they need a good butt kicking).


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## Flyfisher (Oct 1, 2002)

cane crazed said:


> they are a very small majority of fly fisherman. i have been at this game a long time and the biggest problem i face is people being rude ( to the point they need a good butt kicking).


I agree with you wholeheartedly on count 2. I have found a lot of flyfishermen rude and derogatory towards me when I am fishing techniques other than flies, particularly in October when I am targeting steelhead in the runs below gravel, while they are upriver snagging salmon with their $700 Orvis flyrods. While I enjoy using a flyrod, and have done it for years, I reserve it for times that I have absolutely no doubt that the fish are indeed biting.

Unfortunately, there is an awful lot of snagging associated with flyfishing to salmon in tight quarters and on gravel. The perception that salmon are eating small flies in rivers is perpetuated by guides/fly shops to keep their calendar full during the months of September and October. Its good for cash flow going into the cold and unpredictable winter months. I'll buy that cohos will take flies readily and that lower river kings will clobber big streamers but its pure fantasy to believe that a male king about to get down with a chunky ripe hen is looking to dine on #12 green caddis and #10 black stones.


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## Fishbone (Oct 10, 2008)




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